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If The Browns trade up for a cornerback and get him. They still won't be able to stop opponents passing attacks in 2021, or 2022. Cornerback is a dead position.
Berry need look no farther than the Dallas Cowboys abysmal Defensive ends and edge rushers to realize how the Dallas woes in the secondary are effected by their lines inability to hold the edge, pressure the quarterback or even stop the run to force the pass. Db's can't cover forever after the snap and shouldn't be asked to. Cornerbacks don't win you football games at the expense of offense, also, Browns cornerbacks rarely score touchdowns, it is a touchdown driven league.
If it's not pass rusher, the Browns should not be drafting it on defense, in the first 3 rounds, in 2021.
In the course of a long time the Cleveland Browns defense will project to see the First Appearance
First appearance of Delpit First appearance of Greedy, in a long while. First appearance of Clowney First appearance of Walker Lb. First appearance of John Johnson to replace T. Mitchell First appearance of Cb Troy First appearance of Takk McKinley First appearance of Malick Jackson the Big NT
So in theory the Browns should be wise and drafting Offense in a Touchdown driven league. Unless it's for pass Rushers.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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This is an opinion Board.
Everyone gets to put their opinion out there.
So, here is mine.
I disagree with most everything you wrote.
Small schools can produce great talent. It is about the talent of the player not what school he plays for. Kent State is hardly a football powerhouse. Check and see how many NFL players went to Kent. Start with Josh Cribbs and Julian Edleman.
Cornerback is one of the premium positions in football. If a team can not cover receivers they will lose games.
Theory? Your theory not the theory of the NFL.
The Browns will not draft an offensive player in the first round this year.
The Browns will probably be below 500 because they will do the opposite of your opinion.
I don't think so.
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j/c
I've not taken the time to know prospects. My approach to this draft has been to wait and see what the Browns do, and learn about who we drafted.
Trading up seems more likely in the 2-4 rounds than the 1st. Might trade up in the 1st but our draft capital isn't enough to move far. More options in mid-rounds. I'm happy to see future picks. Trading down in the 1st seems unlikely but possible.
The FO has filled the holes on D. They don't NEED to draft for any position. BPA becomes a viable choice (as opposed to other drafts.)
We are approaching a point where keeping all our good players isn't financially possible. Drafting future starters to replace departing ones is smart.
1. #GMstrong 2. "I'm just trying to be the best Nick I can be." ~ Nick Chubb 3. Forgive me Elf, I didn’t have faith. ~ Tulsa 4. ClemenZa #1
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First appearance of John Johnson to replace T. Mitchell First appearance of Cb Troy
I see your point, but I think JJ3 replaces Sendejo, and Troy replaces Mitchell
1. #GMstrong 2. "I'm just trying to be the best Nick I can be." ~ Nick Chubb 3. Forgive me Elf, I didn’t have faith. ~ Tulsa 4. ClemenZa #1
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Randomly look back on the time the Browns' Were making picks while JJ Watts younger sibling was up for selection and passed on him, and he ended up on the Steelers.  Blind much!
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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You know my love will Not Fade Away.........
#gmSTRONG
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NFL Draft, search results. story.. Lions looking to trade back from #7. later found, Rams "very open" to trading back from #8. Now, Answer this question in less than 0.5 seconds, instant first reaction. My answer was, ? If the Browns traded up to #7 overall who would it be for??? Jaylen Waddle, ( my answer in less than 1/2 second) Why Waddle TL? 1. I never thought he'd be there, I never thought the Browns would have a chance so up until now, it wasn't even on any radar, But! 4 quarterbacks, TE Pitts, Penei Sewell, Jamarr Chase a big WR, Devonta Williams? the other Alabama WR, all are very well players in their own right that could get drafted ahead of Waddle and none of which would be as Game changing for the Browns offense, in this point. What was said about Waddle I hear two days ago, comment, (about a third of all his TD's were 50 yards or more,) may have been 1/2 it was a lot. Lions want depth, on both sides of the ball to trade down. (Now this is hypothetical, this is "so you're saying there's a chance, but ... never say never. " What would Al Davis do if you gave him the Browns roster and team today? " Go get speed baby! Hypothetical, Browns trade, Sheldon Richardson, Terrance Mitchell, ( I know, but just pretend), and the 31, 59, 98, and 99ish picks this year, for pick #7 overall and Take Jaylon Waddle Wr Alabama. Now, just imagine, For 3 minutes of your life just imagine the Current Browns roster, Plus Wr Jaylen Waddle, Alabama, stretch the field, 50 yard touchdown threat, On a rookie contract, for one year, OBJ comes back and You have an offense that can do anything, a defense that can do anything. and you keep all of your 2022 picks. I think the addition of Waddle, would be like an addition of Another player along the lines of Kareem Hunt, another player on the level of OBJ. You have your yound exciting Quarterback, What did you put around him. They Sort of have the OL figured out, they have 3+ Tight ends, maybe coming back, Jaylon Waddle? What would a Jaylon Waddle do to the dynamics of this Browns offense. You wanted that, Fastest in the world, 50 yard pass, field stretcher? There he is, trading up at #7 overall, Snachted out of the Jaws of whatever, set up for greatness. The Cleveland Browns, team of destiny! What's the worst that could happen, They've been on the brink, suffered through 2018, 2017, So What if they give up 4 picks, and 2 players for a Jaylon Waddle? Who are they missing out on? Another Howard Wilson? Another Chad Thomas DE? 
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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I don't know how this happened but at 3 years old I used to draft matchbox cars, (hot wheels) one of them.
day after day, whenever they would get out the cars we'd get in a fight over the cars and somehow it just got settled it started to be day after day.
Dump all the cars into a pile, stare at them and alternate picking one car, sometimes we'd get new matchbox cars, but once you chose yours, that's all you got to play with, for the hour. An hour is a long time when you are 3 years old.
And you'd have different kinds of love for different kinds of hot wheels cars, and every one that got away, you'd think how to get it in your pile next time,
and there'd be cars that you liked but they didn't like but you couldn't pick it first every time because once they found out they'd take it just to keep you from having it, and you'd figure whether you could count on one being there next time around, and you'd learn a big lesson about value, and if you see it get it, and don't rely all on one.
So it just ended up, we'd draft matchbox cars, hot wheels cars, (boats trucks, race cars different kinds,) maybe up to 3 times a week, I don't know, a ton of times. Learned a lot.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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If we somehow landed a WR like Waddle, it would be fantastic, BUT... the cost to trade up inside the Top 10 is more than prohibitive. I'd argue that there is not a single player worth doing that for. An Aaron Donald is the ONLY type of player I'd consider doing that for.
Waddle is great, or has the potential to be, but he'd totally be a luxury. We definitely need a speedster, or two, that can routinely challenge defenses deep in multiple ways, but we can get that outside the first round.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Warren Sharp was on the The Ringer NFL Show talking about mistakes teams make leading up to and during the draft: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4W7PWLHvgZSAp7wAIdnUsNHe's one of the smartest football minds available publicly (and also consults for teams). It's worth a listen.
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Random draft thought(s). and GC. 1. I'm so tired, it's annoying to hear that line, " outside of the first round". (been hearing for years)
Listen, a team is always in the first round! in a draft. When they're on the clock, it's the next guy who is going to add to their team, and that comes first.
You are either on the clock! Or your team is waiting for all the other picks until you are On the Clock again! In the Entire class Pool of remaining players eligible to draft!
Any player worth taking in round 4, is worth taking in round 1, or worth watching some other team take them and you having to find somebody else!
I came here to say, Is Nico Collins Wr. Mich. on the Browns radar. If the Browns wish for, If Nico Collins Wr, Mich. is worth the Browns taking at #26 overall. If! He ends up on the Ravens', (or any other team), and he was on Your Radar, (and they didn't jump above your very first pick in the draft), Then the Browns waited one round too long to get him! Didn't they!
I think Wr. about need to be separated into 2 classes, those Above 6' foot tall, and those Less than 5'11 and anyone 5'11-6'0, measure them again. (blocking ability)
If you See a Player you want, You've got to get him before somebody else does.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Is Paulson Adebo Cb Stanford a top 60 pick. last time any corner with a sub 4.5 40, no matter what else they do, fall into the 3rd.
He could have bird wings for arms, any corner that runs <4.5 in the 40. ehh. Oh well.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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135+ miles South west of Cleveland here in the Columbus Reigion, the Weather, has been nice, for an unusual number of days this spring.
The Forecast calls for a chance of Thunderstorms' Thursday, and rain storms, Friday and Saturday. I don't know how that translates to Clevelands' forecast, ... (Wed- 40% chance of storm. Thur- 50% chance of rain.
I don't what kind of Thinking, allows someone to put a 90 foot tall, wind catch. (Same size as Nebuchadnezers tower from the Bible, 180 cubits, just thought of, moving on).
A 90 foot tall Wind Sail on the lake front during "Tornado Warning" season, to put the entire football universe inside of for 2.5 days.
A recipe for disaster, I don't like it, if that thing collapses, or blows over, They'll never live it down. (Not to mention a tragic loss of lives.)
I'm not saying it will, it just "looks" like videos of things that have collapsed in the past, rock concert stages. It is about 60 ft. taller than it probably needs to be, for one.
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Here are the players that I think will most likely be gone by #26
5 Qb's - Lawrence, Wilson, Fields, Lance, Jones 1 TE - Pitts 3 Wr's - Chase, Smith, Waddle 5 tackles - Sewell, Slater, Vera-Tucker, Darrisaw, Jenkins 4 Cb - Surtan, Farley, Horn, Newsome 2 Lb - Parsons, JOK 4 DE - Ojulari, Paye, Phillips, Rousseau
That is 24 Then maybe 1 safety and maybe 1 Rb which would make 26
Assuming something close to this comes to fruition, Here is how I would approach the draft. If JOK gets past the Raiders at #17 I would look at trading a 3rd and a 4th rounder to move up to take him. Should we not be able to move up for JOK then I would look at either Asante Samuel Jr or Elijah Moore.
Samuel is in my mind definitely a 1st round talent. HE is good in man and great in zone coverage. He also seems to be a ballhawk.
Moore will inject some speed, he ran a 4.29 40, he blocks downfield, has decent hands, and as a bons somes from a Wr factory at Ole Miss. We have a lot of Wr talent right now but Landry and OBJ are high risk for being asked to restructure their contacts or become cap casualties. Higgins is on a 1 year contract and Hodge is not starter caliber.
Guys getting a lot of talk that I have these 2 above are:
Zaven Collins - love his highlights. That raised the question, why isn't he projected much higher? That is because he doesn't play as strong as his size would suggest and he misses a lot of tackles.
Jamin Davis - He had one good year. He could be something but is really a developmental pick. I think we could get similar talent in we drafted a lb in round 3 or 4.
If Ojulari falls to us, I would consider him.
Last edited by Jester; 04/25/21 03:04 PM.
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
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You know my love will Not Fade Away.........
#gmSTRONG
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There is nothing wrong with Christian Barmore, (Nor Kwitty Paye)) but Barmore, DT. Alabama, is probably going to be a big difference maker for the team he ends up on.
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four more days.... getting close!
<><
#gmstrong
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Still guessing:
1. Jacksonville Qb Trevor Lawrence. 2. Ny Jets, Qb Zach Wilson, doesn't seem to be discussion.
3. 49ers, Trey Lance, Qb North Dakota St.
4. Atlanta. 5 Cincinnati 6. Miami 7. Detroit.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Tommy Togiai DT Ohio Stat. 6'1 296,
So the Buccaneers, have a write up about taking him right around pick 90+ and he sounds like, Well he had 40 reps at 225 in the bench, almost record. As they talk he seems solid, and he'll get bigger and with speed, said a run stopping 1st DT, Imo sounds like the Joel Bitonio of the Dt middle.
If the Browns get this guy at 89 overall, I'd consider it a win, ( If the Browns draft a lanky DB or weak ilb instead, with no motion skills, and this guy goes 3 picks later) (I'd consider it another missed opportunity)
I listen to all the OSU football games, when guys make plays, I hear their name call, and positive or negative play associated, with it, some guys you just hear more often, ( like Rashard Higgins) and over time it grows in your mind, that this guy makes plays.
This is one guy you hear his name a lot. I bet if the Browns got him, it'd be considered a good take.
Tommy Togiai, DT Ohio State. ^l^
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Still guessing:
1. Jacksonville Qb Trevor Lawrence. 2. Ny Jets, Qb Zach Wilson, doesn't seem to be discussion.
3. 49ers, Trey Lance, Qb North Dakota St.
4. Atlanta. 5 Cincinnati 6. Miami 7. Detroit. In this model of sure things, I'm going to mock. Stephen Gilmore off the Patriots to the Browns in round 1. and Ifeatu Melifonwu Cb out of Syracuse to the Browns in round 2.
No! I'm not happy about it. ( It fits the Conklin- Jedrick Wlls, Offensive line model of addressing the Cb positon group.)
I'm not happy about it. because Gilmore is a 31 year old Cb, in Sept 2021, and is injured as all get out for a 31 year old.
Plus Gilmores' contract "tah dah" ends after 2021 just like all the other veteran contracts.
Haslem is going ALL IN on the year 2021 with so many contracts coming up.
--------
I don't know how it works out, but At least I hope Berry the GM can get some future draft picks out of the deal, SOMETHING! He's a 31 year old with a bad legs, hand, quad, everything. And Stephen Gilmore is not a Qb.
I'm afraid this idea fits too many measurables to only assume, it's inevitable.
OIC Only in Cleveland, Would the Browns not select a college player on Thursday night.
To God be the glory.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Man, that would be GREAT, if nothing else just to watch people's heads explode. It would be terrible for the team, but I would totally be laughing my butt off at the angst. It's a weird and expensive way of getting a backup/rotational guy on his last leg, but what they heck, right?
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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j/c
All I want out of this draft is: - 1 defensive starter (at any position), - 1 solid backup (at any position, possibly Oline ), - and a developmental QB in the 4th or 5th rd.
I would be OK with this and likely couldn't expect much more in any event considering where we are drafting. But the draft is in Cleveland and knowing that the hometown team likes to make a big 'splash', it is anybody's guess what AB will do....
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
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Kicker. We should draft another kicker. We don't need all the later draft picks anyway. Take the best kicker or two out there in the later rounds. JMHO.
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https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/roa...QAQZxL7NsGkhH_8Road to the Draft: The cases for, against each prospect who's being mocked to the Browns Here’s a roundup of the pros and cons to each of the names who’ve been linked to the Browns in the upcoming draft Apr 27, 2021 at 03:40 PM Anthony Poisal Digital Media Contributor In our Road to the Draft series, we've taken a deep dive into the top prospects available at each position group. Now, we're bringing them all together and looking at the reasons for and against why they should go to Cleveland at pick No. 26. Defensive End Azeez Ojulari, Georgia The case for: The Browns could use their first overall pick to formulate a clear long-term plan across from Myles Garrett at DE. Considered by some to be the safest edge rusher pick of the class, Ojulari earned second-team All-SEC honors after leading the conference with 8.5 sacks and four forced fumbles in 2020. Ojulari possesses all of the skills and technique necessary to become an instant impact-player in the NFL. The case against: The one trait Ojuari doesn't have on his side is size. At 6-foot-2 and 249 pounds, he's slightly smaller than average for his position, which may lead to concerns over how well he can transfer his skills to the NFL. Gregory Rousseau, Miami The case for: Rousseau recorded 15.5 sacks in 2019 to lead the ACC and was the conference's Defensive Rookie of the Year. That season alone gave Rousseau, who opted out of the 2020 season, enough stock to be considered a first-round pick in 2021. Miami has a long history of producing some of the most dominant defensive players in the NFL, and Rousseau, who proved he's capable of wrecking backfields out of sheer strength and speed, could add himself to the list. The case against: A large chunk of Rousseau's 15.5 sacks from 2019 could be considered "coverage sacks," according to CBS Sports draft analysts Chris Trapasso. Coverage sacks are when a defense records a sack more so from quality play from the secondary, which gives pass rushers more time to reach the quarterback regardless of whether they won their battle at the point of contact. Trapasso and other analysts believe Rousseau will need improvements to his technique to be an every-down threat in the NFL. Jaelan Phillips, Miami The case for: Phillips was the beneficiary of Rousseau's opt-out season, and he might've done enough to prove himself as an even better prospect. He led Miami with eight sacks and 15.5 tackles for a loss in 10 games in 2020 and has immense size at 6-foot-5 and 260 pounds. He also registered 45 tackles last season and proved to be efficient in stopping the run. The case against: Phillips' durability could be an area of concern. He suffered three concussions at the college level and played in only 11 games his first two college seasons at UCLA. Kwity Paye, Michigan The case for: Paye was ranked the top player on Bruce Feldman's 2020 Freaks List for The Athletic. His explosiveness and lower-body strength should translate well to the NFL and be a stiff challenge week-to-week for opposing tackles. He was a Second Team All-Big Ten pick the last two seasons. The case against: Paye doesn't have a wide array of pass rush moves that could make him a consistent threat to the league's top linemen. According to Brugler, Paye has an "underdeveloped pass rush plan and countering skills'' and "violent hands, but his attack is simplistic and lacks diversity." Paye also made 11.5 sacks in 38 games, which is below average compared to other prospects. Joe Tryon, Washington The case for: He certainly doesn't lack size at 6-foot-5 and 259 pounds, which he used to lead the Huskies with eight sacks and 12.5 tackles for a loss in 2019. Washington coaches also raved about Tryon's coachable attitude, which should bode well for whatever teams drafts and develops him. The case against: Tryon opted out of the 2020 season, which was a crucial development year after his initial breakout season in 2019. NFL.com draft analyst Lance Zierlein believes he is "too obvious as a rusher and doesn't have a myriad of go-to moves or counters when he's facing off against a talented opponent." Cornerback Caleb Farley, Virginia Tech The case for: Cornerback depth is always needed in the NFL, and the Browns likely will need to add some in the draft after they struggled with cornerback depth in 2020. Farley would be an intriguing prospect. In 2019, he led the ACC with 16 pass deflections and four interceptions and displayed an NFL-caliber level of instincts and physicality. He also is a sound tackler and accrued 56 of them across 23 collegiate starts. That case against: Durability. He dealt with a back injury at the end of 2019 and underwent a microdiscectomy in March, forcing him to miss pre-draft workouts. He's also relatively new to the position — he converted to cornerback after originally playing as a wide receiver in 2017, his redshirt season. Greg Newsome II, Northwestern The case for: Newsome ascended as one of the best cornerbacks in the Big Ten in 2019, when he led the Wildcats with 11 pass deflections. He improved his play even more for 2020, when he led the conference with 10 pass deflections in six games and recorded his first collegiate interception. The case against: Similar to Farley, it's durability. He missed three games in each of his college seasons due to recurring injuries. And despite accruing 25 passes defensed, he registered just one college interception. Linebacker Jeremiah Owusu-Koramoah, Notre Dame The case for: Has the perfect blend of size and speed, which are two traits the Browns covet most at linebacker. He totaled 24.5 tackles for a loss, eight passes defensed and five forced fumbles in his final two seasons at Notre Dame and was named an All-American in 2020. Owusu-Koramoah has no glaring weaknesses to his game and has spent the last two years as arguably the most dominant defensive player in the ACC The case against: With no glaring weaknesses or durability concerns, we'll focus on draft strategy here. Owusu-Koramoah appears increasingly likely to fall before the Browns at pick No. 26, so Cleveland might have to gamble by trading up to select him. If the Browns have other plans for their Day 2 or Day 3 picks, they might not be willing to give them up. Zaven Collins, Tulsa The case for: Carries ideal size for the position at 6-foot-4 and 259 pounds and tremendous durability — he rarely left the field at Tulsa. He won the Bronko Nagurski Award in 2020 and garnered an astounding four interceptions in eight games in 2020, displaying a top-tier understanding of pass coverage as a linebacker. He also has experience and potential at the line of scrimmage and could carve a role as an edge rusher, a level of versatility that could be intriguing for a Browns defense already loaded with versatile players. The case against: He has improvements to make as an overall tackler. According to The Athletic's Dane Brugler, Collins "needs to improve his run fits and take-on technique" to avoid missed tackles. Jamin Davis, Kentucky The case for: Davis established himself as a fearless tackler in 2020 after racking up 102 tackles to go along with three interceptions and five passes defensed. He was one of four SEC defenders to end the season averaging double-digit tackles and he's been one of the most recent and fastest risers up draft boards after recording a 4.47 40-yard dash and 42-inch vertical jump. The case against: Davis has just one full season as a starter and still has a few steps for improvement as a tackler despite his 2020 success. Brugler believes Davis "doesn't attack with a forceful punch" and "will drop his eyes and strike too high as a tackler, falling off ball carriers." Defensive Tackle Christian Barmore, Alabama The case for: The Browns might need to select a defensive tackle early and add to a position group that currently holds just four players on the roster. Barmore could be a solid fit after he exploded with the Crimson Tide in 2020 for eight sacks, three passes defensed and three forced fumbles. He is one of the biggest draft prospects at 6-foot-4 and 310 pounds and maximizes that weight with natural explosion, which gives him a high NFL ceiling that touches Pro Bowl potential. The case against: Barmore had just one year of starting experience at Alabama. The raw talents he displayed in 2020 will be appealing to NFL teams, but his draft spot will come down to whichever DT-needy team believes the time spent to harness the raw traits will be worth it. Safety Trevon Moehrig, TCU The case for: The Browns' safety room has a number of players capable of considerable snaps in 2021 with John Johnson III, Ronnie Harrison Jr., Grant Delpit and more in the fold, but they could still add to the room's depth in the early rounds. Moehrig is the only prospect who appears poised for a Round 1 selection after winning the Jim Thorpe Award in 2020, when he registered two interceptions and 11 passes defensed. The case against: The Browns don't need to reach for a safety they're not 100 percent confident in — Johnson, Harrison and Delpit are all still under 25 years old. Moehrig also isn't physically imposing at 6-foot and 202 pounds, which could lead to durability concerns. Wide Receiver Elijah Moore, Ole Miss The case for: Wide receiver is the lone offensive position the Browns appear to have a shot of considering in the first round. Moore built a monstrous 2020 season with eight touchdowns and 1,193 yards, which earned him First Team All-SEC honors. He ran a pleasing 4.35 40-yard dash and is a lethal receiver in space. The case against: This receiver class is deep and will likely hold several quality options to pick later in Day 2 or Day 3. Moore will likely fall as a second-round pick, but he still has a few questions that obscure his draft stock. One of them is size — at 5-foot-9 and 178 pounds, Moore will always be one of the smallest players on the field and will be at a physical disadvantage against some of the top cornerbacks in the league. Rashod Bateman, Minnesota The case for: Bateman's physicality as a 6-foot, 190-pound receiver led to 19 touchdowns and 2,395 yards across 31 collegiate games. He presents a big target for quarterbacks and is projected to make a strong push for starting snaps as a rookie. The case against: Not as quick as other top receivers (4.41 40-yard dash). Brugler also believes Bateman "lacks explosive burst off the line or out of his breaks with average acceleration by NFL standards."
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If the Browns truly have arrived as one of the NFL's better teams coming into each year with playoff/SB aspirations, this is going to be our new draft-day reality... picking prospects that aren't those cream-of-the-crop top10 picks where we're usually selecting. Guys going at the bottom of the round are still talented, but are going to have a wart or two and/or will have deficiencies that need to be fixed or managed.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Not necessarily, some years the top 10 type players group extends to 30+ players.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 15,979 |
Is this the Year the Browns finally take a prospect from Ohio State?
Are you kidding? Hyeck NO! There may as well be a 40 mile wide Convex Mirror in Mansfield! The Browns' can't appear to even see the Buckeyes from way up there in another part of the state. The Future is Now! Andrew Berry, "We're drafting for the future."
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Joined: Jan 2008
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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Among the players listed to me, the least egregious negatives for first-round consideration belong to JOK, Paye, Newsome and Farley. In that order.
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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What carries more weight? The positives or the negatives?
Do you take the player with more positives but more negatives or the player with less positives but less negatives?
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Where does Jaycee Horn, Cb South Carolina, go in picks succession, assuming obviously top 30?
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Legend
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Legend
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There may be a player worth trading up for.
What would the Jaguars take for the first overall pick?
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Joined: Jan 2008
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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What carries more weight? The positives or the negatives?
Do you take the player with more positives but more negatives or the player with less positives but less negatives? I think it's a little more subtle than that. In this instance, I think my first consideration was positional value/need. Although I think JOK can be a star in the NFL I'm not realy comfortable with the positional value at 26. I think I mentioned this in a response to Peen in another thread. I'm unsure of how he would be used in our defense. I put him ahead of Paye basically because he's the cleanest prospect. I would choose Paye over JOK because given his traits and the fact that we don't need him to play extensively this year. He can be developed and ready for a bigger role in 22. The way they describe his weaknesses suggests they are correctable with coaching. Newsome, his injury history doesn't seem as severe as Farley's. Objectively Newsome might be slightly less talented than Farley but based on what we've been told about each player's medical he seems less risky.
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As I typed out my question, I ended up formulating my answer, but I waited to hear your opinion before offering mine.
I think there is a threshold for the negatives. Up until you hit that threshold, the positives are more important, but once you cross that threshold, no matter how big the positives are the negative supersedes.
That raises the question, where is that threshold? I think that threshold varies from team to team. Caleb Farley for example. Some teams may be willing to draft him while other teams may have him off their boards.
My suspicion is that for many teams, that threshold is a floating line. They may take a chance on a guy like Farley but pass on a Shaun Wade. Or maybe the opposite. They wouldn't take a chance on FArley because a 1st isn't worth the risk but if Wade had had the same medical history they would in the 3rd.
Gets complicated. I think we (at least I am) over thinking things. Most teams probably just go by feel.
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
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Legend
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In Andrew Berry’s most recent interview he said something like, “I never draft with the short term in mind, it’s only long term.” Given that idea, along with the lack of data available for this draft, I think we see several trades down by us for less future capital than we would normally expect.
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I think what he said can be taken two ways. A top tier CB in the FA market can cost you a fortune. The same can be said for a top tier FA edge rusher, when and if you can even find one of those two. So filling one of those positions with a quality draft pick at a much lower contract is a great way to help control your salary cap over the next five years with a fifth round option. That too is a long term plan in drafting. Sometimes it's the perception of what people say more than the words themselves that help us formulate our opinions on the meaning.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I think we see several trades down by us for less future capital than we would normally expect. 
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Legend
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I think our early rounds will be targeted, to a degree, toward the positions where we will have some free agents next year... which is like half the roster, I think.
The missing bit of info that we don't have is who Berry is looking to extend/get a new contract to and who he is willing to let go to free agency.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Legend
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Legend
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With Trevor Lawrence, with throws that take that much time to arrive at their target, I don't know how he has success at the NFL level. Maybe it's an optical illusion college guys aren't intercepting them.
Shoot,( In that clip) Waddle, wr Alabama, looks like that steeler wr from 2016 who got weird at the end.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Legend
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Terrace Marshall JR. Wr. LSU has a great resume, on production, touchdowns and bowl games.
I don't know how a team could take Elijah Moore Wr. Ole Miss, instead of him, if they're both on the board.
Take both maybe.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Offensive line is a need of this team in 2022, if this draft is about the future as the GM says, then take one in the top 2 rounds.
25 years of losing shows the time to draft O-line is a year before you need one. The money of signing contracts will come into play eventually.
The Value Play for future considerations might best be OL in either rounds 1 or 2, but
... upon listening to Cleveland. coms mock draft from yesterday, When the 5 sports writers had a mock, and the Browns pick came up, and Mary K cabot, said Zaven Collins, and everybody else, also had a thought,
trading down made the most sense, for if they trade down they could get, whatever and future picks.
If it were me, my decision was thinking 4 players, 3 OL, and Terrace Marshall the Wr LSU. that would be my pick.
The 3 OL would predicate on belief that Elijah Moore would fall to the Browns 2nd pick,
but Terrace Marshall narrowly beats out, Slater, or Wyatt Davis, OL from NW, and OSU,
and because, Marshall is only 20, if he's taken in the 1st you can option the 5th year in 5 years, at cost, and if you re sign him in 5 years that is a skilled position player who is 25, not 27 ish, and you'd be looking at a contract that doesn't take him to age 30, for his 2nd contract and high payout.
Saving money on a skilled position, in 5 years, or on an OL in 5 yers, the OL isn't going to save as much vs. cost. And Terrace Marshall has a lot of Touchdown production, for potential for more.
Why not Z Collins. Off ball linebackers are toast, and can be found in any round. If you have a good one who gets owned by tight ends every week, or if you have a not quite as good one who gets owned by tight ends every week, you have basically the same thing.
And Jammin Davis, or Werner or Browning from Ohio State, or even Zaven Collins, 1 would be avail in round 3. And if not, it's a lot easier to find one of those types next year than to try and find OL when you'll need it, which means it's a year too late.
And Phillips was a pick we had to suffer through last year, so imo, time to get a real position of football players for this year, we took our medicine of crappy linebacker pick already.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
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