DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum So.. the first weekend of FA is in the books.. How'd we do?

Of all people to utter that statement....

Saint, you and I are friends. You are a fair poster. I just want to say that I didn't give them an F or a D. I did not even grade them.

I simply posed a question that we might want to consider before we automatically assign them an "A." I don't see why anyone would have a problem w/that?

I think none of this matters. There will be no more seasons.

Oh shoosh.. there aint no probs bud. I'm extending the conversation so we can chew on that bone. Lets consider it.. what IF thay actually had a plan and they executed the plan.. IMO that means we haven't seen the rest of the plan yet bc the draft is :hopefully: still on

Got it. I just don't know if you read the other posts that have followed our first posts. The crap is so old.

I do get what you are saying. Hang in there, bro.......and hopefully these guys will bring us a winner.

Every year Browns fans get giddy with delight
After free agency
New year new hope. The year before a typical season below .500.
New talent comes in. Here comes the Kool Aid.
Heck I remember the days when signing Dwayne Bowe and Kenny Britt was lauded as brilliant moves by
The GM. Sashi Brown could do no wrong
Only time will tell.
Wins will be factor if this is a good FA Class or
Not

Completely agree. Off-season grades mean absolutely nothing. What was it last year? A+ maybe? And the year before that? LOL. It's definitely hope season once again, which seems to be the only season we're able to win. I think I'll withhold my "off-season grade" until we win more than half our games. Whenever that may be. Or if ever.

I'm not a huge fan of filling gaping holes via draft. I've been pleasantly surprised by their aggressiveness so far... they've earned a little patience from me. If they expect to find Joe's replacement in the draft and expect that guy to come in and filling the role right off the bat.... sounds like a bad plan to me.

I don't see what is described as a "plan" at all. You would be depending on LB'ers worthy of your draft status falling into your lap at your picks.

You would be depending on LB'ers that are the BPA actually landing in your slotted draft picks. If not, it would be planning to reach based on need.

I would conclude that is far more hope than a plan.

Why do you think that?

You think our future is now that of waterworld or mad max?

j/c:

I think thus far the Browns got better on offense w/Conklin, Hooper, and Keenum.

I think the defense is less talented now--due to cuts and losing Joe in FA--than it was at the end of the season.

Exactly...

The two rookie LBs from last year should improve. We lost Sho and that's all at the position - focusing on guys who actually contributed last year. It was Sho, Wilson and Taki last year...Wilson and Taki will be a year older and the Goodson backup is already better than last year's backup(s). FA isn't finished yet and we still have the draft.

We are no worse at SS with Joseph because Burnett is unlikely available anyway and to my eye is no better than Joseph anyway...and Joseph is only 26.. No sense in claiming his release as a "loss" because he won't be playing anytime soon anyway.

Randall lost his mind last year and is/was a malcontent. He wasn't coming back regardless of who is in charge. Not a "loss". Burris and Murray signed for STUPID MONEY and were contributors but just JAGs. Sendejo is no slouch and is - at least - depth and experience.

Carrie was no McCourty by any stretch and was on a very STUPID MONEY contract...oh wait...McCourty wasn't on the team last year.

Billings is better depth than anyone we had as depth at DT last year and is only 26.

The Offense has been upgraded dramatically and the defense has picked up a starter - maybe two - and some reliable depth...and the additions aren't finished yet.

The interim grade in FA is clearly an "A".

Edited to add: I've read that the new regime is pretty high on Willie Harvey. FWIW.

I think Randall is clearly a loss. He's an excellent FS, an area we are very weak at.

I'm not assigning any blame here. He seems like a basket case and two FOs don't seem to want him. But I wish he could get his head on straight, and I wish they could find a way for him back on the team.

I'm totally in agreement. I really want him back on the team, but I get it. Dude has a screw or two loose.

Between his down year, stat-wise, and stories of him being a weirdo accumulating could lead to a very quiet FA period on his end of the phone. That's the best thing that could happen as far as getting him to not be a butt-head.

Yes but he seemed to check out last year - so while he was excellent 2018 - 2019 he was more 'meh'

But you give Baker a pass on the very exact thing.

If Baker should get another year, why not Randall.

Ha - and you posted that like a legit question. I'm sure it's not because I know you are smart ... but just in case, one is a 2nd year player. One has been in the NFL for 5 seasons. One struggled because of a multitude of issue not the least of which was his apparent regression in ability and preparedness - however he battled and fought every single snap. The other struggled (apparently) because he was upset and felt slighted by the FO and basically quit.

If I assumed that your question was legitimate - I'd ask you, based on what we know, if we could only bring back one of them - Baker or Randall - who would you want back? ,,,, and if you could bring back both of them, would you?

I look at Randall's performance and quit in the same light I do Jamie Collin's .... still has plenty of ability but chose not to play hard for the Cleveland Browns.

I'm not in favor of getting rid of good players without a plan. And I don't like the way the Browns traditionally give up on talented players for a multitude of reasons, many flimsy. The organization, due to the constant turnover, always does this.

Randall was a malcontent last year. Why? Who knows exactly. He was probably upset he wasn't getting a contract extension and he let that affect his play. Should that damn him to the Browns for all eternity? I say no, especially when he isn't signed yet and the Browns literally have no plan at the position. Take the chance that your new staff will get the best out of him.

At least come to the table and talk. We are talking about a former first round pick here that we got for pennies on the dollar. Uber talented and we need that on D.

My comment to your comment was meant to highlight how fickle this fanbase is and how readily we love to dismiss players. I'm not interested in watching Randall intercept passes for another team next year while we are counting on a rookie 7th round pick from Mount Union to man the spot.

I think Sendejo and the draft are the plan at that position.

Not comforting.

Understand and I agree to some extent, on the other hand at some point players burn Bridges with organizations. And organization burn Bridges with players. No one likes to see good players leave and play well for other teams, but it happens all the time. Unfortunately with the Browns it has happened more than it should have done over the years. But I don't blame the front office for Randall not being on the team. Schobert is different.... i would have liked him back and would have paid him, he was more to this track than just his individual game performance. Imo

j/c:

What do folks think of maybe trying to sign Vonn Bell at FS?

FA still available

https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-the-50-best-available-nfl-free-agents-in-2020

2020 NFL Free Agency Rankings
1. QB JAMEIS WINSTON
We went into detail regarding Winston and the roller coaster of emotions he elicits, and it doesn't take advanced numbers to tell the story of his 2019 season and career. He finished with over 5,000 passing yards, 33 touchdowns, and 30 interceptions, all perfect descriptors of Winston's game that moves the chains as well as any quarterback in the league while also putting the ball into the defense's hands more than any signal-caller in the NFL. The bottom line with Winston is that he may never change as he annually ranks near the top of the league in both positively and negatively graded throws, but that high-end volatility could lead to a wide range of outcomes from high-end starter with some interception luck to benchwarmer if the ball bounces the other way. A team with strong offensive weapons and a good coverage unit may want to see if they can extract the high-end season out of Winston, as he's capable of putting points on the board in the right situation.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

2. EDGE JADEVEON CLOWNEY
Clowney put up an 88.0 overall grade in 2018 — the highest mark of his career — and he followed up with an 87.3 grade after a trade to the Seahawks despite seeing his sack total drop from nine to three. Clowney has the 11th-best overall grade among all edge defenders since 2017, including the third-best mark against the run (91.3), but his pass-rush grade of 83.9 ranks just 25th among that same group. Pass-rushers earn massive contracts for their ability to get after the quarterback, but Clowney has always been good, not great, in that department. The price tag may be too high for many teams, but Clowney brings top run defense and solid pass-rush to the table, though his game has never really lived up to his draft hype and he’s never matched the production of other dominant edge defenders.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.


Dec 8, 2019; East Rutherford, NJ, USA; New York Jets wide receiver Robby Anderson (11) celebrates his touchdown catch against the Miami Dolphins with wide receiver Jamison Crowder (82) during the second quarter at MetLife Stadium. Mandatory Credit: Brad Penner-USA TODAY Sports
3. WR ROBBY ANDERSON
Another receiving weapon, Anderson has done his best work down the field for the Jets, where he has the 15th-best grade in the NFL on 20-plus yard throws since 2016 and ranks 11th in deep receiving yards (1,311). Anderson has been part of one of the worst groups of playmakers in the league during that time, making his value even more intriguing for a team that has better complementary pieces.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

4. NICKELL ROBEY-COLEMAN
Robey-Coleman has earned 74.0-plus PFF coverage grades in each of the past three seasons. He's offered high-floor production in the slot and should be valued highly by teams in need of an upgrade at the slot cornerback position.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

5. WR BRESHAD PERRIMAN
On his third NFL team already, Breshad Perriman resurrected his career in Tampa Bay this season, particularly with his play down the stretch. A big-bodied receiver with elite speed, Perriman stepped up when the Bucs had an injury crisis at wide receiver and made a lot of big plays for quarterback Jameis Winston. Drops were the curse of his play in Baltimore, but he dropped just one pass in 65 targets for the Bucs, and Jameis Winston had a passer rating of 94.7 when throwing his way. Far from a sure-fire success going forward, Perriman did at least show teams that his first-round talent still exists.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.


Jan 19, 2020; Kansas City, Missouri, USA; Tennessee Titans cornerback Logan Ryan (26) runs onto the field before the AFC Championship Game against the Kansas City Chiefs at Arrowhead Stadium. Mandatory Credit: Denny Medley-USA TODAY Sports
6. CB LOGAN RYAN
Ryan has had a solid career, and he hits free agency once again after three years in Tennessee. He’s a slot corner who has graded between 62.0 and 76.2 in coverage in all but one year of his seven-year career, and that level of consistency makes him an intriguing candidate for teams looking for help in the slot. Ryan has generally been an excellent tackler, though 20 of his 49 career misses came in 2019.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

7. DI MIKE DANIELS
Mike Daniels isn't particularly hitting free agency at the best time, given how the past couple of seasons have gone for him, but he isn’t far removed from being one of the most disruptive interior linemen in the entire NFL. Daniels now has to sell teams on looking past his recent injury history, a downtick in form and the fact that he is now the wrong side of 30. However, he can still generate pressure and play with excellent leverage against both run and pass — and he shouldn’t break the bank anymore.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

8. PRINCE AMUKAMARA
Amukamara earned PFF coverage grades above 70.0 in each of the past three seasons, including a career-high 77.1 PFF coverage grade in 2018. In Chicago this past season, he allowed 36 receptions from 58 targets for 515 yards and two touchdowns en route to a 70.5 PFF coverage grade. He allowed more than 50 yards in coverage in five of the 15 games he played at least 20 defensive snaps in. He also logged just four passes defensed and zero interceptions in 2019. He’s recorded just three interceptions and 16 passes defensed in the last three years.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.



© Eric Hartline-USA TODAY Sports

9. LT JASON PETERS
Somehow Jason Peters is still plying his trade at an extremely high level despite approaching 38 years of age. That age obviously makes Peters a short-term option for prospective teams, and Peters also comes with a significant injury history and the prospect that he might not last 16 games in any given season. But he is still an impressive figure when he is on the field, and he ended the 2019 season with an overall PFF grade of 82.8 after allowing 25 total pressures on the season. Peters won’t be receiving many multi-year offers, but he could provide a very useful short-term fix for a team struggling to find answers on the offensive line.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

10. EDGE EVERSON GRIFFEN
Griffen earned the two highest single-season PFF pass-rushing grades of his career in 2017 and 2019. This past season, he earned a 76.6 PFF pass-rushing grade and recorded a career-high 70 total pressures across 596 pass-rushing snaps. The 32-year-old veteran still has enough in the tank to offer value off the edge in the NFL.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

11. TE DELANIE WALKER
Walker has played only 232 snaps over the last two years, but he finished with a PFF grade of at least 74.0 in every season from 2014 to 2017. Walker has always been a solid run blocker, but he became one of the league's best receiving weapons at tight end in recent years. He's worth a look to see if he can re-capture a year or two of his prime.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

12. DI SHELBY HARRIS
A player who has consistently graded well since he came into the league, the only question teams will be asking about Shelby Harris is how good can he be and how big a role can he assume for a new team? Harris earned a PFF grade of 90.8 back in 2018, but he played just 391 snaps that year, and when the Broncos scaled up his workload as a reward, his play trailed off to an overall grade of just 76.8. Harris may ultimately be an elite-level role player or an average player with a bigger role for a new defense, but either way, he represents a valuable addition to some teams and likely won’t cost a fortune.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

13. QB JOE FLACCO
As the number of teams in need of a starting quarterback dwindles, Joe Flacco joins Andy Dalton, Cam Newton and Jameis Winston in the pool of available options with extensive starting experience following his release from the Denver Broncos. Flacco's career revival in Denver didn't quite go as planned, starting the first eight weeks before suffering a neck injury that sidelined him for the rest of the season. In recent years, he has seen a sharp divide in his play from a clean pocket vs. under pressure, posting an 87.4 clean-pocket passing grade since 2017 compared to a grade of just 33.2 when under pressure. If he were to get back to full health, Flacco could serve as an above-average backup or a competent starter behind a good offensive line, but teams can't expect much more than that at this point in his career.

14. EDGE CAMERON WAKE
Wake’s PFF pass-rushing grade has dropped in each of the past five seasons, falling from 93.3 in 2015 down to 77.8 in 2019. The 38-year-old veteran still brings high-floor pass-rush production to the table, but his days as an elite pass-rusher in the NFL may be behind him.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

15. S DAMARIOUS RANDALL
A player who has bounced around different positions since being drafted in the first round, Damarious Randall is now searching for his third team and a situation that can truly work for him. The Packers initially drafted him as a cornerback, and he struggled in that regard before ending up in Cleveland where he was the deep safety in a Gregg Williams' system before seeing a more well-rounded role in 2019 (202 snaps box safety, 88 slot cornerback, 407 free safety). Randall is definitely a better safety than he was a corner and seems best suited to that single-high role in a Cover-1/Cover-3 system.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

16. S VONN BELL
Throughout his four-year career, Von Bell has shown to be a great box safety against the run as well as when he’s tasked with blitzing. His coverage performance though? No bueno. He’s been exposed when playing free safety, producing the lowest coverage grade at that alignment and allowing the most explosive plays while making very few plays on the ball. Over the past four seasons, Bell has allowed a 108.5 passer rating in coverage and 10 touchdowns with just one interception. The most valuable aspect of a safety is their coverage ability, and Bell hasn’t been able to show he can do that at a high level. Not to mention, he’s performed poorly outside the box. Whichever team signs him will likely limit his role to strictly the box, and box safeties generally aren’t the most valuable.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

17. DI NDAMUKONG SUH
Ndamukong Suh's single season with the Buccaneers didn’t quite go as planned. He finished the year at a career-low 60.3 pass-rush grade and his lowest overall grade since 2012. That said, we mustn’t forget that Suh was one of the most dominant interior defensive linemen in the NFL from 2012 to 2018. He was the third-most valuable player at his position in that stretch and was a strong as both a run-defender and pass-rusher. Suh is 33 years old but worth signing for a season to see if you can resurrect his dominant play.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

18. CB RONALD DARBY
After being an average to slightly above average cornerback in his first four seasons, Darby’s play took a nosedive in 2019. He gave up six touchdowns on his 62 targets and allowed over two yards per coverage snap, ranking dead last. Of 119 qualifying cornerbacks in 2019, Darby ranked 118th in coverage grade at 41.0. He's also had to miss a significant amount of time due to injuries in each of the last three seasons — teams will likely want to stay away from Darby. He’s projected to get about $6.5 million on a one-year deal and might be worth taking a flier on considering he produced an above-average coverage grade in three of the four seasons prior to 2019 (two of which were among the top 25).

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

19. DI DAMON HARRISON
After earning 90.0-plus PFF run-defense grades in four consecutive seasons (2015-18), Harrison crashed back down to earth in 2019. The big man earned just a 63.2 overall grade and a 66.7 PFF run-defense grade with the Lions this past season. At just 31 years old, Harrison still can provide production that falls between his 2019 season and the high-end play he had in the four years prior.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.


Nov 25, 2018; Philadelphia, PA, USA; Philadelphia Eagles defensive tackle Timmy Jernigan (93) against the New York Giants at Lincoln Financial Field. Mandatory Credit: Eric Hartline-USA TODAY Sports
20. DI TIMMY JERNIGAN
The last two years for Jernigan have been hindered by injuries, limiting him to only 406 snaps, and he ended up posting his two lowest-graded seasons overall in his six-year NFL career. Prior to the injuries, Jernigan was becoming a strong run-defender by ranking 33rd and 17th in run-defense grade in 2016 and 2017. Jernigan has been a relatively average pass-rusher throughout his career — not good enough to take him out of that “risky” category given the injuries as of late.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

21. LB JOSH BYNES
He doesn’t bring any value as a blitzer, but Josh Bynes has proven to be a run-stuffer in his career. In all but one of his eight seasons, Bynes produced a run-defense grade above 70.0 and has produced run-defense grades above 79.9 in each of the last three years. Bynes was rather poor in coverage but has taken steps towards improvement late in his career. Over the last two seasons, he's had two of his highest coverage grades in his career — in 2019 he was the 12th best linebacker in coverage.

For projected contract, PFF grade and WAR, click here.

Well............so much for that. LOL

BPlus so far. Spend more for an "A" with a win-now mentality

Go Browns!

I have/had the same wish...but when evaluating the moves of the new FO, one cannot 'pin' Randall's leaving on the current FO.

That is why I stated "Not a loss"...meaning in the context of moves of the new FO.

It’s a surprise that Clowney is still on the market. I bet he ends up back in Seattle

No. I just think it is going to last long enough to make it unwise to hold large gatherings this fall.

No matter. I think so far we have done a pretty good job of filling needs. many worry about LB, and I do as well. There weren't all that many backers from which to choose.

LOL...........we got rid of three of them. At least two of them were signed by other teams for good money. Thus far, the FO has made a mess of that unit.

It's also done a poor job w/the FS position.

Good job on O w/Conklin, Hooper, and Keenum. Poor job in other areas. Balances out in my mind.

We're spending.

We probably need to release a couple players to free up more. What's Hubbard doing these days?

Randall will undoubtedly play well wherever he goes. I still think he's an addition by subtraction.

We are already better in a lot of areas. More to come, I'm sure. And still have the draft.

We are in win now mode.

Kirksey played a whopping 1.5 games last year. A. Taylor was the other non-starter in a two-LB set. He was non-existent. Neither King John not A Berry re-signed Sho. The LB unit was a mess all of last year...it's current status is nothing new...except Kirksey's albatross of a contract is gone.

FS is a mess? King John signed Randall and now the guy is a head-case. King John also did not re-sign Randall. Randall was benched last season for being a jerk...more than once. Like with the LB unit, the FS unit has been a mess for a long time...its current status is nothing new.

Given the facts and additional info shared there, the acquisitions far exceed the "losses"...as those losses were foregone conclusions...sunk costs in the business world.

B+ Still Need LT and Starting LB

Kirksey played 7 games in 2018 and 2 games last year. I liked him - but at this point claiming we are in a mess because he's not on the team is really stretching.

I'd much prefer to have Schobert on the team - I don't see a replacement in place that is as good as Schobert was. But we are early into off season in the grand scheme of things.

So Kirksey is a no-brainer to not be with the team. Schobert is the only other LB subtraction. So again a bit of a stretch to be critical.... if we don't get a bonafide replacement for Schobert - and if we don't get much improved play from Mack/Tacki or replacements and have those guys as depth - then I'd be very disappointed for sure.

It is funny that one point/post is as vague as one can be and the other, competing point/post is full of actual player names and analysis that could be debated...or just shoot out a rofl emoji when a comeback is impossible.

Typical.

If I had considered it worthy of debate I would have done so.

The truth does tend to gag certain folks' keyboard.