DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Baker 2

No prejudice here.

Didn't Deshaun Watson request a trade because they trade his favorite receiver and then hired a new GM? All just 4 months after signing a new contract?

I agree. It's foolish to think we said nothing to our QB or his representation. We may or may not have been able to do a better job, but I don't believe we just blindsided the guy. And hey, even if we did, that happens every day in business all over the world. I don't know why some expect football players to be any different. To me it just sounds like some people jabbering in a panic.

You are clueless. It is his job to play his best as long as he plays anywhere. How about he plays his best for himself? Ever think of that?

Probably not.

Me or you?

You just got on someone for recreating events of what Baker was told or not told because they were not there while you were also recreating events based on what you think happened.

You've hated Baker forever.

I didn't "get on" someone. I had a conversation... but you know, you do you. All good.

Ok.

It's amazing to me how fans don't remember that Baker played hurt most of the year.. We can argue that he didn't want to come out for fear he'd be replaced.. But I chalk that up to being competitive..

How many coaches has he had here? How many different schemes? First full year with Stefanski and we make the playoffs,,, But it's beyond me how anyone can forget that..,

j/c

This pending split started long ago. The pursuit of a "replacement" and the "Adult" comment were simply the last straws. It's past time to move on and simply start over at QB...which means we meander around until we get enough picks to take a shot on the next shiny new object/chance/opportunity...maybe in '23. The FO wants to replace Baker...Baker now wants to move on...half the fan base hates the guy.

The "window" has officially closed on the fingers of the FO and owners. This delusion that this is a talented team "ready to win" is the same farce we lived through last year (pre-season) with all the "weapons" we supposedly had on offense. We now have (1) legit, NFL-quality WR...a ridiculously overpaid, average-at-best TE...(1) legit, NFL DLineman...lord only knows at LB after JOK...a soft CB about to hit the jackpot...and (3) safeties that all play the same position. We need a ton of help and the draft isn't going to provide all that we need...and no "quality" free agent is coming near our latest dumpster fire.

One year ago today we were riding high...

An upset Baker is a motivated Baker. While there will be some hurt feelings to work through, there's also the possibility that this whole "fiasco" was orchestrated to spur Baker to improve. Every time he thinks he has arrived, he regresses. When he's doubted, he goes out to prove people wrong.

Maybe we're all thinking checkers, while the FO's playing chess.

Just a random musing.

Anybody think Seattle might want to trade for baker?

All of those players are pro bowl caliber players with better QB play.

That's the crux of the NFL. That's the way it works.

Bad QB play destroys a team. We are witnessing it. Bad QB play combined with bad QB attitude takes it up a notch.

We are definitely headed back to the basement. We simply cannot compete in the AFC with a bridge QB. Our best chance is Baker, but even that was 50/50.

My suggestion...hope we get lucky in the draft or take a break from this team.

Yes.

Believe it or not, I actually agree with a lot what you said.

You cannot discount the toxicity that has been brought here with Haslam. If I had to guess he creates a tremendous amount of pressure behind the scenes to win, and his FO and coaching staff try to oblige.

We would probably be in a much better position today had the Browns just committed to Mayfield before last season and were somewhat captive to his contract and keep working with him to get better. Kind of like Cincy, Tennessee, and other franchises do. I think Cleveland is sometimes in too big of a hurry to win it all. And I think that comes from Jimmy.

I dunno. I think Pete Carroll thinks Locke is a great fit for what he wants to do. I'm also not sure they want to deal with another QB they'd have to re-sign and would probably want to play elsewhere. There's also the managing a QB's feelings aspect that they're probably a bit sick of.

I totally disagree with your assessment that this roster is not ready to win right now.

Chubb/Hunt are the best running back duo in the NFL. If they somehow retain Johnson the RB position is ridiculously deep.
The Browns have a top 5 Offensive line in the NFL even after letting Tretter go. Willis, Bitonio, Harris, Tellar, and Conkiln and now having Hubbard back this unit is strong.
Njoku and Harrison are both talented Tight Ends.
Cooper is better than any WR we had on our roster last year. Draft Garrett, London, Burks, or Olave, with Donovan Peoples Jones and the team is set at WR

Myles Garrett is still a beast. The Front Office will either find a way to bring Clowney back or replace him. I don't have any fears there. The DT's need better run stuffers than we saw last year. I believe the FO is not finished addressing that position.
JOK, Phillips, and Walker is a really good Linebacker unit. Actually once Phillips came back from injury the defense played really good down the stretch last year.
The Browns have a really great cornerback unit. Denzil Ward, Greg Newsome, Greedy Williams, Troy Hill, and AJ Green. I would take that unit of corners up against any teams corners. With the QB's in the AFC a group like this is very important.
Safety had John Johnson and Grant Delpit also in great shape,

This roster just needs a QB that can not turn the ball over.

DK Metcalf opposite Amari Cooper sounds like a wonderful idea.

The Seahawks to tried to trade us Russell Wilson for the first pick in Baker’s draft to take Baker.

This is it. He is supposed to be a professional, go out and play your best. Every employee is a commodity, every employer wants to improve.

I think it was more the opposite. Dorsey tried to trade for Wilson because he liked Wilson better than Baker. Wilson wouldn't waive his no trade clause to come to Cleveland. Seattle wouldn't have necessarily taken Baker with the pick. I could be wrong, but that was my interpretation of the vague Russ to Cleveland rumors.

Baker wouldn't be on a rookie contract any more as well.

I think the Panthers are our best bet for a solid return because the owner seems desperate for a QB. The Seahawks seem to want to go more run heavy.

Nope. Seattle was trying to trade Wilson before his big contract. He didn’t have a no trade clause at that point. Dorsey rejected the offer.

And that may be what needs to happen, everyone needs to cool down and talk rationally once emotions have calmed, and move forward.

I can't fault baker for acting emotionally, people forget these guys are still young, and in many ways don't have the experiences to know how to deal with these scenarios.

Are you kidding me.

Dorsey loved "Buddy Boy" there was no way he was trading the 1st pick for Wilson.

He had Baker locked in from Day 1 on the job. The Doof.

I know I’m in minority but I hope Baker, his agent and everyone connected to the Browns will take a deep breath and wait a couple of weeks until they open their mouth again. Like they say in Italy - Stampa silenza. Right now every little pip will be misjudged and interpreted the wrong way.

All of them is part of this fiasco. None of them should point the finger at the opposite side. The local media is probably one of the worst offenders in this sorry saga, they should definitely be deadly silent for a year or two because nothing they print or say improves the situation.

Baker hasn’t helped himself one bit with his social media BS but still parts of me widely sympathize with his situation. It’s perfectly OK to think he’s not good enough to be Franchise QB but the way the media and a large part of supporters has hated on him is sickening. Honestly. Some of the worst haters don’t deserve a good QB in Cleveland.

The Browns FO and the owners should ask themselves why they time after time look like idiots and bring make this organization the most unprofessional in the NFL. The smartest GM on earth and his sidekick Ski should also take a deep look in the mirror. Since Baker got hurt and started playing with a harness the whole organization got paralyzed. Bad decisions galore and zero consequence analyses.

The DeShaun Watson saga. Lost for words. A dead end from the first second and nobody in charge reacted or used their brain.

My ideal scenario is that Baker finish his fifth year with the Browns in the best possible way. Forgive, forget and move on. Be the better guy. Show the haters they’re wrong.
Andrew Berry should start to use his famous intelligence and make the best of a bad situation. A good leader find ways to move forward. Now it’s time for him to deliver and stop talking 3D chess whenever he opens his mouth.

I perfectly understand that this is a dream scenario and many of you had enough of either Baker or the Browns owner/FO or maybe both. But anyway. What else?

Now with Baker close to 27 years old, peradventure how much he would give for him now if he could?
Pick #34?

We could only hope.

The article says it was Cleveland that floated the idea. Honestly, I don't think it matters much who did what then. A lot can change in 4-5 years.

Maybe the Seahawks are in play. My guess is the Panthers.

Tepper wants a QB, and "Temple tough" Rhule probably gives Baker points for playing through the shoulder issue.

And yet again under Haslam the Browns are the
Laughing stock of the NFL..it is the most dysfunctional
In the AFC. Not far removed from a 0 and 16 season
Now this.you can bet your bottom dollar
If the Browns don't reach the playoffs in 2022
Myles Garrett will want out.
The rest of the AFC North is getting better but the Browns.

I considered that as a possibility and don't rule it out. The problem is Baker tends to hold a grudge as past history shows, and to be honest, I don't like to bring up a persons spouse, but in this case I don't think Bakers wife is exactly a calming or voice of reason on this matter.

I don't see how trying to win is a flaw. Unless you can tell me right now that Watson isn't better than Baker, then we did what we were supposed to do.

Your owner doesn't fly down to meet 1 on 1 with someone you've moved on from. Desperation is a stinky cologne.

I think you are connecting the start and the end but leaving some of the middle out. If we are guessing...

The Browns told Baker if they found an 'elite' QB available they would pursue.
The Browns told Baker they were going after Watson.
Baker posted what people characterize as his goodbye letter, but also was supportive of staying.
The Browns called Baker a child.
Baker asked for a trade.

We can fill in more middle I guess, as people feel is warranted. But it sounds like the Browns committed to Baker unless they found the next Level QB and then threw him out rudely when they thought they had something locked. I am sure he found out he was done in Cleveland when they called him a child in the media.

I am in total agreement and would add further that we had a LT that not only struggled at the position because he's a RT but has missed games due to injury. All I've heard on this site is he was hurt and that effected his play - REALLY - doesn't seem to apply to our QB. The injury excuse is totally unacceptable for the way Baker played but is constantly used as the excuse for Conklin, OBJ, Landry, Wills, Chubb, Hunt, Clowney, and the fall off at the end of the season by Garrett. Not a single time in this forum has anybody said these guys need to be replaced because of their play - THEY WERE INJURED. That's 8 of the 22 starters whose production numbers fell off either the whole season or part of it in 2021 yet Baker is totally responsible for the Browns 2021 woes. The Browns also have a RT that even today is questionable to be ready for next season and the primary backup that was just resigned is also coming off a season ending injury. That's before we even get into the absolute poor coaching by not adjusting the game plan or taking control of the situation by benching the injured QB that was having issues due to his injury. What the hell do the Browns need a head coach for if the players are going to decide whether to play or not. What about Landry saying at seasons end that he came back too soon and his injury effected his play - Hmmmm, Mayfield's fault again. Who the hell is coaching this team anyway?