DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns: State of Affairs

j/c...

Here's a gross look at the Browns State of Affairs this century...

Bright side, we just concluded our 6th best season of the last 20, by record.

Hey, I'm choosing to look at the glass as half full. Ok wait maybe that's a quarter full... or an eighth. Upon further inspection, that is just the curve of the bottom of the glass. There are a couple drops of water from the last person who drank out of it, though.

Joke is probably not the right word for Jerry Jones. He's more of a cook than a joke. I just think it's funny that many of us make fun of Jerry Jones for being crazy and then when he hires a person that one of us may have wanted he turns into a genius.

Just because he threw what many of us feel to be a pretty good game of darts this time doesn't make him a genius.

There's some good and bad with Jerry. Let's put it this way-- there are plenty of better owners in the league, but there are also plenty of who are worse.

Look at the above graphic. The Cowboys have a winning record over the last 20 seasons. That doesn't even cover the 3 Super Bowl wins during Jones's tenure from before that time period, though we could debate how much of that was because of Jones (Cowboys fans would say, not much.)

I think where the problem lies here is in a single word. That word is genius. I don't feel Jones is a bumbling fool but I also wouldn't say he's a genius either.

Jones is a good owner. I hate the Cowboys and I think he is sleazy. But he is a good owner. He hated the fact Jimmy Johnson got all the credit early, and he has been trying ever since to prove he can do it. He hasn’t, but his teams have been pretty good.

I agree, he got a bit cubby. I chalk that up to the long process after the college season and getting married. Sometimes you have to take a break.


That said, if he doesn't drop 10-15 in fat and chisel up a bit this off season, we might have a problem.

I think we should interview Jeff Fisher, see if he can bring some of those 8-8 records here!

Dang man....how the heck have you been!


Good to see you, my old friend. Hope all is well!

Doing great, great seeing all my old friends on here. Hope you are doing well too. Decided to come back and see what everyone was saying with the ineptitude of our organization which is so frusterating It'll make winning so much sweeter though!

My 2 cents.....

QB- Baker definitely took a step back in his 2nd season. Unfortunate, but it happens in the NFL. I look for him to regroup and make strides moving forward. I do not think he should be considered a bust at this time, however another Jameis W. type turnover filled season would not be good.

Coaching- F as in failure across the board. So many issues throughout the year. Penalties, soft defense, bad tackling, horrible blocking. Looking back, FK should have never even been given consideration but it is the Browns so there you go.

OL- Could have schemed a bit better to help out both tackles but overall not great OL play. I can be on board with average, but no better than that. Obviously Chubb's success makes the line seem a bit better but the pass protection was not great. There were times when Baker did not help them out, but there were many a game where he was running for his life most of the game. How much of this has to do with the predictable play calling? I don't know, but it definitely did not help.

Defense- Losing Garrett was huge, the man is a freak and continues to be held almost every play but still produces. Again, the Browns can not stop the run. Safety play was suspect. Schoebert looks like an all pro some games but is bad in others. Giving up on Avery was a shocker to say the least.

Dorsey- Brought in talent, but did not have the staff to develop it or ensure that all players were committed to their craft. The Hiring of FK seems like a firable offense but I do not think we have all the info of what actually happened during the last 2 seasons. I would have liked for him to have one more season, he was a clear upgrade over Savage and Farmer.

Ownership- UGH- The coaching carousel alone makes this franchise look like the jokes of the league. I know Jones gets a lot of crap for being meddling owner, but his teams have been in the playoffs and are usually competitive.
I am sure Cowboys fans would love it if he would just relinquish his GM duties, but I do not see that happening.
Hasslem is very close to Snyder-esque.

Overall, the Browns should have been better, but until we put a couple of winning seasons together, I will consistently predict 7-9 until things start moving in the right direction.

Vers I enjoy your posts, just try not to be so sensitive. Who cares what someone posts on here. Have your say and move on.

Go Browns!!!!!!!!

Welcome back, KSA!!



Have we fired Stefanski, yet?

Won't happen...we got it right this time.

We need a "Not holding my breath" emoji.

As often as we fire HC's and GM's we need an exploding emoji.

Just a help wanted sign would work.

As long as it's in neon lights.

Browns: State of Affairs:

" Clean-up in Aisle 4"....

Clean-up in Aisles 4, 5 & 6...

Great to see you posting again Versatile Dog!

Bring a mop.

There's some decent stuff in your analysis of the team and I salute you for sharing it. However, you didn't need to go into all the hate re: the board, the members, the "lies" etc. etc. Why? Because you essentially say that you hate the haters and negativity of this board by being negative about this board and hating some of its members! And, as somebody else commented...you never hesitated to say some very mean and spiteful things to many, many people in here, yet whenever people held you to task you threw a tantrum and pointed fingers saying everybody else was at fault. Instead...how about modeling behavior that you wish to see in others? When you do that I am sure people will treat you differently. Or, you might see the positive rather than the negative, which would no doubt be less stressful for you.

And, I gotta ask, and I am not being rude when I do, but if you are no longer going to support the Browns why did you come back here to post all this? Just curious.

I'm a Browns fan. I was born here, will probably die here. They are my football team.

I posted this on FB yesterday.

The Browns have a new head coach, the 5th in 7 years. I want to feel excited, or at least enthusiastic. But it's tough. He seems nice, has a decent resume, albeit without HC experience. But the track record of the Haslams ownership is pathetic. All I can do is wait, watch, and hope that Kevin Stefanski can do well enough to avoid the axe before his version of the Browns has a chance to gel.

That's my assessment of the state of the affairs.

Jimmy Haslam has the worst winning percentage of any owner in major (US) sports history. He has to look up to Ted Stepien. Until he starts wining regularly, this is who he is, and who his team is.

I have no real hope that anything will change until it actually changes. I had hope the past 2 seasons that things were starting to change ...... and then he blew everything up one more time .....

Good luck Kevin. You're gonna need it.

On thing Haslam has over Stepien is that he never chucked balls off the Terminal Tower ending in a disaster!

This is how I feel. However, I was add that as much as I hoped Freddie was the guy....he was arguably the worst hire at the worst time to lead this group. We have talent. A lot of it and they were desperately looking for somebody to lead them, but Freddie was clueless and just wanted to hang out, laugh, have fun and drink with the boys. That cost him the locker room and his job and the guy who was responsible for bringing both the talent and the clueless HC into the mix is also now out. So be it.

Haslam has promised us all of this before and until it actually starts to show on the field I won't listen anymore to anything he has to say. And, why should we?

I wish Stefanski well and certainly won't root against the team, but I have definitely grown jaded and will be cautious with my enthusiasm and optimism next September.

Can't say I agree.

Everyone in this world has a super power unique unto themselves.
For this super power, shall they be named.

Your name: ".gifMaster."

You've posted some very funny stuff.
Props given where props are earned.
Nicely done.

Perfect.

Only the Browns would think reuniting the guys that orchestrated 1 and 31 is a good idea after firing a guy who went 13-18-1 and was lauded for assembling perhaps the NFL's most talented roster.

Welcome back to guys who thought Wentz wasn't a top 20 qb. Welcome back to the guys who thought Trubisky should have been the first overall pick. Welcome back to the guys who traded the 12th overall pick after Hue Jackson thought they were going to draft D. Watson.

I predict the Browns will win quite a few games this upcoming season. I predict they win some games the following season and then be unable or unwilling to keep the talent Dorsey acquired. They will be "smart" and start building for the late 2020s.

This is going to be so fun to watch.

Except they didn't bring Hue back. Hue was the weak link in that chain.

I think the guys we have will work well together and continue to build.

Ugh, I hate that I liked this, but you're not wrong. All those things are true.

Just gotta hope that somehow the implosion came from Hue/Haley etc. and that they fixed those wrinkles.

Here's how I hope it's gonna work:
Stefanski does whatever he wants on offense.

Our D coord does what they do on D.

The coaches tell Berry the type of players they need, and then they run the analytics and give Coach the top 3 scored.

Then Coach picks his favorite of the three for his scheme/instinct and that's who they go with.

I'm a giant math nerd that works daily with A.I. heuristics and data sorting, and the one thing that always gets gummed up is missing that "gut instinct" that all the best in their field always have.

However you don't wanna go by just "gut" or you end up with Manziel :-P

So yeah, hopefully they get the process right this time otherwise Vers I'm afraid your predictions are exactly correct

If you quit being a fan, shouldn’t you not be posting? Or in the Smack Shack?
If I’m reading correctly, you are more pleased that you will be able to feel smug if they lose?

There's plenty of that going on already. I don't see the point of singling out 1 person.

Yeah, if it weren't just for that one guy......

The terrible QB room and lack of offensive weapons had nothing to do with it.

j/c:

2020 Cleveland Browns: Buy, Sell, Cut

Believe it or not, NFL free agency is right around the corner with the legal tampering period commencing on March 16. During this time, teams are allowed to contact and enter into contract negotiations with the certified agents of players who will become Unrestricted Free Agents (UFAs) upon the expiration of their 2019 contracts.

There are a lot of familiar faces and household names that are going to be free agents in 2020, as well as players who could be subject to cuts based on performance, replacement value, and sheer worth. These names include (but are not limited to) the following:

Middle linebacker Joe Schobert
Wide receiver Rashard Higgins
Edge defender Olivier Vernon
Running back Kareem Hunt
Right tackle Chris Hubbard
Free safety Damarious Randall
Left tackle Greg Robinson.
Let’s play a game called “Buy, Sell, Cut” with this list, for which the rules are self-explanatory:

Buy Joe Schobert
Schobert is the defensive leader of this Browns team and is well-deserving of a new contract. The veteran MIKE1 linebacker is at his best in pass coverage, wherein (per Pro Football Focus) he had a grade of 87.7 in 2018 and 67.6 in 2019, which is still respectable for a player the position. The former Pro-Bowler set career marks in passes defended (9), interceptions (4), tackles for loss (7), and solo tackles (89), serving as an invaluable piece both for his on-field performance and in the locker room. He still has room for improvement in the run game, but his services are much needed and wanted going forward. When asked about returning to the team in 2020, Schobert stated, “My number one priority is to play the season out and do the best of my abilities and control what I can control, I can’t really control what’s going on, what’s being said upstairs to my agent and them. I trust my agent. He’s going to do what’s best for me. I trust the Browns are going to do what’s best for the organization. In my perfect world, yeah, I’d be in Cleveland.” I, for one, would love to see him don the brown and orange for the foreseeable future.

Buy Rashard Higgins
The misuse of the mercurial wide receiver was one of the great mysteries of the 2019 season (and there were quite a few). It is well-known among certain NFL circles and fans that Higgins was quarterback Baker Mayfield’s safety blanket during the quarterback’s record-setting rookie campaign. During the 2018 regular season, Higgins had the highest success rate in the league on deep left passes, the 14th-most yards per target over the past five seasons (429 qualifying wide receivers), and the fifth-best passer rating when targeted from Weeks 9-17 (131.0). Flash-forward to 2019 and the four-year veteran was absent any meaningful playing time, only accumulating 172 offensive snaps in seven games for which he was on the gameday roster.

One thing working in Higgins’ favor for 2020 is that he was part of the 2016 NFL Draft that was spearheaded by then Executive Vice President of Football Operations, Sashi Brown and Vice President of Player Personnel, Andrew Berry, who was named as the team’s General Manager on Monday.

Cut Olivier Vernon
This was one of the more challenging evaluations of the 2019 season. Vernon was consistently hampered by a knee injury that forced him to miss six of the team’s 16 regular-season matchups. He played fairly well during the season, generating a 6.5 pass-rush productivity, which is a measure by PFF that rates pressures created on a per snap basis. However, injuries are becoming a concern for the veteran, who hasn’t played a complete season since 2016 with the New York Giants. Another deciding factor here is the salary cap situation, for which the team could cut Vernon before June 1 and save $15.5 million with no dead cap space.

Vernon could be replaced by someone along the lines of Arik Armstead from the San Francisco 49ers, who is an unrestricted free agent in 2020. Per PFF, Armstead had a 90.0 season grade, which was third-best at the position. Additionally, he had a wins above placement (WAR) value of 0.23 in the 2019 season, which was ninth-best among all qualifying players at the position group. The 26-year-old could be a long-term solution at the Edge defender spot opposite Myles Garrett, especially with the familiarity of rumored defensive coordinator favorite Joe Woods, who currently serves as the 49ers defensive backs coach.

Sell Kareem Hunt
Hunt will be a restricted free agent in 2020, meaning he can negotiate a contract with any team, but if he accepts an offer sheet from a new team, the Browns would have right of first refusal. This is a five-day period in which the Browns would have the opportunity to match the offer and retain him, or choose not to match the offer, in which case the Browns may receive one or more draft picks from the original offering team. The Browns could place a second-round tender on the young back, which would carry a projected cost of $3.278 million in 2020. However, after the damning video released by TMZ Monday, the front office and coaching staff will have to ask themselves if the juice is worth the squeeze. Meaning, would it be more advantageous for the Browns to draft a running back in the mid-rounds, e.g. University of Utah’s Zack Moss3 and have control of that player for three-to-four years at a discounted rate, rather than just one more year of control for Hunt?

I am in support of the former, mostly as a result of Hunt’s continued questionable decisions off-the-field. There is no doubting his talent, versatility, and playmaking abilities at the running back position, but talent will only take you so far. Sometimes the best ability is availability and Hunt’s availability continues to dwindle with each mistake. Further, he plays at a position for which there is relatively inexpensive replacement value, e.g. of the top-15 leading rushers in the NFL in 2019, only six were drafted in the first round. The backup to Nick Chubb should be drafted in the mid-rounds of the 2020 NFL Draft.

Cut Chris Hubbard
The right tackle signed a five-year, $36.5 million contract with the Browns on March 14, 2018. The contract included $9 million guaranteed at signing and $15.15 million guaranteed regardless of injury. I believe it is fair to say Hubbard has not lived up to this contract, as his performance consistently underwhelmed at the position and could even be considered a liability in both pass protection and run-blocking. In fact, PFF, there were 65 offensive tackles who played at least 500 offensive snaps in 2019, wherein Hubbard ranked 50th in pass-block grade (62.0) and 63rd in run-block grade (38.5). Further, his 29 quarterback hurries allowed were the ninth-most. The Browns could cut ties with Hubbard before June 1 and save $4.9 million on the salary cap, with only $2.4 million of dead cap space. This is a no-brainer in my opinion.

As mentioned in Mock Draft v3.0, Hubbard could be replaced by former Auburn University Tigers right tackle Jack Driscoll at a fraction of the cost with a hopeful premium of production.

Sell Damarious Randall
The Browns traded for the veteran safety at the beginning of the 2018 league in a deal that included DeShone Kizer and a swap of fourth and fifth-round draft picks with the NFC North Green Bay Packers. During his two-year stint with the team, Randall never graded higher than 30th at the position group, nor did his wins above replacement ever top the same ranking (PFF). His 2018 season had a few bright spots, including four interceptions, nine passes defended, and 2 solo tackles, but will be most remembered for the year he handed former head coach Hue Jackson the football after an interception versus the Cincinnati Bengals.

2019 was a different story, as Randall was front-and-center of two incidents during the season: he was ejected week 11 versus the Pittsburgh Steelers for a helmet-to-helmet hit that left rookie wide receiver Diontae Johnson bleeding from the year and then was a healthy scratch for unspecified disciplinary reasons just two weeks later.

https://waitingfornextyear.com/2020/01/b...on-kareem-hunt/

Cutting Olivier Vernon would be a huge mistake.

Agreed. Unless we get his replacement beforehand. If so, cutting him would cost us nothing. In a perfect world, I hope we restructure his contract. His missed games per season has increased the last three seasons. That's not a good trajectory, IMO.