DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2018 NFL Season 2018 NFL Draft Moving Down from #4

Ooooops ... i thought it was Fitz cause thats one of his strengths ... a MAJOR ONE FOR ME ...

I apologize for that ...

I don’t come here to make myself feel smarter tabber ... i made a mistake and mistook what u said ... but u just coldn’t resist taking yet another shot at me ... your turning into quite the sniper tabber ...

There certainly are some positions more important than others. I'd say the biggest being QB, DE, and LT (although, i wonder if the LT position isn't viewed as such a big deal now that a lot of edge rushers are rushing from the LDE position).

I'm actually interested on your take on that. Would you say the LT position has dropped a little in value?

I mean, in 2017, the first tackle taken was Garrett Bowles like at 20. And in 2016, Ronnie Staley was the first tackle taken at 6. Now a bunch of tackles were taken in 2016, and Laremy Tunsil had the photo before the draft smoking pot with the gas mask, but still...... And 2015 Brandon Sherrif was the first tackle off the board at 5.



Anyway, I guess we value what Fitz does a little differently. Because, I think he can play the deep zone, but will also be able to go up and play the TE's that are creating these mismatches.

I think Fitz holds a lot of value



I guess, I'll disagree with you on both accounts. And I like Ward and I like Derwin.

But my elite guys are still Chubb, Fitz, and Barkley.


FYI I like all three a ton. I'd be happy with any of them. I just think that Fitz is getting knocked a bit. Ward I'd put in right behind those three. But he's behind. I just think those guys are the elite group

I guess, I'll disagree with you on both accounts. And I like Ward and I like Derwin.

But my elite guys are still Chubb, Fitz, and Barkley.[/quote]No worries everyone has their own views. Oh, and I meant to type I have Derwin rated higher then Fitz not Ward.
I like all these guys. I have Ward rated higher then both Derwin James and Minkah because of positional value. For me an outside CB trumps a Safety.


Who is/why do you think Fitz is getting knocked?

I'm sorry, I said it wrong.

Not that he's getting knocked. I just feel like he isn't getting mentioned, or he's getting forgotten, instead for some other guys.


Maybe part of it is because we're so focused on QBs on this board, and a lot of that in the media, period

No worries.

I study up on all these prospects. I'm a draft nerd like that.

I have Ward as the top CB in my book and James is the best S.

And I love Fitz as a prospect. Had a long discussion with rastaplan about him.

Agree 100% .... same with McGlinchy the kid from ND ... hes a RT at best ... his lateral movement is not good ... bad feet ... but man is he big ... *L* ..

Been looking at Buffalo's Message board and they think they can get #4 for as little as a 1st, 2nd and 3rd and no future picks lol ... They are saying Cleveland always screws everything up (which was true) but they forget we have a veteran FO guy in Dorsey now ...

We'll see. A lot of my confidence in this FO circles around this number 1 pick

Regardless, we won't know for 3 years. That first pick won't play in 2018, then he will have 2019 as a "rookie" progression year, then 2020 will be his make or break when we actually find out what he has.

Personally, I think Baker Mayfield is the only QB in this class to challenge Tyrod Taylor in 2019. Sam Darnold could be on par with Tyrod, but if that's the case, why not just extend Tyrod? Everyone else has a steep hill to climb in my opinion.

MOST people would disagree with that, who's to say who is right and who is wrong? We won't know until 2020..no sense in arguing.

If Buffalo is drafting at #4 Cleveland has really screwed up!!!

CBS.Sportsline Link

1. Cleveland Browns
Josh Allen, QB, Wyoming: It's a coin flip for me on Allen vs. Sam Darnold. Part of me keeps coming back to how Allen is a perfect fit for what John Dorsey had with Alex Smith and Patrick Mahomes in Kansas City.

2. New York Giants
Bradley Chubb, EDGE, NC State: Gettleman wants to see a gold jacket type of guy when he takes him at No. 2. Chubb is that kind of guy.

3. New York Jets (from Indianapolis)
Sam Darnold, QB, USC: It's pretty bananas that the Jets would trade here assuming they are fine with any one of three draft prospects and that will work for them. But here they are, getting Darnold at three.

4. Buffalo Bills (via mock trade with Browns (from Houston))
Josh Rosen, QB, UCLA: This avocado-toast-eating intellectual benefits from avoiding Cleveland and landing in a spot where he can win the starting job right away.

12. Cleveland Browns (via mock trade with Bills (from Cincinnati))
Mike McGlinchey, OL, Notre Dame: The trade down pays off nicely for the Browns because they find a replacement for Joe Thomas in this spot.

22. Cleveland Browns (via mock trade with Bills (from Kansas City))
Derrius Guice, RB, LSU: And here's the argument for not taking Barkley in the top five. Trade down, grab a bunch more picks and come away with a quarterback, a left tackle and a running back of the future. John Dorsey will have praise heaped on him from high.

I don't think we're taking Allen #1 overall, but that's not why I'm pasting, otherwise this would go into the Mock Draft thread. This has the Buffalo trade here.

Assuming we did get our QB #1 overall, McClinchey and Guice + a 2nd rounder this year or a 1st next, would that change anyone's opinion on the potential trade?

I still want Chubb at #4, but if he's gone, do you draft Barkley or trade down to get a tackle+Guice like above.

Throw in our #65 we gave up for Tyrod Taylor and I'm with you ... It's the principle of the matter to me ...

I'd cry if we drafted allen at #1 and they would NOT be for joy. I would honestly rather not draft a QB than draft him.

#1 Take saquan
#4 Take chubb

alternate

#1 take Saquan
#12 Ward, Courtland, or BPA
#22 BPA

Anything but taking Allen at #1 overall

-jc-

My opinion: Stay at #4 unless you get that offer you can't refuse.


The Browns are in a possible unique situation. We have the ability to sit at number one, do our due diligence to find out which (if any) of the QB's in this draft is a Franchise QB and draft him.

Picks 2 & 3 look to be going QB if you believe many of the mock drafts and pundits out there. So the Browns can sit at #4 and still get the best player in the draft and hopefully the Franchise QB.

All the years of trading down to acquire assets was for a situation like this. I see no need to trade down. #4 is going to help this team win this year and hopefully will also be a perennial ProBowler.

Chubb and Barkley seem to be the two names people throw out at #4. I lean more toward Chubb because you can find quality backs in the second round. The drop off of RB's from Barkley to the 2nd round is not as far as the next guys behind Chubb.

Chubb and Garrett on that line....we can start putting tons of pressure on opposing QB's with the two of them.

But I would not be upset with Barkley and his dynamic play making ability. Just don't think RB's are critical in the grand scheme of things. Philly just won a SB and they don't have that elite RB. Ajayi was pretty much thrown off Miami.

JMHO

I'd agree with that.

I agree with that strategy given those circumstances, although I disagree with those selections.

We still hold the cards either way...
I still think that QBs' will go 1,2,3.

And the media darlings are typically chosen based on stats and highlight plays... Barkley has a ton of both.

Yes,...
It's a shame that he didn't come out a decade ago, because he is one hell'va good KO returner.

Also they are not paid to be right...

...that is assuming that they have not always been right.

The Chubb Barkley debate cup runneth deep. MG's injury history warrants needs to be accounted for. I think I take Chubb, maybe.

You cant teach Myles Garett athleticism, and you may not be able to judge motor in a Chubb.

We need to define safe pick, because #4 is more than important

With the amount of draft picks we already have, could we make an educated guess and say, we will not trade with Buffalo?

Fitzpatrict, Chubb and Barclay could all be there when we are on the clock at #4. We need impact players. I think it would be a huge mistake to trade down. History should have taught us this. More does not mean better. In our case it has meant average. We need to get playmakers not just players.

What if Buffalo trades #12 and #22 to Indy to move up to #6.
Now that want to trade their 1st next year and a 2nd this year to move to #4?

You are still guaranteed to get one on of Barkley, Chubb or Fitz.

There in lies the rub, I think a move down to #6 is the max play, I think we stay put at the end of the day.

We will see if he doesn't play this year. You seem to forget this is Cleveland. We get our QB's killed at a record pace. We can go from our first stringer to a guy off the street in a heartbeat. Kessler wasn't supposed to play his first season either... Or we could go 0-6 0-7 etc. Then starting the kid to get him some experience might seem like a better idea...

If Barkley is there I take him, If he isn't then if Chubb is there I take him, if both are gone then I'd take that trade. We could set our offense up for the next decade. Notice I said could... not a guarantee. But if it works out, having an elite running back in our division is a very good thing. If he is gone, and that is a possibility, then Chubb is a pretty damned good consolation prize. Bookend stud DE's is also a good thing to have. If it works out we could have a killer D line for many years to come. In our division that is a really good thing to have. Stuff the run and sack a lot of QB's. At #4 we are in the exact same situation as when we took Joe Thomas. It was a choice between Adrian Peterson and Joe Thomas. Either way you win... Both had awesome careers and both will be in the HOF. I think between Chubb and Barkley we will get one hell of a football player. Both seem to be into football and are excellent people off the field as well. I really don't want to trade back. It would take one hell of a package for me to say yes. The QB of the future plus either Chubb or Barkley? That is a winning draft right there. Then three more picks in the 2nd? If our new GM and front office people do their jobs right for a change we could get a lot better very quickly.

I still stay at 4. There is no guarantee I would get the player I want at 6. I might have to settle for my 2nd choice, I am tired of trading down and not getting my 1st choice. The Browns have a chance to get their 1st 2 choices in a QB and a positional player. This chance hopefully will never come again.

I could see something like that happening. I see 6 as the lowest we would go. Getting a 2nd or 3rd this year and a first next year and still get a quality player this year sounds great.