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I see each topic on a separate basis. Some have reasons to be optimistic. Some don't. I read your posts. You have no room to talk about being classless to anyone.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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I see each topic on a separate basis. Some have reasons to be optimistic. Some don't. I read your posts. You have no room to talk about being classless to anyone. I don’t kick people when there down ... Later ... Its been fun while it lasted ... Enjoy and Good Luck ... Have a nice life Pit ... BYE BYE ...
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Legend
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Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-most-improved-nfl-team-in-each-divisionMost improved NFL team in each division for 2018 AFC North  Key Additions: WR Jarvis Landry, OT Chris Hubbard, QB Tyrod Taylor, CB/S Damarious Randall, CB E.J. Gaines, CB T.J. Carrie, RB Carlos Hyde, QB Baker Mayfield, CB Denzel Ward, RB Nick Chubb, OL Austin Corbett, DE Chad Thomas Key Losses: LT Joe Thomas, QB DeShone Kizer, RB Isaiah Crowell, NT Danny Shelton, CB Jason McCourty There’s no replacing future Hall of Famer Joe Thomas on the blind side and the peace of mind he afforded the smattering of quarterbacks he blocked for over his career. When you look at the sheer multitude of talent they brought in over the course of the offseason, it starts to look far less consequential. The Browns brought in four different players who had grade of 80.0-plus in the NFL a season ago as well as four of the top 35 picks in the 2018 NFL Draft. The Browns arguably had a greater influx of talent than any team in the NFL this offseason. The cherry on the top is the addition of the No. 1 player on PFF’s big board – and owner of the two highest graded seasons we’ve ever given to a college quarterback – Baker Mayfield.
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I agree we APPEAR to look improved and myself are cautiously optimistic. However, until we prove it on the field with competitiveness and some wins it won't matter. It does appear we made some good moves and are moving in the right direction. We are long overdue.
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Legend
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I guess a part of this thread I am wrestling with is "Just how gap-pish are we?" Getting rid of some of the players who hurt us helped. Some vets helped. Some quality players helped.
Are we just in wait and see mode? We unavoidably must be. I still believe that without too much more, we can be much tougher to live with in games, that we are better than it seems on paper already.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Legend
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https://www.profootballfocus.com/news/pro-most-improved-nfl-team-in-each-divisionMost improved NFL team in each division for 2018 AFC North Key Additions: WR Jarvis Landry, OT Chris Hubbard, QB Tyrod Taylor, CB/S Damarious Randall, CB E.J. Gaines, CB T.J. Carrie, RB Carlos Hyde, QB Baker Mayfield, CB Denzel Ward, RB Nick Chubb, OL Austin Corbett, DE Chad Thomas Key Losses: LT Joe Thomas, QB DeShone Kizer, RB Isaiah Crowell, NT Danny Shelton, CB Jason McCourty There’s no replacing future Hall of Famer Joe Thomas on the blind side and the peace of mind he afforded the smattering of quarterbacks he blocked for over his career. When you look at the sheer multitude of talent they brought in over the course of the offseason, it starts to look far less consequential. The Browns brought in four different players who had grade of 80.0-plus in the NFL a season ago as well as four of the top 35 picks in the 2018 NFL Draft. The Browns arguably had a greater influx of talent than any team in the NFL this offseason. The cherry on the top is the addition of the No. 1 player on PFF’s big board – and owner of the two highest graded seasons we’ve ever given to a college quarterback – Baker Mayfield.
Btw all kidding aside you know who is a GREAT FREAKING PLAYER?
Ward this kid is better than my wildest dreams and he's a hard worker and will get better. Hope he's a Brown forever...him and Mayfield man o man what a difference than Gilbert and Manziel. Thank goodness we got the FO and organization we have now. Thank you Haslam, you have brought us a long way.
Just compare those two first round position picks. Manziel vs Mayfield. Gilbert vs. Ward....we got something to look forward to. And yes Pit, I'm speculating yada yada how can anyone know...well I can look and know. Two great players on our team now. I can't wait. Dynasty baby!
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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We have sucked for a long time, and we've set a record for sucking in the past 2 seasons. Recent historical performance is as good a gauge of future performance as offseason transactions. Gotta show which is true on the field.
Until we stop sucking, we still suck.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Precisely.
You are what your history says you are until you write a new history.
Until we actually do not suck, we still suck. Nothing else is proven.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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My cheer has been:
Go Browns! Don't suck!
All starters apparently have been deaf.
Go, Browns!
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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Funny how that works .... in this case ... The TALENT on this team will make this group MUCH BETTER LISTENERS .... 
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Precisely.
You are what your history says you are until you write a new history.
Until we actually do not suck, we still suck. Nothing else is proven.
Quoted for truth. We cannot expect respect until we earn it. We are at the butt-end of the league until we are not.
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Precisely.
You are what your history says you are until you write a new history.
Until we actually do not suck, we still suck. Nothing else is proven.
Quoted for truth. We cannot expect respect until we earn it. We are at the butt-end of the league until we are not. Just curious bro ... Am i suppose to walk around with my head up my ass and pretend that if we had a QB last year we would have won 3 or 4 games ... Am i suppose to bury my head in the sand and pretend we didn’t make MAJOR UPGRADES at every position on our team but OL and DL including a MAJOR UPGRADE at the QB spot (going from an historically bad season to below average - average is a MAJOR UPGRADE IMO .. ) I get it .. we need to prove it on the field ... but gosh darnit I’m not going to be all doom and gloom and IGNORE the FACTS ... NOT A SHOT IN HELL .. U guys can say what u want ... I’ll guarantee U everyone on our schedule and especially thiose in our division HAVE TAKEN NOTICE and know what this team is CAPPABLE OF ... everyone on our schedule knows were no longer going to be a walk in the park ... Were not talking super bowl contenders here .... were talking a legite shot at 500 .... We have WAY MORE TALENT HERE THAN EVER BEFORE ... not sure how thats even debatable ... End of the day ... this team need to PROVE TO ME THEY STINK when in years past they’ve had to PROVE THEY DIDNT STINK!!!! I can’t believe those words just came out of my keyboard ...
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Am i suppose to walk around with my head up my ass and pretend that if we had a QB last year we would have won 3 or 4 games ... You keep making this argument, but how does winning 3-4 games make you a good team?
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The AFC North is coming back to the Browns as much as the Browns are gaining on it. If it's a fact that we're improving AT ALL is better than what we've accomplished in many a year...
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You keep making this argument, but how does winning 3-4 games make you a good team? You could theoretically say that that's 3 or 4 more wins. And then the other upgrades we have should theoretically give us a few. I'm excited about this year. Hoping for six wins (or obviously more). But i'm very excited. Can't wait for the season to start. Esp after the Cavaliers screwjob I saw lastnight. I'm done with basketball (till Game 2), skipping baseball (cause the sport is boring), boycotting the World Cup because of no Team USA and because it's held in an Axis of Evil State, and ready for Training Camp!
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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It don’t ...
When folks talk about this year they start the convo with last years team won zero games ... thats true ...
My point is we won zero games but had enough talent to win 3 or 4 if not for our QB play ...
So even though we won zero games last year it was a team that had enough talent to win 3 or 4 games ... so using zero wins as your baseline to start talking about this years team is a FALSE BASELINE IMO ... its true but other than qb we did not have a zero win team ...
Thanks for asking ... i should have put that out there at the beggining of the discussion ..
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The AFC North is coming back to the Browns as much as the Browns are gaining on it. If it's a fact that we're improving AT ALL is better than what we've accomplished in many a year... Couldn’t agree more ... our division has been in decline over the last 2 - 3 years ... were not a good division anymore ... Pitt is not all that and the other two teams aren’t good at all ...
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Enjoy your summer dawg ....
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Precisely.
You are what your history says you are until you write a new history.
Until we actually do not suck, we still suck. Nothing else is proven.
Quoted for truth. We cannot expect respect until we earn it. We are at the butt-end of the league until we are not. Just curious bro ... Am i suppose to walk around with my head up my ass and pretend that if we had a QB last year we would have won 3 or 4 games ... Am i suppose to bury my head in the sand and pretend we didn’t make MAJOR UPGRADES at every position on our team but OL and DL including a MAJOR UPGRADE at the QB spot (going from an historically bad season to below average - average is a MAJOR UPGRADE IMO .. ) I get it .. we need to prove it on the field ... but gosh darnit I’m not going to be all doom and gloom and IGNORE the FACTS ... NOT A SHOT IN HELL .. U guys can say what u want ... I’ll guarantee U everyone on our schedule and especially thiose in our division HAVE TAKEN NOTICE and know what this team is CAPPABLE OF ... everyone on our schedule knows were no longer going to be a walk in the park ... Were not talking super bowl contenders here .... were talking a legite shot at 500 .... We have WAY MORE TALENT HERE THAN EVER BEFORE ... not sure how thats even debatable ... End of the day ... this team need to PROVE TO ME THEY STINK when in years past they’ve had to PROVE THEY DIDNT STINK!!!! I can’t believe those words just came out of my keyboard ... That wasn't my point. I am not trying to change your thinking and I definitely wouldn't want you to stick your head there. Thinking we could have won a few games last year with a better quarterback ... while very possibly true - it is a hypothetical. We didn't have a good QB last year so we don't know. I am not saying anyone is wrong for thinking that, but it is a hypothetical. Talking about how much we improved this off season - on paper I would agree. But "on paper", right now, is theoretical. Again, not saying anyone is wrong for thinking this either. But we will not get respect until we earn it. During the season. Look at the power rankings. We are #31. That's because this team has not actually done anything. That's my take. All this stuff is nice to think and hear and read. But it don't mean nothing until we actually win some games.
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We have WAY MORE TALENT HERE THAN EVER BEFORE ... not sure how thats even debatable ...
No, we have more talent than we've had for probably the last decade. We've had this much talent before, and we've had close to this much several times... and we've consistently done little with it.
End of the day ... this team need to PROVE TO ME THEY STINK when in years past they’ve had to PROVE THEY DIDNT STINK!!!!
It's all well and good that you feel that way, but I'm seeing it the other way. Having theoretical talent on paper is one thing... that talent living up to its abilities and the coaching staff using it appropriately are entirely different matters and all of it determines whether or not we suck. Again, we've had similar talent before - and done very little with it.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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We have WAY MORE TALENT HERE THAN EVER BEFORE ... not sure how thats even debatable ...
No, we have more talent than we've had for probably the last decade. We've had this much talent before, and we've had close to this much several times... and we've consistently done little with it.
End of the day ... this team need to PROVE TO ME THEY STINK when in years past they’ve had to PROVE THEY DIDNT STINK!!!!
It's all well and good that you feel that way, but I'm seeing it the other way. Having theoretical talent on paper is one thing... that talent living up to its abilities and the coaching staff using it appropriately are entirely different matters and all of it determines whether or not we suck. Again, we've had similar talent before - and done very little with it. From what I can remember, almost all seasons fans consider that we had lots of talent.. So this is the Browns being the Browns, then game 1 comes and reality sinks in....
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While I'm certainly hopeful for this season, I'd have to say I see it much the way you do. I've heard the word potential so much, with such little results, just the thought of that word makes me throw up in my mouth just a little bit.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Yeah I get it oober...I have said it often we got to start winning or else its just talk.
Still exciting cause of the youth we had the last two season and the worst QB situation on our O making it so hard to win. 16 we lost our starter n back up in two games having to play our 3rd. round rookie.
17 playing our #52 pick QB who was not read for the NFL and might never be. We just had no chance. Now its different. We went and got Vets for just about all the position groups we have strengthened our two most influential positions for the sucking facor. D our DB is tremendously improved. O our QB position amazingly improved.
We got weapons on both side maturing and several on the O just not here. Look at our WR group this time last year. Amazing transformation.
So there is a lot to look forward to and the chances of HOPE seem more realistic. But as you stated. We got to win baby or else its all for naught!
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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My 2 cents based on the ranking in the OP.......
Offensive lines - Agree
1. Steelers –
2. Ravens –
3. Browns –
4. Bengals –
Runnings Backs - Disagree
1. Steelers - L. Bell, J. Conner, F. Toussaint
2. Browns – C. Hyde, N. Chubb, D. Johnson
3. Bengals - G. Bernard, J. Mixon, B. Hill
4. Ravens – A. Collins, J. Allen, K. Dixon
Wide Receivers - Agree
1. Steelers – A. Brown, J. Smith – Shuster, D. Heyward-Bey, J. Washington
2. Bengals – AJ Green, B. Lafell, T. Boyd, A. Tate, C. Core
3. Browns – J. Landry, J. Gordon, C. Coleman, A. Calloway
4. Ravens – W. Snead, M. Crabtree, J. Brown, B. Perriman
Tight Ends - Disagree
1) Steelers- Jesse James, Vance McDonald, Xavier Grimble
2) Browns- David Njoku, Seth DeValve, Darren Fells
3) Ravens- Hayden Hurst, Mark Andrews, Nick Boyle, Max Williams
4) Bengals- Tyler Eifert (stays injured), Tyler Kroft, CJ Uzomah
Quarterback - Disagree
1. Steelers – B. Roethlisberger, M. Rudolph, L. Jones
2. Ravens – J. Flacco, L. Jackson, RGIII
3. Browns – T. Taylor, B. Mayfield, D. Stanton
4. Bengals – A. Dalton, M. Barkley, L. Woodside
Front 7 - Disagree
1. Steelers – C. Heyward LDE, J. Hargrave NT, S. Tuitt RDE, B. Dupree LOLB, J. Bostic LILB, V. Williams RILB, TJ Watt ROLB
2. Ravens – B. Williams DT, M. Pierce NT, B. Urban DE, T Suggs OLB, CJ Mosley MLB, P. Onwuasor WLB, A. McClellan SLB
3. Browns – M. Garrett DE, T. Coley DT, L. Ogunjobi DT, E. Ogbah DE, J. Collins SLB, J. Shobert MLB, C. Kirksey WLB
4. Bengals – C. Dunlap LDE, A. Billings NT, G. Atkins RDT, M. Johnson RDE, N. Vigil SLB, P. Brown MLB, V. Burfict WLB
Secondary -
1. Ravens – J. Smith CB, B Carr CB, T. Jefferson SS, E. Weddle FS
2. Steelers – J. Haden CB, A. Burns CB, M. Hilton CB, S. Davis SS, T. Edmunds FS
3. Bengals – D. Kirkpatrick CB, W. Jackson CB, G. Illoka FS, S. Williams SS
4. Browns – D. Ward CB, EJ Gaines CB, T. Carrie CB, Boddy-Calhoun, D. Randall S, J. Peppers S
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Diamdawg isn't much for history- more talent than EVER before- check the All Pro listings for teams in 50s,60s, and once in 70s- we had 8 Pro Bowlers on team- Jack Gregory,Gene Hickerson,Fred Hoaglin,Jim Houston,Walter Johnson,Leroy Kelly,Bill Nelsen, and
Paul Warfield. Please name more than two on today's team. We have vastly improved....but in our history- not close and I'm old guy, we were World Champions on my watch-64- and fondly remember smoking Johnny U and FAVORED Colts 27-0....Go Browns!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
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Legend
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*L* ... by history i meant since our return not going back to ANCIENT HISTORY when we actually WON games I didn’t reply to those guys cause i dont want to get down in the weeds with that argument ... not worth the time ... But since u brought up I must ask ... SINCE our RETURN ... witch team has had as much TALENT on it as the one were gonna send out this year ... Its not like the bars high ... we’ve had one 9 win and one 10 win season since our return ... we have not had a winning season or even a 500 recorded in A DECADE ... I contend that u guys have been way over optomistic since our return and have therefore been burned way to often and thats affecting your ability to see the TALENT WE HAVE ... I have never even really been optomistic so i have not been burned by the results like the majority ... If u refuse to aknowledge the TALENT WE HAVE TODAY cause of PAST RESULTS ... thats on U, not me ... PS. My nuts are fully recovered ... thanks for asking the other day ...
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if Kendricks comes here, he adds to our LBs IMO
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns Closing the AFC North
Talent Gap
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