DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum What did you learn the most from the last regime failure?

YI learned that I've been better at evaluating HC talent than the FO has been since 1999.

You just learned that .... u usually catch on much much quicker than that ...

What do you grade Kevin Stefanski?

I learned that tanking and poor personnel decisions by Sashi, Depo, Berry, etc had a residual effect on a very good GM in John Dorsey.

Of course, I predicted that establishing a losing culture would have long-lasting negative consequences on the Browns.

I consistently maintained that football was a different animal than baseball and basketball due to the number of games played during a season and the time between games. That theory was consistently ridiculed by a certain faction of the board. Of course, they are now ignoring how ex-NFL people are talking about the issues w/establishing a losing culture in football. Instead, they'll post a tweet from a dude in Canada w/34 followers to tell us how bad Dorsey was. LOL

I think this year's team will win quite a few games due to the talent Dorsey acquired. I think they will win a couple less the following year and then things will get ugly again. Players won't be re-signed. Players will be cut. Questionable draft choices will highlight each and every year. The rhetoric will be that the Browns are building for the future and are being "smart." The reality of it is this particular group is as clueless as any one group can be.

I would rather have had Rivera or McCarthy.

How dare you advocate bringing people here with proven NFL success at their respective positions rather than elevating the flavor of the month!

I don’t believe Andy n Kev were the flavor of the month .... not sure either of them had a sniff elsewhere this off season ... Not saying that as a negative ... IMO its not ... the flavor of the month is 50/50 at best ...

Past results don’t guarantee future success ....

At lease Kev’s never been fired as a HC .. he’s got that over those two ...

I agree with experienced coaches, but everyone has to start somewhere. If they selected who they felt was the BEST choice, then I'm good with it. If they selected Stefanski because he'd "fall in line," then it's a horrible decision.

How many changes are retreads and fail time and time again?

Freddie had never been fired as a HC either. Until he was.

Freddie is Ready is right there with ...

DAVID DAVID DAVID

And

BRADY BRADY BRADY

More egg on my face ... thank god i love eggs .. *L* ...

A little math for u ...

Wanna make a bet on who gets fired first ...

I’ll take Kev and u can have Ron and Mike ... u take both cause that will “even” out the thief’s quick trigger finger ... *L* ...

I actually believe this group gets 4 or 5 years .... the thief loves analytics and these are “his” peeps ...

When it appears as though Haslam uses a dart board to decide who to fire first, no bet is safe.

Now I will bet you that none of them get four years. Other than Depo. You know, the guy that always gets paid yet many claim Haslam never listens to.

How does that math go again?

https://www.dawgtalkers.net/ubbthreads.ph...oll#Post1720483

In the first poll listed in the above link 45 people voted. Three of them said Stefanski was their first choice.

I learned that I may have better instincts than Jimmy Haslam LOL

And yet now......

We have more information?

We have people convincing themselves that uproven people at both the GM and HC positions are a wonderful idea.

Probably a little bit of both.

Shocking, I know, that fans of a team talked themselves into rooting for the team. It has happened before though! Some people talked themselves into Hue Jackson (Hue Jackson!) even after he only won one game in two years.

I was vote 46.

So if you think the hires were bad you don't root for the team?

I don't think anyone actually "talked themselves into Hue Jackson". They did know he had a crappy roster and a crappy QB room to work with though.

The best I actually heard about hue was, "Well let's see if he can do any better with better talent". Not exactly a ringing endorsement.

I'm sure you were. A lot of people try to skew the numbers after the fact.

j/c...

I learned that after a garbage season, STH prices can still go up.

Mine went up $500 this year!

For how many tickets?

Two.

$250/seat.

I sit on a price break. The row directly in front of me went up $500/seat.

U sit on the bench? ... *L* ... that’s 25 a ticket a game ... guess its not that much ...

What was the previous price?

No, not horrible, considering they are still overall lower than the league average.

Just funny after a disaster after a year.

Previous cost: $4,000
New cost: $4,500

Let's hope the STH gift is upgraded this year from a pair of socks and 99¢ gloves!

A comatose frog, about to be pinned to a board, has better instincts than Jimma Haslam.

I learned that "football" guys make fatal mistakes., such as Freddie

I didn't learn this just now....I know that you have to be able to get along and not storm troop over other people who are trying to help.

Team building doesn't stop with the football players.

That John Dorsey, Eliot Wolf, and Alonzo Highsmith were a damn good front office. Best in decades. In TWO years' time they got us more talent than every other front office staff did since the return. Combined. Now, we have a complete turn-over of the front-office leadership yet again. Youngest and least experienced GM in history. Part of the 1-15 0-16 crew... Woo hoo! We just let a TON of front office experience walk out the door. But of course, that is best for the team because they were football guys and you sure as hell don't want football guys running a football team. That job is best suited for mathematicians. Did John Dorsey make mistakes? Damn right he did. Name ONE GM that hasn't missed on players or hired the wrong coach at some point... Just ONE. EVERYONE makes mistakes. Yet we still have more FOOTBALL talent on this team that we have had since the return and that is a direct result of John Dorsey, Eliot Wolf, and Alonzo Highsmith as well as the rest of the staff they put together and worked with. A team that John Dorsey had a BIG hand in building just won the Super Bowl. Sure glad we don't have him around anymore. *snicker* It is unfortunate you can't fire the real problem with this team. Haslam. Worst owner in the league. He is starting to make Modell look better... Never thought that could happen.

Well then, thank god they got rid of the football guys. Wouldn't want them around. Of course, John Dorsey had a big hand in building the team that just won the Super Bowl. So yeah, I can see why running him out of town for a GM that is the youngest and least experienced in the league is a huge step up for the team. *snicker* We won't miss him or Wolf or Highsmith one little bit. lmao

Nope. Acquiring all of this talent in the last two years was a huge failure. We need to purge any and all talent while collecting draft picks and cap room. Pass on all quarterbacks because they might miss and talk a good game about how winning is still important even though bringing in any talent or spending any money is strictly verboten. Having talent on the roster is a horrible feeling to some of these guys. From the sound of it, a lot of these people prefer returning to having the least talented roster in the NFL again.

For the record I am not glad John is gone. I had hoped he would stay. He decided he couldn't do that.

My second comment was more on point. He didn't do much for team building beyond selecting football players. It's the same reason he was bounced out of KC.

John Lynch and Kyle Shanahan

The Niners started out 6-10 and 4-12 under Shanahan and Lynch in their 1st 2 years. Does anyone think that the same records would result in a 3rd year under Haslam? (no matter injuries, or any other factors)

So, you're upset that we didn't magically choose to go with a Guaranteed Home Run set of choices at both positions.... man, if only we'd thought of trying THAT at any point in the last twenty years.

I'm saying that if Shanahan and Lynch had been in Cleveland, and produced the results they did in SF in years 1 and 2 ..... they would have been fired before year 3.

well, I reckon we'll just have to hope that Haslam has some patience this time around. Not much else to do, regardless of who was hired.


That being what it is, I strongly suspect that as long as there aren't signs of the internal dysfunction that has marked every single regime of the last 10+ years, he will have that patience. The fans and Cleveland beat writers, though, not so much.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaybe if Baker got hurt like Garoppolo did. Maybe.

Why has there been internal dysfunction, though? I believe, and have read, that a lot of it starts and ends with Haslam. Why should I believe he will change now?

I listen to the pressers for the new HC/GM/etc .... and it is almost always the same garbage. Will it be different this time? Who knows? I won't believe it until I see it.

I wonder what Haslam will do if we wind up winning only 4 games this coming season?