DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus MEDICARE FOR ALL WOULD SAVE $450 BILLION ANNUALLY WHILE PREVENTING 68,000 DEATHS, NEW STUDY SHOWS

Two timelines have been proposed. A 2-4 year transition in stages... and a 10 year transition in stages. And most actual healthcare providers will not see significant reductions in pay because there will be no more deadbeat and poor people write offs. hospitals will prosper too. It's the price gouging price of meds and medical devices that will take a hit, but they already sell for a profit for much less in other countries.

Well, then seriously, I feel like I did my due diligence here, I even supposed that ALL of Bernie's ideas for funding would be passed... WTH am I missing??

The alternative is Trump and his admin killing Obamacare including pre-existing conditions and dumping 60 million off their healthcare. Meds will get higher, premiums will continue to skyrocket, and social security and medicare will be cut. If this sounds better, you have options.

The current rate of medicare is so high because the elderly and sick are the only ones enrolled. Your not going to spend nearly that much on a healthy population.

Then factor in the things I listed in my earlier post. I'm guessing the bean counters that did the study have a much better grip on the number than any of us.

1779

Obama saved a whole lot of money in 2009 by staving off the total economic collapse the last republican handed the dems. Before that Clinton turned the economy around. And now Bernie is going to fix it again... see the pattern yet?

Has this plan actually been laid out? As in % increases and thresholds?

On his site. I posted a link to what has been put out. And he and AOC have talked about it in some interviews.

Thanks ... I missed it but I don't follow every thread. I'll google

https://www.sanders.senate.gov/download/options-to-finance-medicare-for-all?inline=file


https://berniesanders.com/issues/how-does-bernie-pay-his-major-plans/

And this study:

https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1003013

Currently we're 20 trillion dollars in debt but people want to give the government more money, control, and power.

Based on their previous track record, no matter what administration, what makes you think they'll do anything efficiently? This is a high level general question. I just don't get it.

Because people want a return for all those taxes that helps their lives not just big corporations and the rich. Wouldn't you like a return on your investment? Don't you think it's time the middle class had a government that puts them first? Just a high level general answer.

You missed the point. You're just regurgitating socialist talking points.

Everyone wants return on investment for their money or taxes. However, the government's track record shows that they do NOT spend their revenue wisely. If they did then why are they 20 trillion dollars in debt?

Just because you give more money to the government in taxes doesn't mean they're going to use it efficiently. Based on their negative situation I'd bet no.

The system of capitalism does put the middle class first and has lifted the most people out of poverty in the history of the world. That is a fact and one of the main reasons why the United States is the most powerful country, has the best economy. Its not a coincidence.

How do you trust the government to do anything efficiently based on their spending track record? Answer the question. I want anyone who wants socialistic type programs to answer that question. Answer it.

So when somebody comes along and starts a movement some 40 million strong wanting to change that and create an economy that works for everyone, you want to crap on the idea because the rigged system you are so hell bent to preserve is somehow the only way that's right?

Are you seriously going to tell me the middle class has been put first the last 40+ years? AND we have the best economy because of socialism under FDR! That triggered the boom of the 50s and 60s! After WWII the American middle class built the strongest economy the world has ever seen. And since the late 70s corporate America has drained every red cent they could out of that economy in the name of larger profit margins. It worked pretty well until they started sending all the jobs overseas to make more profit. We stopped making stuff and became consumers and service providers. But don't full yourself, we're not that great country anymore, we're a consumer debt driven economy digging a big hole that is eventually going to swallow us all. Every year there is less for us, more for the rich, and our resources go to the highest bidder. We sell our best food to places like Japan were they have a real economy. We sell our best lumber to other countries and build our homes with twisted c-grade pine. I could go on and on with examples of corporations and fat cats bilking our country dry over the last 40 years. But you keep telling yourself how great it is. How great the debt is, rather you have personal debt or not you're paying the bill. Everything the government has done for the last 40 years has just killed the middle class. And unless you are elite, you are just a slave to the machine no matter how well off you think you are.

Imagine what your income would be if wages had kept pace with inflation the last 50 years. Imagine the money you would have if your weren't being put through the ringer for healthcare insurance, education, ridiculous housing costs, etc.

So when you ask me how I trust the government, I don't. But I see a chance to change all that. And I see people saying they've had enough and coming together to make those changes. I see people taking their country back, not from boogeymen like poor immigrants but from modern robber barons and a corrupt government. So yep, poor me a big ass glass of socialism and lets get this party started.

Bro stop acting like you care about the debt now. You and the rest of the conservatives went dark the moment trump got elected, despite the fact that he added to the deficit and debt.

Don’t start caring now. Ignore it like you did the last 4 years.

No ... these hypocrites will start crying about debt and deficit the moment a Dem is in office again - whether that's this year, the term after or the term after. Then they'll sit back and watch the debt go up and deficit go up and say nada once a Rep is back in the WH.

Thanks for the reply, but here's one area where people lose.

My employer pays 100% of my health insurance. With Bernie's plan I suspect that money will be diverted to the government, so no loss to me, except, now I will also have to pay additional tax, so technically, I am paying more money than currently.

I gotta pay more taxes too bro. We all do.

But I’m cool with that if that means our FELLOW Americans are all covered. I’ll take that all day everyday.

I rather my taxes go to our people’s quality of life over anything else.

Google inserted chome

That's not how it works, that's not how any of this works.

I am too Swish, but I'm pointing out that not everybody will be "saving" money, which is one of their "selling" points.

Granted yes, after saved deductibles and such probably, but luckily I have never had to use my insurance for things outside of preventative care that do not have deductibles.

And we all know if the long run, it will come into play in everyone's life, but there are a lot of people who won't see passed the now.

My most expensive out-of-pocket expense was a prescription last year that was $35.

Then of course there's always the concern that our government does what it does best, and that is use our tax dollars inefficiently, and/or use it as a threat against the people to get what they want. (IE: "If we don't raise taxes again, we will have to cut your healthcare.")

Yea not everyone will save initially, I agree. But that’s in the short term. If the government actually does what they’re suppose to do and make tweaks and changes and such, in the long term, it will be cheaper and more efficient.

It’s what the government should’ve done during the ACA, and maybe we wouldn’t be talking about national healthcare. But instead of making tweaks, they decided instead to try over and over again to get rid of it, and it’s a big reason to why we are where we are today.

I just believe way more people will benefit than not. And imo, there’s no way we will go through with this with no private insurance option. It’s the only way a national healthcare plan is going to pass.

.

JC,
I think its such a phony remark when some here are concerned
about their fellow americans when it suits their talking points.
But when it comes to illegals then their liberal horns come out and hate some of us "FELLOW AMERICANS" that don't agree with their craziness

eh, i rather people be wishy washy on that, rather than be like you with your every man for himself mentality.

thats pretty fake.

and selfish.

That's all you got.....FELLOW AMERICAN pfffft weak

caring about your fellow americans is weak?

ok, Trump.

Play the Trump card now my,m,my I guess Im done now before the race card comes and the commie card comes out cause that's all you and yours got here sad

A Democrat\Socialist trying to talk about debt, that's damn rich for sure.

I've always cared about the debt because I'm a Libertarian, not sure what the hell you identify as. Its not clear because your party has no message at the moment. Maybe socialism but that's about it. You WANT to increase the size of government and spending so don't you dare lecture me, you WANT more spending buddy. You WANT more government.

And I have a major problem with spending the past 4 years. Hell I have a problem with spending since 1971. I doubt you can tell me what happened that year. I'd be very surprised if you could.

It's almost as funny as Trump talking about debt. And as goes with it, the Republicans who support him talking about debt.

Do you have anything additional to contribute to the conversation? That's it? That's all you've got?

other than a corrupt racist nixon starting a war on drugs to destroy black and brown families?

i dont know what happened and dont care.

what i care about is what happened the last 20-30 years.

and again, you have been dead silent on the deficit and debt under trump, but wouldnt stop under obama, even though he lowered the deficit.

im just asking you to be consistent. trash trump like you did obama.

bet you wont.

Other than showing the hypocrisy of your previous post? Not at this time.

When you point the finger at Democrats for debt while Trump is racking up huge amounts of debt as we speak, I'm going to point that out.

Carry on.....

Did you read my last post I guess not? You're comprehension is incredibly low.

I'll say it again, I don't give A DAMN whether the administration is Trump's, Obama's, Clinton's, republican or democrat, they all spend too much!

Also, I'll help you guys out a little bit. The switch away from the gold standard happened in 1971. Ever since then we've moved to using fiat currency and been printing money, that is a problem. The money isn't backed by anything.

I also want an audit on the federal reserve today, this minute. I think we should be advocating for those things rather than more programs.

Why aren't the candidates talking about the debt? I want to get tickets to one of the Dem debates so I can ask Bernie Sanders what he's going to do about the debt.

Your reply about you don't care what happened in past history is your problem. That's why you believe in the stuff you do.

If you don't learn from history you're doomed to repeat it.

And he'll pound his fists on the table and say "Listen, Americans demand free healthcare as a right. Other countries do it, we can too."

OMFG ! How about you ask TRUMP about the debt ... he's actually, you know, 'in power' and is sending it HIGHER despite a booming economy. Good lord. Bunch of hypocrites.

Then maybe you should stop taking shots at only one side.

So just for snits and giggles.... wanted to see how the National Debt as a % of GDP compared between all those far left socialist EU countries - and the USA. You know those virtual commies with free nationalized health *the subject of the thread* and with high quality of life - and with healthier citizens - lower procedural costs - Germany with their commie free Universities ......

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/09/19/5-facts-about-government-debt-around-the-world/

I mean with all their Govt spending - they have to be up chit creek right ????

Oh - apparently not. I guess more real world, actual examples of how stuff works. No doubt not as good as that Alt Right Wing economic theory that's so popular. Maybe Trump or Tasty can get in touch and let them all know that what they are doing and living isn't right since it doesn't correlate to theory.

cool so you refuse to be consistent. gotcha

C'mon dude, that's a ridiculous shift... So Americans shouldn't care if someone running for POTUS cares about debt or how things should be funded because Donnie doesn't? If they do they're a hypocrite? WE pay the bills, and it's your exact approach that has led to the crisis... Not caring about the future and just pointing fingers at the past. Politicians do it, we do it, and nothing ever changes.