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Report: Eagles hire John Dorsey as front office consultant, might promote him to full-time role



The Philadelphia Eagles have hired former Kansas City Chiefs and Cleveland Browns general manager John Dorsey as a consultant, according to a report from NFL insider Mike Garafolo. It also sounds like the Eagles might promote Dorsey to a more permanent role after the 2020 NFL season. Garafolo had the following to say on NFL Network:

“John Dorsey, who’s been a general manager twice, his name is kinda sorta being kicked around again, possibly a third stint. Now, I would say that maybe the odds are a little bit stacked against him. But the fact of the matter is, he left the Chiefs and Browns in much better shape after he left the GM role. His ability to spot talent has been impeccable. And that’s why — quietly — the Eagles have brought Dorsey aboard as a consultant this year. They’ve lost a couple of guys in Joe Douglas and Andrew Berry that went and became general managers. So, Howie Roseman and the Eagles looking to strengthen their talent evaluation in the front office, brought Dorsey aboard. Now, we’ll see what happens with Dorsey in 2021. If he doesn’t get a GM job, perhaps he sticks with the Eagles in a full-time role. I know he is thought of extremely highly inside that building. So perhaps the Eagles will bring him aboard in a full-time role next year to help strengthen their talent on their roster.”

Some thoughts on this news:

Probably no coincidence that this news emerged shortly after the Inquirer’s report about how Jeffrey Lurie hasn’t even considered firing Roseman. Seems like an attempt to placate fans.
This isn’t the first time we’ve heard of the Eagles hiring a former NFL general manager as a consultant. You may have missed that the Eagles have previously worked with Scot McCloughan’s scouting service.
There’s a surface-level appeal to Dorsey that will have some fans thinking this development is great news. I’m not so sure. I don’t know what impact he can truly have as a consultant when Roseman still has final say. I also think there should be concern about the team hiring Dorsey in a full-time capacity. He’s made some good draft picks in the past, sure. But there are serious red flags that stand out when looking at his track record. Pete Smith did a nice job of highlighting such issues at length in a recent article titled: “Don’t Hire John Dorsey As Your Team’s General Manager”:

The problem is that the bad outweighed the good by a significant margin. Dorsey has not evolved or adjusted as the game has changed over the past quarter century. He hasn’t incorporated improvements in the scouting process, simply relying on how he learned it dating back to his days with the Green Bay Packers, bristling at different approaches to scouting and roster building, which resulted in Andrew Berry leaving for the Eagles before coming back to take over the GM job.

It’s why he will take huge risks on players with extremely troubling character concerns and will scoop up former 5-star high school prospects that never panned out in college under the misguided notion that somehow he can unearth the greatness within.

Dorsey’s track record has been consistent since he first took over the Chiefs. He will draft a few outstanding players, waste an incredible amount of draft assets selecting picks on gut instinct over evidence, mortgaging future drafts in the process all while signing players to bad contracts that the next general manager will have to clean up.

Dorsey will tell fans and media that it’s all in the pursuit of wins and championships, but it doesn’t take long to realize it’s all for his own glorification. He wants to win, so long as he’s the one in control. A man who was arrogant enough to believe future Hall of Fame head coach Andy Reid needed to yield control to him will always get in his own way and the team will be the one that pays the price.

Both the Chiefs and the Browns are in far better places post Dorsey than they ever were with him. If a team is misguided enough to hire Dorsey for a third term as general manager, they can eagerly anticipate the moment the team improves because he’s no longer a part of it.

Some more Dorsey condemnation worth considering:

The Eagles potentially hiring Dorsey to be their next version of Joe Douglas shouldn’t be viewed a real solution to the team’s front office issues. It would just be another lame half-measure by this organization. Fans shouldn’t stand for the Eagles applying this year’s ‘Don’t hire a real offensive coordinator, just bring in a bunch of different assistants!’ approach to the front office. ‘Don’t fire Roseman, just surround him with highly thought of executives!’ The reality is it doesn’t really matter who the Eagles bring in to help with personnel since Roseman will still have final say.

People really have to stop with this idea that the Eagles just need to find someone who can run the draft while Roseman is left to handle the cap. The Eagles aren’t in good financial shape! Roseman has handed out some of the very worst contracts in the NFL!

The Eagles promoting Dorsey to a bigger role would very much be in line with this organization’s “no new ideas” ethos. How about maybe hire an up-and-comer instead of a failed retread who’s obviously been quick to wear out his welcome elsewhere?
I wonder how the Eagles potentially promoting Dorsey would impact Doug Pederson’s standing. Doug and Dorsey overlapped in Kansas City. But there’s been talk that Dorsey and current Chiefs offensive coordinator Eric Bienemy could be a package deal.

It’ll be interesting to see what happens with Dorsey and the Eagles moving forward. Maybe he gets a real general manager job elsewhere and this concern is all for naught. Or maybe he just stays on in a mere consultant role. But it sounds like there’s at least the possibility he could ascend in the Eagles’ organization ... and that might be troubling.

More at link


https://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2020...draft-record-gm

As a pure talent evaluator I’d like him on my staff as well ... in terms of character or people skills, I would shy away obviously

Well, that's interesting. We basically just did a FO Swap with Philly.

We got Berry back from them and Dorsey went there.

Best of luck to him and Philly, except when they play us.

my thoughts too... guy did a pretty good job adding to the roster... just don't let him pick a HC...

I think he'd do very well in a consultant role and I'd have him heavily involved with the draft...

I wish John D. luck. He's the guy that started the turn around here no matter what anyone says. Plus, we don't have to worry about playing the Eagles for another 4 years!!

I’m sure Dorsey and Howie Roseman will get along great. . .

This was my first thought.

It sounds like the Eagles may be trying to overhaul everything ... Pederson might be out

Everybody needs a franchise QB. You'll never get far for long without one.

I wonder if Freddie Kitchens gives a 'Whoopty-Hell'. ?

Dorsey's draft grades from the link:

not much context around this. his picks are wayyy better than how this looks

Chubb Baker and Ward alone make him a good pick
(Greedy will be a good pick)

throw in Landry and OBJ, and Vernon...


Plus, all of his FA acquisitions... made us who we are

he is a really good GM that gave us a foundation to build on.

his trades were also really good

Seemed to be on this board there are splits regarding his effectiveness for the Browns franchise. Those who thought he was an extremely great talent evaluator, and others who thought he made poor admin decisions.

I an certainly not an expert and obviously am not inside the organization as none of us are so I have no idea but whoever we hire I just want to win.

When we hired Dorsey I believe it was after Kansas City had fired him. I always wondered why KC would fire a guy whose ability was so respected but I figured it was our gain.

This past season I was curious and looked up articles from KC print media from when he was hired. I only read two articles but both writers indicated that JD loved causing friction among FO, coaches & players. One of the articles indicated that he felt a person performed better when "agitated" (my word not his because I can't think of another right now). They praised some of his acquisitions but spoke very negatively about his handling of people and situations.

I am only repeating what I read but if true I have always hated guys in organizations that I worked that fed off turmoil. Now I realize these writers could have been upset with Dorsey for other things or gotten bad info from players who had it out for him. But that would explain how two organizations who seemed to get decent results from one portion of his position would choose let him go.

Who would write such things.
It's not worth reading.

John Dorsey draft picks (with KC and Cleveland)
Travis Kelce
Patrick Mahomes
Tyreek Hill
Chris Jones
Marcus Peters
Eric Fisher
Kareem Hunt
Nick Chubb
Dee Ford
DeMarcus Robinson
Baker Mayfield
Denzel Ward

Traded for:
Alex Smith
Odell Beckham

Signed
Jarvis Landry

https://twitter.com/JasonCole62/status/1348471041019011073

Yes, he is a very good talent evaluator, no one is saying that. He is respected leaguewide for that ability. Your did forgot a few names there that were less than stellar, at least from the Browns perspective. I did not bother to look up KCs draft so don't know about that.

Plus if you acquire talent and foster a lousy work environment does that diminish the talent?

He would be the last person I would expect the Eagles to hire.

What do you expect? We still have people sticking up for that basketball guy.

Of course they're going to attack the guy who brought in most of the talent that just won us our first playoff victory since 1995. What, you think they're bright?

Great post in the game day thread, pit.
Sincerely. I was gonna PM you about it.

But you should probably lose that sig. get over Sashi, type of thing.

Can I scream author bias and dated material. It does not matter if a draft pick is from Sashi or your own. There is a lot of movement and trades on draft day as well. Last I checked Corbett was starting for the Rams.

For me, it wasn't his evaluations on players. He was a top 3rd of the league type guy. Very solid.

His problem was team building, and building a team is more than just throwing a bunch of talented players in the pot. By all accounts he had poor relationships with the coaches he worked with and the people in the front office.

If he had went with KS instead of Freddie, he would still be here. I think Berry has done a good job of bringing in players. I also had no problem with Dorsey's player evaluation.

If the material were only dated, that would be one thing. Says Greedy was outperformed, but only has his rookie season to compare (CBs have a learning curve). Knocks Ward's performance, and not his injuries. Has a ? on Baker citing his 2019 performance (no mention of his rookie season). Knocks Takitaki because he doesn't have enough snaps. Calls Avery a bust. Mack, while not good, was a 5th round pick. How do you call a 5th-rounder a miss when he's out there playing? Says the Forbes pick (a 6th rounder) was a miss because he's not playing ("our 6th rounder hasn't taken Bitonio's, Tretter's, or Zeitler/Teller's job yet? What a loser!).

I agree, up to a point. We would still have the issue of Dorsey having a history of being a 'me first" type of manager.

However, winning has a way of hiding things...at least for a while.

I should probably eat healthier too, but.....

Heck, a shave and haircut wouldn't hurt anything now that you mention it.

How to wrap our minds around John Dorsey’s impact on the Browns and Chiefs – Terry Pluto


CLEVELAND, Ohio – In back-to-back years, this man drafted Patrick Mahomes and Baker Mayfield.

That alone would say a lot about John Dorsey. He has that distinction of selecting the two QBs who will face off in Sunday’s playoff game between the Kansas City Chiefs and the Cleveland Browns.

And Dorsey will probably be watching from his home, as he has been fired by both teams.

Dorsey was the general manager of the Kansas City Chiefs in 2017 when they traded up to take Mahomes with the No. 10 pick. Some in Kansas City will say the choice was driven by assistant GM Brett Veach, the man who now has Dorsey’s old job with the Chiefs.

Head coach Andy Reid also pushed hard for Mahomes.

Nonetheless, Dorsey was the GM. He did engineer the trade. And he also was wise enough to take the opinions of others into consideration.

Dorsey once told me how he became enamored with Mahomes. The Texas Tech QB looked intriguing on video because of his strong arm and remarkable athleticism.

But Dorsey was sold when he watched Mahomes on the white board with Reid and other KC coaches. They kept throwing plays and questions at Mahomes, who quickly digested the material and could explain the X’s and O’s. Quarterbacks have to be smart and able to digest information fast.

That also was something that appealed to Dorsey about Mayfield.

MAKING BIG MOVES

The following year, Mayfield was the surprise No. 1 pick in the draft by the Browns. Dorsey fell in football love with Mayfield before being hired to run the Browns.

While many thought the Browns would pick Sam Darnold or Josh Allen, Dorsey called the name of Mayfield.

He also surprised draft experts with the selection of Denzel Ward with the No. 4 overall pick in 2018. Ward has been a Pro Bowl cornerback while Mayfield has led the Browns to their first playoff appearance since the end of the 2002 season.

Dorsey declined to talk for this story. He is now a consultant with the Philadelphia Eagles.

Here are a few facts, some of which I received from an NFL source:

1. In the last 10 years, 11 of 54 draft picks by Dorsey have become Pro Bowlers. That’s 20%.

2. Next is Dallas (16%). The NFL average is 10% of draft picks making a Pro Bowl since 2010.

3. With the Browns, Dorsey had 16 picks in 2018-19. Nick Chubb and Ward have been Pro Bowlers. Mayfield, Mack Wilson and Austin Corbett (with the Rams) have developed into starters.

4. In his five drafts with Kansas City (2013-17), nine players have gone to the Pro Bowl.

5. When with Kansas City, he took Kareem Hunt in the third round. After Hunt was released by the Chiefs following off-field problems, Dorsey signed the running back to a contract with the Browns in 2019.

HERE COMES DORSEY

Despite having a 43-21 record in his four full seasons with the Chiefs, Dorsey was fired not long after picking Mahomes in the 2017 draft.

In fact, the announcement came soon after Reid received a contract extension. One reason for the dismissal was some salary cap issues in Kansas City. Other whispers were Reid and Dorsey were having some disagreements.

Veach was promoted to take Dorsey’s place.

Dorsey was hired by the Browns on December 7, 2017, to replace Sashi Brown. Thanks to Brown, he inherited a treasure chest of draft picks and salary cap room. I wrote about Brown’s influence last week.

The media and many fans tend to dwell on Dorsey’s big deal with the Giants for Odell Beckham Jr. and Olivier Vernon. But his best trade was adding Pro Bowl receiver Jarvis Landry from Miami for fourth- and seventh-round picks in 2018.

Dorsey had some hits and misses.

The 2019 draft has not yielded much. Top pick Greedy Williams has played 12 only games – none this season – because of a nerve injury to his shoulder. Other picks still with the team are Sione Takitaki, Sheldrick Redwine and Mack Wilson.

THE KEY IS THE COACH

One of the knocks on Dorsey was his willingness to take chances on players with character issues. In Kansas City, he had a strong coach in Reid to help sort out the players and keep order.

Several factors led to Dorsey being dismissed by the Browns after the 2019 season. He was not a fan of the analytics department headed by Browns Chief Strategy Officer Paul DePodesta, So there was an internal split.

But the biggest mistake was hiring Freddie Kitchens as head coach over Kevin Stefanski, who was favored by DePodesta. Kitchens was overwhelmed by the job as the Browns finished 6-10 last season.

Browns owners Dee and Jimmy Haslam became discouraged by the conflicts within the front office. They fired Dorsey and Kitchens, allowing DePodesta to head the search for a new GM and coach.

That led to Andrew Berry (who’d worked under Sashi Brown and a year under Dorsey) to return as GM in 2020. And this time, the Browns did hire Stefanski.

Would the pairing of Dorsey and Stefanski have worked? We’ll never know. But the Kitchens disaster finished Dorsey with the Browns.

AN EYE FOR TALENT

Dorsey needs someone over him to say, “We are not drafting Antonio Callaway after he was suspended and missed all of his final season at Florida.”

Greg Robinson was another troubled soul who was signed by Dorsey and flamed out.

I still think the Beckham trade was an over-reach. Dorsey loves to collect talent and let the coach sort it out, sometimes that is a challenge.

But the rosters of the Browns and Chiefs have both been enhanced by the Dorsey touch.

A small move was trading for Buffalo’s Wyatt Teller for a fifth- and a sixth-round pick in 2020. It was a steal, Teller emerging as an exceptional guard.

Along with Mahomes, the Chiefs have key players such as Travis Kelce, Dee Ford, Tyreek Hill and Mitchell Schwartz who were acquired by Dorsey.

At the age of 60, it’s possible Dorsey is not about to get a third shot at being a GM. But at the very least, Dorsey should be a key member of the player personnel department of a team.

https://www.cleveland.com/browns/2021/01...erry-pluto.html

Jealousy will get you nowhere.

j/c:

The perfect role for Dorsey. No real authority but he can chime in when he needs to.

Looks like exactly the role he’d excel in

If Dorsey can be a part of a turnaround in the Motor City that would be an epic addition to his resume. Since Detroit has agreed to trade Stafford that might be a start to build the program up.

He’ll get along with kneecap dude for sure.

Wonder if there’s room in the D for Hue and Sashi?

Haha good point

Biting knee caps and flexing muscles, bruh!

John should do well in that role.

Just because the guy has poor people skills in a management function, and is hard to march out as the face of your front office doesn't mean the guy isn't excellent at other things.

Draft picks don't mean a thing if you keep drafting crappy players.

If you love Baker, thank John Dorsey. You love Chubb? Thank John Dorsey.

Or maybe you favorite guy.

He certainly drafted my favorite current players on the Browns. How about you?