I figured this might be a good time to open a QB breakdown thread...and take a closer look at Baker Mayfield.
Like the QB breakdown threads from last year, this is a chance to take a much closer look at a QB prospect's game. Much more then casual impressions (which are fine btw) this thread hopes for discussion of a 1 specific game at time. And for specific plays to be broken down and discussed.
All are welcome and look forward to your observations and discussion.
CHS put together a good template and started a good discussion. His stuff along with mine will be reposted here
All are welcome with the expectation that specific plays will be discussed.
I rewatched the game and put all my notes into a spread sheet with varying criteria. I got a lot of the same conclusions you did. One thing that I really noticed this game is how strongly he rotates his hips while throwing. It's like watching a lightweight boxer, he does it so quickly. The throw you mention how he could have a bigger arm, when I watched the play, I thought his footwork was limiting his arm strength on it. He sort of hops around and doesn't get his back leg into the throw like usual.
Baker a lot of gimme passes manufactured through the offense. Play-action quick throws swings, screens and hitches....but that's what you get with some spread offenses.
A QB can only execute the system he plays in and Baker executed a high level in this game...didn't really miss any throws.
Didn't face a lot of pressure or have to throw from muddied pockets.
When he was pressured handled it well and made plays. Threw a couple off his backfoot. Flashed good arm talent on some throws and good improvisational skills...plays with confidence.
Plus displays of arm talent: 13:17, 9:20, (2nd Q) 11:36 (3rd Q) 3:32, 3:00/?(...could argue IF he had a bigger arm could have lead the receiver), (4th Q) 11:19
Well we passed on Clay Matthews son, we passed on Frank Minnifield's son, what makes you think we won't pass on Zues's son ... Oh Yeah John Dorsey
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
I kinda like “little zues” butbIDK, does he fit the type of OLineman that Dorsey likes? I can’t recall him drafting a guy with that kind of size. I’m going by his listed measurements of 6’8” and 345lbs. I think Dorsey likes more athletic types. That and I know he likes aggression from his Olibeman. I think Brown fits that with the way he tosses guys around sometimes.
Mayfield to Gordon would be DEVASTATING and unstoppable.
Don't forget his anticipation of using his TE/s as we got Njoku a bigger miss match then he had in College and I think he had the best TE. Also Devalve who just gets better each season.
Play action will have some nice results also if teams continue to game plan...Stop the run and let the QB beat us...well he would do just that!
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
Had to re-chart the whole game, lost my notes. Not that anyone is really reading or participating in this effort anymore, lol --------------------------------------------------------------
Here's my take: OU vs Ohio State
Baker a lot of gimme passes manufactured through the offense. Play-action quick throws swings, screens and hitches....but that's what you get with some spread offenses.
A QB can only execute the system he plays in and Baker executed a high level in this game...didn't really miss any throws.
Didn't face a lot of pressure or have to throw from muddied pockets.
When he was pressured handled it well and made plays. Threw a couple off his backfoot. Flashed good arm talent on some throws and good improvisational skills...plays with confidence.
Plus displays of arm talent: 13:17, 9:20, (2nd Q) 11:36 (3rd Q) 3:32, 3:00/?(...could argue IF he had a bigger arm could have lead the receiver), (4th Q) 11:19
Once the whole game is chartered, imho it gives a better view of the whole prospect and how the individual plays formed in a general impression stack up against the sum of all the prospects plays.
Do they resemble the defenses Wentz faced at North Dakota State?
Careful. I was pretty called an idiot for bringing this up.
Pretty much was told Big 12 defenses is a deterrent to drafting Mayfield, but the defenses (which are worse) in the Pac 12 is not a deterrent to drafting Rosen or Darnold.
The third play in that series 9:20 - I am *assuming* he's read the defense because that's a timing throw and he's dropping, throwing without waiting for the WR to get open and the ball is out as or before the WR makes his move. To me that looks like it will translate to the NFL.
The first play (3rd Q) 3:32 in the series - it's good but it can also be lucky. If he shows a consistent knack for that throw - so be it, maybe it's a positive and the fact he's doing that to OSU is another factor ... but there are QB's that chuck it up and have WR's that make the play great - and that isn't something transferable to the NFL necessarily.
The broken play 2Q 11:03 (1st & 10) - meh. You're going to get that. He seems to miss an easy check down to his left but who knows.
I don't know how hard they would be to find, but I'd be interested to see throws from the pocket where WR's aren't running wide open and he hits his guy in stride in a narrow window. . . and also I'd like to see evidence of progressing through his reads - at least to #2.
Last edited by mgh888; 01/12/1803:49 PM.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Also .. the 2nd play. . 11:45 (3rd & 4) . . how open was the WR? If he throws a catchable ball does he give a chance of an INT?? I don't know that he made a terrible call/throw other than not going to a different option.
Last edited by mgh888; 01/12/1803:49 PM.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
The first play (3rd Q) 3:32 in the series - it's good but it can also be lucky. If he shows a consistent knack for that throw - so be it, maybe it's a positive and the fact he's doing that to OSU is another factor ... but there are QB's that chuck it up and have WR's that make the play great - and that isn't something transferable to the NFL necessarily.
Quick question, out of curiosity did you view the entire youtube cut-up of the game and did you have a chance to look at the game charting that CHSdawg and myself put up? Or are you looking at the posted gifs?
The gif on this play starts when Mayfield is already scrambling, its not the whole play. This play starts with Baker escaping from pressure.
For me this play highlights Baker's ability evade pressure as eludes an unblocked edge rusher. It also shows his improvisational ability and his ability to throw on the run. It also shows me that he has good but not great arm strength.
Also .. the 2nd play. . 11:45 (3rd & 4) . . how open was the WR? If he throws a catchable ball does he give a chance of an INT?? I don't know that he made a terrible call/throw other than not going to a different option.
11:45 (3rd & 4)
Seems pretty cut and dry to me that the receiver is open on this play. He has a clean pocket but he's leaning on his back foot instead of stepping into the throw. The pass sails high. Baker was off target on this throw.
The third play in that series 9:20 - I am *assuming* he's read the defense because that's a timing throw and he's dropping, throwing without waiting for the WR to get open and the ball is out as or before the WR makes his move. To me that looks like it will translate to the NFL.
9:20
This play highlights his ball handling and ability to throw quickly and from a muddied pocket. After he executes the play-action he gets immediate pressure from up the middle. He is able to set his feet throw form the far hashmark (right) to the opposite (left) side numbers. That a long throw and gives a guage of his arm strength.
Quote:
The broken play 2Q 11:03 (1st & 10) - meh. You're going to get that. He seems to miss an easy check down to his left but who knows.
2Q 11:03 (1st & 10)
After he executes the play-action, he looks to the right side hitch/comeback route (labeled 1). He resets his feet to find his next progressions (labeled 2-3). Baker has #36 open but doesn't pull the trigger. You get to see him going through the progressions of his offense. But you also see him hesitate/hold the ball with a receiver open.
just looked at the giff - I don't have time to watch multiple hours of tape ... maybe closer to April if I am lucky.
No worries, i'm not asking you or anyone else to watch multiple hours of tape. I was just curious if you did watch the cut-up (only 9 min btw) because it would provide more context then just viewing the gifs.
Also, did you look at the game charts from CHSdawg or myself?
I ask because the plays are already broken down and categorized in the charts with a time stamp. That way you could look through the charts and choose which plays you wanted to watch based on the traits you were interested in.
Either way good convo and thanks for your contribution.
Timing and place does not sit well for us getting him. I'm telling you... the NFL Football people have a biased in drafting a QB under 6'1" in the first round...Manziel was the first ever to be drafted in the first being under 6'.
You got Aaron Rodgers dropping all the way down to 21? cause he was 6'2"
I love Mayfield I don't think we would wait that long or look to trade back that far. but odd are we will take QB #1 or #4 the latest...I don't think our NEW Football guys will use those picks on a QB that is under 6'1"
Now I would love for us to pick him at 33 if he is there. But we will not do that as a PLAN...
betch if still there at #32, the Pats will take him
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
I think our people could surprise you. I don't think height is the leading concern people assume it is. I believe they'll take the best QB. Could be Rosen, could be Mayfield. I firmly believe Mayfield is the top QB in the draft and I suspect I'm not alone. I don't think he gets past the 5th pick.
I know he's a different breed of player but Vick was even shorter than Mayfield and he was the first player taken in 2001. I think a once in a generation player that breaks the mold comes along every great while and I believe Mayfield is it.
I have no idea who we will take. I do think that Rosen is the best, but I don't profess to know who Dorsey will take.
And why do you only criticize my takes? I never see you criticize other posters for their posts on the football forums. If you think my posts suck so bad, why read them?
Hell, we got guys insinuating that Joe Thomas is a liar in the PFF, but you don't say a word to them. And you get on me about weird stuff.
Don't be overly sensitive. No, I am not criticizing you. I simply pointed out that you sent a sarcastic reply to Device about him championing Mayfield yet, you have done the EXACT same thing about Rosen.
I'm not even going near the people criticizing JT. I learned long ago that this entire forum is made up by people posting stuff as if they are better football minds than the people who are actually paid to make decisions, watch/assess and evaluate countless hours of tape, coach players etc. etc. Yet, where are all of us? We're all sitting on our butts posting in a fan forum and watching the team on our tvs. Because, we're fans with opinions. Nothing more, nothing less. Otherwise we would all have monthly checks printed with the Cleveland Browns logo on them.
I do not say that we should take or will take Rosen several times a day. In fact, can you post all the times I have said that in the last week or so?
device posts the same thing multiple times per day.
There is a difference.
But whatever, I was just having some fun and it wasn't even an insult. It was intended as a playful jab. Nothing more. But, thanks for turning it into something that was not intended.
As far as the rest........you have no problem criticizing me for my football takes, but you stay out of the way when others make football takes. LOL.......okay man.
Dude, saying it over and over and over again does not mean that the FO will listen to you.
The front office doesn't have to listen to me. I'm sure they can see for themselves. A former GM went as far to say he's a better QB coming out of college than Jared Goff. And Goff was drafted #1.
