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https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-ranking-all-32-nfl-rosters-ahead-of-the-2021-nfl-draft

Some may disregard this. Not me.

PFF is highly respected and their analysis is based upon intense research.

This is not Las Vegas and betting. This is football in the first degree.

I have gone on record in saying this is the best Browns roster in my lifetime. I am 73 and have been following the Browns intently since 1960.

So, having PFF rank the Browns second confirms my belief. At least in my mind.

We can not control injuries and injuries can wreck a season.

But if we can stay relatively healthy.

NFL games can be decided in many weird ways. However, over the course of a season the cream rises to the top.

This year (before the draft) the Browns have a damn good shot at winning the whole damn thing.


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Sure, why not I say!

You do need to stay healthy and maybe get a bounce or two of the ball go your way.


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Doesn't matter at all unless they get it done and earn this on the field, but it is nice to see nonetheless.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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A little hindsight on my part, but I do believe the team that last won the championship was a better team..

But that really remains to be seen I guess.

I do agree, this team, on paper, looks stacked... So here we go Brownies, here we go!

Last edited by Damanshot; 04/23/21 03:19 PM.

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You mean the 1964 team?

They won the Championship so that has to be considered. And there were good players on the team for sure. But I do not think top to bottom that roster was as good as this team.

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It's nice that our Browns are getting positive attention and accolades but the bottom line is they still have to go out and win games. Nothing else really matters.

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Quote:
Some may disregard this. Not me.

PFF is highly respected and their analysis is based upon intense research.


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Originally Posted By: GratefulDawg
Quote:
Some may disregard this. Not me.

PFF is highly respected and their analysis is based upon intense research.


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Speaking of vers i wonder if he's ok he hasn't been on since last nov.
Seems odd since he isn't banned

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He chose to leave.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

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Obviously, with the draft still to come the final roster is not set. After the draft free agents are brought in and some signed.

Camp comes in August where when it is over cuts come.

The draft will be about future plans more so than immediate impact per Berry.

Still, you hope the first round will get you a starter. The second and third rounds your goal is to have guys that will in a year or two develop into starters.

The rest of the rounds you hope for the best. Maybe you get lucky.

Here is the break down of our starters by round drafted.

nine - first rounders
five - second rounders
three - third rounders
two - fourth rounders
three - fifth rounders
==========================

Ronnie Harrison and Hunt were third rounders.

The draft will add another 1st, 2nd, 3rd rounders.

Draft round does not always equal performance.

However, it is still an indication of how these guys were graded coming in the league.

10 of our players have made a pro bowl:

Myles, Conklin, Ward, Chubb, Clowney, Odell, Jarvis, Hooper, Bitonio, Hunt. Somehow Teller did not make the pro bowl?

That is one hellava roster talent wise.

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On paper, we look great.

But the only proven unit is the offense. I still have a lot of concerns on the defensive side of the ball. I just don’t have any reason to believe that just HALF our defensive starters will stay healthy. I get that COVID was a freak year, but greedy and ward were dinged up even before last season. We don’t have a track record of having a healthy D line, either. Our Linebackers seem to stay healthy, but they were kinda trash so I dunno what to say about that unit.

I get that we upgraded our defense overall on paper, but these guys still gotta show up on sundays. We went from an always hurt Vernon to an always hurt Clowney.

I just have a strange feeling that baker is gonna put up MVP caliber numbers, only for us to barely make the playoffs cause of the defense.


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Originally Posted By: Swish
On paper, we look great.

But the only proven unit is the offense. I still have a lot of concerns on the defensive side of the ball. I just don’t have any reason to believe that just HALF our defensive starters will stay healthy. I get that COVID was a freak year, but greedy and ward were dinged up even before last season. We don’t have a track record of having a healthy D line, either. Our Linebackers seem to stay healthy, but they were kinda trash so I dunno what to say about that unit.

I get that we upgraded our defense overall on paper, but these guys still gotta show up on sundays. We went from an always hurt Vernon to an always hurt Clowney.

I just have a strange feeling that baker is gonna put up MVP caliber numbers, only for us to barely make the playoffs cause of the defense.


That pretty much sums it up.
This definitely wouldn't be the first time we looked great "on paper" only to poop the bed when things got real. We should definitely be a better team than we were at the end of the season, but we need to earn the ability to say that we actually are.

We ain't done nothin, yet... nothing to it but to do it.


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"Might just as well win it all" Wasn't that Major League? Loved it and still do.

maybe this year is the year when we may be able to make up for a whole bunch of crappish karma and do some deep winning. I don't care who wins us games. We are tough on paper, Purp.

Just win, baby! Unleash The Elf! brownie


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Last year even in games we won like the Cowboys. Teams came back and scored.

When you look at how we lost games as well as the ones we won. The common thread was defensive backfield.

Ward missing games. Delpit and Greedy missing the season. We were forced to use guys that were depth players.

Linebacker play was slow and tackles were missed.

In free agency the players that were signed were all upgrades. Greedy and Delpit are on track to return.
John Johnson is a huge upgrade. Hill is a highly ranked slot corner. Walker was a captain and is considered a great tackler.

IMO we will go from a lower third defense to a top ten.

Nothing is guaranteed lots of factors at play.

But this defense should be way better. Coverage and pass rush should be much improved.

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Originally Posted By: bonefish

Last year even in games we won like the Cowboys. Teams came back and scored.

When you look at how we lost games as well as the ones we won. The common thread was defensive backfield.

Ward missing games. Delpit and Greedy missing the season. We were forced to use guys that were depth players.

Linebacker play was slow and tackles were missed.

In free agency the players that were signed were all upgrades. Greedy and Delpit are on track to return.
John Johnson is a huge upgrade. Hill is a highly ranked slot corner. Walker was a captain and is considered a great tackler.

IMO we will go from a lower third defense to a top ten.

Nothing is guaranteed lots of factors at play.

But this defense should be way better. Coverage and pass rush should be much improved.


I Agree WAY BETTER than 2020 thumbsup


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Originally Posted By: Swish
On paper, we look great.

But the only proven unit is the offense. I still have a lot of concerns on the defensive side of the ball. I just don’t have any reason to believe that just HALF our defensive starters will stay healthy. I get that COVID was a freak year, but greedy and ward were dinged up even before last season. We don’t have a track record of having a healthy D line, either. Our Linebackers seem to stay healthy, but they were kinda trash so I dunno what to say about that unit.

I get that we upgraded our defense overall on paper, but these guys still gotta show up on sundays. We went from an always hurt Vernon to an always hurt Clowney.

I just have a strange feeling that baker is gonna put up MVP caliber numbers, only for us to barely make the playoffs cause of the defense.

Can I change this from offense to defense and make a similar point.
Quote:
On Paper we look great
but the only proven unit is the defense.
I don't have any reason to belief just HALF the Offensive starters will stay healthy.
Covid was a freak year but Tretter and Hubbard were dinged up even before last season.
We don't have a track record of a healthy (offensive skilled positons) either.
( Our special teamer and 3rd tier Wr's (Natson, Hodge, Taylor,) seem to stay healthy, except for Natson, but they were kinda trash so I don't know what to say about that unit.

I get that we upgraded our Offense overall on paper, but these guys gotta show up on Sundays. We went from an always hurt Chubb, to an always hurt Odell.

I just have a strange feeling that Myles is going to put up MVP caliber numbers, only for us to barely make the playoffs because of the offense.
thumbsup


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One game at a time.

Good teams string 2-3-4 wins together and keep losing to 1 game, maybe 2 games in a row .


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Our linebackers are our biggest concern... By far.

We needed a lot of help last year. We need just as much help this year.


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LB is not, and will not be a position of huge emphasis for this team.

We will only play 2 on the field at most times, and can be situational/rotational type players.

Last year's defense didn't have a huge problem at LB. The problem was that we have to play 3 of them, at the same time, too often.


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Originally Posted By: YTownBrownsFan
LB is not, and will not be a position of huge emphasis for this team.

We will only play 2 on the field at most times, and can be situational/rotational type players.

Last year's defense didn't have a huge problem at LB. The problem was that we have to play 3 of them, at the same time, too often.


People should think of our off ball linebackers usage situationally. If it’s first and ten we’ll have one or two of them on the field based on the offense’s personnel. Two of Phillips, Takitaki, Smith, and/or Walker. If it is a short yardage/clear run situation then it’ll definitely be Takitaki on the field with one or two others. If it is a clear pass situation it’ll be one linebacker (probably Smith or Walker).

Off ball linebackers are no longer a priority position because “sub” packages are used so frequently and because you can easily sub them off the field based on situation.

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The biggest thing in my mind will be how we manage injuries and pace ourselves over a 17 game regular season. Literally any team can go from championship caliber to cellar dweller with half a dozen injuries. So... depth. How well does coaching preserve key players until the post season and how quality is the depth behind inevitable injury.

That’s why I’m in favor of drafting a RB, WR, linemen. Need quality platoons.




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Agreed and we have enough draft picks and eventual cuts from other teams to round out our roster. We have a better roster this year no doubt but we also have a much tougher schedule. We were helped last year by playing a weak NFC East division and a Steelers team that didn't play a lot of their starters in the last game. To our credit we beat them good in our playoff win and almost beat the Chiefs at their place and may have if the helmet to helmet penalty was called. We need to be better this year if we hope to go farther because of our schedule. Even games we should definitely win like the Denver, Detroit and LA Chargers games aren't givens because we historically have trouble with those teams. We need to stay focused and hope for a minimal amount of injuries. JMO

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Originally Posted By: Homewood Dog
Agreed and we have enough draft picks and eventual cuts from other teams to round out our roster. We have a better roster this year no doubt but we also have a much tougher schedule. We were helped last year by playing a weak NFC East division and a Steelers team that didn't play a lot of their starters in the last game. To our credit we beat them good in our playoff win and almost beat the Chiefs at their place and may have if the helmet to helmet penalty was called. We need to be better this year if we hope to go farther because of our schedule. Even games we should definitely win like the Denver, Detroit and LA Chargers games aren't givens because we historically have trouble with those teams. We need to stay focused and hope for a minimal amount of injuries. JMO


I have faith that Stefanski will keep this team focused thumbsup


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Originally Posted By: PastorMarc
Originally Posted By: Homewood Dog
Agreed and we have enough draft picks and eventual cuts from other teams to round out our roster. We have a better roster this year no doubt but we also have a much tougher schedule. We were helped last year by playing a weak NFC East division and a Steelers team that didn't play a lot of their starters in the last game. To our credit we beat them good in our playoff win and almost beat the Chiefs at their place and may have if the helmet to helmet penalty was called. We need to be better this year if we hope to go farther because of our schedule. Even games we should definitely win like the Denver, Detroit and LA Chargers games aren't givens because we historically have trouble with those teams. We need to stay focused and hope for a minimal amount of injuries. JMO


I have faith that Stefanski will keep this team focused thumbsup


I agree, but it's much more than just Stefanski. We lost coached to CO-VID last year, and the team still stayed focused. We lost Stefanski, in a playoff game, out 1st in a long, long time, and the team stayed focused. It was very impressive.


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jc...

I hope the players are smart enough to ignore all of this "unearned" praise and attention by the media.

Games will be won on the field by those players who do the work and make the sacrifices needed when called upon.

Such as, a defense capable of protecting a lead in the fourth qtr would be a good start.

PFF grades are meaningless at this time.

Last edited by mac; 04/25/21 05:58 PM.



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Originally Posted By: mac
jc...

I hope the players are smart enough to ignore all of this "unearned" praise and attention by the media.

Games will be won on the field by those players who do the work and make the sacrifices needed when called upon.

Such as, a defense capable of protecting a lead in the fourth qtr would be a good start.

PFF grades are meaningless at this time.


This one's a big one for me. Not just because I'm a grumpy old fart with a growing protestant work ethic every year I get older but the acting like you've won anything before you've really done anything is about the most aggravating thing a team or player can do IMO. The Freddie Kitchens year should be seared into the team's memory. The preseason hype, egged on by Freddie and Baker and the other young players (and media) only to come out and lay a big fat egg for the season. It was such a tee-up for the humiliating hate that flowed so free towards the Browns that year. Uhhg, just don't. Keep your mouth shut, compliment you opponents, keep your words off their bulletin boards, don't make rising to your shade the extra juice they need against you, and make the over-celebrating and taunting a punishable offense within the team. As the saying goes, act like you've been there.

Last edited by 10YrOvernightSuccess; 04/25/21 07:11 PM.



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Quote:
The Freddie Kitchens year should be seared into the team's memory.


Words of Truth.

That said, I saw something last year that really impressed me. This new regime looks/sounds/smells nothing like the stuff we used to see. We have a group of boring, driven, competent professionals running things with all oars in sync in the water.

I don't think this team's leadership will allow a lax attitude/approach. If you recall, there was almost no trace of controversy during the entire 2020 season, and I think that is directly the result of coaching staff and admin. Our players were disciplined on the field, and that directly led to wins in games we used to lose.

It's a concern of yours that I truly understand. I mean, we've all lived through the years since 1999. PTSD is real. But I really think the Browns will be one of those teams who are on top of rules.

They already know what the stakes are. They lost to KC because of rules. If anything, I expect them to play at a higher level of acumen, based upon the lessons they learned in 2020.

I've been one of the board's biggest pessimists/realists for quite some time. That said, I see a completely different FO model from the usual dysfunctional clustergrunt that has always been 'New Browns Football.' It gives me hope that we are entering a period of CLE history that sees us perpetually in the hunt for the next decade.

Yep. Dynasty stuff.
Dare to dream, eh?

This team has been very smartly assembled, and is also being smartly run. This ain't luck, though it kinda feels like it, given our decades of "Battered Dawg Syndrome."


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Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
[quote]
Yep. Dynasty stuff.
Dare to dream, eh?


Agreed ... and ... very nearly ready to dream ! LOL.


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Originally Posted By: bonefish
You mean the 1964 team?

They won the Championship so that has to be considered. And there were good players on the team for sure. But I do not think top to bottom that roster was as good as this team.


Yes that would be the team that I'm thinking of. They won, so it's simple, they were the best of that era.

But as of today, I question if that team could have survived today. Jim Brown would have done well today.. Beyond that, I just don't know.

SO perhaps, you are right...


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Originally Posted By: Clemdawg
Quote:
The Freddie Kitchens year should be seared into the team's memory.


Words of Truth.

That said, I saw something last year that really impressed me. This new regime looks/sounds/smells nothing like the stuff we used to see. We have a group of boring, driven, competent professionals running things with all oars in sync in the water.

I don't think this team's leadership will allow a lax attitude/approach. If you recall, there was almost no trace of controversy during the entire 2020 season, and I think that is directly the result of coaching staff and admin. Our players were disciplined on the field, and that directly led to wins in games we used to lose.

It's a concern of yours that I truly understand. I mean, we've all lived through the years since 1999. PTSD is real. But I really think the Browns will be one of those teams who are on top of rules.

They already know what the stakes are. They lost to KC because of rules. If anything, I expect them to play at a higher level of acumen, based upon the lessons they learned in 2020.

I've been one of the board's biggest pessimists/realists for quite some time. That said, I see a completely different FO model from the usual dysfunctional clustergrunt that has always been 'New Browns Football.' It gives me hope that we are entering a period of CLE history that sees us perpetually in the hunt for the next decade.

Yep. Dynasty stuff.
Dare to dream, eh?

This team has been very smartly assembled, and is also being smartly run. This ain't luck, though it kinda feels like it, given our decades of "Battered Dawg Syndrome."





leadership,, SOmething we've lacked from the FO and Coaching staff..


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