DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus A plaque with the words 'Ku Klux Klan' still hangs on a building at West Point

A plaque with the words "Ku Klux Klan" written below a hooded figure holding what appears to be a rifle currently hangs on a building at the U.S. Military Academy at West Point in New York.

The marker referencing one of the country's most infamous hate groups is garnering attention due to a special commission formed to look into connections to the Confederacy at U.S. military bases and other properties.

Last year, the Naming Commission was charged with surveying Defense Department assets for ties to the Confederacy and making recommendations on how to rename or remove the references.

In a report released on Monday, the commission highlighted the presence of the Ku Klux Klan mounted marker at the entrance to Bartlett Hall, a science building at West Point, the U.S. Army's elite training school.

A plaque with the words "Ku Klux Klan" hangs at the entrance to Barlett Hall, a building at West Point. The marker was highlighted in a recent report by a special commission looking into U.S. military assets with names tied to the Confederacy.
The Naming Commission

Though it noted that there are "clearly ties" between the KKK and the Confederacy, the plaque fell outside of its specific remit created by Congress, the commission said.

"The Commission encourages the Secretary of Defense to address DoD assets that highlight the KKK in Defense Memorialization processes and create a standard disposition requirement for such assets," the report said.

The KKK was formed in 1865 by six Confederate veterans of the Civil War and initially targeted Black people in the postwar South before also turning its hateful agenda against Jews, Catholics and others.

https://www.npr.org/2022/08/31/1120...-5ZdQETiK99brJtCLSriZHzo5Cw4jXINx5iCGFBg

Murica!

It’s been there since the 60’s??? For that to still be there tells me alot about the integrity and make up of the Army generals of today who went to West Point and knew the plaque was there. Black or white.

I think it's a bigger issue than that which permeats much more than West Point. Actually if you go to the link I believe the bigger picture is shown plainly. Here it is....

Why the U.S. government is reviewing names tied to the Confederacy

Though the commission concluded that the KKK plaque was beyond its purview, the eight-member body found other assets linked to the Confederacy at West Point and the U.S. Naval Academy in Annapolis, Md.

They included barracks, a housing area and a child development center at West Point named for Confederate Gen. Robert E. Lee, as well as the superintendent's quarters and a road at the Naval Academy named after Confederate Adm. Franklin Buchanan, to name just a few.

Notably, the commission has made recommendations for renaming nine Army bases across the South with names tied to Confederate figures.

For example, Louisiana's Fort Polk would be renamed Fort Johnson in honor of William Henry Johnson, a Black soldier renowned for his heroics in World War I.

The commission also suggested renaming Fort Hood in Texas as Fort Cavazos after Richard E. Cavazos, the first Hispanic American to become a four-star general in the Army.

Early last year, Congress overrode President Trump's veto and passed a defense spending bill that included a provision requiring the renaming of military assets with names linked to the Confederacy. It followed the racial justice protests that erupted across the country in the summer of 2020.

The secretary of defense has the final say on renaming bases and other assets, and a plan is expected to be implemented by Jan. 1, 2024, according to the commission.

https://www.npr.org/2022/08/31/1120...-5ZdQETiK99brJtCLSriZHzo5Cw4jXINx5iCGFBg

I mean most of us have heard the excuses used for it. But the truth is that the confederacy seceded from The United States and were the enemy forces that were at war with our nation. They actually killed more U.S. troops than any other enemy we have had in our nations history. This would be no different than naming military bases after Hitler's generals. I know that will upset some people but inconvenient facts have a way of doing that. Germany was no less of an enemy of The United States than Germany was. Only Germany didn't attack us on our own soil. People need to face the fact they were citizens of a nation formed that attacked the U.S.A. and started a war with our nation. They were the the C.F.A., not the U.S.A.

JC....

I thought the same as Perfect Circle, until I investigated much more and realized it's not 1 small plaque, as the article images suggest. It's part of a much larger plaque, which I can see makes it more difficult than just unscrewing it and removing it. And it is meant as a review of history of the US, both good and bad.

https://wstpost.com/black-troops-vi...ssional-committee-says-is-ok-to-keep-up/

That does help explain it to a minor extent. Now if only I could figure out how the KKK has anything to do with any military history or soldiers who served in WW2 or the Korean "war".

If you click the article link, they show up close some of the carvings and their meanings. Like purchase of Alaska, Clara Barton founder of the Red Cross, Susan B Anthony.

It's "History of The United States Of America", and it is DEDICATED to the WP grads of WW2 and Korean War.

It's not about those 2 wars, or even about war itself.

Now if we could just deal with all of those pesky American military bases named after the generals of a foreign country who attacked and killed more Americans than any other foreign country in our nations history. And on our own soil no less.

Who really cares?

There comes a point where beaching about everything become tiresome.

people like me who are the targets of hate from these racist clowns. damn must be nice not to care about this when you arent the target of their bigotry.

yet another example of why i call conservatives fake. if it doesn't effect you personally, then it shouldnt be a big deal to anyone else.

smh...who really cares...peen just told everyone that minorities and white people who aren't racist garbage should just let this happen and move on. garbage.

I'm not being snarky, asking quite seriously, please don't take this the wrong way.

If the plaque is depicting both tragedy and triumph in our nation's history, why would you want the KKK erased? How would that help anything going forward? I guess I'm not following how you become less of a target of bigotry if an image is removed from a plaque that is chock-full of many images of both good and bad.

because we aren't looking at JUST the symbol, but the overall situation.

if you were to tell me that this was the only reference to white supremacist in its context, ok. but when you have this, right wing extremist continuing to infilitrate the ranks, honoring of confederate soldiers, and a country where half the country believes in the lost cause myth, it becomes a problem.

it shouldn't have to be explained how powerful imagery and symbolism is.

Certainly not anyone who doesn't consider people other than those who look like and live like themselves.

That's cool. Sorry for asking for an explanation, just wanted your opinion on the matter. Thanks for the added context, it certainly helps explain things. I'm surprised it's been there so long. I guess many will feel like the mere imagery is offensive, or serves to perpetuate the "lost cause myth" (thanks again -- learned something new). I just always try to dig deep enough to find my own feelings... it's not hard in this case... I see any symbol or reference and I'm disgusted.

Sometimes we need to be reminded that out past was not as idealistic as we remember or have been told.

I am more neutral towards removal of symbols of the past, especially when there is a different meaning than originally intended.

bro dont apologize because as ticked as i am, without explanation nothing changes. and again let me be clear: historical imagery in its context is absolutely fine. but this country has a long history of imagery being used as propaganda and covert symbolism to the disgusting aspects of our society. the imagery with the klan and the confederacy was never about hitorical context for most of this country's history. it was always about sending a message about who this country was truly meant for, and who it wasn't.

for example, the klan never used to burn crosses until the first movie in history Birth of a Nation was released. that movie perpetuated the lost cause myth to the american masses, and was so powerful to the worst of the worst in this country that they adopted crap from the movie into their real life traditions. most of the confederate statues that were erected didn't even come directly after the civil war; it came between the 1890's and 1950's. ya know, during the rise and peak of the jim crow and overall segregation era in this country, black codes, and debt peonage.

really go learn about the reconstruction era bro. you will be really shocked to see how much of that era affects this country today. and not just a vague effect. huge in our faces today kind of effects.

preach it.

I'm tired of laying the needle in that same old groove... to played for an endless queue of Helen Kellers.


time to retire.
it's to you, young man.

i wont be able to convince people like you have.

exhausting.

no wonder we die younger.

I am not making light of the KKK or being a KKK sympathizer as some suggest. My point is it is some obscure image on some plaque depicting the nations history, at least to the point the plaque was made.

History isn't something you can simply erase. If that was some testament to the virtues of the KKK, then sure, take it down. Take it down long ago. The deal is that it isn't. Reminders of the bad points in history are of benefit IMO.

History isn't without stains just like our own of life isn't without stains. If you and others somehow think taking this down will somehow make the idea of the KKK go away, you are being foolish.

no one has ever clamed it would go away. that's a conservative mindset by the way. yall the main ones always claiming "well, if we dont talk about racism, itll just go away". conservatives are like the series Desperate Housewives. HOA suburban's who try to pretend there's no issues going on until the bodies start piling up too high.

there's a huge difference between making something go away and removing imagery so it doesn't get glorified and worshipped.

What they seem to have a problem understanding, although I have no idea why, is placing things like that in prominent places, naming military bases after confederate generals, having statues of them in town squares is elevating them and glorifying them. They try to make some faux argument that if you don't glorify them you're trying to erase history. If that's true, why don't we have the generals of our enemies in other wars in town squares? Why not military bases named after Hitler's generals in WW2 for example? Aren't they afraid that if we don't do that we will erase the history of WW2? You see, when you point that out their argument falls flat.

All a part of the division in this country.

Now we have a President saying the country's own citizens are the threat.

You aren't paying attention. That started a few years ago. Whether it was communists, radical left, BLM, the free press .... they were all enemies of the state according to Drumf.

A certain portion of them have become that way. MAGA believers and supporters are a threat. So why do you think celebrating generals who were responsible for killing more U.S. troops than any other foreign Army in our nation's history by placing them in a place of honor something we should be divided over? What other enemies of the U.S. have we done that with? And please, spare me the excuse that this was our own people against each other. Once you secede from the U.S., have your own president, government and armed forces, and attack our country, you are no longer "one of us", you're "one of them".

One of the things we had talked about previously was the symbolism involved in kneeling for the flag and I was pretty much in agreement with you. People can feel differently about what a thing symbolizes and how they should be interpreted. Given that, they should have the freedom to interpret symbols as they like. I don't feel the same way about this piece of art that you do for a couple of reasons. I don't think that it is intended to make us feel good or prideful. A lot of art is intended to make you feel negative or mixed emotions. I don't mind artwork that creates negative emotions. I also think the historical aspects are important. Erasing the KKK from all history or even to oversimplify that history is a mistake. If we erase history then we are doomed to repeat it.

Clearly not all imagery is intended to be unoffensive. Some of it is intended to offend. I agree with you on that. A lot of people will proudly display things and actually do it to offend others, even when they are saying that they aren't doing it to offend, they often are. That is the cost of freedom of speech. We occasionally have to allow people to intentionally do things that offend us.

If governments no longer wish to support artwork that could offend people (and most of it was clearly not intended to offend), then I just ask that they do not destroy it and instead put it up for auction so that people can privately preserve these works.

It's not just the President, about 70% feel that way about MAGA.

70% of who?

I think we could get Dems, and Republicans to agree all Ku Klux. Klan members should have to wear pee stained sheets and pillow cases.

All day, while they pick cotton with bare their hands under the hot noon-day sun...


I'm a fan.


Which causes me to wonder (as I often do, when considering groups of people)... how many secret Klan members have memberships at DawgTalkers?


-just thinking out loud....

Probably none.

Of the American People, even old-school republicans including many that voted for him twice. The 6th was TOO far for most, the docs are icing on that cake. Anybody without Trump blinders can see this unless they are lying to themselves. Is that clear enough?

I hope.

Truth: they belong to a wide number of 'communities,' so there is no way of ever knowing for sure.
Which is why the question is always in the back of my mind.

Be thankful that you don't have to ever concern yourself with such things.

My mileage may vary.

#DiffAmericaforEach

I hope so too, but the reality exists there are all sorts of hate groups. I do have to concern myself with such things. Being concerned is the right thing to do, right? I also know that hate groups have a way of manifesting to in groups that hate all of us for one reason or another, at one point or another, so none of us are exempt.

Hate has a way of shifting as public perception shifts and a multitude of factors can lead to that shift.

Yep. That's why so many hate MAGA. Little differences like supporting insurrections, espionage, and one man being above the law tend to cause that. WHO KNEW?

I think the difference here is it is not a matter of free speech by an American citizen as you have described. I don't disagree with you when it pertains to that.

The issue is we have nine military bases named after confederates. When someone erects a monument, statue, gets a military base named in their honor, that's a sign of approval and respect bestowed on them on the behalf of our government. That's the issue here.

I agree, Who knew that communists would infect all levels of government and the media.

And that the fascists would destroy it, lie and undermine our democracy.

Well, it's your side of the equation that's trying to turn America into Russia... So I suppose you should know... Did they give you a secret decoder ring?

Soldier Who Said He Wanted Combat Experience to Kill Black People Booted After FBI Probe

https://www.yahoo.com/news/soldier-said-wanted-combat-experience-204338897.html

we should just ignore this too. i mean who cares, right peen?

I’ll respond on his behalf…

Communists commie communism. Communistic communists commie communisticly communist.