DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Grading the Trades

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry. A+++

When this was announced my first thought was I hope we did not trade #4. When I found out we traded 2 3rd day draft picks I was ecstatic. Immediately improved the team.

#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor. D-

I do not like trading a high 3rd round pick for a bridge QB. Taylor does not excite me as a QB. He is an up grade from Kizer. I just do not like giving away a high draft pick at #65 for a bridge QB. It is obvious with this pick that QB will be selected #1. Darnold, Rose, or Allen.

#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall. A

Once the 2nd trade happened for Taylor it became obvious the Browns were taken a QB #1. Kizer is a developmental project and the shiney new QB taken #1 overall will fill the developmental role. He would just complicate things. Randall is an instance upgrade to the secondary.

#4 - DT Danny Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick. F---

All of the good feelings that came with yesterday's moves came crashing down with this announcement. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. The Browns again are the only franchise in the NFL that cannot show the ability to hold on to their own talent. Browns players never see a 2nd contract and we wonder why they are 1 and 31 in the last two years. This trade is in the same mold as letting players like Alex Mack and Mitchell Schwartz walk.

How do the rest of you Browns fans see these 4 trades?

IMO:

1. Landry Trade - B+ ... we didn't give up anything of value, but his contract will be very big (yes, I know we have a TON of money)

2. Taylor Trade - B ... he's not great, but above average. I think he'll be good enough for a year or so. My concern? We probably didn't have to give up a 3rd rounder IMO. Probably could have had him for less.

3. Kizer/Randall Trade - C ... I wanted to keep Kizer, but I get why we didn't. This is more of me worried that he'll develop into something.

4. Shelton Trade - C ... I guess it's nice to get something for someone who we'd cut (he wasn't a fit), but hate these swap picks/conditional trades

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry. A+++

A+ Self explanatory

#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor. D-

C+ Not Because of TT but I think we gave away a bit much in #65

#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall. A

A+ Kizer was damaged goods here and his inaccuracy will haunt him his whole career + we got a starting CB ... JMHO

#4 - DT Danny Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick. F---

A - Most of his tackles were downfield he wasn't worth a 1st ... JMHO

How do the rest of you Browns fans see these 4 trades?

I agree with you on #1 and 3. I don't see the Tyrod Taylor trade as a D. I would say a C+ or B-. I have liked Taylor from what I have seen. If we had played him in 2017 instead of Kizer, I believe we would have been 4-12 to 6-10, simply from him not turning the ball over, primarily in the red zone. Just simply changing the red zone turn overs into field goals easily changes the momentum in 8 of the 16 games. I think we gave up a little much for him, but starting quarterbacks have elevated price tags (see Alex Smith).

At first glance, I gave the Shelton move an F as well. But, after careful thinking, I realized that Williams simply did not like his skill set for what he likes to do on defense. And I like that we finally have a front office that is focused on getting players that fit the coaches instead of getting players they like, and making the coaches try to adjust to them. That is a HUGE improvement. I wish we could have gotten more for him. I would have liked a 3rd in 2018 and no sending the 5th, but I don't know what goes on behind closed doors (I still can't believe we got Landry for a 4th and a 2019 7th... that still blows my mind... so my "values" must be wrong).

So I give the Shelton trade a C. But, that C could elevate to a B if we were to make a trade or sign a big name defensive tackle in his place (Suh, Loteleli, or other).

I disagree with #2. TT is probably better than any QB we've had since we came back. A 3rd is not that much for a decent starting NFL QB. I would give it a B.

I was initially sad to hear about Shelton. Dude has game, and I would've liked to get a bit more for a good, young stud.
But the fact is he was picked up when we ran a 3-4. That's his strength and we don't do that anymore. We have a wealth of even younger talent behind him. We'll be ok.

As for Taylor, it would've been nice to get him for a little less. Especially this year with the glut of QB talent looking for a home. Still, he's a mediocre starting QB. Those are (most off-seasons) tough to find. He's a steady Eddie pickup... not the sexy pick. I'm ok with this. As long as we clearly get our guy in the draft, I'm good with this. It makes sense.

Landry.......A depending on the contract. If we give him 15 million a year the grade goes down.

Taylor.......A.. We got a good bridge and are only on the hook cap wise for one year. Much better choice than giving a stiff like McCarron big long term money.

Randle.....B. This could move up if he plays FS, but if he plays CB we probably overpaid because he’s a very average CB.

Shelton....F. To be fair we don’t know the specifics that led to this trade, but on paper it makes no sense.

#1 trade I grade A+
#2 trade I grade A
#3 trade I grade A
#4 trade I grade B

Shelton will end up being an over priced FA. Did not perform to being the #12 pick in the draft.

The cornerback from GB may end up being our starting FS. Kizer would not have played here.

Taylor for a 3rd pick is a steal.

Landry for a 4th and a 7th is beyond a steal.

I LOVE the trades. All of them. We are so much better today than we were a couple days ago. And we still have 5 of the first 64 picks in the draft this year.

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry.

This is a solid A in my book.

No real downside to this trade for us at all. Landry is a possession receiver who seems to compliment Taylor's skill-set.

#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor.

I give this trade a B+.

Taylor is a game manager and is likely better than any of the other veteran QB's we could have acquired in Free Agency.

Taylor also provides insurance for whichever rookie QB we draft in the first round. "Trial by fire" for our QB of the future is no longer necessary.

This also gives us more flexibility at #1 and I think it also gives us more leverage to trade down at #1 or at #4.

#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall.

I give this trade a B+.

Kizer (aka the turnover machine, aka the ham sandwich) was a lame duck QB after last season and the regime change. He was never going to be on the roster at the beginning of the season.

To get a viable CB ( a need of ours) in return is a win in my book. This trade also gives us more flexibility to use Peppers in the box (more in alignment with his skillset).

#4 - DT Danny Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick.

Umm ill give this one a C-.

This one is a bit of a head scratcher but starts to make ( a little ) sense if you think about it.

-Shelton is a 3-4 DT that doesn't fit Williams scheme. He was solid no doubt but was likely to get lost in the shuffle this upcoming year.
-We have good depth at DT.
-This may also indicate that we are looking to target an EDGE DT in the draft (Chubb at #4?)
-We still have a ton of draft capital and it is unlikely that many of our later picks end up making the team.

If the 3rd round pick from NE is conditional then I think the trade is a C+.

Overall Grade: B+. We are going to be competitive next year. Anything less than 6 wins and I will be disappointed.

Truly... if you look at the history of qb trades a third rounder isn't that bad for a starting qb... even if you only expect him to start for a few years... plus yo don't have to pay out of the nose for the guy and cripple your franchise more...

While I'm not a hue Taylor fan... a third rounder feels right to me...

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry. A+++

This was my most coveted FA and we got him for a song.

#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor. B

QB's don't come cheap and we got a great bridge QB for a 3rd rounder. If the pick was just a bit lower, I would have given this an A

#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall. D

Again QB's don't come cheap and Kizer would have been able to focus on his mechanics this year and would have been worth a lot more. If Randall turns out to be better at FS, I might upgrade this to a C but he looks like just a guy at CB.

#4 - DT Danny Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick. F----

Just plain stupid. We would have got a 3rd round comp pick for him if we just let him play out his contract. Teams should have been lining up to trade a 2nd for him and some probably would have traded lower first for him. Whatever team that drafts Vita Vea in the 1st round this year should have been the team that we traded him to.

I put this in another thread, but so far I think we took 2 steps forward and 2 steps back.

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry. Grade - A

Needed a good WR. Got one at a good price.

#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor. Grade - A

You have to look at the options and cost. Is he better than any FA except for Cousins .. YES Is he a starter... YES Is he young enough to be here a while .. YES Does he make the team better .. YES Is he better than any QB we have had since the return... YES


#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall. Grade - A

Kizer was never going to see the field as a Brown again. He did improve each game and was never going to improve on his accuracy issues, but may be a decent backup. Randall will be an improvement on Defense as an everyday player as either a Cornerback or Safety.


#4 - Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick. Grade - B

WE could have kept Shelton. Rookie contract, low cost, above average NT. Problem .. Browns run a 4 -3 defense, no Nose Tackle. Not a good scheme fit, so trade him before we let him go as a FA next year.

Kizer trade and Landry trades were great rest we were robbed. Wouldn't have given an 8th check down Taylor the bills were going to cut. Give away one of the leagues best run stuffers to a team desperate for a big run stuffer. Waste

I've been away and busy and just blown away by the activity.

Landry is a great pick-up. I'm disappointed to see Shelton go as he gave lots of effort and was a huge part of our run D. However Coley, Ogunjobi (sp), Brantley and the remainder seem to fit William's scheme more. However, for those bitching at Taylor for a 3rd. We used 3rd round picks on Colt McCoy, Cody Kessler and Charlie Frye. Taylor is better than all those guys. I'm not anointing him anything but for a better QB than we currently have on our roster, a 3rd is acceptable. We still have 5 picks in the top 64. Mind boggling.

EDIT: I see we are rumoured to be interesed in the honey badger. That would be a great pick up dependent on price (draft picks and contract). I loved him coming out and despite the injuries, he has been one of the best centre fielders in the game. Where we incidentally have a huge hole.

I like all the moves. I understand the moves. A third rounder for a starting, decent QB whose skills mesh right in with the stud slot receiver we just got is a great deal. TT doesn’t turn the ball over, has decent accuracy, and can move the chains.

How many times did we complain about 3-and-outs? Dozens?

How many times did we complain about interceptions? Hundreds?

So, we now have a guy who doesn't turn the ball over, moves the chains, and from what I have read is a very good teammate and locker room guy.

You absolutely can develop two guys. In fact the guys that get less snaps for game prep have more time for you to work with them.

If we traded Kessler or Hogan, I would have been more happy about it, but we'll regret this trade.

#1 - A 2018 4th round pick and a 2019 7th round pick to Miami for WR Jarvis Landry.
#2 - A 2018 3rd round pick #65 overall to Buffalo for QB Tyrod Taylor.
#3 - QB Deshone Kizer to Green Bay for CB Demarious Randall.
#4 - DT Danny Shelton and a 2018 5th round pick to New England for a 2019 3rd round pick.
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So lets look at these trades. Will any of them at all be playing for us in 2019? Right now it doesn't look like it since none of them have any obligation to play for us beyond this year. Now if that changes my opinion could change with it.

#1 a 4th and 7th round pick for a 1 year rental is pretty steep. Still for a player like this ... I give a C. It they get him under contract then definitely an A+

#2 A 3rd round pick for another 1 year rental. However, this fills a serious need and buys us some time for the QB we will draft. At worst we get a nice backup to cousins if we can't sign him. So I give it an A+

#3 So we give away a QB with a solid year of experience and who might have made a leap in improvement this year for a 1 year rental on a guy who we only get for 1 season. I seriously doubt he wants to take a paycut to play FS for us where he would shine. If they manage to resign him then I give this a B. If they can't resign him then I give it an F because it's way to high a price to pay for a 1 year rental.

#4 Trading away a first round pick who has had decent play for this kind of compensation is flat out stupid. There is nothing so great about a third round pick that made it worth giving up on this guy. Grade F.
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Overall I am not that impressed so far. It's a lot of fuss for 1 year rentals and I think we did nothing to improve beyond this year for a very expensive price. IF they get some of these contracts renewed though I am happy to change my opinion but for now that hasn't happened.

How do figure we will regret this trade. 1st he is in the NFC, 2nd he will sit behind Rodgers for at least 5 years, and 3rd he won't even be GB's backup, sorry Deputy but I don't think Kizer will make us regret anything ... JMHO

j/c

Landry Trade-- Very Good
Taylor Trade-- Bad
Randall/Kizer Trade-- Indifferent
Shelton Trade-- Bad

the only way the Kizer trade can be a negative is if he beats out Rodgers as the starting QB (darn near impossible). Otherwise, we are getting a starting CB for a backup QB.

not sure how this could be a negative?

And really a long term back up.... it could work out for both teams... we need DB and QB help now... Kizer is far from ready... maybe he sits four years behind Rodgers and will learn how to be a starter...

That's how I view it as well.

We also traded a second round pick for a first round pick.

I withhold my grades until we have seen how thing play out on the field. It's too early to judge.

No contract can be signed until after the player is officially on the team and league year has started. It has been stated that extensions are in the works.

With Randall, the club can extend his 5th year option by May, if he is not extended.

As to Shelton, I would have preferred to keep him to the end of his contact, but obviously Williams did not feel Danny was a scheme fit and wanted to move on.

Well that's why I offer better grades if they are resigned. At this point there is no way to know if that will happen or not. If they get resigned then I will have a lot more positive look on the trades.

Landry - B+

Shelton - C-

Kizer - C

Taylor - B-

Explain to us how you have a Starting QB in Taylor, a Rookie #1 Pick in say Darnold and a 3rd who you PRAY never sees the field, HTF are you going to spend time to develop TWO QB'S of which your PRIORITY lies with the #1 pick in the draft.

Rumor is we will draft two QBs fairly high, so the plan is to develop two QBs simultaneously apparently. . The difference is Dorsey wants his guys...no harm in that.

If we take 2 QB'S in this draft, REGARDLESS of where? NOW you can start saying STUPID MOVE.

Dorsey already has 2. He drafted Hogan and now has Taylor.

Have you ever been to a football practice?

Your starting QB gets most of the reps working on the gameplan. The back-up (sometimes the #3) will get some reps but that is mostly with the scout team. The rest of the time QB's 2 and 3 are working with a QB coach doing pitch and catch and working on mechanics. You have TIME to train 10 QB's. TIME is not a problem for any QB that isn't the number 1 guy. That guy doesn't have time work on mechanics because he is working on the gameplan. We didn't have that TIME for Kizer last year, but we had it for him this year. When GB puts that TIME into him, he is going to be worth a heck of a lot more than we got for him. He had enough talent to be worth the TIME.

Buy low and sell high is a good idea. Buy low and sell lower is not.

I gotta agree. Kiser is young, very young and needs to sit awhile. The poor kid didn't have much to work within the Browns. No receivers, Hue would not run the ball. Hue did the kid no favors. I hope Hue didn't ruin him. If Kiser can learn to be a little more accurate and make faster decisions he could still be a very good QB.

A - Landry Trade-- going from Coleman/Britt/Louis to Jarvis
A - Taylor Trade-- starting QB for a 3rd round pick
A - Randall/Kizer Trade-starting CB for a developmental QB
Incomplete - Shelton Trade-- depends on the compensation Shelton is one of the better run stuffing 2-gap DT in the NFL

Kevin Hogan is not going to be on the team.

HUNDREDS. From LCC to Berea.

Your #3 QB is an AFTERTHOUGHT.

Name ONE #3 QB who ever became SQUAT in the NFL.

And don't spew your typical BS that this QB was #3 for 2 MONTHS and got elivated to #2.

You WON'T develop some schmuck #3 QB to be anything when you're concentration is on your FUTURE #1.

You ain't developing TWO QB'S who are firmly planted as 2 & 3's. Not in a 4 year contract.

The Landry trade is a slam dunk. The compensation was very little. I don't see how anyone could not like. The Landry contract might be a different story.

Getting a starting QB who can play "winning" football for a third round pick is also a slam dunk. I've always liked Tyrod Taylor (I wanted him last off-season) and think he can excel if given the proper circumstances. Furthermore, we can now deploy our rookie on our terms instead of having to force him into action because there is no one reliable in front of him. With all that said, I wonder if we could have gotten him for less than the third round pick.

It was clear DeShone Kizer was gone pretty early into the off-season. We knew we were going to bring in some sort of veteran and draft a QB, that left Kizer as the third QB. He was likely never going to play another snap for the team. Getting anything for him, let alone a starter, is a great move. Swapping picks with the Packers doesn't amount to much.

The Danny Shelton trade makes sense. We are about to bring in a whole lot more players between free agency and the draft. Shelton was likely going to be gone after this season. I like getting something for him now (cost certainty) instead of having to cut a guy with more years on his contract. I wish we could have gotten more back for him.

A+
B+
A
B

Here is Bill Barnwell's column on the trades:

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/22706...r-jarvis-landry

Landry - A+ - Adam Schefter is reporting the Browns are already close to giving Landry a deal. Giving up a 4th and a future 7th is crazy low. Landry is slightly limited as a slot receiver who hasn't had much success pushing the ball down field, and his yards have never been high, but Landry not being a "perfect" receiver doesn't change the fact he's a Pro-Bowl receiver who is the best in the game from the slot.

Taylor - A- - I think Taylor is an underrated quarterback who has largely played with a team with a poor offensive line and limited receiver options after letting the talent they had walk. I honestly don't know if he's a stop gap, I'll wait and see, but the price doesn't deter me. We all remember how much last year sucked without a reliable veteran quarterback. If Taylor is able to hold it down while a rookie learns, which increases the chance of that rookie being the guy, then I'm happy to part with the pick.

Randall - C - I'm not sure he's a starter. Nice depth, still has potential, but I just don't see the plug and play guy that others are seeing.

Shelton - B - This trade is meh. The only reason it has a good grade is because the Browns were evidently not going to resign him, so Dorsey essentially got a 3rd round pick for a role player we had no intention of resigning. We've got nice depth already with Ogunjobi, Coley and Brantley so it isn't a terrible move.