DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Would you accept Cousins, Sequon & Minkah (Or OT, DE, WR, etc.)

I listened to the interview in the car this afternoon. Albert Breer went on to say, the reason being, is because many people around the league don't think the Browns are too far of from being a really good team. Throw in the draft assets and it could be a team worth considering.

A good QB would amplify the talent already here.

Oh, and by the way, I dunno why everybody just accepts that Rodgers is the best QB in the game right now.

Cause he ain’t better than Drew Brees.

If Cousins is taken and they trade the 1 then take Minkah with the #4 and then grab Sony Michel or even Royce Freeman in the 2nd or 3rd.

Of course this is assuming JT returns.

I like Cousins, but that would mean we would almost certainly be passing on Rosen.

Man, I don't know about that.

Cousins is proven in the NFL, Rosen isn't. Both are a roll of the dice but only one has proven what they can do.

Rosen also has injury concerns.

Just voicing my personal opinion. Not saying anyone has to agree.

I think Rosen is going to be special. Very special.

Well, we now have the FO in place and it is a well respected one. If they are worth their salt they will find the best guy who they believe will be "special".

In my opinion, this isn't being leaked because Cousins is saying he'd consider playing for the Browns, he and his agent are outright asking Cleveland to come get him in free agency.

As has been mentioned, a lot of people think the Browns are struggling now due to age, but are going to be a damn good team moving forward. The OL is above solid, if not very good, and the Browns front seven on defense is stacked. There are players like Njoku, Gordon, Peppers, BBC, Johnson and Devalve who are reason to be excited moving forward.

On top of that, the Browns have an abundance of assets to continue building. If the Browns sign Cousins, the projection is that the Browns would still be amongst the top teams in available cap space. Cousins knows his signature makes the Browns a lot more attractive to other free agents.

Not to mention all those draft picks, of which plenty will be used to surround Cousins with talent.

Perhaps most importantly, however, is that Cousins has long felt overlooked. Unwanted. Underappreciated. Undervalued. Unrecognized for his talents. Not only will nobody appreciate his talents as much as the Browns faithful, but there isn't a legacy in the NFL that will carry as much meaning as the quarterback who returns the Browns to greatness. Denver? You're just doing what Manning did two years ago. Giants? You're walking in the other Manning's shoes. Jacksonville? You're riding their wave. With the Browns, the quarterback will own the legacy.

Cousins also will be with Hue Jackson: Is there a better way to kick Jay Gruden in the balls than to go on and do great things with Hue Jackson?

I think it's becoming more and more likely that Cousins makes his way to Cleveland - which could explain why it was so easy for Dorsey to attract a bunch of high-value front office executives who seemingly had better opportunities elsewhere.

Exciting times.

I would take Cousins over any QB in the draft but I doubt Cousins would come to Cleveland. I also would love to have Alex Smith. Smith or Cousins would bring a sense of excitement and hope back to Cleveland. With a few pieces added via the draft and free agency and who knows what can happen.

That, or, the more teams allegedly interested in Cousins drives market value up. Particularly teams with significant cap space...... Like us. The more teams tied to Cousins, the better it is for him. It's smart his agent wants the Browns in the mix, even if there is zero merit to any of these connections.

I agree. A bird in hand is worth 2 in the bush.

Signing Cousins is my 1A option.

Back in Hue’s garage .....

Well....he's injured so I guess you're right.

I'll never forget when the two faced off in the season opener in 2011. One of the best gun-slinging fights I've ever seen. Rodgers came out on top though

I doubt it. The Browns are already listed as a team who will undoubtedly have some level of interest, and there isn't much point in driving up the price of the guy who'll undoubtedly become the NFL's highest paid player.

In fact, if it isn't true, driving up the price would be a horrible strategy.

The Browns are projected to have $111M cap space. The next closest suitor is the Jets at $76M. The next closest suitor is the Redskins at $52M. Denver is projected at only $15M and the Giants at $30M.

Teams are going to have a hard enough time locking him down financially while also selling him on their long-term potential. Driving the price higher will only serve to help the Browns, who boast not only the most space post-Cousins, but the fewest high-value players off contract over the coming years and the most draft selections to add cheap players around him.

The Jets come the closest to the Browns with their cap space, but look at their free agents over the next two years. They may have around $47M left over if they sign Cousins, but half their roster comes off contracts that are worth, at most, $6.2M (Skrine) and will either need to be signed for a higher value, or Cousins will have to place trust that they'll build back up.

No doubt, the Browns have building to do, but the only "scary" contract we have ending between now and 2020 is Joe Thomas. Maybe Duke Johnson. That's it. The Browns not only have this cap space, but the freedom to use it because the talent we do have is locked down for years.

Pushing the value higher just gives the Browns a greater advantage for negotiations.

Agreed. It wasn't too long after this interview on CBD where this was said (see below) that all of sudden Cousins agent came out and said he'd consider playing for the the Browns. It is certainly in Cousins best interest financially to make other teams believe he would consider the Browns.

Nathan Zegura Verified account
@NathanZegura
Just now on @Browns_Daily @john_keim just said that Cleveland is the “last place” he would envision Kirk Cousins playing in 2018 and said he would be “absolutely shocked” if Cousins signed here

Tweet

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/

I'm showing different teams and amounts in the cap space race..

Of course an ESPN Washington reporter, who staunchly wants Cousins to remain in Washington, thinks the Browns have no chance. Nobody but Washington does, so if everyone could just go ahead and not contact him, that'd be great.

Regardless of where he goes, I think it's becoming less and less likely that it's Washington. That relationship has been deteriorating for quite some time, and as has been said, may well be beyond point of repair.

Yep. It's just projected at this stage, so they all vary to some extent in their projections. So that one is:

Browns - $114M
Jets - $80M
Redskins - $53M
Bills - $32M
Broncos - $28M
Cardinals - $27M
Jags - $25M
Giants - $24M
Dolphins - $10M

They're the most likely suitors, in my mind. Really, it's only the Browns, Jets and Redskins who make much sense. Anyone else will have to dedicate almost all of their cap space to bringing Cousins in.

Regardless of which projection, I still think the Browns stand out as having the most favourable mixture of available cap space, future selections and talent under contract.

Then again, I am bias, but I don't see how anyone else matches Cleveland in terms of teams who have the best chance to build around a guy like Cousins.

Which is funny. Washington has been digging themselves a hole, and now they're setting themselves up so that they won't have a QB.


All the good quarterbacks in the draft will be gone before they pick too.



So yeah, if I was Jay Gruden, I'd be getting pretty nervous. Cause next season is not looking good for Washington unless they manage to get Kirk Cousins back (which seems less and less likely)

You're reaching. John Keim, may be a beat reporter for the Redskins, but he is originally from Lakewood, OH and went to Ohio State. He's not saying this as some desperate attempt to keep Cousins in Washington.

Cousins isn't coming here.

I remember an ESPN Miami Reporter say there was no way Lebron would return to Cleveland, the day before he did...

Being from Ohio doesn't change the fact he's a reporter for ESPN, based in Washington, covering the Washington Redskins for a Washington Redskins readership.

If you like it or not, they have a vested interest in building up the likelihood of a Cousins return. Just as the poster below you highlighted, Miami based reporters had a vested interest in selling Lebron returning to the Heat, at a time when every market insisted they had the best chance of getting Lebron. Ironically, LA media already thinks Lebron is coming their way next year.

The reality is this: Nobody can conclusively say what decision Cousins will make, but it is obvious nothing is off the table. To say Cleveland is the "last place" Cousins would play should be giving you pause. Anyone dealing in definitive is just peddling narratives - especially when the guy's reasons are utterly stupid - Browns are losers (Washington are losers WITH Cousins, imagine them without him), money doesn't matter (Cousins has already spoken about the difficulty in balancing cap allocation, something Keim himself reported last week, and something the Redskins have not balanced well, so it actually is important to him) and the coach may be fired (Like Gruden won't enter 2018 on the hot seat himself given the team has regressed under him). So, poor reasoning across the board.

No matter how you personally feel, it seems Cousins is going to consider all options. Which he's said, and Keim himself has again reported on, in just the last week.

I'm sick of the anti-Browns rhetoric. Not only is it remarkably simple to punch a hole through, but it's remarkably simple to highlight that other team's aren't quite as idyllic as their faithful like to think.

Over the Cap, I think, does a better job than Spotrac. They use the numbers on the site from the NFL Network, so I think it's pretty reliable.

Here is the cap space for every team going into this off-season:

https://overthecap.com/salary-cap-space

The writing on the wall for Cousins and Washington to part way is clear as day.

They botched his contract for 2 years and most Washington fans realized that Kirk would be gone last year.

Kirk is a smart guy. Family oriented and business minded. He will go any where he and his family are comfortable, the money is right and he has a chance to win.

If Cousins wants to go to where he has the best chance of winning (in the near-term), then we present very favorably. Money is no problem currently, so the deciding factor may be how well of a 'fit' he sees himself ib Hue's system...

We have the money.

I'm not so sure that he will view the Browns as a team that is going to win. LOL...I get the agenda angle, but just look at how many people are calling for Hue to be fired. We just fired Sashi. We fire guys almost every year. Unstable franchises don't win very often and we are the definition of that.

Why would he not fit in Hue's system. Hue followed Gruden in Cinci and Dalton had the best years of his career under Hue. Cousins has a better arm than Dalton. Other than you not liking Hue, I don't get the angle of questioning whether or not Cousins will fit into his system.

You're right that Cousins has to determine he'll be a good fit in Jackson's offense, and we don't really know, but I think there is a good chance of that.

If anything, Jackson is a better fit than Gruden's system currently is. Very similar in many regards, but much more emphasis on downfield passing with Hue. PFF graded Cousins as having a down year on their final review of the season, but he was best against the blitz (3rd in the league) and passing over 20 yards (6th in the league). Cousins is an awesome downfield passer, so that may be a strength.

Actually, after you mentioned that, there is a HUGE feather in the Browns cap to acquire Cousins that I completely overlooked.

While people will mock the Browns on job security, Cousins will have Jackson. Jackson won't get fired because adding a QB like Cousins makes it near impossible to lose enough to get fired. Granted, Mr. 1-31 makes it look easy, but surely he can't lose with a franchise quarterback.

However, with a team like the Jets or Denver, who both have head coaches with a background in defense, he'll always be at risk of his OC being promoted and losing the base offense they run. His success could see him having to learn a new offense as teams flock towards whoever is having success.

That's a pretty huge influencing factor.

j/c:

I have to go back to these comments from Gruden:



Man, that is strong stuff! Sounds like Gruden is done w/the Cousins' situation.

I don't know where Cousins will end-up, but I doubt it is in Washington.

Well, we got he bread to pay him.

I hope we do get him. That makes the draft so much more open. He will make Coleman look way better, and Gordon will be back to his dominant form.

Since the Veteran QB thread was locked I thought I'd quote Vers' last response in that thread here because it sums the situation up nicely.

My fear is we sign Cousins, pass on Rosen or Darnold, and end up in mediocre-ville or worse for the foreseeable future. If we sign him, it would be to a huge contract for at least four years and we're not going to "Garappolo" ourselves with Rosen or Darnold or put a target on Cousins' back with "the real"l franchise QB sitting on the bench who everyone would want to start anyway. Almost any other scenario that involves taking a QB at #1 works for me. This is the one that would feel like a stone in my gut.

I would add this:

While he wasn't the #1 overall pick. the Packers drafted Rodgers, and played Favre for several years. The Browns would control the #1 overall pick for a total of 5 years, if they want. (and the #4 overall as well)

I would take either Darnold or Rosen at #1, even if we sign a longer term veteran. I want as much talent in that room as possible, plus, you can never know when injury will strike the QB spot.

Do or do not. There is no try.

Get the best vet QB that you can and draft the best rookie that you can. Don't let doing one talk you out of doing the other. We have the money and the picks to do both and one of the above can be traded when we are certain about our QB.

I like the philosophy, just don't trust the process.

Because your getting a KNOWN COMMODITY with Kirk ... Rosen and Darnold could end up being way better than him or they could stink up the joint ...

Thats why ...

I would rather roll the dice on one of the young kids ...

That's where we differ. I prefer the known commodity. With the known commodity you have the extra high pick to fill other needs while still solving your QB problem. Either option works, I just prefer to know the QB problem is solved by someone who has been there, without the worry of if the rookie will translate to the NFL, not being a Manziel, Weeden, Quinn, or Kizer.

We have paid so dearly for the draft positions we have .. I hate to waste any pick we do not have to.

Bone, every team in the league would DROOL over a 27m a year Cap hit for a QB.

It'd mean the position is solidified.

Even if we go the route of QB at #1, we're still going to have that Cap hit in the future. Probably even higher.

Rosen and Darnold are BIG TIME. I don't care what Stephen A Smith and that Quack he debates with say.

Personally, I would rather go the route of Rosen or Darnold than Cousins. It's an AGE thing and I'm GREEDY. I want my QB around for 12+ years, not 5.

Vers. Here's a thought.

Rosen is our Aikman (Both from UCLA) lol
Gordon is our Irvin (Playmaker)
Guice is our Smith

Hmmmm.

I completely understand your line of thinking .... 100% ... its also VERY LOGICAL TO ME ... I just prefer to go the other way ...

I like Cousins .. i think hes very good ... above average ... i just don’t think hes that good ... hes going to more than likely be the highest paid QB in football ... and i like him .. but that not much ...

I like him but i don’t think hes as good as many on here appear to think he is ...

If we sign him ... i won’t be upset or anything .. I would just prefer to go the other way ...

I actually think we have NO SHOT at him ... there’s 3 or 4 other much BETTER, MORE SECURE landing spots for him ...

If i was him .. my agents first call would be to J-Ville ... that’s ONE HELL of a football team with Coughlin and Marone in charge ... VERY STABLE and I can’t stand Marone .. but he knows O ... very good coach ...

J-Ville is ready to win now ... if i was a FA QB this year .. that’d be my DREAM SPOT ...