DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns 2019 training camp preview: Analyzing the offensive line

I think we settled on a starting line and they have been working together for awhile.

For a long time, I have thought that fans [not just Brown's fans or folks on this board] and the local media across the NFL are much too critical of offensive line play.

O-lines are going to give up sacks. They are not always going to open up holes for the RBs. Defensive players are paid well to make sacks, force quick throws and stop the run.

It's like fans don't think much about when their team is creating sacks, but then freak out if their own team gives up some pressures.

Take last night for example. Let's say you recruited fifty people who know football and had absolutely no alliance to either team and had them evaluate the line play for both teams. What do you think they would say?

A. The Browns OL is a mess.
B. The Bucs OL is a mess.
C. The Browns DL is impressive.
D. The Bucs DL is impressive.

I am willing to say that B and C would the overwhelming....and I mean--overwhelming--choices of those impartial viewers.

I experienced this first hand as a RB. I would break a long run and folks would be saying "what a great run." I would get stuffed at the LOS and folks would be saying "the blocking sucked."

I made sure to let my guys know I didn't feel that way. LOL......I knew who buttered my bread.

J/c

That’s the thing about our entire first team O ... there’s very little GAME reps as a unit (not just the OL) ... it’s why the first game or two in the NFL is always rough

tab talking football.

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/video/baker-mayfield-postgame-press-conference-vs-buccaneers-x1656

Baker was willing to own it even if some posters won't.

I want to be clear about something because tab has made some statements about me on a couple of threads.

First of all, I don't prance.

Secondly, I am not happy that Baker didn't have a good game.

Finally, it was one game and it was in the preseason. It's not a big deal. I was simply trying to talk about the OL on an offensive line thread.

I know that. Anyone who says anything negative about Baker gets treated that way by tab.

The kid had a bad night in a preseason game. He's had good games. Each game stands on its own.

We are all Browns fans we all want Baker to be a great QB. Just because some people don't like him running his mouth doesn't change that. Just because you point out he had a poor performance doesn't change that.

I just learned to consider the source and move on.

Freddie Kitchens on right guard situation: Eric Kush will get first shot to show what he can do and if we had to play a game today he would be our right guard

https://twitter.com/ByNateUlrich/status/1165329867614932995

A ringing endorsement.

Haha, yeah “I mean, if we HAVE to ..”

Baker had a bad day throwing to guys he won't be throwing to much in the regular season.

Most of the pass catchers had a bad day with drops and improper routes.

Every o-lineman not named Bitonio had a bad day in both pass blocking and run blocking. (and snapping the football)

Our run blocking is borderline scaring me.

It isn't, but I think the guy has done a good job in pass pro.

I agree, there was a shared blame, enough to go around for the entire offense.

Better that it happened in the preseason so that we have the time to get to the root causes and work on getting them corrected.

Maybe tab will set him straight.

j/c...

#ThePlanAllAlong

you know, with Hubbard and Robinson as bookend tackles the last eight games last season it is no wonder baker got sacked and pressured so many times. It is a wonder he could get a pass off. .....oh wait, the last eight games our o line as a unit gave up the fewest sacks and the fewest pressures in the league. hmmm!! Who would have thunk it???

I know you want Williams, but I am very disappointed that it was you who posted such a BS article.

While reading this board, I constantly read how great Baker is, but yet, some of you act like he needs a Pro Bowler at every position to just be okay.

Our OL gave Baker way more time than just about every single qb in the league last year. Yet, the OL is getting dissed.

I find all of this aggravating. If the team does well, it's because Baker makes them better. If the team struggles, it's everyone else's fault.

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.............I don't like this attitude and it isn't good for a locker room, either.

It was a BS article and our OL has performed just fine. Whatever man. I didn't think you would resort to that crap. Post away. But, I KNOW OL play and I am going to voice my opinion, because you know.........it's a message board.

Every single OL in the league gives up pressures and sacks. Our OL gives up far fewer of both than almost every other OL in the freaking league.

But, I can see this is going to be the narrative all freaking year long. It's putting a bad taste in my mouth about this team.

One person above everyone else is not something I embrace.

The OL did NOT play well against the Bucs...as bone noted...we have Bitonio and Tretter and some guys who might figure it out...they haven't yet figured it out.

You are an OL expert?

You are?

You are also an expert on running backs, and receivers, and d line, and safetys, and cornerbacks, and tight ends. You played in h.s. You played in college - but we don't know WHERE in college, and you were a 'scout'.

And a jr. high teacher.

What college did you play at?

What school hired you to be a scout?







I appreciate some of your football talk.........but c'mon man, you ain't all that.

No...I've stated that countless times on this board.

My eyes tell me that a couple of the (3) of the (5) present-starter spots very-well could change by opening day...those (3) are not above-average.

Forbes over Kush is a matter-of-time...sixth rd rookie.

Robinson's ceiling is average but he MIGHT develop under Campen.

Hubbard is Hubbard.

Okay arch...........I ain't all that. I am not going to get into a blanking match w/you.

If you don't think I know much about OL play, than I guess you can just dismiss my opinion and rely on WSU's. It's all a matter of choice.

Why do you go and do that?

The OL was not-good against the Bucs. Tretter wasn't shy about that...and he usually says very little.

The run-blocking was non-existent...the pressure on passing plays was not acceptable. What else is there to say?

jc -

I am not liking the Zeitler trade right now.

I previously stated that the run blocking was not good. I said that multiple times.

I also said that there were two plays where the OL got whupped.

I have said a lot more that you guys are ignoring. Such as:

--other than those two plays, the OL did a very good job in pass pro.

--all OLs give up pressure.

--all OLs struggle.

--compare our OL performance to Tampa Bay's.

--fans and local media unfairly judge their OLs because they see a pressure or two and it is "OMG, our OL sucks." Yet when our DL applies pressure, it's "Man, our DL is awesome." LOL

You can believe me, mock me, or perhaps consider my message when I say that this OL is not nearly as bad as you guys are saying it is. Again, it was ranked second overall by PFF last year and we lost one guy. A very good player for sure. But, do we go from second to 30th because of an interior linemen? Nah man........that ain't so. We might drop to 8th or 10th. But, that isn't good enough for the future HOF qb that is Baker Mayfield and the best skilled offensive group of talent the NFL has to offer?

I am analyzing the OL, bone.

And their pass pro has been damn near flawless. You might not realize this, but teams would kill to have an OL only give up two pressures in a half. I watched Miami play last week and their qbs were under immediate pressure on every freaking snap they took. How did Tampa Bay's OL look? Pressure happens, dude. QBs have to deal w/it.

Well, no matter how good they play.............I'm sure there will be folks who trash our OL every time they give up a sack or a pressure, because you know................that never happens to other teams who have such great OLs.

J/c

Reading Tretter’s quotes are a good sign ... at leas they hold themselves accountable and have high expectations

I just find something rather curious here. Almost everyone agrees that Baker had a poor outing. I mean it happens. But myself, along with others see it more as an anomaly. We saw him last year and know that he plays much better than that. We see it as an outlier and most are not concerned about it. At least that's where I and most others I've read stand on the issue.

So why are you treating our OT's differently? After Harrrison was removed and Robinson was the starter, out OT's performed up to snuff. No, they're not stellar tackles, but they did an above average job. They allowed few pressures and sacks during the second half of the season.

So why the double standard here? Now let's not play bait and switch about Zeitler being gone. Sure, the interior is a question mark in terms of the RG. But the tackles are the same.

I don't see why anyone could claim that Baker just "had a a bad outing" based on everything he had shown last year and then not use that same measurable in terms of out OT's. It certainly appears to be a double standard based on whose name it is.

Baker didn't look sharp. Our WR's were not getting separation and our OL looked bad. That's the entire O unit. They simply played very sluggish. Trying to claim that means doom and gloom for out OT's and giving other people a pass for a similar performance seems very disingenuous.