DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Russian Spy and the NRA

Target: GOP and Religious Right

Mission: Flip their views on Russia

hmmm...

I think in the grand scheme of things this is knight takes rook.

There is a strategy that is being played by Mueller, and this was a bold move that alters the game.

Russia blocked Romney as Secretary of State and might have put Tillerson forward for Trump! Potential evidence discussed in this video. Did Russia pick the cabinet?

You could not possibly, more loosely link those two together. This Russian spy piece is wild speculation being passed off as fact.

A Russian female who joined the NRA. I don't think literally anything else in the piece was corroborated.

Let me follow this one:

- Maria Buttina asks a political opinion…..to a political person….Alexander T….if he liked the pick
- This guy is sanctioned from the US
- Trolls made trump not pick Mitt Romney…..LOL
- Said trolls were “delighted” they did not pick Romney…..WOW he didn’t pick the guy they didn’t want, what a shock they were happy about it…..?
- There is a photo of them together.



Sure it warrants looking into, but this seems like a media driven story more than anything. This is partisan stretch at every angle. At no point were they able to provide anything but circumstance and some Russians, and they even threw in my favorite RUSSIAN TROLLS!


Let me boil this down:
This is linking a random NRA, Russian female living in America (who admittedly was clearly interested in our politics).…..sending DM’s on twitter to a Russian official. “RUSSIAN TROLLS” were delighted that Trump did not pick the candidate the said “RUSSIAN TROLLS” hated.

This is at worst McCarthyism and at best a gigantic stretch.

Do you actually believe that someone can be arrested or that charges could be brought forward based on your synopsis?

Edit

I think that they can arrest anyone for any reason they want.

This specific woman I am certain that they have something, but the media certainly does not. Drumming up a spy conspiracy based on twitter DM's is literally what they did here.

Actually it's the government that believes she's the spy, not the media. But I think we can agree that the media is drawing some pretty far out conclusions as to why the government thinks she's a spy.

She very well may be a spy, they are throwing poop against the wall as usual.

I take more issue with their absolute certainty of it. It's dishonest. Give me the facts and admit you're speculating and let me use my brain.

I would just like to ask you if you're surprised? I look at all different forms of media. Both conservative and liberal. Then I have to decipher both and find that the truth usually falls somewhere in the middle.

Both sides stretch, bend and twist any form of truth into exactly how they wish to make it sound. There is no innocence here from either side. I think forming some sense of outrage on either side of such a topic is disingenuous.

We should both know that each side of the media is FOS by now and not only be used to it, but hold both sides to the same standard. A standard neither side seems to live up to.

Here is the link to the affidavit for the filing against Butina


https://www.justice.gov/opa/press-release/file/1080766/download

In a 30 second google search, here is info on Person #1. U.S. Person 1 hasn’t been identified, but the New York Times (and many other outlets) have “previously reported that Ms. Butina developed a close relationship with Paul Erickson, an N.R.A. member and longtime conservative activist who was part of the effort to arrange a meeting between Mr. Putin and Mr. Trump.

Did you miss the part about her messaging that she is awaiting further orders and being sick of having to live with and have sex with "person 1"? But hey, that might be secret NRA gun talk or something...

Maria Butina: Russian gun activist at heart of US Kremlin row


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44885633

This is as unbiased as it gets, you draw your own conclusions.

Dude, this directly contradicts themselves in the first article from the BBC in this thread. That was posted 4 days ago and they are already walking it back? Unbiased?

Edit: sorry it was the same picture that MSNBC used from this article. Nonetheless the point remains.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-44854365







A non radical liberal at University, it's not a surprised she is facing backlash.



So now we are going to believe Russian press when it's convenient to, got it.




An unpaid intern, being used to translate, doesn't seem like a stretch to me.


They continue to bring up gun rights to try and drive home this narrative that anyone who likes gun right must be some animal.





Look it is very possible that the US government has some damning information. However, this articles sources are some pretty inane comments on social media and message boards. If she were charged with being a spy "a couple years" in jail would definitely not be what she was looking at.


I dunno, like the MSNBC video, this seems to be cobbled together and a lot a speculation based on preconceived notions on gun owners and Russians. Certainly she had some very loose ties to government officials but I wonder how many unpaid interns they churn through in a single year, probably hundreds.

I will wait for some evidence that sounds more than speculation.

Well now that Putin will be visiting America, we will be able to ask him about all this.

Putin is an animal and the only reason I like Trump wanting to help him is that Russia is not doing well. You do not want to back down a hungry animal, you throw him a bone and keep him from lashing out at the pack.

If there is some espionage or treason I will be the first one to say "Grab the rope". Not backing a dangerous man into a corner is a good thing, not a bad one.

Agree 100 percent.

Don't go to war with the other half of the world's nukes.

If Putin would nuke another country (US or otherwise) due to economic issues, then he is too insane to deal with at any level of diplomacy. If you think he is a man with his wits about him, then there is very little reason to capitulate with our 30th largest trading partner.

Giving him Crimea was giving him a bone. Now we've almost let them out of the corner that Reagan pressed them in.

So back him into a corner then.

We were doing that strategically, and then Trump showed up.

NATO exists almost entirely because we don't want Russia to encroach on Europe. It has its problems but just like you don't fix a hangnail by killing yourself, you don't fix NATO by disbanding it. Yet our president curiously seems to want to get rid of NATO.

The president saying it's an "incredible offer" to send Americans to Russia to be interrogated not just puts Americans at risk, it puts Russia on the same pedestal as us. It makes no sense. Unless perhaps, you want to increase Russia's power on the world stage.

There are other examples but those two stick out to me as recent examples. Those are just in the last few days! US policy for decades has been to keep a sphere of influence around Russia, and we are hell bent on undoing that. The justification the WH is giving is that if we don't kneel before Putin, he will go to war with us. Putin is an evil man but not crazy. He is incredibly narcissistic and intelligent, and that means that war against the US is not something he wants to pursue. He wants to weaken the US, and going to war with a country that could annihilate his country six times over is not pursuant to that goal.

From what I understand Trump has always rightfully stated that the reason he is going in on NATO is that we are footing 1/3 of the bill for 29 countries.....Trump makes up numbers all the time but it's somewhere between 24-33% we pay. I do not agree with footing the bill for countries and driving our debt even higher. This is why Trump was elected and it has the side affect, intentional or not of helping Putin then it OTHER NATO members that need to figure that out and pay their dues.

You never know what's in a mans heart but from the Campaign trump has talked about how unfair the distribution of payment in NATO was. I am not a foreign policy expert by any means but the man is trying to make good on campaign promises in my estimation.

so we got a russian spy in the NRA, so ofcourse bpG doesnt think its legit.

so fake.

I thought it read "advising America", not "visiting america" and I was going to agree with you. Never mind.

Misspeaking and Misunderstandings happen to everyone.

I just hope the unhinged Left lets Trump out of Treason prison long enough to greet Putin.

Right -

Left -

Once they get him in there, they won't be letting him go any time soon.

Putin is annexing the US via Trump. Secret meetings *wink*wink...

3D-printed gun blueprints can be downloaded starting next month, ending lengthy legal battle

Blueprints for 3D-printed guns can be downloaded starting next month, following a landmark Department of Justice settlement with Second Amendment advocates.

“It’s personally satisfying,” Defense Distributed director Cody Wilson told Fox News, adding America’s gun culture has been “guaranteed safe passage” into the modern era.

Defense Distributed and the Second Amendment Foundation were co-plaintiffs in a 2015 lawsuit against the government, which had forced Wilson’s firm to take blueprints for the “Liberator” 3D-printed gun off its website. More than 100,000 copies of the controversial blueprint were downloaded before the government’s clampdown.

The settlement paves the way for Defense Distributed to again offer the Liberator files, and others for 3D-printed guns, on its website. “Under terms of the settlement, the government has agreed to waive its prior restraint against the plaintiffs, allowing them to freely publish the 3-D files and other information at issue,” explained the Second Amendment Foundation in a statement released July 10.

SAF Founder and Executive Vice President Alan M. Gottlieb heralded the settlement as a victory for free speech, and “a devastating blow to the gun prohibition lobby.”

http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2018/07/20/3...gal-battle.html

I will be expecting the headlines "Printed Gun Explodes and Kills Gun Nut" or "...Kills Kid"

Cant be....I specifically remember those on the left on this board call me all kinds of names when I stated a while ago that it was possible to 3D print a gun. I was called an I believe an idiot and that its impossible to do so.

Missed that bro or I would have backed you up. It was done several years ago. I wonder how much trial and error went into the first success?...

They know not of what they speak. again.

The Second Amendment makes all the others possible.

Don't you have a hole that needs slithered to...?

Why the Christian Right has embraced Putin

https://nypost.com/2018/07/21/why-the-christian-right-has-embraced-putin/

Last week’s arrest of Marina Butina, the 29-year-old operative who allegedly wielded sex as a weapon to spy for Russia, revealed not one but two channels into American power pursued by Russian intelligence. We’ve known for a while now that the Russians have attempted to use the NRA, and America’s love affair with guns, to shape the nation’s politics. But Butina’s other “backdoor” was more surprising: the faith community, which she infiltrated through the National Prayer Breakfast.

The annual National Prayer Breakfast dates back to 1953, and every US president since Eisenhower has regularly attended, along with much of Congress, foreign heads of state and high officials. Invitations to the seemingly bland event come on congressional letterhead.

And yet the breakfast is entirely organized by and funded through a private and deeply secretive Christian organization called the Fellowship, known by its innermost members as “The Family.”

“The more invisible you can make your organization,” its longtime leader, the late Doug Coe preached, “the more influence it will have.”

That’s a sentiment Maria Butina and her handlers in Moscow could agree with.

The National Prayer Breakfast is the Fellowship’s only public display. The event itself is spoken of within the Fellowship as a recruiting tool to bring elites into private “cells” that will “work behind the scenes.” The breakfast itself, Coe once said in a rare interview, “is only one-tenth of 1 percent of the iceberg.”

Butina was clear about what the Russians wanted: “a back channel of communication” with American conservative elites. But what was in it for the Fellowship? Why would they not only allow their big event to be co-opted for Russian influence-peddling but actively facilitate such “back channels” with the government of Vladimir Putin, an autocratic American adversary?

Because Putin is their kind of guy. The Fellowship dates back to 1935, when founder Abraham Vereide believed God told him that Christianity had been getting it wrong for nearly 2,000 years by focusing on the “down and out.” God, Vereide said, wanted him to build a movement for the “up and out,” “key men” with the power to shape whole societies for Jesus.

Democracy, Vereide concluded, would only get in the way.

He followed instead what the organization calls to this day “the man method” — bringing “key men” — and, more recently, a few “key women,” such as Butina — together in private to work things out “beyond the din of the vox populi” — the voice of the people.

It’s not just the means that are antidemocratic. God, the Fellowship believes, can be understood through a study of strongmen. “You know Jesus said, ‘You got to put Him before mother-father-brother-sister’?” the late Doug Coe was fond of preaching. “Hitler, Lenin, Mao, that’s what they taught the kids.”

This isn’t just rhetoric: throughout its history, the Fellowship has provided “back channels” to American power for a long list of dictators, from the genocidal Suharto of Indonesia to Yoweri Museveni of Uganda, where the Fellowship’s men in parliament not long ago developed legislation known, accurately, as the “Kill the Gays” bill.

Putin would be a prize of another order. American fundamentalists admire his anti-LGBTQ crusades, his revival of the Russian Orthodox Church, his “family values” lip service, his bare-chested manliness. The GOP, observed Butina in The National Interest, a conservative foreign-policy publication, “derives much of its support from social conservatives … and those that support an aggressive approach to the war against Islamic terrorism. These are values espoused by [Putin’s] United Russia.”

Most of all, they admire Putin’s strength — and they’re glad at last to have an American leader who hits just as hard, even if he may be nearly as corrupt.

At a 2017 Prayer Breakfast in Moscow, Doug Burleigh — a current Fellowship leader and lifelong Russia hand — appeared alongside Butina’s handler, Alexander Torshin, to declare “a breakthrough in relations between Russia and the US is about occur.

“I believe,” the Fellowship leader continued, “that Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump will yet become friends.”

_______

Smh.

Avenatti called the White House the New Moscow Annex. I think he's right.

I must be dreaming but now this...

Liberal 9th circuit backs right to carry firearms in public, in latest pro-2nd Amendment ruling

The liberal Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals endorsed the right of individuals to carry firearms in public in a ruling Tuesday, striking down a lower court argument that the Constitution only protects that right at home.

“Analyzing the text of the Second Amendment and reviewing the relevant history, including founding-era treatises and nineteenth century case law, the panel stated that it was unpersuaded by the county’s and the state’s argument that the Second Amendment only has force within the home,” the ruling states.

The case resulted from Hawaii resident George Young being denied twice in 2011 as he sought to carry a handgun. Two of the three judges ruled against a lower court upholding the restriction.

Judge Diarmuid O’Scannlain wrote in his opinion that “for better or for worse, the Second Amendment does protect a right to carry a firearm in public for self-defense.”

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2018/07/...ent-ruling.html

Wow! Step by Step by Step that even I didn't see coming!

I have no idea what "steps" you're talking about. With a CCW you can carry guns in public now.