DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Its BQ Time ......

Post deleted by hooter

That's odd, you made the exact same post 20 minutes ago.

Them pork chops outta be burned by now.

didnt think it worked. oops.

You need a hug

BigWillieStyle is Joey Porter??

He can't even be a little creative when insulting people,, he has to rely on what a few other posters said about me,,,, Cracks me up Whoops,, sorry, I meant

Welcome back... Good solid post!

You and others have made good points, shared logical perspectives and opinions as to why BQ should be under center. Just as mnay other have shared equal reason as to why not...

The difference is that you don't change any QB when they are playing as DA is and has been. Stats are for losers and figures don't lie, but liars sure figure, but when you look at the offense overall, the 0-line coming together, improving, gaining more confidence and DA's play nearly matching that you don't try and fix it if it aint broke. PERIOD!!! You just don't make the change some of you are presenting. There is no reason too. There is no justification to pull DA... If there is, I haven seen it or heard it anywhere. Subjective conjecture and unjustified personal opinions and unfounded prognostications aren't reasons either...

I'm not a DA guy. Never have been. Still not sold. I need to see a longer period of productive, consistant play. If the time comes where DA is not leading the team as he has been, isn't getting the job done and doesn't have the entire organizations confidence, then it's time to make the change. Until then the Browns need to ride the wave... Go with the flow... Play the hot hand... Not many here thought the Browns would be 3-3 and had a real opportunity of being 4-2... The same can easliy be said about DA's performance thus far...

No one loses their job when they are performing at a very high level and are well respected, liked on and off the field.

I'm a big time BA guy... Have been for a long time... For obvious reasons... Look at ND this year... But now is not BQ time. The longer he can sit and learn the better the situation is for all

Take care, hang in and enjoy!.

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There is no reason too. There is no justification to pull DA...

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According to a few posters there are plenty of reasons,, such as:

Inconsistency: What they don't take into account is that for all intents and purposes,, DA is a rookie,, only having started 8 games in his NFL career.

And to counter that, the most common comment is that he's been in the league for 3 years, watching and learning!

While that's true, who's he been watching,, Did they forget that it's two different teams and 3 different OC's and 3 different systems.. I guess that only counts if it supports thier contention that he should be pulled... LOL

Then there is this one:

He's gawky and can't move in the pocket:

Ahh,, I seem to remember a scrambling TD in the last game.. And I also seem to remember a couple of QB's that were Scramblers not doing so well here.. (garcia and Frye) So I don't see this being a good reason.

Another reason is:

He throws behind his receivers..

Yup, he has done that and it sucks when he does.. Are they trying to say that BQ will never ever do that? Not sure!

Yet another reason is:

He stares down his intended receiver...

Again, yup, he's been guilty of that.. yet he still manages to get the ball out there to the right guy most of the time..

Oh, and lets not forget his decision making ability:

Again, I agree, it's an issue. one that just about every QB that has only 8 starts under his belt is gonna have. Is it that they expect BQ never to stare down a receiver?

Most everyone I think would agree that BQ is probably the future here.. I doubt many would dispute that.. In fact, I'm very very anxious to see him play..

But I'll bow to those who know way more than me or for that matter, any of us.. If that means I'll get called a person that blindly follows,,, so be it.

I'd much rather blindly follow those in the know, then some on here that don't know squat and have agendas....

I'm not sure why you keep implying people have said BQ won't make mistakes. I have said, numerous times, that he will. And, I would rather he make most of them THIS season than next. That's my reason for wanting him in now. Sure, it's fun to win, but I think we have the same chance to win with him as we do DA.

And, it's not about anyone knowing more than someone else. Both camps have their reasons for wanting one QB or the other. Doesn't make anyone right or wrong. It just is.

Also..if it is agreed that BQ is our "future" as you said, what exactly are we waiting on? That's the part that really doesn't make much sense at all. We have a line to protect him...they could at least let the kid play a few plays at the end of the games.

j/c

In as much as I wanted to see BQ start after this bye week...IMO it cannot be considered an option after the game that DA had against the Phins. It was a near flawless performance. The incumbant just cannot be removed at this point.

There are more games to play and if DA is not 'The Man' then it will show over time. If he keeps playing to a high level...well, that's what we want out of the position (or any position)...the next guy on the depth chart has to stay there and await his chance...no matter what round he was drafted in or how much money he's making.

I tend to agree with wanting to see BQ a bit this year. I'm just not sure when or how it will play out. I really think the front office is desperate for wins and will ride DA's coat tails for as long as we are in the games. If DA is playing even decent and the offense is not losing the games..I think DA plays it out this year. Still...how many starting QB's have finished the year here lately. Improved line or not, one hit and BQ could take over and not look back.

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I'm not sure why you keep implying people have said BQ won't make mistakes.

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No No Michelle, what I'm trying (unsuccessfully it would appear) is to convey the thinking that, "What is it, people think BQ won't make mistakes?" when they use inconsistency, or staring down receivers as reasons to bench DA..

It's not that I really believe that anyone actually is stupid enough to think that he won't make mistakes... not at all,,, Clearly, I'm not getting my point across very well.

My dismay towards those that want BQ starting is only directed to those think they know more than the coaching staff and the other professionals running the team.

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Also..if it is agreed that BQ is our "future" as you said, what exactly are we waiting on?

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If I ever gave you or anyone else the impression I know why the powers that be have not started BQ,, I'm sorry,, I don't know either.

Obviously it's one of three things as I see it.

1. DA is doing well and they don't want to upset the apple cart until they need to.

Or

2. They don't feel BQ is ready.

Or

3. A decision was made to sit him for the entire year and as long as DA is playing well, they have decided not to stray from that plan..

Which of those or any other reason it is is beyond my knowledge..

Keep in mind Michelle,, when I say stuff like this, in my heart, I wanna see BQ starting as soon as possible..

My reasons are perhaps somewhat different and off the beaten path, but they are, I think, Valid anyway.

My concern is two fold,, QB controversy... I don't want one.. and with DA being a RFA this off season, I wanna know if we can count on BQ next year.. the only way of knowing for sure is to put him out there..

But that's JMO,,,,, I really don't know squat either

According to the FO,CS and many others here who feel differently, , there are really very few reasons, if any to yank DA in favor of BQ at this point...

I clearly acknowledge/d that others feel differently. And they make some good viable points. Based upon their opinions, persceptions and prognostications.

There are very few reasons on the list that you presented here as an overview, that don't apply to all the top QB's in the NFL Not a single "reason" you listed precludes, P. Manning, Brady, Favre, Palmer, Romo, McNabb, Hasselbeck, Brees, E. Manning, Kitna from the same faults, drawbacks and or areas to improve on week in and week out... And all these QB's listed have many more games started than DA. DA has only been sacked about once per game... So his need to scramble has been minimized. DA has taken off and made postive plays with his feet instead of forcing a bad throw or throwing it away as well.

It's clearly not BQ time now... It's DA time now... We will all know when this changes... Thanks for the reply.

missed the thread...lol

already 8 pages I'll wait for Bring It On Part 2..

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There are very few reasons on the list that you presented here as an overview,

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Ahh Boise,,, those weren't my reasons,, those were reasons that have been expressed here on this very board in other threads by various posters... I just restated them for this thread..

Michelle if they threw you into YOUR job with only 6 to 10 weeks training and looked for every tiny little mistake while you worked, would you have handled it better then, or would you have handled it better if you got to watch somebody else doing your job for a year while everybody and his brother watched in slow motion and wanted to fire the person in front of you for every little mistake?

Well, if I was making the money BQ is making, I would sit on my ass for as long as they wanted me too.

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Well, if I was making the money BQ is making

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I know your kidding, but for the record, money shouldn't even enter into the equation.....

Ahh Daman... I know... Thats why I stated you presented them as an overview...

I read the board... I've been around here and the old/other board/s for 7000 posts or so...

Just not around here much the past year or more... Boards are different the past year or so... I don't enjoy them as much as the old boards... Not the same quality topics, threads or posters...

I agree with you Michelle, I VERY MUCH want to see BQ in the game.... But I can't see the FO or RAC making the change. DA is playing better every week and nobody can argue that. BQ is still unproven, although I don't care about this, a Coach that needs to establish himself SHOULD CARE. So my guess is that we will ride this season out with DA.

If DA continues to put up huge numbers the team will definately have a QB issue next offseason. Both will want to start, both may rather be traded then not start. The question is who will go? And if they BOTH stay we (The Fans) are the winners.

Personally I like the situation and I am beginning not to care about which QB starts. I simply like the winning. If we win it's all good. If we lose it's never good.

The one thing we know for sure is that there are at least a few teams in the NFL who wish they had this problem....

I have something else I would like to throw into this mix. I think I was watching 'Inside the NFL' the other night when the question come up that;

What if DA continues to improve and puts up Tom Brady like numbers this season? What if he earn a trip to the Probowl? What if he takes us to the playoffs or the Superbowl?

Could we justify losing him in FA?

What would we do with our QB of the future and a the first round pick we spent to get him? Could we bench a Probowler?

Could we keep BQ on the bench long term?

If we had to trade one of them which one would we trade?

If these questions are being asked by the football minds on 'Inside the NFL' maybe... just maybe... we should be thinking like this too. There could be something to this.

I know it's a long shot that DA does this, but every week he is putting up solid numbers. Every week he seems to be getting better. Some of the fans have jumped on the 'Start DA Indefinately' bandwagon. The FO and coaches will too, if he continues to perform at a high level.

So tell me how YOU would answer these quetions.

IT'S NOT VERY COMPLICATED.

51 points, then 41... and lots of big plays. DA has made boneheaded rookie-type mistakes, but is 3-2 as a starter and has a big time weapon - his arm.
I don't know if BQ would have the timing/chemistry like DA has right now with this offence.

Three weeks from now, if he leads us into Heinz Field and beats Pittsburgh... that would be huge.
So much is unknown right now.

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I'm not sure why you keep implying people have said BQ won't make mistakes. I have said, numerous times, that he will.

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This just in!! Every QB in the league makes mistakes.

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Ahh Daman... I know... Thats why I stated you presented them as an overview

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Whoops,, sorry, I missed that....

I know what you mean about the boards,,, This one is reasonable, can't stand the Browns Chat associated with the team site.. horrible. Seems as if there are a bunch of kids over there..Not that I mind kids,, but geez!

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What if DA continues to improve and puts up Tom Brady like numbers this season? What if he earn a trip to the Probowl? What if he takes us to the playoffs or the Superbowl?

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With DA being a RFA, wouldn't you think it was important to find out if BQ has what it takes? I do?

But to answer that question, If DA does all of that (I'll be a monkeys uncle) then we gotta keep him.. no way around it. As for BQ, he sits. I wouldn't think it's a good idea to bench a Pro Bowler in favor of a Rookie.

The thing is, BQ isn't a dummy. He's got to know that if DA does some or all of those things, he's gonna sit. He's gotta know it. Now, what HE may say at some point is that he wants to be traded to a place that will give him a shot. I couldn't blame him if he does.

But for now, realistically, all I want to know is, CAN BQ PLAY at this level.. Can't find out with him on the bench.

Diam...WTF R U??????????????

Hope you're feelin' better chief...That craps goin' round all over the Country and it HURTS...Get healthy...

Where we at with this thinking now???

We know what Anderson's capable of on his Good and Bad days...And there's ALWAYS a few bad decisions even on a good day for him...Lots of good QB's have that tho...

We know DA's young and inexperienced...We know he can make some boneheaded decisions of which even tho may not SOLELY contribute to a loss (Oak & NE) but they sure as hell CONTRIBUTE largely to those losses...

Big question here is what to do with Anderson KNOWING full well this is gonna be Quinn's team...We haven't seen all of Anderson yet for sure...NO WAY we pull him right now...

It's gonna be interesting the next 4 or 5 games...IF this kid improves we gotta seriously start considering giving him a multi-year contract to be our #2...He's growin' on me...And it ain't just because he played solid games against Miami's WEAK D and a Cincy team that HAS NO D...lol...

His completion percentage has a bit to do with the Vertical Offense Chud's got us in...He's goin' downfield quite a bit...He still throws way off receivers tho (Edwards on the 1st quarter slant with Miami)...

As a #2 QB this is what I WANT...

1) Can u run the offense? Yeah he can...

2) Can u manage the offense? Yeah he can

3) Can u produce in the 2 minute offense? Yeah he can

4) Can u complete better than 50%? Yeah he can

Why 50%???...Because when u go to most #2's around the league u end up with guys that CAN'T...It's a reason why they're #2's in the 1st place...One of u stat guys can go ahead and throw all the 2's completion percentages at me but MOST KNOW what I mean...

Getting rid of Frye and having Anderson play has IN MY MIND solidified alot...And it's GOOD for us...

Quinn is the #1
Anderson is the 2
Dorsey is the 3

AND THAT'S ALL GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!

I don't care about the stupid plays that contribute to losses from a #2 QB...They're 2's FOR A REASON...It's a rarity u find a 2 that can take a team for 10+ games and keep it above 500...Just don't happen frequently...

With an improved Defense in 08 and 09 Anderson CAN KEEP US ABOVE 500 if Quinn went down for an extended period...I'm growing ever more confident in that one...We need to sign this kid beyond just Tendering him next year as a RFA...

IT WOULD BE STUPID TO TRADE ANDERSON!!!

Teams NEED 2 decent QB's and WE HAVE EM'...

Where r your thoughts now???...I know we need to see more but where u leaning???...Anderson the 2 or get rid of em'???

Ya know DnD,

I have been a HUGE Quinn pimp and DO think that he is better than DA... However, I like 99.9% of everyone NOT named Diam think we need to keep Brady Warm on the sideline and let this thing play out... IF DA continues to impress, then that pumps up his value...

I would personally like to see us throw a 1st RD tag on him if he continues this level of play... Call me crazy if you want but Houston ponied that sort of jack up for Schaub and the rate DA is going, it is conceivable that we could get it... I honestly see Carolina being a candidate for DA not just because they are in need of a QB but because JD would know how to utilize him in his vertical offense...

Kitna had a HELL of a season and the Bengals still gave him the hook in favor of Carson the following year...

We can debate this subject to death and to be honest, we are in a cannot lose situation for one of the hardest positions to find on an NFL roster... I for one would like to see the RFA Tender put on him but if we chose to keep him as a solid #2, I am all about that as well...

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Where r your thoughts now???...I know we need to see more but where u leaning???...Anderson the 2 or get rid of em'???

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I know you're asking Diam but he ain't here and won't be back for a week, so I'll chirp in.

Tendering him may be the only way to keep him here and I'm not sure about the history of teams tendering a backup QB. ?

The thing is, although I believe Quinn will be the better QB, if DA keeps playing at this level he may see himself as a starter somewhere if not here. He may be very reluctant to accept a backup role on the team he started for and played well with.

Plus, as some have said, he will have created a demand for his services from other teams and that would play into his desire.

I'd like to keep him as the #2. But I'm not sure we hold all the cards. Putting up the kind of numbers he has so far and the fact that he'll be a FA gives DA a stacked hand in this poker game.

In other words, it may not be as simple as what the FO wants to do with him.

On the other hand, if DA does as DA is, he's likely to come back to earth which would dispell any notion of him being a consistant, quality, long-term starter for anyone. He just may regulate himself into the backup role. Honestly, that's what I expect from him.

I love that he's putting up points right now and feel good for both he and us as he does that. But I really believe that Quinn can do the same thing, after gettin some experience, and cut down on the number of bad throws and missed open receivers which would make our offense even more potent.

Even though I'd like to see him start soon, I don't mind if Quinn sits out the season. Regardless of all the arguements pro and con for him watching on the sidelines, I don't think that hurts any QB. How much it helps is debatable but I doubt very much it hurts.

With our schedule this season, I can't think of a better scenario for a young QB to learn, improve and succeed. That's one reason I'd like to see Quinn playing soon. Because next season the schedule is not nearly so "young QB friendly". If we wait until next season to give Brady his chance we just may take a step back as he learns.

In the end, what we are able to do with DA is going to be completely dependent upon who's got the best hand. If DA keeps improving and gets somewhat consistant, (and with the schedule he may), he'll have it.

If not, the FO will.

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I would personally like to see us throw a 1st RD tag on him if he continues this level of play... Call me crazy if you want but Houston ponied that sort of jack up for Schaub and the rate DA is going, it is conceivable that we could get it..

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Man I hate it when we agree,,, nothing to argue about

You see Carolina being a team that would like DA,,, and I agree, but I think you gotta throw Miami in the mix as well..

With Trent Green done for the year and him being 37 years old, and given the nature of concussions, I'd say there is a better than an even chance he never returns to the game..(side note, it's too bad about Green, it's one of the good guys in the NFL)

Given that DA is running a version of the same Offense that Miami is running (I think anyway) There might be a built in match.

Miami screwed up last season by not taking Quinn in the first round.. (I love Ginn, but to pass on Brady Quinn for him when you don't have a QB,,, wow)

They may want Brady Quinn for the first and something else,,, but I think that's a no go! But DA for a first and maybe some late round pick...WHY NOT!

Only problem is this, Miami is on pace to get the first pick in the draft..... I don't see anyone on the planet giving up a the first overall for DA or Quinn for that matter. Anyway, there has got to be some QB out there worth the #1 overall pick next year,,,,,,RIGHT

Good post but remember this about Miami... They Spent a 2nd Rder on QB this year... Lemon looked pretty decent against us but then again, we have the 32nd ranked defense in the league... Hell, I could look good against our defense as bad as we are... With that said, he will gain enough experience in this offense this season and will most likely be thrown into the mix for the starting gig in 2008..

I am just arm chair QB'ing here but IF they do end up with the 1st pick in the draft, I see them honestly looking at unassing it to get some O-line help...

Franchise QB- They spent this years 2nd on what they think is one.

Franchise RB- Ronnie Brown fits that bill.

LT- um.... er... Vernon Carey anyone??

I see them trying to move down to #3-5 and grabbing LT Jake Long from scUM... WAY too early to talk draft but I was attempting to lay out why I think Miami wouldn't be one of the teams that will be in pursuit of DA...

I ruled out Atlanta as I can see Petrino making a HUGE push for his boy Brohm from louisville...

Still alot of ball left to play before all is said and done... I just hope that DA continues to over achieve as that would be in the best intrest for the team... Playoffs? Maybe a dream but not quite the pipe dream most of us thought it would be before the season started...

He takes us to the playoffs, jacks up his value?? I see NO downside here whatsoever if things do end up playing out like that...

Yup,,, I forgot about the guy the got last year,,, that makes a difference,,,

I know it goes against the common thinking including mine, but DA could end up better than BQ.

He is starting to make strides that don't look too bad at this point and BQ has yet to play a NFL down.

I would get DA signed and let the chips fall where they may.

I myself don't care who ends up the starter here as long as it is the better of the two.

I can agree with you completely on this Peen.. But to be sure, wouldn't BQ have to get in a few games to compare..

Pretty much, that's my only reason for wanting BQ to get a shot.. like you, the name on the back of the jersey don't mean anything... Just the best guy!

Owners hate to pay the big $ to a backup... A backup that we gave up our 1st Rder in 2008 for I might add... Look for a push to get brady some PT in one of the following scenerios...

a. We are out of the playoff picture...

b. We are blowing out a team and we let Brady go in for Garbage time...

One of those two things don't happen, I am fully expecting to see us use the rights to DA as leverage... I can see us getting a mid-first for him if he continues on this path... Where will the Panthers likely finish this year?? Top 20??

Phil knows we need defensive help BAD and the only way to shorten up the void in acquiring talent other than FA is through the Draft and without a 1st Rder this year, he will need to hit some home runs... Lucky for us, this is a DEEP draft and we should see some potential starters staring at us in the 2nd...

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We no longer know "full well" that it's Quinn's team.

Ask Edwards and Winslow what they think over a beer. We may not like their answer.

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Toad, I'm guessing that the powers within the organization are thinking it's still gonna be Quinns team..

But as far as what Edwards or Winslow say,, hey, if they are happy,,then I'm happy... so yeah, you can bet I'd like thier answer...

You wanna know why I'll be happy,,, well, I'll tell you,,, I don't have an agenda,, I just want the best QB on the roster out there playing each week....

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They pinned their future on their 2ND ROUND PICK, John Beck, QB. They aren't interested in trading picks for another QB.

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LOL,, so I've been told,,, Try and keep up there Toad (that was chop busting bud)