DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Kevin Stefanski cont

No, I think you're pretty much alone on that one and that's the way I'll leave it. I'm not joining your cause. Most of what you post I don't think even you believe.

j/c:

Baker again? I thought this was a Stefanski thread. But yeah, I brought him up yet again.

So if Steff starts to win he will be winning these battles.....hmmm Now I understand

Do you really not see how laughable it is for you to boo-hoo when being accused of constantly bringing up our former QB? Seriously? It's past the point of not mattering what thread it's done in.

I am not doing the who coached better as an agenda. I thought it might be interesting. Especially with the controversy that some people want to keep him and some want to replace him.

And yes, I realize this is all subjective. I posted my opinion on the topic.
I would love to see your opinion on which games he out coached the opposing coach and which ones he got out coached in.

Okay, I apologize if I misinterpreted your intent.

I really can't tell you who outcoached whom in most of the games because I don't enough information and zero first-hand knowledge. What I can tell you is we have never had a HC who is better w/clock management, using timeouts, and maybe even using challenges than Stefanski. I do know quite a bit about scheme and play design. I did not like the Stefanski hire, but his scheme is excellent. His play design is very good. It's very similar to Kyle Shanahan's. I also know that he has caught other teams like the Bengals off-guard w/personnel match-ups. One such example that most should remember is when Cooper beat the Bengal CB for a long TD on Halloween because the corner wasn't even ready. We caught them before they could substitute. He does these things very well.

I am not asking you to agree. You are not a name caller or bully. Just giving my answer to your question.

Kevin has done a good job considering everything he’s had to deal with. I’m with Joel B. He get’s my vote of confidence.

I made That post because I don't know what I think about bringing Stefanski back. He is clearly no Hue or Kitchens. So I don't feel like we need to fire him. On the other jand, he is no McVay or McDermott, so I don't feel I can beat rhe drim to keep him. And I may not have been clear, this is judgement on KS and his coaching staff, not just KS.

When forming my opinion on who coached better, I took into consideration that just because a play worked, that doesn't mean it was a good play. If it doesn't work that doesn't mean it was a bad call. I tended to base my decision more in adjustments. Like the NO game. Allen made the determination that they couldn't pass the ball well and thiught they could just pound the ball with Kamara and Hill. It worked. What did we do to adjust to stop it? I didn't see any adjustments but if we made them they didn't work. The 2nd Baltimore game, I think the ravens did a terrible job. They were averaging something like 8 yards a run to rhe right and 1 yard to the left. What do they do? Run left and pass pass pass.

I would agree that he has a good scheme on offense. I have 2 issues with KS though they play into each other. 1, I think having him call plays and try to game manage is too much for him. I rhink that when we are on defense he needs to be paying attention to the defense and the overall game management but my opinion is that he is thinking abiut the offense only. I don't know this but that is the impression I get. 2, I think he acts toouch like an OC and not enough like the HC. Again just my opinion.

The team has an interesting way in showing how much they respect Kevin.

When you just stated you trust, love, and support him. R>E>S>P>C>T

If the result of respect is a 6-9 record it doesn't appear that respect is nearly enough to get the job done.

I see we've reached the point in the season where the players are coming out and verbally supporting the HC because his standing is on shaky ground or at least there is that perception.

It reminds me of when players came out and supported Chud, Kitchens, etc. I guess, what else are they really supposed to say in that situation.

I was just reading back when Bitonio and Kirksey were discussing the Kitchens firing. https://www.beaconjournal.com/story...-wake-coach-freddie-kitchens/1984850007/

The players and coaches all say the same thing game after game

Season after season.

Almost like the FO writes down a script and says

" Here you go, stick to this and things will be fine, Until we fire you "

Seems pretty much political.

Need a HC that goes off script and tells it like it is

Show some fire and passion for once !

It's stupid to think that any player would come out and say something negative about Stefanski. Every HC, including Stefanski, holds the future of those players in his hands - who would bite the hand that feeds them. MSM asks the question about the future of Stefanski - player answers they have faith in him because he still could be here next year. Only an idiot would put themselves in the Stefanski doghouse not knowing what the FO is going to do with their failing HC.

Bitonio says " We all trust and love Kevin "

He's putting words in the mouths of all his teammates.

Do they all trust and love Kevin ?

I don't want to start over with another coach and I can't think of one whois available, besides maybe Payton. But dammit, he has got to give up calling the plays. He made so many ridiculous calls this year, most recently passing on third an 2 and fourth and 2 in Arctic temperatures. The idiotic Brissett-in-for DeShaun for a bomb. On and on. And every time, the Orange and Brown Report guys (who I like) say, "If it worked, no one would be complaining." That is the dumbest justification for a bad play call that doesn't work.
I would also like to see some sort of personality out of KS. Be funny, be fiery, be .... something. I know he cares, but why doesn't he act like it?

You know regarding Stefanski, I don't pretend like I was a great football player or coach, I don't pretend to know what's going to happen the next two games and in 2023. I do know - like someone posted earlier today I am not convinced after 3 seasons he is the right guy. He's done a lot of good things and he's had more success than anyone else - but he's also done some things I think are red flags, he's done them each year and repeated the same issues which is concerning.

I guess after watching Watson - who I feel is the Brown's only hope to be good next year - I have two growing concerns and a somewhat sinking feeling. Both of which are either exemplified by or summed up in posts by others this last few days. There's this that relates to Stefanski:


There's this as relates to Watson:


It's some rando armature breaking down Watson's throws in the saints games (and stats on the other Watson games he's played/broken down while playing for the Browns). If nothing else it made me realize I have not watched much of Deshaun Watson - what I know of him is that he's considered a top QB by many talking heads. He was supposed to be a squeaky clean, great guy, great locker room presence and leader. I saw someone post stats in some specific meaningful categories and DW was off the charts in 4 or 5 of them, the sort of analytics that some might hate but you know Depo would salivate over. I've seen highlight reel throws to Brandon Cooks, I've seen other stats, but never really watched him play. I do know I have seen him scramble and look like he's holding a loaf of bread which is concerning - I know in the game he played against the Browns he wasn't crash hot. I know as a Brown he's been rusty - What the link in the above quote does show/highlights - is that the rust we've seen is 100% more than just throwing a ball to receivers.

Not sure what my point is other than a sinking *concern* that KS isn't the guy and a horrible 'what if' Watson turns out to be $230M of 'meh' - Kirk Cousins, Carr, Dalton and Murray all rolled into one. . . . I am not saying fire Stefanski. I might by season's end. And I am not saying Watson is a bust - no matter how he plays this season, I'll judge him and the trade 100% on 2023 and onwards .... I am saying it doesn't feel Rosy or good or positive .... Ey Ey Ey.

I think this has more to do w/players responding to reporter's questions than them just volunteering information.

It is. We've just reached that point again where those questions are being asked.

I could have worded it differently.

I hope you don't think I was getting on you about it, Milk. I wasn't. You are an excellent poster. I just wanted to add that reporters often put players in situations they don't want to be in.

No doubt. Then the entire internet of fans psycho-analyze and read waaay more into it than ever intended. It seems like an entire sub-sport of the sport itself.

Stefanski is not surviving two lopsided losses to end the season. He may not survive two close losses depending on the circumstances around them.

The players can say all they want. Actions speak louder than words.

On a team with zero leadership at the player level, it has to come from somewhere. But we get zero leadership at the coaching level as well. It is a team devoid of leadership. It's why the Steelers are still in the hunt after losing their best player the majority of the season and why in the biggest game of the year, we got beat by Dennis Allen and Taysom Hill, a kinda sorta football player.

It's amazing to me that people want to continue down this road.

/rant...can't help myself. I have already written off next year. It's a sucky feeling.

I’m okay with giving KS one more year but he’ll be on the early hot seat in 2023. He’s had a lot of QB issues hamstring him the past two seasons and while I sometimes hate his cutesy play calling, I don’t want to start over.

I’m not even sure we should fire Woods. I would like to see us shore up the interior DL, draft an impact LB, and acquire a WR to complement Cooper and DPJ, a field-flipper with elite speed.

I didn't take it that way at all. No worries.

Question. Who lead the Browns to records of 6-10, 7-9, 7-9, 11-5, and 5-11?

Bill Belichick

Gee after three years as head coach many people thought he sucked.

I didn't. It was obvious what he was building and he was getting better as he went along. He was also the CEO of the team, not a coordinator pretending to be head coach.

Night and day differences.

I don't know the answer to this one way or another - would Belichick have been the same HC that's talked about being in the discussion for one of the all time greats, developed into the same HC he was today if he'd remained in CLE? Without Brady would he have been the same? Because of my dislike of Brady, and because backups came in and performed at a high level I always gave the most credit to BB during Brady's time in NE. Since Brady left, I've had to adjust that thinking and give props to Brady who stands alone as GOAT. . . . regards KS, I hope he and DW form a partnership to rival the NE pair and despite some angst on the board I think every fan hopes for that even if they have concerns.

Wait a second...you are just recently recognizing Brady as a great QB, but believed for the longest time, and still do, that Baker is a good QB?

Is this a joke or am I reading that correctly?

You aren't reading that correctly.

I understand. Not really. But we'll go with your version.

Be happy Milk. You've been graded excellent by the person who gives out the grades on the board.

LOL........we have a guy so freaking miserable that he actually makes fun of people who say something nice to others. smh

Yeah, that's it. You got me! lmao

They can love Stefanski all they want but there's a problem. He's not producing wins.

Do they love him because he lets them get away with things? Is loosy goosey and easy going? They think, I'd rather have this guy then someone that's strict, accountable for real, and keeps discipline.

I’m not sure that it’d be fair to Woods if he’s fired. His D is playing much better of late now that the DL isn’t being face-planted consistently.

Whoever the new DC is, he will to be able to make adjustments
At half time like Lou Anarumo of the Bengals or be able to
Shutdown the other teams best weapons aka Dan Quinn
Of the Cowboys

Maybe I haven't paid enough attention - but don't some of the DC's that failed as head coaches and are hired back as DC's make some of the best DC's or simply do well? I honestly don't care what scheme we play - as long as (like luvmystripper says) the guy can make adjustments based on the talent on the roster and what the other team is doing come game time.