DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Coaching Search Continued

No, you didn't.

Here is one of the dozen or so posts you made on the decision:

I am not sure if the context is right, but sure....at HALFTIME, you take the points. You aren't trying to win the game with a first down at the end of the half. Surely you get that.


A 1 yard gain would have won the game. You talked about situations earlier....situations are different at the end of the half and the end of the game.

At halftime you try to narrow the gap. At end game, your hope is to win the game.

And regardless we won against the Bronco's.

Vers, I know you've told me you're not going to respond to me anymore, but I can't fathom coming in here with some old gripe about how you feel Hue Jackson was unfairly criticized. It's almost mind-boggling.

If you want to bring up Hue, then the question is something like, is Gregg Williams really a great coach, or does he just look like a great coach compared to Hue Jackson? Someone else asked this before. It is a fair question and a good question.

I don't have the best answer, though I do think Williams has done a nice job stabilizing things. He's getting the guys to play hard and improve. You have to at least give the guy that much. This season could have gone off the rails and I just don't know how many more of those seasons some of us can take.

And we didn't against whoever the heck it was that we didn't.

I asked it....about if Gregg was the best hire if we hired him because the Hue Jackson bar was pretty low.....like on the ground.


It would be almost impossible to not look better than Hue, especially if you were a football coach.

If you spent 2 plus years telling people how much you know about football, and what a great coach Hue was, and then you see the turn around this team has made since Hue was fired? Yeah. Egg. Face.

Add in Hue blaming others for the the losses?


Apparently this board sucks? We've been told that on numerous occasions. (only when people didn't agree with the person you replied to) Yet, that person continually comes back to tell us how 'right' he was.............even though he's wrong, as evidenced by the record since Hue was fired.

If the board sucks, why come here?

Don't pile on Arch...we all make bad calls.

Fair enough. But I wasn't piling on. I stated facts.

Here's my thought about Hue supporters :

1: You don't know crap about what a HC is suppose to do.

2: Your understanding that a HC is okay to have a win / lost record that is second worst of all time at 3-36-1 ...only one spot better than Bert Bell at 10-46-2...And keep his job because they consider him a good coach...Meds needed.

3: Man crush...

4: Just likes to stir up trouble by saying he's a good coach just to get people up in a tizzy...

5: I ignore them because by the grace of John Dorsey the Loser is gone and the winning in Cleveland has begun.

6: The Bengals need more fans....Hue should help with that.

Look............I haven't been talking about the Browns for the following reasons:

1. Lies are being told and no one is challenging them. Swish and a bunch of others just challenged me, but yet, complete lies are being ignored by the board

2. Sashi and Hue are gone. Yet, people are still fighting over them.

3. There is a small group of posters who hijack many threads, yet they go unchecked and then I hear about my agenda. LMAO

4. The refs....or probably ...one ref is completely biased and is inconsistent in enforcing the rules of the board.

5. I feel that a lot of the bad posters dominate this forum. They gang up on issues and/or posters while the good posters stay out of the fray.

I can't promise, but I am trying really hard not to talk about the Browns because of the above issues. I love talking football and it bothers me that it's come to this.

And with all of that said...............I have absolutely NO problem w/Hue being fired. I am a fan of the team and not an individual. I will not whine, cry, campaign, and b.... like the others did for over a year due to one decision. He's gone. It's over. Baker did not like Hue and that meant he had to go. It's Baker's team.

So Swish........you can shove the agenda crap up where the sun doesn't shine. I have ZERO problem w/Hue being fired. And bro..............how's come you never say boo when Memphis posts his hashtag crap about Sashi? Isn't that an agenda?

Y'all can kiss my butt.

because i don't like sashi either.

arch likes insults. That is a common theme.

I remember Vers sticking up for Hue ... I don’t recall him ever saying he was a good coach much less a great coach ...

There’s a HUGE difference ... and that part of what u said isn’t a fact .... its not true ...

I’m not looking for a fight or an argument ... thats simply not right ... ya’all went to really bad places and it was real ugly ... loads of extremely bad blood there ... I get it ... but thats not true ..

He stuck up for Hue .. that’s a far cry from saying he was a good coach much less a great coach ...

Impossible...Hue will never take his lips off that...

That's right where I am. Hue should've been kicked out the door with him to get rid of the stench of 1-31. We'd probably have a playoff spot clinched by now if that happened.

So. let me see if I have this right, based off your posts.

This board sucks, we all can kiss your butt.

Thank you.

And I have a proposition for some folks. If I can find early posts where I criticized Hue and others got mad because of that, will those said posters leave the board for a certain period of time? And if I can't, I will leave the board for a certain period of time.

I didn't love Hue. I was on his case early and often. I defended him later on because so many blamed him for Sashi's issues and the lies being told. I also have always supported people who are being bullied. I would rather others bully me than peen when he criticized Couch or when others pile on YTown because he is religious or when someone gets on Swish because of his race. I throw myself out there to protect those guys and look and see what happens.

And I am going to say this one more time. I have ZERO problem w/Hue being fired. Bake hated the dude. He had to go. I just don't like lies and they are being floated around in abundance.

LMAO..............I had the funniest response, but I probably would get suspended for it because there are different rules for different people.

But envy was one of the words, arch. Hell, I could even be like others and post one of your PMs on here.

Envy? Of what?

Go ahead, post any pm's we have had.

Sad, on your part. But go ahead.






Oh, different rules for different people? I don't think so, but it is telling that you think so.

arch, have you ever once thought of how much time you spend on trying to discredit me rather than talking about football?

That is where the ........... envy comes from.

What are your thoughts on what I had to say about the situation? Or, have you already forgotten what my points were?

j/c

Ah jeez, here we go again. And I've run out of popcorn (quite a while ago, actually)...

Popcorn is carbs you don’t need. Grab a beef stick and watch the fun.

Meanwhile, not one comment on any of this:



Because, you know......the other crap is "pure football" and my commentary is not.

Hue wasn't fired because of Baker. You've stated that twice now. He and Haley were fired because of the infighting and the 3-36-1 record.

I hope at this point we keep William's and Kitchens. I think he should still do interviews to be positive, but Williams is making it tough to go elsewhere, especially if they win out.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...-job-right-now/


This is the right approach, IMO. Focus on the task at hand, beat the Bengals... recreate the first half of the last matchup, and then pour it on in the second half.

All those things can be considered on the 4th downs and other game situations. Like I mentioned before, the idea would be to have a base strategy which you could then deviate to some degree in either direction. This means, depending on the situation, you might be somewhat more aggressive or less aggressive than what the data, which is often based on league averages, say to do.

Right now, the Browns can get an advantage by just being more aggressive than other teams. We don't have to jump to full out optimal strategy right away.

To get an idea on why this matters, look no further than across the sideline with Vance Joseph's inexplicable decision to kick a FG on 4th and 1, down by 4, late in the game. It probably cost the Broncos the game, as well as their playoff hopes.

So, you're no longer having a hard time rooting for Mayfield?

I'm good with GW.

Man, I thought I was gonna come in here and read about some coaching stuff.

Instead its the mean girls stupid loop.

Y'all like a bunch of junior high girls giving each other side eye.

Graduate to High School already.

I still feel like John Dorsey needs to do his due diligence in finding the next coach of this team, maybe the most important coaching hire in the history of the team, given the climate in the AFC North, the Browns QB problem being solved, and the young and unbelievably talented roster we have. This is as crucial of a hire as you will see.

I was against Greg Williams coming back as the permanent HC, but I have to say he makes one hell of a case, and obviously, if he stays, there is no way in hell Freddie Kitchens is going anywhere.

I think GW has done a good job of trusting the staff that is in place.

I am to the point where Kitchens needs to stay. He's doing a great job with the playcalling, I think he has the full confidence and trust of Baker Mayfield, and I think with a young QB, switching coaches, OC's, schemes, philosophies, etc is not good for the growth and development.

To have Kitchens around going into Mayfield's second training camp, and first as the unquestioned starter would be HUGE.

I also think it would help Dorsey and the scouting staff find the right guys, as their system is in place, and they can identify where they need help, and what kinds of guys can fit. Talent is great, but fit is just as important, and we'd have a leg up, instead of having to get rid of guys already on the team because they don't fit what the new guy wants to do. I think we'd be setting ourselves back big time if we got rid of Kitchens.

I know how hard of a sell that would be for a new coach coming in, but how could any rational human being (i know, NFL coaches are far from rational) see the situation, and immediately want to change it, just so they put their stamp on that move.

I feel pretty good about the Browns, and I think they will do the right thing. If it ends up being GW, I'm fully behind it, and I think we'll be ok. More than anything I just want the to see what else is out there. Maybe Williams is the best guy for the job right now.

One thing I have to say about Greg, he has been exactly what we have all wanted our HC to be.

He has stopped talking Paul Bunyan and been very professional. Picked up practice intensity. He has also been super aggressive and constantly working on the sidelines. I admire what he has done.

I think that Dorsey should do a complete and thorough search for the right head coach, and should, as part of that search, interview Williams and Kitchen for the position.

Like I said on another thread ... it's obvious that Kitchens had a plan in case he was ever promoted to offensive coordinator, and I bet he has one in case he were to become a head coach. Given his excellent relationship with Baker, I think he should get a shot.

Agreed.... And he's won games. Wow. And apparently that's not good enough for some!!!!

Sure if Brian Bilichick wants to come coach the Browns, or mcvey, or one of the other top tier guys... If think that's be a good move. Another retread out of a job our an unknown from the college ranks ??? No way. One more win and I think it's a done deal. Two wins? Don't even interview anyone else.

Kitchens for me had already locked up the OC position.

Lots to be very positive about, let's not out think and out smart ourselves!

At this point, I'm certainly leaning that way. Both guys have exceeded my expectations so far...

J/C

One thing that I don't believe has been mentioned is the timing of making the decision on Williams/Kitchens. How soon after the season do either of those two get called for interviews with other teams? I would say that each could reasonably be in demand based on what's happened since they've taken over here.

It's certainly possible that while Dorsey is interviewing candidates for the HC job here, that either Williams or Kitchen get hired elsewhere. Do their contracts here prohibit that or does the fact that Williams is interim allow him to leave for another job once the season ends?

Timing could end up being an issue.

I agree, like I said, by design....

MGH888's post made me wonder, do they have to still interview candidates under the Rooney Rule if decide on Williams? Just wondering, I really don't know

I didn't think of this.

I reckon the safest move would be to promote Kitchens to Assistant Head Coach. That would protect that one.

Williams is going to interview like everyone else. If we move Kitchens to Asst Head Coach, then until Williams is fired, I'd assume we can refuse him going anywhere else.


Cause, keeping Gregg Williams seems much less enticing without Kitchens. And that's from someone who doesn't want Williams in the first place.



Of course, with my optimal solution, it would be hire Bruce Arians right away. Easy transition for Kitchens to make. Kitchens coached a bunch of years with Arians. Then he could bring in Todd Bowles to run our defense (who likely will be fired by the Jets, but IMO, has gotten a lot out of low talent teams, although it seems to be a circus in NY sometimes).

That seems to me to be the way to go.