DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2019 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 13 Patriots 27 Postgame Thoughts

I saw Kush have a rough day from my own eyes, and Bitonio hasn’t been good the past 2-3 games (for him)

Well, since I'm not on the "fire everybody" band wagon, I'll give my thoughts.

Offense moved the ball, unfortunately getting down 2 scores early made it more difficult to stick with running game.

Defense had some nice stops but constantly played with their back to the wall. Not sure why in some situations of 3rd and 3-7, we were in full retreat basically handing them first downs though.

Seems like we have guys with defenders all over them on 3rd and 4.. against us teams just send a guy down 5 yards to turnaround and it's pitch and catch.. not sure why... seems too easy.

Team continues to shoot itself in the foot. Ward drops a rare Brady INT opportunity, gives them 3 points. Chubb gets the ball kicked from his hand by Bitonio, gives them 7 points. Chubb gets stripped 60 yards downfield, costs us 7 points. DL in the backfield before the ball to INT a shuttle pass.. (that's just amazing) OBJ drops a perfectly thrown back shoulder throw, costs us FG range. There were others.

Then there were the penalties, some legit and others not so legit... but the biggest thing that pissed me off was the Pats were doing all the same stuff and not getting called. ALL DAY LONG!! Praising their RT for maintaining his block on Myles on the TD throw when he had his arm wrapped around his neck.. WRs pushing off, pick plays, holding, arm fighting in the secondary.. completely all called one way. The OPI on Higgins was a freaking joke.

Speaking of Higgins, I have far more faith in him than I do Callaway... TBH, I'm not sure what the staff sees in Callaway.

No idea how they graded but I thought the OL played pretty well. Run blocking was good and pass pro was adequate. Baker got swarmed a few times but it's never going to be perfect. Disclaimer: Except for the jumping offsides about half a dozen times. Those mental mistakes are KILLING US.

Watching Brady just throw the ball in the dirt at the first sign of trouble because he knows his defense will win games for him.

Freddie is still struggling to stay one step ahead doing the HC and the play calling thing.. like the aforementioned send the punt team out to get the penalty because he wasn't ready to call a 4th and 11 play.. game was pretty much over at that point though but it matters.

I agree, Callaway has been nothing but a liability on the field. A lot less Callaway would be a step in the right direction.

Like this...

Right Tackle false starts as well...

Agree with all your post - these two in particular. Mind boggling how 3rd and short is easy against us and we just flat out struggle.

Was driving me nuts that Pats were doing the same things and not getting called. On the play you referenced with MG - he was held 3 times on the same play. The RT had him hooked with his arm - waist, then shoulder then neck. Ridiculous.

I saw that false start on Edelman too .. I think we got away with one too

I'm not sure that's a false start, as he can't he technically go in to motion? He was moving lateral to the LOS, so I would think that would be legal. The RT moving though ...

Well, yes he did move to the side but I think he did so in reaction to his initial flinch ... almost like “oops, maybe I’ll fool them”

Yeah the RT also moved too

Which is what a well coached receiver should be doing if he flinched. I've seen running backs do it before, where they "jump" at the snap count, and then just go into motion to avoid the penalty. It's only the O-line that can't flinch at all.

I am pretty sure it was Joel who got blasted off the line which allowed them to get that INT on the shovel pass.

Agree, it should've been thrown on the RT.

Yep, it was he

There was a play in the 3rd quarter, where Brady threw an out route but Dorsett was sliding out of bounds when he caught it and it was rightly ruled not a catch.. it was a fairly uneventful play..

But he ran about 8 yards downfield, stuck his hand right in Wards facemask, shoved him back and made his cut.. it was only because he slipped that it wasn't caught. the sideline official was standing right there staring at it.. No call. That play was going through my head when they called Higgins for making contact with a DB who was trying to hold his arm..

One thing that bothers me is the media places so much blame on the coaches for the penalties, when so many of these penalties are fundamentals for players that should have learned not to jump offsides playing kiddie football. Belichick always says that he looks for smart, tough, and dependable players and I think that the past several front offices have put too much emphasis on physical abilities and not enough on being smart and dependable. I think that there is only so much that the coaching staff can do with individuals that are not smart enough to be easily coachable.

There was also a bad hands to the face on one of their OL when they had a play that got into the red zone .. no call

Someone mentioned earlier that Chubb's fumbles were "bad luck". I would agree on the first fumble, but the second fumble was all on Chubb. When that long run broke open he absolutely had to switch the ball to the outside (sideline) arm, away from contact. They teach that to JV RBs, maybe even before that. Anyone carrying the football has to know which direction the pursuit is coming from and protect the football from being punched out.

On the intercepted shovel pass, it appears that one of the anchors to the OL, Joe Bitonio, got blown up by Lawrence Guy, who beat Landry to the ball. How does that happen?

The Browns gifted 10 points to the Pats with two turnovers deep in their own territory, and then cost themselves points with Chubb's second fumble in the red zone. Possible 17 point swing ... and there's your ballgame.

This week, I would like Freddie to send his assistant up to the attic in Berea to dig out Todd Haley's playbook, and bring it down to him. Take down the top 15-20 plays from it, along with the formations. Script them into the offense this week, along with the no-huddle offense, and more of Baker working under center. With the QB under center instead of the shotgun, your RBs are running downhill when they get the handoff instead of getting it from a dead stop, and it also makes your play action more effective.

I think Denver is a must-win for there to be any chance at a successful season this year.

The DL who intercepted it was lined up over our LT.. at the snap the LT pulled and the DL just fired off and followed him into the backfield... Bitonio had very little chance to get to him. He didn't get blown up, he never really touched him.

Now I'm not sure what was SUPPOSED to happen but the Pats DL was all over it.

YouTube Link that NFL Blocks and won't let be POSTED

That's a wider view than the youtube I watched - thanks. He wasn't blown up, but it sure looked like he needed to get between the DE and the exchange between Baker and Landry. Or maybe its just a really poorly designed play?

j/c...

I don't think it's poorly designed, we've run it successfully a number of times.. in fact, perhaps just like the super bowl.. the Pats are so well schooled that they saw a key and knew it was coming and that's why the guy fired off so hard into the gap...

How can anyone say that this doesn't seem preferential, either consciously or sub consciously?

What about the hands to the face call on edelman I believe where the defender barely grazed his facemask as they were hand fighting coming off the line?

I think the refs are sticking it to the Browns. They are calling ticky tack momentum changing plays because they can.

Power is intoxicating.

Browns fans caused the NFL the greatest professional sports league headache in history after they left town. Anyone of age remembers all the fax, phone and letterwriting campaigns going on. Literally burnt up NFL fax machines as I recall. They've hated us since then and we were shafted at the return by rushing the new team into existence and ever since.

Our own incompetence perpetuated it mind you..

The refs are bad for every team. My guess is that every team has a message board with a thread about how bad the refs are. When you combine that with the team being horrible when it comes to penalties it seems fishy. The part we can control is not being horrible and we aren't doing that.

Our first penalty was on an RPO, ineligible player downfield. That's on the QB. The offensive line doesn't know if it's a run or a pass. That means you need to hand the ball off or throw it quick. Baker double clutched it and threw an incomplete pass. We had six false start (seven if you include Freddie's brilliant move to intentionally false start) or illegal shift penalties, those are easy calls where players are just doing being undisciplined.

This Higgins situation is soooo stupid.

Id rather trade AC.

It's pretty dumb that he's not playing over Callaway but I don't mind trading him. He was never going to be on the team in 2020.

Higgins is a free agent at the end of the season and we are already paying huge salaries for two wide receivers. He's a tough re-sign. Callaway is cheap and under contract for two more years after this one. It's not a hard decision to make.

Which, IMO, is equally stupid to not have him on this roster in the future.

I don't think hes a tough resign, its not like hes a going to cost a ton - and what he brings is well worth it.

Its not saving money on AC's rookie contract when he cant play due to suspension or if hes dropping balls for INTs.

He's an above average receiver. I'm not going to be upset about losing him. There are a lot of guys like him in the league. When you are paying guys like OBJ and Landry players like Higgins just can't stick around.

I noticed on several plays that Greedy Williams was covering Julian Edelman. That is a pretty big change as T.J. Carrie has been our slot corner all year. There are rumors about Carrie being traded. I was wondering who would replace him if he is traded and I think we might have our answer (with Terrance Mitchell and Denzel Ward on the outside).

j/c

I noticed the Pats going at Greedy more often than not ... it was definitely their plan to go to him instead of Ward IMO

j/c...

Someone was assigned to block the DE and it was Bitonio

I’d like to congratulate the Cleveland Browns. We have sucked for decades, that is actually impressive. To suck for decades, is hard to do. 3 turnovers, in 3 consecutive plays. That’s a new level of suck. I wonder how many times that has happened in NFL history?

I’m being serious, it is hard to suck that much, it’s actually impressive I wonder what kind of suck we do next week. Maybe we commit 20 penalties, that is very possible. Dont underestimate the ability of the Cleveland Browns to suck, when you think it can’t get any worse, it actually can.

j/c...

Here we go.

A loss in Denver and this thing is going to go off the rails.