This thread is a good example of how the radical left is turning liberals away from the Democratic party. They are acting like the idiotic, name-calling, insulting right from past generations.
The constant insults and bias is not going to help you win elections.
This thread is a good example of the far right presenting themselves as centrists. I have remained silent for too long, out of respect for you, Vers, but I will no longer be silent. You are a conservative. Just because you think black people are humans and gay people have the right to get married, doesn't make you a Democrat/leftist. Cons have accepted both black people and gay people since the last election. You can now go join your place back with the far right and stop being a Democrat. Dixiecrats like you are the reasons why democrats are failing morons. Especially Southern Democrats. You have destroyed their message with your far right agenda. I will no longer sit back and watch you call centrists like Gage, Swish, Clem and many others the 'radical left' nor any other altright buzzwords you choose to use. Your rhetoric is so vile that I've had multiple people PM me to tell me they were no longer going to be using the forum because of you. You should take that message and think about that.
If you want to read the work of the "radical left", maybe you should read some MLK instead of quoting him all the time.
Maybe there should be a safe place on here for you and your buddies to go if Vers upsets you.....They could even have warm showers and pacifers.
can i use the same safe space that you used after you refused to take my tax refund and turned tail out of that thread?
This thread is a good example of how the radical left is turning liberals away from the Democratic party. They are acting like the idiotic, name-calling, insulting right from past generations.
The constant insults and bias is not going to help you win elections.
This thread is a good example of the far right presenting themselves as centrists. I have remained silent for too long, out of respect for you, Vers, but I will no longer be silent. You are a conservative. Just because you think black people are humans and gay people have the right to get married, doesn't make you a Democrat/leftist. Cons have accepted both black people and gay people since the last election. You can now go join your place back with the far right and stop being a Democrat. Dixiecrats like you are the reasons why democrats are failing morons. Especially Southern Democrats. You have destroyed their message with your far right agenda. I will no longer sit back and watch you call centrists like Gage, Swish, Clem and many others the 'radical left' nor any other altright buzzwords you choose to use. Your rhetoric is so vile that I've had multiple people PM me to tell me they were no longer going to be using the forum because of you. You should take that message and think about that.
If you want to read the work of the "radical left", maybe you should read some MLK instead of quoting him all the time.
Maybe there should be a safe place on here for you and your buddies to go if Vers upsets you.....They could even have warm showers and pacifers.
can i use the same safe space that you used after you refused to take my tax refund and turned tail out of that thread?
I don't need a safe space, buddy.
Glad to see you're still here and didn't leave like your buddies because Vers was mean to you. There are a lot of guys on here that are a little prickly, but running to the refs or putting someone on ignore is weak.
'We're Gonna Stand': Blue Lives Matter Founder Rejects NY Jets Request for Partnership
The founder of pro-police officer group Blue Lives Matter defended his organization's decision on Saturday not to partner with the New York Jets.
Joe Imperatrice declined the team's offer this week, saying that the National Football League does not respect police officers.
The move comes as preseason protests continue amid the ongoing controversial issue of kneeling during the national anthem before games.
Imperatrice said Saturday on "Cavuto Live" that he takes issue with associating his organization with the Jets.
He told Neil Cavuto how touching it had been to see the son of a fallen NYPD Det. Joseph Lemm saluting his father's casket that had a flag draped onto it.
"That's why we stand," he said. "We're gonna stand because Joe can't anymore."
The Jets said in a statement regarding the rejection that the team has "had positive relationships with First Responders throughout the Tri-State area for decades and will continue to do so."
Imperatrice said specifically that he has an issue with one of the team's players, running back Isaiah Crowell.
Crowell posted an image to Instagram in 2016 that depicted a police officer's throat being slashed, an image that has since been deleted.
Imperatrice told Neil Cavuto that players like Crowell need to be held accountable for their actions by their respective teams.
"These family members that lose their loved ones can't hit the rewind button. ... [Crowell] was able to press rewind," he said.
According to emails shared with The New York Post between Imperatrice and the Jets, he told a team official that he felt it wasn't the right time for a partnership.
“Once again I do appreciate the offer but revenue we have could better be spent on the families of officers killed in the line of duty protecting the ignorance of these individuals rather than contributing to their paycheck.”
He also commented on the news that ESPN will not join coverage of "Monday Night Football" games until after the national anthem is played.
"That's like saying when a little child goes and does something bad and takes a candy bar, the parent [pays for it] instead slapping their wrist and saying 'don't do it.'"
both still fly a flag and show pride in something that got royally whooped on by real Americans.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
This is why players take a knee. This is blatant ass racism.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
once again failing to address what was posted. what a joke.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Chicago has the largest police presence and 40% of their general budget goes to police, but they can't get their city under control. Maybe the police just suck?
You see the autistic kid get choked and sat on by a school resource officer?
what?!
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
I don’t understand why they don’t wait til the parents arrive for specific encounters that involve kids with autism.
This was painful to sit through.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
My first instinct was to take you hard in the paint, but not today. Instead, I'm going to treat you with respect, and simply make a couple statements/questions that I hope you'd take into consideration.
* Scenes just like this one happened to me 4-6 times per year throughout my 20's. Every other month or so, I was pulled over and put through the drill. Question: how many times did something like this happen to Vambo per year? Per lifetime?
* Each roust was a chess game between officers who laid baits and traps with each questioning point. For me, a stalemate was the same as a victory. In other words, 'victory' was synonymous with survival and being free to drive home unharmed. How many encounters like that happened to Vambo?
* Every single encounter began with an adrenalin dump into the bloodstream. That familiar, acrid taste at the back of the throat. Fight/flight impulses being suppressed. Shallow breathing. The knowledge that my every movement MUST be controlled, no matter what.
* And every single encounter left me- an honor roll student, a church-going Baptist, a law-abiding citizen, the son of a cop- feeling humiliated, emotionally trashed and treated like a common criminal... just because I was out on the street in a nice car.
*These two young men have obviously been students of The Talk, and did a fantastic job of negotiating the traps laid and set. Why this didn't end after 3 minutes with a radio call: "no wants/no warrants... thank you sir- have a nice night" is obvious. They lived to get home in one piece, but had to jump through some very sketchy hoops to do it.
__________________
If Vambo had experienced such treatment even once or twice in his life, he would probably think twice about treating this issue like a win/lose 'points game' in some silly non-debate.
Dawg... this happens to real people every day. It has happened to people on this message board whom you talk to every day. These encounters can quickly devolve into a 'deadly force' situation. And the best you can do is try some bs misdirect about crime in Chicago? Do you really care that little about the experiences of your fellow community members to simply blow them off not caring?
They aren't just talking points in some L/R word battle. And the types of people whom we need to help us are people like you. It's a heavy lift, but God knows we keep trying. We kneel. We pray. We speak up at town halls. We write op-eds. We march. We sing songs of protest and hope. We run for office. We vote.
And still, you don't hear us. And still, you'd rather focus on something... anything else than this. I don't understand that pathology.
If you address nothing else I've talked about, please explain that. Please explain why you can't/won't talk to us/with us about this. It would help me to know who and why you are.
I don’t understand why they don’t wait til the parents arrive for specific encounters that involve kids with autism.
This was painful to sit through.
Probably a whole lot of variables there.
First is, what was the kid doing before the video started?
Second is: Could the parents even leave work in such a situation?
Third: My mom went 'back to school' if you will. She had a kid (she was a teacher) in 3rd grade. He responded to her so well, when the kid got into middle school, the school/parents/state - I don't know (my mom had retired by then) she got hired to - get this: spend the day with him. Pick him up, take him to school, sit in on all his classes, etc.
She did that til the day he graduated. Costly? Probably.
Was this kid 'bad' enough that maybe he should've had someone with him all day?
The vid. was tough to watch, absolutely. But there's much we don't see. That's not be absolving anything or anyone one, by the way.
I don’t understand why they don’t wait til the parents arrive for specific encounters that involve kids with autism.
This was painful to sit through.
One of my very best friends is Mitch. Mitch is 17 years old. Mitch is 6'2" tall. Mitch weighs about 220. Mitch is profoundly autistic. He can't speak more than single words. He communicates with a iPad by pointing to pictures. More than once, Mitch has escaped his house and headed to our home just because he wants to hang out (they live about a mile from us).
Last time, we got a call from Jim (Mitch's dad) telling us to be on the lookout. I hopped in the car to intercept him. Found him about 3 blocks from the house. He got in the car with no trouble, but there are never any guarantees. On our way back to my house (Jim was coming to get him) we passed a squad car. I can't even imagine what might have happened if a patrol car had rolled up on me trying to coax an irritated, frustrated Mitch into my car at 9:30 PM. What a chaotic scene to be forced to handle for them. And for me.
These are special circumstances to be sure, and there has been an explosion in the number of Autism cases since the 80's. I truly hope that police departments are getting trained in how to handle cases like this 11 year old boy and my buddy Mitch.
My first instinct was to take you hard in the paint, but not today. Instead, I'm going to treat you with respect, and simply make a couple statements/questions that I hope you'd take into consideration.
* Scenes just like this one happened to me 4-6 times per year throughout my 20's. Every other month or so, I was pulled over and put through the drill. Question: how many times did something like this happen to Vambo per year? Per lifetime?
* Each roust was a chess game between officers who laid baits and traps with each questioning point. For me, a stalemate was the same as a victory. In other words, 'victory' was synonymous with survival and being free to drive home unharmed. How many encounters like that happened to Vambo?
* Every single encounter began with an adrenalin dump into the bloodstream. That familiar, acrid taste at the back of the throat. Fight/flight impulses being suppressed. Shallow breathing. The knowledge that my every movement MUST be controlled, no matter what.
* And every single encounter left me- an honor roll student, a church-going Baptist, a law-abiding citizen, the son of a cop- feeling humiliated, emotionally trashed and treated like a common criminal... just because I was out on the street in a nice car.
*These two young men have obviously been students of The Talk, and did a fantastic job of negotiating the traps laid and set. Why this didn't end after 3 minutes with a radio call: "no wants/no warrants... thank you sir- have a nice night" is obvious. They lived to get home in one piece, but had to jump through some very sketchy hoops to do it.
__________________
If Vambo had experienced such treatment even once or twice in his life, he would probably think twice about treating this issue like a win/lose 'points game' in some silly non-debate.
Dawg... this happens to real people every day. It has happened to people on this message board whom you talk to every day. These encounters can quickly devolve into a 'deadly force' situation. And the best you can do is try some bs misdirect about crime in Chicago? Do you really care that little about the experiences of your fellow community members to simply blow them off not caring?
They aren't just talking points in some L/R word battle. And the types of people whom we need to help us are people like you. It's a heavy lift, but God knows we keep trying. We kneel. We pray. We speak up at town halls. We write op-eds. We march. We sing songs of protest and hope. We run for office. We vote.
And still, you don't hear us. And still, you'd rather focus on something... anything else than this. I don't understand that pathology.
If you address nothing else I've talked about, please explain that. Please explain why you can't/won't talk to us/with us about this. It would help me to know who and why you are.
thanks in advance, -some guy who's not your enemy
If you keep doing the same things over and over and it doesn't work why not try something different?
Like I said I didn't see any players protesting off season, how many went to where this is happening and protest there?
Kneeling isn't working it is only creating more devide so at what point after how many years do you say hey let's try something else, something that would get us supporters rather than shun us even further. Open places where they would have counselors to hold family's together not give out abortions. Teach family values drive gang out of the neighborhood.
Now ESPN is it doesn't televise the Anthem so they are losing even more audience, time to find a better way.
Trump like him or not made an offer to Pardon some people the NFL players believed should have one. So what do the players do they go overboard instead of working with him, how may offers to the White House were turned down that would have been a fantastic Platform to get their message out? The players instead shunned it. They are wasting golden opportunities to spread the message.
I appreciate your taking the time to respond. A few points, if I may.
1. You may not have seen offseason protests, but that in itself is kind of cool. Here's why: those who were so inclined pivoted from static protests to true activism. I won't cut/pate the text, but I will share the links for you. Each will take you to a story of offseason activism, wherein the players put their efforts where their knees were last season.
Those are just the first two articles to pop up on a web search. They are followed by a host of other accounts dating back to 2017... stories that weren't told in lieu of the sensational 'click bait' headlines of kneeling players.
2. Malcolm Jenkins is spearheading off-field initiative. 3. Anquan Boldin actually quit the NFL to dedicate himself to social justice efforts.
So you see, it's always been so much more than just kneeling for 3 minutes before a football game.
_____________
So you ask: "If you keep doing the same things over and over and it doesn't work why not try something different?
It's interesting that you highlighted one particular passage in my text, because that was my most important message of all- and the actual answer to your very question. Vambo, as a little kid, I was part of the marches in the 60's that brought about our nation's first wave of social change. I remained active in the cause through volunteerism, mentorship, free/reduced cost music lessons, Boys & Girl's clubs, etc. I've watched my friends and colleagues do the same at community centers, after school programs, youth outreach with the local police departments and more. All of those efforts help in their own ways, but they do so in private, away from cameras and news crews most of the time.
And yet, we still have Philando Castilles & Michael Browns who steal the headlines... and daily scenes like the one in Swish's vid.
So how many different ways are a group of people to try before they are HEARD?
No violence- that's a turn off. No shouting- you just sound angry No calm speech- we can't hear you and you don't seem sincere No silent protests- we just want to watch a game and take a break from daily life without some 'message' in our faces. Stand for the anthem, or we refuse to engage Riot- we'll send in armored cops
Like I said... everything that can be tried has been or is being tried. The one common theme amid all this failure/slow pace of improvement: the deafness of those who could make more happen than anyone else.
And here comes the ultimate kicker: this will only be resolved when enough Euro-Americans see a need for it to be resolved. Those who hold the reigns of power make the changes. Those who live under the terms of those in power can do nothing by themselves.
So... this is now another extension to our conversation. I've again treated you respectfully. I've presented you with facts. I've outlined at least a half-dozen ways in which I and others have tried to get the message out. I've done my best to personalize this conversation with anecdotes from my real life so that you actually see and regard me as a fellow American citizen- a fellow American who is seen and treated differently by society and its law enforcement personnel.
I ask you: what else would you have me do? What have I not thought of in 50 years of efforts that would bring you along to a reality that truly does exist in this country?
Because if that wasn't enough to at least get you to thinking... then perhaps you are the very kind of person described in your sig line. And that would be a shame. For both of us.
But I'm more concerned about you and I... that's where stuff happens that affect us.
Well where I live I don't see the things you say you do, I personally don't have issues with and race or gender of people. I have worked with, for and had them work for me, I treat everyone with respect until they do something to lose it. I have had interaction of many kinds as long as they are good people that's all I care about.
Malcolm Jenkins is spearheading off-field initiative.
he raised his fist during the national anthem before the Philadelphia Eagles' 2018 preseason opener,
Quote:
Anquan Boldin actually quit the NFL to dedicate himself to social justice efforts.
Not the only reason. He was 37 when he quit, and he has privately and publicly expressed support for players who have (taken an knee), especially his former quarterback, Kaepernick.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
unless you're a catholic, then you're kneeling for something else.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
This thread is a good example of how the radical left is turning liberals away from the Democratic party. They are acting like the idiotic, name-calling, insulting right from past generations.
The constant insults and bias is not going to help you win elections.
This thread is a good example of the far right presenting themselves as centrists. I have remained silent for too long, out of respect for you, Vers, but I will no longer be silent. You are a conservative. Just because you think black people are humans and gay people have the right to get married, doesn't make you a Democrat/leftist. Cons have accepted both black people and gay people since the last election. You can now go join your place back with the far right and stop being a Democrat. Dixiecrats like you are the reasons why democrats are failing morons. Especially Southern Democrats. You have destroyed their message with your far right agenda. I will no longer sit back and watch you call centrists like Gage, Swish, Clem and many others the 'radical left' nor any other altright buzzwords you choose to use. Your rhetoric is so vile that I've had multiple people PM me to tell me they were no longer going to be using the forum because of you. You should take that message and think about that.
If you want to read the work of the "radical left", maybe you should read some MLK instead of quoting him all the time.
I want to thank you on two fronts.
First of all, thanks for the laugh when you said you would no longer be silent. LMAO..........you post all day, every day and your message is always the same.
Secondly, I would like to thank you for exemplifying exactly what I was talking about. I've never once voted for a Republican presidential candidate, yet you assigned labels to me and insulted me repeatedly because I do not agree w/you and others who make fun of those who don't completely share your views.
Thanks for revealing yourself. As I have said a couple of times, you are no different than guys on the other side.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
I appreciate your taking the time to respond. A few points, if I may.
1. You may not have seen offseason protests, but that in itself is kind of cool. Here's why: those who were so inclined pivoted from static protests to true activism. I won't cut/pate the text, but I will share the links for you. Each will take you to a story of offseason activism, wherein the players put their efforts where their knees were last season.
Those are just the first two articles to pop up on a web search. They are followed by a host of other accounts dating back to 2017... stories that weren't told in lieu of the sensational 'click bait' headlines of kneeling players.
2. Malcolm Jenkins is spearheading off-field initiative. 3. Anquan Boldin actually quit the NFL to dedicate himself to social justice efforts.
So you see, it's always been so much more than just kneeling for 3 minutes before a football game.
_____________
So you ask: "If you keep doing the same things over and over and it doesn't work why not try something different?
It's interesting that you highlighted one particular passage in my text, because that was my most important message of all- and the actual answer to your very question. Vambo, as a little kid, I was part of the marches in the 60's that brought about our nation's first wave of social change. I remained active in the cause through volunteerism, mentorship, free/reduced cost music lessons, Boys & Girl's clubs, etc. I've watched my friends and colleagues do the same at community centers, after school programs, youth outreach with the local police departments and more. All of those efforts help in their own ways, but they do so in private, away from cameras and news crews most of the time.
And yet, we still have Philando Castilles & Michael Browns who steal the headlines... and daily scenes like the one in Swish's vid.
So how many different ways are a group of people to try before they are HEARD?
No violence- that's a turn off. No shouting- you just sound angry No calm speech- we can't hear you and you don't seem sincere No silent protests- we just want to watch a game and take a break from daily life without some 'message' in our faces. Stand for the anthem, or we refuse to engage Riot- we'll send in armored cops
Like I said... everything that can be tried has been or is being tried. The one common theme amid all this failure/slow pace of improvement: the deafness of those who could make more happen than anyone else.
And here comes the ultimate kicker: this will only be resolved when enough Euro-Americans see a need for it to be resolved. Those who hold the reigns of power make the changes. Those who live under the terms of those in power can do nothing by themselves.
So... this is now another extension to our conversation. I've again treated you respectfully. I've presented you with facts. I've outlined at least a half-dozen ways in which I and others have tried to get the message out. I've done my best to personalize this conversation with anecdotes from my real life so that you actually see and regard me as a fellow American citizen- a fellow American who is seen and treated differently by society and its law enforcement personnel.
I ask you: what else would you have me do? What have I not thought of in 50 years of efforts that would bring you along to a reality that truly does exist in this country?
Because if that wasn't enough to at least get you to thinking... then perhaps you are the very kind of person described in your sig line. And that would be a shame. For both of us.
Hey Clem, I know you addressed Vambo, but I would like to discuss this topic w/you. I have the intelligence and fair-mindedness to do so.
However, I only want to discuss this topic under the following guidelines and most of them have nothing to do w/you.
Guidelines:
--Neither of us tries to "win" the argument. Instead, we have an intellectual and "real man" conversation. You know what I mean by real man.
--Labeling should not be permitted, or at least kept to a minimum.
--Others can't hijack the conversation by twisting either of our words around. By that, I mean I don't want to hear guys like 40 twist your words around or guys like Swish and CHS misrepresent what I am saying. Btw--------all of the previous guidelines were influenced by my concerns over this particular one.
--We both keep an open mind and hopefully other intelligent posters like DC, Devil, etc will weigh in w/their thoughts that aren't fueled by one-sided rhetoric.
Okay..........I know that is a lot to ask. LOL. However, the results could be really cool. We could show people how to have different opinions on a subject, but discuss them logically and respectfully, instead of resorting to tactics that are designed to "win" a debate by labeling and insults.
The key is to educate. Not win or lose the debate.
Chicago has the largest police presence and 40% of their general budget goes to police, but they can't get their city under control. Maybe the police just suck?
It's not the police's city, unless you are advocating for some type of martial law or police state. It's the people's city, the people's neighborhoods, the people's neighbors...
Chicago has the largest police presence and 40% of their general budget goes to police, but they can't get their city under control. Maybe the police just suck?
It's not the police's city, unless you are advocating for some type of martial law or police state. It's the people's city, the people's neighborhoods, the people's neighbors...
My point was that Chicago is already a surveillance state that has failed miserably.
I couldn't post the videos two weeks ago, due to the language, but a few weeks ago, the Chicago PD parked a bait truck, full of Nike shoes, outside a basketball court where a bunch of teens were playing basketball. When the kids went into the truck, they were mass detained by the police. A few citizens saw all of this go down and began filming the encounter and it went viral.
Well Vic Mensa saw it and organized a shoe drive for the kids. They've now raised over 10k shoes for those kids.
Here's a link to an article that talks about the entire situation.
The last lines are the real kicker.
Quote:
Three men, ages 21, 36 and 59, were arrested for breaking into the trucks and removing merchandise.
Burglary charges against all three men were dropped by Cook County State’s Attorney Kim Foxx “in the interest of justice,” according to office spokesman Robert Foley. Norfolk Southern released a statement last week expressing regret for the operation, and committing not to use similar tactics in the future.
The 56-year-old man still faces charges of simple battery. Officers accuse him of refusing to drop a collapsible knife after they confronted him.
Another one of the arrested men, who was deaf, told police in sign language he had entered the truck to look for food, according to a police report.
