DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus 2020 Dem Candidates pt.3

All it gives me is hope that the Democrats won't shoot themselves in the foot again.

Hillary is a centrist. Obama ran as a progressive but was more centrist in office. John Kerry is a centrist. When was the last time a true progressive was the nominee? How far back do we have to go? Sometimes I think you talk just to see your mouth move because the words coming out of your mouth hold little fact based value... Show me the last 'far left progressive' that lost an election and I'll show you a half dozen centrist candidates that lost too. Simple fact is the far left rarely gets past the centrist in the party to get a nominee.

we DONT know how it will play out.

hell, as much as i didnt like Bernie, something tells me even you would agree that he probably would've done better than hillary against trump, seeing as how he actually campaigned and showed up to swing states.

and that moron is a card carrying socialist.

but now 2020 is different. everything is wide open right now. hell, we dont even know if trump will be president by then, which means the dynamics of the election could change overnight.

you see how im not talking in absolutes? yea, i learned my lesson from 2016, you clearly haven't.

In case you missed it, my mouth doesn't move when I type. Better luck next time. You may wish to work on that.

Hillary had a target put on her back for years by Republicans. Anyone who thinks she lost because she was a centrist has lost their ever loving mind.

According to what you are calling progressives, Obama was a very middle of the road centrist from the very beginning.

Kerry couldn't excite a rattlesnake into biting him.

You guys are right. You're going to get a bunch of moderates who have proven they will swing either way with their votes, to back the most far left candidate in someone like warren they have ever seen in their lifetime. Makes perfect sense. lmao

Swish, I'm not talking in absolutes. I'm talking in terms of odds. The odds of getting swing states to vote for a moderate candidate, and I'm not talking a centrist per say. I'm talking about Mayor Pete, is much better than a far left candidate.

You said it yourself that Pete is a progressive candidate. So it's not like I'm promoting Biden here.

I'm speaking in terms of electability and hoping for the best chance to win. Surely you understand that people who are notorious for being moderate voters would have an easier time supporting someone they feel they may have to bend a little to support rather feeling they have to bend over backwards to support.

ummm......doesnt this describe you to a T, though?

lolololol i mean come on bro.

No it really doesn't. The difference is I think that anyone, well almost anyone but Trump would be a better option.

Just like you, I follow the news, I follow the impeachment hearings and the evidence. I follow what the man says and his lack of honesty and integrity.

Let's face it man, most people don't keep up with things the way we do. So for people like us it's a no brainer. For most voters it isn't.

You know what I meant about the mouth thing...

Again, come November 2020, I'm voting Blue no matter who. I hope you do the same. I think Bernie is making a comeback and expect him to pass Liz up in the coming months. AOC is helping him somewhat because young people love her, but he is also the most popular among progressives IMHO.

And I like Pete enough to support him wholeheartedly. Super smart, well spoken, and doesn't seem to be easily shaken. He's about 30% progressive. But I do struggle with his religious convictions not seeming to match up with some of his campaign points. And He flipped positions on medicare for all, which tells me he's pandering to the center.

well i most certainly agree with that aspect.

my thing is that....bro look how many people said the country wasnt ready for a black president.

and while sure, we all can most certainly point to the clear evidence that supports said position.....Pit, he still got elected.

twice.

all im saying is that you never know. i most certainly never thought we would elect someone like freaking Trump, yet here we are.

and trump isn't ANYTHING. he just....exist.

Gives me a decent feeling.. I can vote for a moderate dem. I hope they maintain their moderate positions and don't succumb to the bullying of the national democratic party and go full on radical if they want to continue their career at the national level.

I also have to ask you since you are worried about center moderates not voting for far left candidates. Do you think Pete's homosexuality will be a factor in those swing states? Do you think those moderates are ready for that?

I have no issues with it whatsoever, but I think many in the center will.

You are the exact type of voter I had in mind. Of course I had no way of knowing how you as an individual felt about it, but I could see people similar to yourself feeling that way.

At least the dems have moved to a position of more intellectual honesty. They want massive expansion of government power and control in your life. But it's ok, trust them, nothing bad will happen.

As if republicans don't. They just want to help the rich and corporations where dems want to help working class and poor people. There are no conservatives once they are in power, republicans have proved that time and time again. Deregulation under the guise of freeing businesses from undue burdens is nothing more than giving them the right to pollute and otherwise act bad. Bad actors are the reason we had the need for the regs to begin with in most cases.

No I don't.

I think most of those who would be concerned about this are already Trump loyalists. The hard line evangelicals. Those who are so insecure in their own manhood that they think being a bully or looking up to a bully is an attribute.

Let's face it, most people by far know someone who is gay, have a close friend or relative who is gay. The stigma isn't what I used to be.

As Swish said before, people said Obama couldn't be elected because he was black. And once again those who refused to vote due to race are pretty much the all people staunchly standing in Trump's corner now. The Steven Miller's of the world have already chosen a side.

I would say that centrist 40 and under would not have as big an issue, where centrist 40 and over would.

Taking out evangelicals, I think its more an of an age issue than left and right.

This thread is about democrats..

So you're saying that they didn't vote for Obama because of race? Is that to mean that those in Trumps corner now might have voted for John Edwards or Joe Biden or Hillary or anybody else who was in that Primary? I mean, since it was about race....

I think that both race and sexuality play a part in it. Many see voting Democrat as being nothing more than a hand out to blacks and illegals. They think Democrats are "against white people".

And I do believe the racists of the world have taken a side. Same with homophobes.

That's not to try to say all Republicans are racists and homophobes. It just so happens that's the side they align themselves with.

So yes, I think a lot of votes coming from the right are based on those things. Like I said, they've already chosen a side and you won't get their votes.

Running a man who is gay won't make a difference because they weren't voting Democrat anyway.

Bam....Now that my friends is truth. And there is no denying that.

I agree. Making it pretty much impossible for me to consider myself a republican until they do some serious work to try to distance themselves from that group.

I've never met an intellectually honest Democrat.

Says the guy who likes all of his own posts.

You should have your water tested for lead.

jc

Colorado elected a gay governor. National media went bonkers with it when he won. Leading up to the election, I don't recall it being much of an issue or mentioned all that much.

You may never get that chance, given the trajectory and velocity with which this has become the face of that party. Those from whom you'd keep distance are firmly ensconced; they will not go quietly or willingly, now that they have the bully pulpit. In very short order, I believe they will constitute the majority mind set of the GOP, at which time, it completely ceases being the brand you always knew.

In the past 2-3 years, there has been a mass exodus of conventional GOP officials, dozens upon dozens of whom are retiring outright or returning to the private sector. These folks were your brand of GOP. A good number of those who are lining up to fill the vacancies are not.

It would take a civil war within the ranks of the GOP, and I'm not sure the old guard has the stomach these days. In some ways, they seem more fatigued and beaten down than their dem counterparts. I'd be surprised to see them 'spine up' at this late date to fight for the soul/direction/ideals of the party.

Splinter party, perhaps? They'll never seek a home with donks, but they certainly aren't comfy with how things stand at present.

It would seem that everyone who is like you.... is doing the same thing as you. That's how a man like Trump can hijack an age-old traditional party and turn it into something that you don't recognize- and can't stand.

You may never get your party back from these jackals. But then again, how well does one think a leaderless pack of jackals will fare, once their alpha is gone? At that point, is there anything left that you would even want back?

sad set of circumstances, no?

Pete Buttigieg's youth and optimism is winning over older Iowans

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/pete-but...ory?id=66773614

And? Your trying to combat what I said?

Your article doesn't do that, not one bit. In fact, the mere need to have an article saying "hey - old people are voting for him" shows that older people probably not predisposed to vote for him.

If your trying to say that older people are more inclined to accept a gay man than younger people, you can post all the articles you want, that's just not the case.

You mean the closed minded one's that are already loyal to Trump? If so then I agree.

We are talking about moderate centrist, in a dem candidate thread. Why are you brining up Trump or trump supporters? I really do think you have a complex.

This is exactly why the left will not run away with this election in 20.

By all accounts, they absolutely should. They literally short of digging up Epstein and running him on the ticket, it shouldn't even be close the way people hate trump.

Yet, when someone like myself, who is absolutely open to vote Dem or even just sit out, makes a comment that is complete unbiased - you try to turn it into something about Trump...smh

Congrats - you have run yet another person out of the discussion which could have the potential to be a 2 vote swing.

The point in this is not complex.

From the article.....





I guess you haven't been following the thread. Which doesn't surprise me.

The fact is, most people in today's society have a child, close relative or friend who is gay. Those who find that some type of macho, you know, "try to kick me in the balls!", kind of person has already made their mind up about who they're voting for. They think being a bully or supporting a bully makes them tough. They aren't moderate or going to vote for anyone but Trump. That's why he was brought up.

Open minded moderates will vote for a gay man just like they voted for a black man. Then you have those on the other side who would vote for neither.

Folks just don't get it.

The Democrats are desperate because the Democrats can't field an electable candidate so they are desperate because they know with the field the way it is now, Trump rolls to another victory EASILY

That being said, Obama himself has warned the Democratic Party that they have completely lost their way.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/16/obama-warns-democrats-against-going-too-far-left.html

https://www.latimes.com/politics/story/2...ng-too-far-left

https://www.axios.com/obama-2020-candidates-left-3ec239c4-0e0d-43ac-98df-17e7629eb7cf.html

and I quote:

"“I don’t think we should be deluded into thinking that the resistance to certain approaches to things is simply because voters haven’t heard a bold enough proposal and if they hear something as bold as possible then immediately that’s going to activate them" - Barrack Obama

“This is still a country that is less revolutionary than it is interested in improvement. They like seeing things improved. But the average American doesn’t think that we have to completely tear down the system and remake it. And I think it’s important for us not to lose sight of that.” - Barrak Obama

"“My point is that even as we push the envelope and we are bold in our vision, we also have to be rooted in reality and the fact that voters, including Democratic voters and certainly persuadable independents or even moderate Republicans, are not driven by the same views that are reflected on certain, you know, left-leaning Twitter feeds or the activist wing of our party,”" - Barrack Obama

People just don't get it, the Majority of America is NOT in favor of:

The Democrats radical positions on immigration (Obama doesn't support them, he flat out), healthcare, and other areas are NOT what the majority of the common working American voter wants.

The News media has tried to normalize the absolute bonkers radicalization of people like AOC and the Squad, and most Americans have universally rejected their idea of a "perfect America"

Will the Democrats be smart enough to listen to Obama? Will they get back to being the party of the middle class working American, that supported industry, construction, and labor reforms and healthcare in this country? Or are they going to continue down this radical road of liberal extremism that to be frank is incompatible with our Republic and Constitution.

the Repubs only keep getting the votes they get because the Dems give people no other option. Not a single candidate the Dems have up right now is electable, it wouldn't matter if Barney the Purple Dinosaur was running against those people, Barney would win.

Yet, here we are today on the Twitter verse with the Dems calling out Obama telling him he turned his back on "Hope and Change", and that he is "liberal enough" and all other sorts of troll comments.

If Obama was running for President today, he would have to run as a Republican, The Dems no longer support his platform.

Obama never wanted free healthcare, he wanted affordable healthcare. Whats affordable or not is up for debate, but he never wanted it to be free, folks were going to have to pay a fair share on their own. Obama was also very pro-secure borders. He deported more illegals than any President in history. Obama made numerous statements on tv on how he would continue to hunt these people down and bring them to justice and he did. the fact he deported more than any President in hisory proves it. Obama was a blood hound for illegals, and he absolutely was against open borders and all this other radical far left immigration idealogy you see out of the Democrats today.

The funny thing is, except for the border wall, all the increased security and stuff aorund the border was Obama ideas! Trump left Obama executive orders in place for dealing with people at the border, and Trump was just following them! It was Obama that urged Trump to ramp up border security artound Mexico during his transition from office.

If the Democrats don't make a huge platform shift, and soon, they will end up as a 3rd party. They gotta get people like the Squad out of there and not let their ideas poison the party, they are destroying the Democratic Party, they are a far worse cancer than the Tea Party was to the Republicans, and the Republican Party barely survived the Tea Party...

Will the Dems listen to Obama? So far it doesn't look like it...

We'll see. I agree with Obama. Some seem to think they can win without listening to him.

They have candidates who can win. The question is will they nominate one of them.

The problem the dems are facing at the moment is that the republicans have rolled up the wackiest things each dem have said and attributed it to "the dem party".... eventually one person will come out of this and will have to stand alone and the wacky ideas of the others will be gone from the discussion...

Right now you have Beto and his gestapo-style comments about bringing force to your home to take your guns...

Bernie suggesting that Bill Gates with his $106 billion in net worth could pay $100 billion in taxes...

Kamala Harris saying kids should go to school from 8 am to 6 pm to mirror the typical parents work schedule to make it easier on the parents...

Biden, the one issue that over 65% of American agree on, which is legalizing marijuana, comes out AGAINST it.. <smdh>

Warren just wants everything to be free.. healthcare, childcare, housing, college, student debt... "Republicans said $940 billion over 10 years for the Affordable Care Act was too expensive — but that’s a rounding error compared with Warren’s agenda." and that's from the freaking Washington Post...

Pete Buttigieg wants to completely dismantle the supreme court and remake it into a 15 judge panel...

At some point some of these will fall by the wayside and one of them will have to stand alone and defend themselves and only THEIR ideas... then we will see what happens... because for now, you roll them all up.. yea, they look like one giant conglomerated lunatic.

Anyone is 'electable' if they get the votes. This is a BS talking point. Trump proved that.

Where was this said, I'd like the link:

Me, a 'victim'?

Geesh dude, get over yourself. Or, as you always do, change the topic. I never claimed victim, at all.

If you ask swish nicely, he mind hand you a bit of credibility back.

It actually came from Gates talking about Warren’s wealth tax. Bernie spoke up (on Twitter) and added his two cents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.commondreams.org/news/2019/11/07/taxing-bill-gates-100-billion-counters-bernie-sanders-could-end-homelessness-and%3famp

So DC, you stoop so low as to use this as a smear on Bernie when it's obvious he is just making a point using a made up example with Gates? smh

The fact you don't find me credible is all the credibility I need.

Yeah, you weren't whining arch.