DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum LB Mychal Kendricks To Visit Browns This Week

Maybe. But either way, contract-wise we're better off keeping him this year. His salary is guaranteed in 2018 and if we cut him we lose another 2.5 million dollars on top of his 2018 salary.

Cut Collins in 2019 and we start saving money.


Maybe a trade is possible (and we could re-coup our losses), but i doubt anyone wants to trade for Collins and pay him something like 12 million dollars a season.



That's why this move (signing Kendricks) left me a little puzzled. But, we'll see how it goes. Now we have one of the better backup LBers in the league, and I guess his versatility should help us as the first man up.

I don't see Kirksey going anywhere, nor Schobert on his rookie contract. Since it's doubtful someone would want to pay for collins, and I think Avery will certainly be in the plans; Burgess and any other LBers are really going to struggle to make this team.

I agree, at least in principle.

If Kendricks is ready to go, and we find that Burgess has taken a step forward ... and Avery looks ready to help .... and Carder is back to being a great special teams guy .... and Collins looks a lot like he did last year ..... then I could see them, possibly, moving on from Collins.

I don't see them making a decision on that right away, though.

Agreed. Me personally, I'm a fan of Collins.

And competition at the LBer spot can only help us.

Makes no sense of releasing a guy just to release him.

The nice thing is that we have depth. Kendricks can play multiple positions. So can Collins. And I'm willing to bet if we need Schobert to slide into the SAM position, he can do that.


One guy of those three goes down and we're not stuck trotting out Burgess or hoping that Avery can show up

Thanks, you two, for the common sense posting.

I think Carder will be gone. Burgess is decent on special teams, and the new Special Teams Coach doesn't really hold any allegiance to him.

I just think we're too deep at LBer right now (to keep Carder).

It's a passing league, and we're a 4-3 team. With Avery, Kendricks, and Burgess, that's six LBers. I wouldn't be surprised if we only kept 5 LBers and tried to find some guy we could put on the Practice Squad next season. At most, I don't think we'd have more than 5 LBers eligible on the gameday roster

James Burgess would be eligible for practice squad, although highly likely to be claimed off waivers

I may be wrong, but didn't they just resign Carder a few months ago?

Not that it matters really... Just asking

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cleveland-browns/tank-carder-9968/

One year contract. I don't think any guaranteed money. I'm not sure what they mean by Cap Hit vs Base Salary. Maybe Cap Hit is the money toward this year's cap?

Forgot about Burgess ... he played quite a bit last year. Wasn't very good, but well see now

Some people thought he was, I thought he was always a step late to the play.


https://twitter.com/Schultz_Report/status/1003434647978696705


That part right there is news to me. Start from Day One? I've never really heard of this Schultz guy. Could this just be his opinion or was Kendricks given assurances?

So did he sign with us or not? Seems like everytime there is a report of him signing with us, there is a profanity laced response from him saying that it is not true.

lol, he signed. My question is, what's this "Will start from Day 1" thing?

Is he starting over Kirksey? Collins? Schobert?

Jamie Collins is one of the most over rated players in the NFL... hope he does not start another game for us

Burgess had 12 tackles for loss, but he also ran himself out of plays at least that many times. He did have 4 sacks and a forced fumble. He had some good, but also some really bad. I think that he was, overall, below average. At least some of that may have been that he was an inexperienced guy, (and Williams's defense is very complicated for a young player to learn right away) but I think that he has some tools that could allow him to be successful in the league.

yeah, burgess at least gained experience. We'll see if he can eliminate the bad

I think Kendricks will start in Kirksey's place and Kirksey will compete with Schobert at MLB. Kirksey was good when he played inside in the 3-4 we played before but last year he struggled playing outside.

Kendricks - Kirksey - Collins

Schobert/Burgess backup

Kendricks signed up for one year...Say he moves on next season...Then what does the Browns do ? another FA signing for a year or two..or draft a guy that stays with the team for several seasons ?

My guess is that we'd do both, and if we can get the replacement high in the Draft and he pans out early, the veteran is immediately a solid backup.

This FO doesn't seem to put all of its eggs in one basket. Across the board, it looks like every position group they've addressed has been done like this.

What if he plays really well here .. the team wins ... and he wants to be here?

Maybe he re-signs for 3 or 4 years. Who knows?

Honestly, i'm not that worried about backup LB depth next year. An inexpensive FA next year, Avery improving, maybe Burgess will still be here.

I think it's too early to really be concerned with backup LBs next season. Especially when the three we have are pretty versatile

J/C

I never understand why when we sign a player that makes a unit better, either by that guy being depth, or him being better than the starter and making the starter depth, do people want to negate that by releasing someone else? I would get the contract argument if we were close on cap,, but we have plenty of cap space for the time being

I do think I understand the logic of considering who will get cut when someone is signed.

There is a 53 man roster in the NFL. When you add one, one leaves. The amount of players kept at each position is usually pretty much the same unless you switch from a 3-4 to a 4-3 or vica versa.

Exactly. It's not like I don't like Tank Carder or James Burgess, but we're limited by roster size.

In today's NFL, when running a defense with predominantly two DE's and two DT's, you're limited on how many LBs you're going to carry. Especially with how often you have to run Nickel because of how offenses are run nowadays with three and four receivers being the norm

Right , I get that signing Kendricks will mean someone will lose a roster spot. I am just saying why would people think that roster spot would come from the top of the depth charts? It should be the bottom man is gone. Which surely isnt Jamie Collins

Exactly. It's like cutting your 2nd best corner to save money because you signed a cheaper but slightly worse DB. Find the guy on the bubble and cut him (no offense to him). Don't cut talent that can help. {See Haden from last year}

This.

On a side note, I really like Burgess. I hope he gets some opportunities to shine.

Can anyone refresh my memory but I remember a lot of people saying Gregg usually doesn't operate with three LB'ers on the field much anyway, but from what I recall of last year what I did watch - we did so and did so frequently.

Can anyone with a better memory confirm, deny and etc this?

On the topic of the thread, I like the idea of moving Kirko to MLB and Collins/Kendrick outside of him.

Good guy to have in the rotation. Keeping everybody fresh. Nice move.

interesting on NFLN they said they Browns defense became too predictable with personnel last year; teams knew what we were doing

This move changes that a bit

I agree. I don't see any upside in releasing Collins.

Doug Hendrickson
‏Verified account @DHendrickson41

It’s official with @MychalKendricks and @Browns let’s go!
1:35 PM - 4 Jun 2018

His agent, Doug Hendrickson, announced on Twitter that the deal was done on Monday.

I agree, I was excited at first about the prospects, but he has proven to under-perform.

Plus Genard Avery

good call! how could I forget my favorite player

What does signing linebacker Mychal Kendricks mean?

By Dan Labbe, cleveland.com | Posted June 04, 2018 at 07:44 PM


CLEVELAND, Ohio -- There was one position noticeably absent from the mass additions of veteran players John Dorsey made this offseason: linebacker.

The Browns added cornerbacks. They added a safety. They brought in running backs and linemen on both sides of the ball. They signed wide receivers. They even traded for a veteran quarterback and signed another.

Through all of this, the trio of Christian Kirksey, Joe Schobert and Jamie Collins at linebacker went relatively undisturbed. That is no longer the case with the addition of linebacker Mychal Kendricks. The Browns agreed to a one-year deal with him on Sunday.

What does it mean?
Let's start here: the Browns had two of the top five linebackers in the league a season ago in defensive snaps played. According to FootballOutsiders.com, Joe Schobert and Christian Kirksey each played every defensive snap.

Jamie Collins and James Burgess combined to play 980 of the Browns' 1,072 defensive snaps. Burgess filled in for Collins when he was injured last season.

So Gregg Williams used a lot of three-linebacker looks last season.

This is a little surprising. Williams' recent history suggests that hasn't always been the case.

Looking at data from 2016 compiled by Football Outsiders, the Rams, with Williams as defensive coordinator, played Mark Barron 1,086 defensive snaps and Alec Ogletree 1,089 defensive snaps. No other linebacker played more than 122 snaps.

In 2015, according to the NFL's Game Statistics and Information System, Williams' top two most-used personnel groupings included just two linebackers. The same goes for 2016. Last season, you have to go all the way to the tenth-most-used lineup to find less than three linebackers on the field for the Browns.

What does this tell us?
Last season appears to be an outlier for Williams. With the way the NFL is trending, three linebackers at a time is generally a dangerous recipe. The best teams in the league are passing more often and on earlier downs and that puts pressure on a traditional setup at linebacker.

The Browns' three linebackers are an athletic group. Schobert dropped weight last season to feature his speed, while Collins came to Cleveland touted as a strong coverage linebacker. Kirksey is more of a rusher, but his versatility allows him to play all three spots.

Part of the reason Williams went with so many three linebacker packages stemmed from a lack of trust in his secondary. The cornerback position has been completely remade, now, and the hope is that Jabrill Peppers can thrive at strong safety. Damarious Randall will play at free safety, but he has the ability to slide to corner and cover. Briean Boddy-Calhoun can line up at nickel and drop back to free safety. Derrick Kindred could be a useful piece if he's limited to working against the run.


So ...
That versatility in the secondary and the flexibility along the defensive line means we will see something very different in 2018. The word different here could mean any number of things, including:

1. Collins has time to get healthy

Head coach Hue Jackson said last week that Collins should be ready to go by training camp, but, if he's not, there's no rush to get back with Kendricks in the fold.

There is versatility in the front seven

If the Browns carry four starting-caliber linebackers into the season along with their current group on the defensive line, Williams could employ some interesting looks up front. He could play two defensive linemen and some combination of linebackers. He could roll out the old Romeo Crennel 'UFO' defense. Or ...


2. ... Collins could get some time at end
Not often, but Collins, listed at 250 pounds, could put his hand in the dirt on occasion. He has the athleticism to cause problems for a slower tackle and it would allow the Browns to move either Myles Garrett or Emmanuel Ogbah inside on certain downs.

3. There will be real competition at linebacker

Kirksey and Collins were written in pen a season ago. Schobert, meanwhile, was competing with Tank Carder and got the job when Carder was lost for the year in the preseason. (I think Schobert would have won the job, regardless.)

Yahoo's Jordan Schultz tweeted on Sunday that Kendricks will start from Day One.

If that's true, one of the returning three won't. Could Kirksey move back inside and push Schobert out? Is Collins in trouble following a season-and-a-half of flashes without consistent production? Even though Kirksey is likely safe, anything could happen with this new front office.

Competition everywhere. Including, now, at linebacker.

https://www.cleveland.com/expo/erry-2018/06/b7ecc6d6081063/what_does_signing_linebacker_m.html

and



I was the one who mentioned Collins, so allow me to explain, since you have questioned my logic and Memphis said there was no common sense in my thinking.

First of all, I am not saying that Collins will be traded. And I doubt he is cut.

People are speculating about the unit and rightfully so. Diam said Schobert would be replaced. That makes some sense.

I wonder if the guy might be Collins because I think he has vastly underachieved since he's been here. He was dead last among LBers in pass coverage in PFF's ratings in his first 8 games in Cleveland. He had a terrible overall rating by PFF last year. Burgess actually had a higher rating.

Additionally, he is making pretty good money. We also have to consider that BB gave him away for a stinking 3rd round pick in the middle of a season in which the Pats were battling for another Super Bowl appearance. They eventually won that Super Bowl. That seems strange to me.

So while I am NOT saying that Collins will traded or released, my deductive reasoning tells me it is not lacking in common sense or illogical.

And after all, this is a message board about the Browns and it is not all that wrong to speculate a bit.

I hope that explains my reasoning and position a bit more thoroughly.

I find it hard to believe Kendricks was signed just for depth. I'm thinking Collins is on the hot seat. Schobert made the pro bowl and played every snap last year. He should only get better. Kirksey is also young and played every snap as well. Kirksey is solid and on the upswing. Collins might be athletic but he is coming off an injury and has not played that great in my opinion. I would say unless Collins has a big training camp, he may not make the team.

or maybe Collins isn't progressing as quickly with his health as hoped

That is a possibility, too. Good call.