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j/c

The Chiefs are $7M over the cap. If they had won this weekend, the urge to keep Smith might have been too strong, but his $20M contract ($17 against the cap) is pretty good incentive to trade him. Most teams would probably want KC to eat part of that contract while they negotiate a longer deal with Smith, but we have the cap space to eat the whole thing. That takes KC from -$7M to +$10M. If we offered to take his full contract off their hands and offered a mid round pick in return, that might get it done. He starts here in 2018 enters FA as a 35 y/o next year. If the Browns win 6 or more games, his agent can sell him as a miracle worker.

Hmmmm. I guess that's viable.

Except for those last 17 stupid words, I'm intrigued.

Smith for One Year. Rosen Darnold? Hmmmm.

What's the trade cost though?

Lotsa variables.

I'm intrigued with the McCown thing. Hmmmm.

We're NOT sitting the #1 pick for an entire year. Anyone thinking this needs to STOP.

My last sentence was an attempt at humor. Sorry you didn't think it funny.

As for sitting a rookie a full year, we have disagreed on this point before, and I still think it best. I agree to disagree. That said, if he sits half a season, it still works. Smith starts the first 8 games, the rookie takes over with Smith backing up, and Smith leaves in FA after the season.

I am sure Smith would love to come here knowing that was the plan. Let's see - please trade me to CLE (0-16 team) where I can play a half season until a rook takes over and ride the bench or maybe trade me to JACK or AZ where I can play for a few years on a good team with a chance to make the playoffs. What do you think, Mr. Hand?

I'd retire first...

I don't think Alex has any say in the matter.

Exactly.

Haven't heard of any no trade clause in his contract we'd inherit. Have you?

The only thing he could do is refuse to talk about an extension, which would be fine because we would likely want to start whatever rookie draft in 2019.

Then theres the small matter of the COMPENSATION ...

W/o and extension in place ... NO WAY DOES THIS WORK ... unless U want to give up at least a 2nd round pick for a possible one year rental ...

This is NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN on a few levels ...

Compensation? Anything more than a 3 I say NO WAY.

Gimme Mccarron and Darnold or Rosen. Done deal and start the dominant run.

Personally, I don't think Dorsey has Smith anywhere near Radar Contact. Different time, different team, OLDER QB.

And I'm HAPPY CAMPING

Well, someone literally gave us a 2nd to take a QB away. LOL

No take on my earlier question to you and a couple of others?

I think he has enough respect in KC that they'll do right by him.

I also think he could happily choose to threaten to retire if he's cast off to an undesirable situation. That's a PR nightmare for the Browns. Imagine the headlines. "Alex Smith prepared to retire if forced to Browns in trade."

We talk about building culture, but we're the first to say of a player that he has no say in the matter.

While I'd love to have a QB of Cousin's caliber (I think he's significantly better than any other FA QB available this year), I don't think our plans for him would jive with him. I want a more-than-capable FA QB to start this year and play well enough to get our fledgling but talented offense heading in the right direction until our rookie QB is ready to take the job. To me, that sounds more like Alex Smith instead of Cousins.

Well retiring rather than playing out a year would be kind of drastic with the millions he'd be getting in his next contract. His coach is gone and the GM that traded for him once, would be the one trying to trade for him again.

If he was closer to 40, I would say you have a point, but I don't think he's ready to walk away nor do I think he would threaten to.

I don't think NFL teams really care about a player enough to "do right by him." That's why I never bought the Jimmy G crap that some people brought up.

Guys like Joe Montana, Jerry Rice, Ronnie Lott, Johnny U, Reggie White, etc, etc have been unceremoniously dumped.

The NFL is a business.

I generally subscribe to the idea that Hoyer had more to do with the deal than Jimmy G.

But that Schefter article that came out a couple days ago has me wondering if maybe there isn't more to it than that.

A guy like Alex Smith is worth north of $150M. I don't think money means as much to him as a guy on a minimum contract who just wants playing time.

At this stage, do we really think he's going to want to go from 10+ win, pro-bowl QB, to being a stopgap QB on an 0-16 team, knowing they don't want him and have no future for him?

I doubt it. But, to each his own. Personally, I think there is a 0% chance the Browns land Alex Smith if the intention is for him to play a few games in front of the #1 pick. If the Browns get Alex Smith, he's going to be the Browns QB for several years.

If he plays until he's 40 he might meet or exceed another $150 mil.

As far as how long we play him before moving on, would depend on who we draft and how they progress. Even if the QB we draft manages to play first year, there is no guarantee that he would play well. We could franchise tag Smith if that were the case. He also could agree to a longer contract of say $22 mil a year for 4 years when we trade for him and we would have teams lining up to trade for a contract like that. It wouldn't necessarily lock us into anything.

Digging into this thought a little deeper, I tend to agree and like those 2 possibilities.

Why? IF we are dead set on Darnold or Rosen, and obviously it's going to take the #1 pick to land either, I am DEAD SET on the fact that we WILL NOT sit the #1 pick in the draft very long.

Mccarron works for obvious reasons having been with Jackson. This one would be an excellerator to getting the Rook ready. Knowing the playbook, able to Start if needed. We know what Jackson thinks about him. What does Dorsey think?

This is a Veteran Presence in the locker room and the QB Room.

Then there's Chase Daniels. Interesting thing about him is he was with Dorsey in KC and working alongside Smith, who is a TRUE Pro. Prior to that he's been under Drew Brees in NO and again this year. Another TRUE Pro. Pretty good company he's been around.

This is another Veteran Presence in the locker room and QB Room.

Those 2 are the guys not named Cousins we should be watching for.

I certainly agree with you in theory. A guy like Alex Smith would certainly muddy the waters and create a huge QB controversy at some point if we draft Rosen. If say a Smith/Cousins started winning off the bat, it would make it very hard to bench them for the rookie.

Yet at the very same time, we have been devoid of an answer at the QB position for a very long time. I could see a scenario where this FO isn't willing to gamble. That they may not be willing to risk the possibility that their draft pick may fail or succumb to serious injury ala Bridgewater.

It could really go either way.



I'm just baffled that people are promoting drafting a QB who may or may not develop into an NFL QB over a QB who is most certainly NFL ready. On a personal level, I've seen enough developmental QB's to last me a lifetime.

Any NFL GM who puts a players desires over what's best for the team who employs him isn't doing his job.

Firs to say that its amazing that Vers, after being disproved still keeps with his crap about JG, instead of retracting and apologizing to the ones that got the version right.

Second, a team and a GM success depends on the ability to find and attract talent, now it in the finding talent the way you treat your players and staff does not get much in the way, in order to attract talent the way you treat your players is a competitive advantage.

This is a question that goes beyond any business model, and is apart of the values of an organization.

You can have short term success if you treat your employees bad, but in the long run customers and people will prefer to buy and work for companies that they perceive are fair.

Much of the success of any winning team lies on the chemistry between coach and QB and the way the Coach and Team treats their players...

Just take a good look at the way the Stealers handled Big Ben this year vs how Kansas City treated Alex Smith,or the Giants treated Eli..

BB has a unique way of doing business, but one thing for sure is that he commands a high respect of his players.

BB did what he was told by Kraft to do and traded away JG. He didn't have to like it and wasn't about to put any effort into it.

From Pit:
"I certainly agree with you in theory. A guy like Alex Smith would certainly muddy the waters and create a huge QB controversy at some point if we draft Rosen. If say a Smith/Cousins started winning off the bat, it would make it very hard to bench them for the rookie."

I sort of get what you're saying here, but if a Smith/Cousins wins right off the bat, why would we WANT to bench them for the rookie? If the team is winning, that should trump playing the rookie.

So why did wake up Kyle to make the trade. I believe you are mistaken, and BB had an high interest in the trade, to the point he called a former assistant of him, and presumably a friend to make the trade.

You don't get to his status by not being fundamentally an integer man. He has many faults but he would never trade his QB for the future to the Browns and to Hue Jackson.

He could have got a 1st round pick for him if he wanted it. There are 30 other teams he could have called and a lot of those teams have ex assistants on them. Since he wasn't on board with trading JG, he wasn't going to do Kraft any favors.

He traded him to a coach he liked with a backup he liked.

We kind of agree if you think about it.

I think it was obvious from the start,but for some its really hard to see the obvious, I think.

I think its also obvious that the reputation of our coaching staff is going to prevent us from getting anyone good. Nobody sane would come and play here until things are sorted out.

Only the close friends of the mediocre staff we have....Its that obvious to me...

And even if you somehow believe any good QB would sign with us, than you will have to vastly overpay them, which will render all the work being done here useless.

Well the discussion was more about what we think they would do and why.

You never sit a winner.

The question is, will they sign a top FA QB or will they sign a lesser FA QB. And to me it all depends on their plan. If they plan to draft a top QB prospect they feel can start soon, an NFL ready QB like Rosen, do they sign a top tier FA QB like cousins or Smith?

If you wish to see my thoughts on that, you can read my post above that you quoted.

I think a QB room of

Rosen, Kizer and any vet (u used Moore as your example) is FINE ...

I want Kizer ... no way should we give up on him YET ... i don’t think hes going to be a long term starter BUT NO WAY should we give up on him ...

I want either Rosen or Darnold ....

So in my world those 2 slots are a done deal ... experience be dammed with those two .. *L* ..

There lack of experience is why i want the VET ... they need a guide in the room with them .. NOT A COACH ...

And just about any VET is good with me as long as they’ve got at least 5 years in the league ...

My version of the VET is someone like an AJ McCarron or even a Moore ... someone who will have a shot to start but won’t have to start ... there “main” job here is to mentor with an opportunity to play until Kizer or the rook prove there better ...

Thats my take anyhow ....

Could Alex Smith solve the Browns' veteran quarterback problem?

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ss...art_river_index

Updated Jan 8, 5:16 PM; Posted Jan 8, 12:55 PM

By Dan Labbe, cleveland.com dlabbe@cleveland.com

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- The Browns, as usual, didn't have a playoff game this weekend, but at least one thing might have gone their way when the Chiefs blew a 21-3 halftime lead to end another promising season with yet another disappointing playoff loss.

Even before the game, NFL Network's Ian Rapoport tweeted that the Chiefs could be open to trading their starting quarterback, Alex Smith.

"Kansas City won't actively seek out trade partners, but they will listen," Rapoport wrote on NFL.com. "There is a real chance Smith, who's set to make $17 million next season, will be dealt for the second time in his career."

The first time Smith was dealt ties directly to the Browns. That's because new General Manager John Dorsey had just landed in Kansas City as their GM and, as part of a flurry of moves, gave up the No. 34 pick that year and a conditional pick in 2014. That conditional pick ended up as the No. 56 overall pick that San Francisco traded to Denver.

It ended up being a winning move for Kansas City. Smith has started 76 games in his five years in Kansas City, the Chiefs have won double digit games in four of those five years and went 9-7 in the other, making the playoffs in four of those seasons and have now won consecutive AFC West titles.

Smith, for his part, has seen his completion percentage improve every season, peaking at 67.5 percent this season, has thrown 102 touchdown passes. He has thrown just 33 interceptions, with a high of eight in 2016.

In other words, he's a pretty good quarterback -- better than anything we've seen here in Cleveland since -- well, let's just say it has been a while. So why would Smith even be available?

The Chiefs are in a strange position. Despite all that regular season success, they have failed to advance in the playoffs, including their loss this past weekend to a team in the Titans who had release a statement backing their head coach -- after a playoff win. The combo of Smith and head coach Andy Reid has been unable to capitalize on bye weeks, on homefield advantage -- on everything teams usually parlay into playoff runs.

Meanwhile, they gave up last year's No. 27 overall pick and a third round pick plus their first-round selection this season to jump to No. 10 in the 2016 draft and select Smith's replacement, Patrick Mahomes from Texas Tech. Mahomes started Kansas City's season finale and threw for 284 yards in a meaningless win at Denver.

Smith turns 34 in May and Kansas City's cap situation isn't pretty. Their offensive coordinator just took a job as head coach of the Bears. If they could send Smith's salary elsewhere and hand the keys to Mahomes, it might open up at least a little flexibility. On top if that, if ever there were a roster that prime for an unproven rookie to drop in and play well, it's the one that operates at Arrowhead.

If Dorsey is able to pull a repeat of what he did when he first arrived in Kansas City, that would be an ideal situation for the Browns. I put together a list of free agent quarterbacks last week, and there are some options there, but none as enticing as Smith as a player. Unless the Browns are ready to hand the keys of their franchise to Kirk Cousins, they're looking for a placeholder more than anything.

Smith is good enough that there would be no rush to pull him off the field. He's old enough that no one would look at him as an answer at the position beyond the next season or two. He has been durable enough since leaving San Francisco that you could safely believe he could play an entire season -- though we know how that usually works out here.

As far as what it might take -- the Browns have three second-round picks to come up with something. Would some combination out of those three picks be able to beat out Jacksonville perhaps offering their first-round pick? You have to at least try. Those second-round picks shouldn't be treated as untouchable, especially in a draft where you're already adding two players in the Top 5.

It's all, admittedly, fantasy league style speculation at this point, of course. Maybe Kansas City rides it out with Smith or makes Mahomes beat him out for the job. Maybe they'd want to do right by him instead of simply taking in the biggest haul. Maybe they don't want to deal with Dorsey. Maybe head coach Hue Jackson would rather Dorsey ask about AJ McCarron again.

So it's more complicated than just making a phone call and throwing the picks on the table. Dorsey's been here before, though, and sometimes history repeating itself isn't such a bad thing.

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P.S. I'd be happy to have him on our team.

Plus he's never been in pool with swan, doesn't get drunk or smoke weed, no DWIs....and he's SMART. Hope he'd come to us....GO Browns!!!!

Thanks. Good post.

I really want us to draft Rosen and roll w/him. I am a bit concerned that we sign Smith because that means we will probably pass on Rosen.

I could be dead wrong, but I think not drafting Rosen will be a huge mistake.

I agree. Keep hedging your bets in every way that you can. If we have the problem of having too many good QB's, it will be a problem that we haven't had in 20 years.

Once everyone recovers from the initial shock, we can trade one away.

JMHO, Rosen is brittle and too opinionated, don't think he'd do well with grown men....like Donald more due to his size and attitude....GO Browns!!!

You know I respect your opinion, especially on QBs.

Personally, I think Rosen is quite a bit above Darnold. That doesn't make me right. I'm just sayin'....

I love the accuracy. I love the reads. The progressions. The movement in the pocket. The arm. The mechanics. The quick release. But again, most of all........the accuracy. Same as what I said about Jimmy G. I love QBs who get their receivers YAC.

Being that he has played in a pro style offense and is obviously good at reading post-snap coverages and going through his progressions.......the dude should start day one.

I am afraid that if we trade for Alex Smith, that we will pass on Rosen and take a developmental qb. That's almost certainly Darnold. Maybe Allen, but I doubt it. I know you like both of those guys and again, I respect your opinion on QBs more than anyone else on this board.....but, I still think passing on Rosen would be a huge blunder.

So again.............I am kinda of in a quandry about how we address the qb position. I think having an established, successful vet in the room is very important. Extremely important. I still can't believe we went into the year w/not one qb on the roster who had won a freaking NFL game. That is amazing!!! Yet, I want Rosen to start day one and it would really bother me if we passed on him and took a project.

I think if Josh puts on another 20 lbs (shouldn't be hard at his height) it would do wonders on the injury front. He is a little skinny in my opinion, but not obscenely skinny. I saw him listed at 210 somewhere but someone else mention he was 218. If that's the case, he has even less to put on. The head injuries scare me, but we'll clear up that risk with medical tests.

As far as his opinions, they'll grill him in the interview room and see if that is a problem.

In other words if we pass, we probably had a reason and if we don't pass it is hopefully because we did our due diligence.

I'm starting to lean more towards Darnold anyway because I think he has a higher ceiling, but I won't get upset at all if we take Rosen and we did our homework.

I was the one who said he was 218. That's what I saw listed. However, when I was researching today, one site had him at 210. So, I'm not sure of his weight.

I think he is similar to Goff in stature. Bigger than Matt Ryan and Tom Brady when they were in college. Probably very similar to Eli Manning's build. Peyton's too. I don't think any of those guys have been plagued by injuries. I have always thought wiry strong was stronger that weight room strong.

As far as hitt's assertion about him being "too opinionated." LMAO

Let's see:

--Accuracy Check
--Arm strength Check
--Anticipation Check
--Mobility Check
--Reading defenses Check
--Reading coverages Check
--Going through progressions quickly Check
--Quick release Check
--Political and social opinions OMG.......we can't draft that guy!