DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum "The guys that were here before, they didn't get real players". - John Dorsey

Browns' John Dorsey: 'The guys that were here before, they didn't get real players.'

Such a way with words. Reminds me of Trump. People like them sometimes speak without a filter and without regards to other people's feelings and/or emotions. Narcissistic in nature.

Dorsey was obviously curt but what he said was pretty much true, although we do have a few really good players on our team, but not enough to win games.

The truth hurts and he probably shouldn't have said what he said, but whatever.

I listen to 92.3 FM the fan today talk about this until I had to turn it off. Start winning games and this drama will fade (at least somewhat) away. Keep losing and every other word will be scrutinized. The drama replaces the winning.

-Off to a good start!

I wonder if after he said that he thought to himself "Did I just say that out loud or only think it?".

J/c

I really like everything I’ve read about this guy ... hes a football guy that gets it ... at least he talks like he does ....

- sits down with Hue to learn hues systems to help him understand what Hu’es looking for and talks to hue about the best players to fit his systems ....

- he could sit down with Kizer and relate on a slightly different level than Sashi could have ... What was Sashi gonna do ,,, “yo D the analytics aren’t working out here u need to play better” .. ...

Really like the things i’m reading .. lets see how it translates .... that’ll be the key ...

This ,,, Pffffftttt ... no clue why he would say it ... very very STUPID if u ask me ... no need to be a douche about it ...

Say your thankful for the position Sashi left you in with some talent, great draft picks and a ton of cap space .... then move on ... no need to crap on Sashi and bad mouth some of the inferior talent we have here .... NO NEED for that STUPIDITY ...

But i could care less ... all i care about is him using our ASSETS to make this team EXREMELY EXTREMELY GOOD ...

I’d bet Hue is back ... but i don’t think its a done deal ...

Pretty much where I am as well. I think Hue will most likely be back, but if we go 0-3 over the next three weeks then it isn't guaranteed by any means.

I don't think Dorsey's people skills translate to a long term tenure at all, but I'm really happy that he is the guy using these picks.

We haven't had standouts like other teams had a Lambert or Clay Matthews class. I think there is truth we didn't pick them. A slam on front office and owners and players and scouts.

We have skills we didn't develop in many; we have drafted hyped up folks with little value to return in wins.

I hope he clicks here.

It just took too long for someone to come out and tell these guys they suck...thank god the new boss isn't going to sugar coat it nor put up with it...1 win in two years...thats embarrassing...thats awful...thats absolutely atrocious...those guys should wear a brown sack on their head in public....thats how much they stink.

im glad we have a GM that has the cajones to point the blame where it lies...the players are far too often given a free pass while they fire front office people and coaches...its not the front office people and coaches throwing the ball, catching the ball, blocking, and tackling people...its the bums we have on our roster right now that have been good for winning one game in two years...LOL....no one should feel bad for them.

They suck, the guy is telling the truth.....

Agreed. Stupid thing to say, but just get this team back on course.

Strengthen the secondary, get a QB & LT, get some more help at WR. Demand an Offensive Coordinator and get rid of Chris Tabor



This guy should be able to bring in the talent

Famous last words......

Agreed. If he thought this was bad, he should have been here a few years ago when "football guys" were in charge.

John Dorsey expects Browns to win AFC North in '18: 'Anything else is unacceptable'

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2017/12/browns_john_dorsey_aiming_for.html#article

Updated December 14, 2017 at 5:19 PM; Posted December 14, 2017 at 4:14 PM



CLEVELAND, Ohio -- John Dorsey has been the Browns GM for a week and he's already cast aside the long-term rebuild like a worn-out shoe.

"I'm the eternal optimistic,'' Dorsey said Thursday on the Really Big Show on WKNR 850. "I believe we have to be competitive in the AFC North and my total objective going into the '18 season is to win the AFC North. Anything else to me is unacceptable.''

The Browns have lost 15 AFC North games in a row, and turning that around will be a priority for Dorsey, who's been a part of 19 playoff teams, 11 division titles and two Super Bowl victories in his 26 years as a personnel executive.

During that same interview, Dorsey made it clear that he wasn't a fan of his predecessor Sashi Brown's player-acquisition skills.

"I'll come straight out with it,'' he said. "The guys who were here before, that system, they didn't get real players.

"As Bill Parcells would always say, 'you are your record' and you know what? There it is, so that's the truth-teller in this thing. And I'm going to do my darnedest to get Hue (Jackson) players.''

Dorsey's win-now mentality has been music to Jackson's ears. From the day he was hired, he emphasized winning as soon as possible, but that didn't jive with Brown's long-term overhaul of the roster.

The problem is, Brown and his executive team made 24 draft picks and 17 trades, and had only one victory against 27 losses to show for it before Brown was fired last week. Dorsey, who cut Kenny Britt on his first day, has made it clear he'll aggressively attempt to upgrade the talent.

"He's walking up and down these halls preaching, 'Let's win. Let's get to winning as fast as we can,''' said Jackson. "I appreciate that. He's doing everything he needs to do on his end. We have to continue to keep coaching better and get our guys to play better."

Here are a few other nuggets from Dorsey's interview with Aaron Goldhammer:

* He was thrilled to meet Jim Brown. "I had to get my picture taken with him because he's a Hall of Famer and I think that's like cool. That was awesome.''

* He shared something his former Packers QB Aaron Rodgers told him after Sunday's game about Josh Gordon:

"It's pretty cool when (Rodgers) says 'hey, how come I don't have one of those guys like No. 12?''' he said. "I said, 'I don't know, he must be a Cleveland Brown.' But I will say this, just watching him, he's got all the physical skills in the world and he's got to understand where we as an organization are headed and what my mindset's about and what I expect from him.

"That's important. And what Hue Jackson expects from him, I think that's important. But the important thing is, we're here to help him and assist him as well because my objective all along is not only do you want those players to be better football players when they left but that the organization has helped them be better men when they leave the game of football."

* He reiterated his No. 1 criteria for a QB: "Can he win? There's some physical traits within that, but the bottom line is 'do you win?' If your quarterback can win, that does good things for the organization. The intangible that we in the NFL always want to try to find out is what lies within and that's the mental quickness, the ability to process, how do you react to adverse situations? Those are the skillsets that you do try to find. How do they react under pressure?"

I'll be impressed with him when we win. Until then, he's just another blowhard trying to say the right things. Just like every coach we've had, just like every new front office we've had.

At this point, he's nothing to me. Put it on the field and prove it. Get back to me after yet ANOTHER season.

Hey Pit............isn't it cool that both you and I are live our lives as positive people. We are not "Negative Nancys" and try to see the positive in all things in our lives.

Life is too short to allow negativity to dominate your life. And yet people dismiss our opinions because they think we are "homers" and see things through orange colored glasses.

We both also are mature enough to not act like "spoiled little brats." We are "willing to give this new regime a chance" instead of "throwing temper tantrums."

LOL............sometimes karma is a ...........

Seriously though.............I really like this new combo of Dorsey and Hue. Two football guys. Two guys willing to work together.

No more of this crap where a lawyer thinks he knows more about football than the coach. Imagine how Hue felt when he praised Haden and then Sashi turns around and cuts him? Gee, that's teamwork.

I am very excited that Sashi is gone and Dorsey is in.

I can see the following conversations playing out:

Hue: Sashi, you gotta get me some players. We're taking a beating here.

Sashi: I went to Harvard. You didn't. And I have given you players. You just can't coach them up. Oh dear, a hanging participle.

Now......

Dorsey: I'm going to work w/you and get you players, but if you don't win, I am going to can your ass.

Hue: I wouldn't expect it to be any other way!

Gone is the snooty geek and we now have two tough football guys. I'm lovin' it.

I like that you're positive about him. I'm not down on him, I've just seen this before.

We've pretty much tried every single FO setup at this point. And each one has said the same thing when they're on their way in... and each one failed for one reason or another.

I'll jump on the bandwagon when I start seeing positive results.

excellent post the browns can be in the playoffs if dorsey drafts right and hue can coach if we are 0-16 next year at this time everybody will feel the heat.

Not asking you to jump on the bandwagon, bro. I am just saying I am on it. You know me........... I could care less if others agree w/me.

I am not usually a positive poster, but I like this set-up. Much more than putting a lawyer in charge, that's for sure.

And no offense against lawyers. I would say the same thing about a doctor, an accountant, a plumber, etc.

I see the comment being more about Brown and Heckert.



This makes me smile. I cannot agree more. QB is as much about decision making quickness as it is physical skills.

Unless I'm mistaken, the Browns have never tried the "traditional" approach of allowing the GM to interview and hire his own head coach. The Browns have always taken a convoluted approach that culminates in a awkward and/or forced marriage.

This got me to thinking.......When he says "can he win," who does that describe more than Alex Smith? I didn't think we would go after him, but if Dorsey wants to win the division next year like he claims, getting Smith makes quite a bit of sense.

You mean having Joe Banner interview the head coaches and then firing him was probably a bad idea?

Not nearly as bad as Phil Savage being hired after Crennel or Lombardi named the GM after Chud was hired or Farmer being the named GM after Pettine was hired.

The real gem was allowing Mangini to hire his own GM (Kokinis).

What about trying to mesh Sashi Brown with Hue Jackson?

The one that makes the most sense is Holmgren/Heckert hiring Shurmur.

Sashi was too arrogant to work w/Hue. All I know is that I think we are much better off w/Dorsey and Hue moving forward and that Sashi is gone.

Don't be absurd, the ideal structure is for the HC to usurp the position of strength much like Butch Davis with Dwight Clark.

HaHa.

However, I think the ideal situation is for the GM and HC to work together. I think that is what we will have w/Dorsey and Hue.

Undoubtedly, for the Browns and as Jim Nantz says for The Masters, this would be a tradition unlike any other.

Dorsey seems to me like a opinionated sort of fellow.

Not in a bad or good way...more like he knows what he knows (2+2=4) and you won't convince otherwise.

not shy to speak on it.

strong personality, know what you know, vocal personality that type of stuff will come out his mouth lol

I am ok with it. But with comments like those you better back it up buddy...

I agree. Dorsey may think that. He may share that in a closed room, but to say that in a public forum isn't good business.

You don't put your players down in the newspaper.

Sashi was the one who hired Hue.

Hue was Sashi's Head Coach, but clearly Sashi wasn't Hue's GM, but Dorsey apparently is.

Hue was hands down the best coach willing to coach for the Browns. Sashi hogtied him from the get go by letting the o-line fall apart in free agency, not getting Hue the kind of WRs he likes, and most importantly sticking him with washed out leftovers at QB.

Sashi got fired because he didn't do enough to get Hue the QB he asked for when it was a top priority. Please don't confuse Hue's positive PC talk as an endorsement of the QBs Sashi brought in. RG3 was a legit target worth taking a chance on BUT they should have still drafted Wentz just to be safe.

At the end of the day you can't have someone with no NFL experience calling the shots IMHO on who the team drafts.

Also sounds like Baker Mayfield.

j/c

We went from a FO mouthpiece who rarely spoke publicly to a FO mouthpiece who certainly says what he thinks with no discernible filter.

There was no value in saying what Dorsey said publicly...actually...negative value. Then he shared what Rogers had to say about Gordon...which reflects on GB's WRs. I imagine Rogers said that thinking it would stay between him and Dorsey.

Hue likes to talk and say things publicly...Dorsey likes to talk publicly. What could possibly go wrong? Personally, I think they both talk too much. I'm off to stock up on lollipops.

You beat me to it...exactly what I thought when I read that.

This isn't true. Hue is the arrogant one. And I wouldn't necessarily say we are "better" with Dorsey, it's just a different direction.

Not sure why people think this. Hue is Jimmy's guy. Hue is the coach Jimmy wanted and the front office had to go along with it. Nothing is more evident to this than the fact we fired Sashi and Hue is still here.

Sashi was so quiet that only an insider would know whether he was arrogant. That's just agenda-talk.

The agenda-posters won't like this but...where there was (1) guy in Sashi, there will be at least (2) guys who replace him. A GM and a contracts guy.

Sashi was not a "GM" like Dorsey is and Dorsey is not a contracts guy like Sashi was. If Sashi was truly just the tie-breaker guy, then the rift could just as easily be between Hue and the football guys in the FO/scouts.

I've said this before and will say it again: If Sashi was truly just the tie-breaker guy, then no matter which way he decided he was doomed to lose because he was forced to disagree with a football talent evaluator when that was NOT his level of expertise.

Dorsey seems good with Hue right now. It will be interesting to see what he does with the football guys in the FO and the scouting dept. That might be rather telling.

Obviously Hue and Sashi were never on the same page as this is what Hue signed up for. It almost seems like Hue knew he had a built in excuse when it came to all the losses and he knew he was going to lose. Posters on this very board said Hue was running plays when we didn't have the personnel for them. Yet instead of saying Hue should run plays to the strengths of our players, people put the blame on the front office for not getting the player to fit those plays. Make no mistake the front office drafted good players but they didn't fit Hues gameplay. Which is fine, but don't say they suck out loud. Hue needs that already groomed pocket QB. That's why Watson wasnt drafted, because Hue would have made him look like crap. We might be the only team of 32 in the NFL who doesn't adjust to their players, Hue had shown to be the stubborn and arrogant one yet some posters think Sashi was arrogant.

Yes. If you go back and read the quotes from Jimmy when these guys were hired I think it's easy to see. Jimmy decided before he even hired Sashi that Hue was the head coach he wanted. I think he partly understood they need to work together, that's why he hired Sashi. His comments about Sashi was that he was very smart, very fair, and worked well with others. He wasn't arrogant at all. Haslam felt this was the perfect match for Hue or any hired coach. Sashi drafted good players, just not "Hue" good players and Hue refused to use said players because they weren't the ones Hue wanted. And at some point Hue and Haslam ended up on the same page thinking that the players we drafted have been bad. Enter new GM who was asked to keep Hue. Hue had felt invincible for quite awhile now.