DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Mass shooting Lewiston Maine

At least 16 dead, 50 to 60 injured.
Multiple locations including bowling alley, Walmart distribution center, rec center.

Pic on twitter of subject with long AR type gun with large magazine

They still haven’t caught the guy yet.

It’s a very nice rifle he has in that security cam footage…

Police are en route to a boat dock in Lisbon, Maine. Vehicle matching description is there-setting up a perimeter. No word if a subject is at the vehicle

There was a kids event at the bowling alley tonight.

Scanner just put out a bulletin for a second shooter vehicle- a black pickup truck

I was just in Portland a few weeks ago.

They should have taken him more seriously when he threatened to shoot up the guard base. He also had multiple mental issues.

These govt agencies need to have their weapons taken from them until they are mentally cleared. Especially, when they threaten to shoot people.

Do I understand you correctly, you want those in the government to have their weapons taken away?

Anyway, I'm sure those in the republican NRA party will send their thoughts and prayers.

Correct. People with mental health issues or who threaten to shoot up a place should not be allowed to own a gun... until they are deemed safe.

Ban all GOPer guns!

So how do you determine someone will have a mental breakdown before they have a mental breakdown? I mean in this case it should have been prevented. And we hear how that should fix everything if we only improve our mental healthcare system. But while that's easy to say, it isn't so easy to do. What criteria do you use to determine that? Do you wait until someone is so mentally ill that they have to be involuntarily locked up before you take their guns? What if they are actually that sick and nobody in their family had them committed? That's a very gray area that a lot of gun owners, including myself have concerns about. What if someone is depressed and taking medication for it? Is that enough reason to take their guns? If they have severe anxiety, is that enough reason to take their guns?

Then you have the problem of actually getting lawmakers fund a rebuilding of the mental healthcare system and have it available to all. We know how difficult that's going to be to accomplish. So while on the surface I agree with what you're saying in theory, the details are far more complicated when one thinks about how we manage to get to the end results.

Not really on topic, but there is a case coming to the Supreme Court about those found guilty of Domestic Violence not being able to own a gun. I guess there is a law from a state that is under dispute.

It is just sad.

People are dead, dying and injured and all you people can do is make this tragedy into a political issue?

Heartless!

It's only about politics when trying to find a solution. Yesterday the new speaker of the house said this isn't the time to address this issue. OK,, when is?

I believe in the second amendment. But no way do I think a person with a mental problem or a criminal record should be allowed to own a gun. ANY GUN. I do believe in enhanced background checks in an attempt to identify those with Criminal records or mental issues.

The only way to address those issues is through politics. What would you have us do.... Ignore it?

Ahh, mental health, not domestic terrorism.

Dude is definitely suicidal and his body will be found eventually. And either way, allowing kooks like this easy access to firearms is also suicidal.

We hear that same empty rhetoric every time somebody tries to find a solution. Trying to find a way to stop, or at least minimize such mass shootings seems like something we should all want to accomplish. Or should people stay silent about that as this continues to happen over and over and over again? To me, even suggesting that is what's heartless.

Perfect.

Saved the state $100,000+ and saved a bunch of extra needless grief for the families.

Burn in hell, scumbag.

He got want he wanted. Mass murder, fear, and dodged any real world accountability for his actions.

I just don't believe the government would tell society the truth.

So if they are saying what happened is "this", then I say prove it. Prove it prove it prove it. Otherwise it's what? Just telling people what they want to hear? or is it just projecting the reality they can force, the one they can force to be if they are powerful enough to force, inasmuch as they remain powerful enough to force you to believe what they say is real, beyond evidence.

I think when it comes to what the evidence shows, that if in times past there have been mostly lies, about a ton of different subjects then, whatever the authorities tell society happened, then hey, hold it up in front of the camera and put it right in our face, because
well because it would be easy to and because they haven't been truthful to what the evidence appears in times past.

Of course we can't believe the JFK asas ination footage, and that was filmed. They got bin laden or Hussen but they dumped his body at sea. At sea? C'mon,

Like I said above, allowing kooks easy access to firearms is a suicidal tendency. We’re playing Russian roulette with armed lunatics.

You have spoken before about your guns. (and, dem's ought to arm themselves).

How does anyone know that tomorrow, or next month, you'll go off the deep end?

The problem of someone going off is not about to change.

The problem of allowing them to use a weapon that can fire a round a second for a 30 to 100 rounds can change.

Time and magazine size can limit the damage.

Thoughts and prayers will take of it.

I'm pretty much convinced that the NRA does NOT want to find a solution. The more this happens, the more the word comes down that it will only get worse. The worse it gets the more guns are sold. And the NRA, funded by the gun makers want it that way.

Coming from someone who already has that's hilarious.

How have I gone off?

The question I asked is a legit one. Take your name out of it if it makes you feel better. Use "Joe Smith" as the example if you want.

Nobody knows when someone may go off the deep end. But people certainly do. As I have posted before, there are ways to stop some or most of them before it happens. But the system in place often times doesn't allow for that. The public at large doesn't always know about an individual that has gone off the deep end, but in many of those situations their family and close friends do. So a red flag law to allow them to petition the court to take their firearms until such time as they have gotten treatment and rectified the problem would be a good place to start. But currently many states refuse to pass one.

On the surface I like the idea of red flag laws. But as a gun owner I can see how such a law could be abused and may be in some states. So it's with much caution that I suggest such a thing. As of now someone who is accused of not being able to have a gun under red flag laws has the right to defend themself in court and it seems like a positive step in the right direction. We have to start somewhere. The status quo can not be accepted.

You can stop things like the gun show loophole or simply buying firearms from individuals which require no background checks involved. In both of these circumstances it prevents convicted felons and those with documented mental illnesses from purchasing guns so easily.

Now I have heard the argument before that this won't "solve the problem". And no, none of these things will stop the problem. But they will help. They will slow down the problem. I've always considered less corpses a good thing.

I suggest if you want to have a discussion you not start out by making it personal. As you can see, when you take that part out of the equation I'm more than happy to discuss a topic.

If there is one certainty, it is that the status quo is not acceptable.

Fair enough. I apologize for using "you" as the example. In doing so, you took it as "YOU", and not Jon Doe.

Now please explain how I could take that as you referring to someone other than me arch? Are you seriously going to try and play that game?

I don't play games. I don't move goalposts. I apologized for saying "you". And? You're pitting again. So much for conversation and discussion with you.

Once again explain how you were referring to anyone but me when you posted this.......


For someone who claims they don't move the goal posts, you just did.

Don't worry, I don't actually expect you to address what you were doing. I expect you to keep blaming me for it by claiming I took it out of context. You know, by moving the goal post ,like this....


Much like you're arching again. You say something obviously referring to me and then claim somehow that I'm the one who assumed you were talking about me. Of course I took it as you were talking about me. Because you were talking about me.

But I do certainly understand why you would now wish to stop talking about that.

Tots and pears

Nothing to see here. Move along.

Jc

Damn our society sure did move on from this shooting real quick.

We’ve officially become desensitized to tragedy in this country, and have been successfully groomed into accepting this reality.

More tots and pears for Tampa.
3 dead 18 injured last night in a shooting

Actually, NPR had a story that between Friday night and this morning in the US, there were 12 mass shootings that left 11 dead and 76 injured

Can you link to it? My guess, and I may be wrong, is: gang/drug shootings. That wouldn't change the fact that 11 died, and 76 were injured.

Thanks for the link. Kind of what I thought.

Aren’t those all red states? Interesting.

All major cities in America are Blue except 1.

This is a list of mayors of the 50 largest cities in the United States, ordered by their populations as of July 1, 2022, as estimated by the United States Census Bureau.[1][2] These 50 cities have a combined population of 49.6 million, or 15% of the national population.

Honolulu, Indianapolis, Jacksonville, Louisville, and Nashville have consolidated city-county governments where the mayor is elected by residents of the entire county, not just that of the main city; in these cases the population and respective rank are for the county.

In some states, mayors are officially elected on a nonpartisan basis; however, their party affiliation or preference is generally known, and where it is known it is shown in the list below.

The breakdown of mayoral political parties is 36 Democrats, 10 Republicans, and 4 Independents (two elected with state Democratic support).


Cities with Republican mayors.......

Eric Johnso, n, Dallas

Mattie Parker, Ft. Worth

David Hunt, Oklahoma City

Jerry Dyer, Fresno

John Giles, Mesa

Jean Stothert, Omaha

Bobby Dyer, Va. Beach

Francis Suarez, Miami, Fl.

G. T. Bynum, Tulsa

Karen Goh, Bakersfield

Cities with Independent mayors......

Ron Nirenberg, San Antonio

Rick Blangiardi, Honolulu

Carolyn Goodman, Las Vegas

Yemi Mobolade, Colorado Springs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mayors_of_the_50_largest_cities_in_the_United_States

We're starting to react to mass shootings the way Russians react to war casualties.

Why is it that the song Sound of Silence is running through my head right now?

"All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent."

The Army said the Maine gunman ‘should not have a weapon’ months before the shooting rampage that left 18 dead
Shimon Prokupecz
By Nouran Salahieh, Shimon Prokupecz and Haley Britzky, CNN
7 minute read
Published 9:42 AM EDT, Tue October 31, 2023


CNN
—
New details are emerging about the US Army reservist who authorities say killed 18 people and wounded 13 others in Lewiston, Maine, last week – including previous warnings about him from the Army and his family, and two attempts by law enforcement to check on him weeks before the rampage.

The Army in July said that Robert Card, 40, “should not have a weapon, handle ammunition, and not participate in live fire activity,” after he was seen “behaving erratically” and sent for an evaluation at an Army hospital, Army spokesperson Lt. Col. Ruth Castro said.

About two months later, a deputy was sent to check on Card twice in mid-September after a soldier became concerned the reservist would “snap and commit a mass shooting,” according to a document from the Sagadahoc County Sheriff’s Department. An alert was then sent to law enforcement warning that Card was “armed and dangerous.”


That was less than six weeks before the terror unfolded in Lewiston on Wednesday evening, when Card first opened fire at the Just-in-Time Recreation bowling alley and then at Schemengees Bar & Grille about 4 miles away, authorities said.

The violence – which marked the deadliest mass shooting in the United States this year – was followed by an extensive 48-hour manhunt that ended with Card being found dead inside a recycling facility box trailer with a self-inflicted gunshot wound, authorities said.

While questions remain over what motivated the attack and why those locations were targeted, previous warnings about Card that are coming to light are raising questions over authorities’ handling of the warning signs and his access to the firearms.

“An important part of our response in the coming weeks will be to understand exactly what happened and to ask ourselves what changes are needed to protect the safety of Maine people,” Maine Gov. Janet Mills said Monday.

The mass shooting upended life in Lewiston and surrounding communities, injecting fear into the area and ripping families apart.

The 18 people killed ranged in age from 14 to 76. They included a boy who was bowling with his father, contestants in a cornhole tournament for the deaf, and several fathers who leave behind young children.


Family contacts officials about gunman
The Sagadahoc County Sheriff’s Office was contacted on May 3 by Card’s family, who said they were concerned for his well-being and shared that he had access to firearms, documents show.

Card’s 18-year-old son told a deputy that starting around January, his father was “starting to claim that people were saying things about him, while out in public,” according to documents shared by the sheriff’s office.

His ex-wife also told the deputy that Card had “picked up 10-15 handguns/rifles” that were at his brother’s house, the document says.

The ex-wife and son said their plan was to stay away from Card, according to the documents.

After speaking with the family, the deputy spoke with representatives of the 3rd Battalion 304 Training Group and connected them with Card’s family, “who assured our office that they would ensure that Card received medical attention,” the sheriff’s department said in a statement.

Deputies sent to gunman’s home weeks before shootings
In September, an Army Reserve unit in Saco reached out to the sheriff’s office in an email to ask for a wellness check on Card.

The email says that on July 15, Card was getting beer in West Point with some soldiers when he accused the three of them of calling him a pedophile and ended up shoving a soldier and saying, “he would take care of it,” according to a letter shared by the sheriff’s office.

Card was taken to a psychiatric hospital, where he spent two weeks before being released, the letter says.

Then there was another incident.

Card and a soldier were driving home from a casino when he again started talking about people calling him a pedophile, a statement to Sagadahoc County Sheriff’s Office said.

“When [his friend] told him to knock it off because he was going to get into trouble talking about shooting up places and people, [he] punched him,” the statement said. “According to [the friend], [he] said he has guns and is going to shoot up the drill center at Saco and other places … [the friend] is concerned that [he] is going to snap and commit a mass shooting.”

BOWDOIN, MAINE - OCTOBER 26: Law enforcement officials gather in the road leading to the home of the suspect being sought in connection with two mass shootings on October 26, 2023 in Bowdoin, Maine. Police are searching for U.S. Army Reservist Robert Card, 40, who is wanted in the shooting deaths of 18 people at a bowling alley and a bar last night in nearby Lewiston. At least 13 others were wounded in the rampage. (Photo by Joe Raedle/Getty Images)
Cops were sent to Maine gunman’s home weeks before massacres amid concern he ‘is going to snap and commit a mass shooting’
The threat to the military facility in Saco led to some extra patrols, Saco Police Chief Jack Clements told WMTW Maine, but the reservist never showed up.

The US Army told CNN the health and wellness check was requested by the shooter’s unit “out of an abundance of caution after the unit became concerned for his safety.”

“The Army takes all allegations seriously. Due to an ongoing Army investigation, we cannot go into any further details,” the email statement from Castro, the Army spokesperson, said.

A deputy went to Card’s home on September 15, and then again September 16, but didn’t see him, the sheriff’s department said.

The Sagadahoc County Sheriff’s Office sent a File 6 alert – an attempt to locate teletype – to other law enforcement agencies about Card, warning that he’s known to be armed and dangerous. The sheriff’s office said File 6 alerts are “common and are issued by law enforcement when they are trying to locate a person.”

“Robert has been suffering from psychotic episodes & hearing voices,” the alert to law enforcement says. “He is a firearms instructor and made threats to shoot up the National Guard armory in Saco. He was committed over the summer for two weeks due to his altered mental health state, but then released… if located, use extreme caution.”

The File 6 alert was canceled on October 18 – a week before the mass shootings.

Law enforcement officials have said Card, a certified firearms instructor, had extensive training, including land navigation and firearms.

The Sagadahoc County deputy later spoke with Card’s unit commander, “who said that Mr. Card no longer had any weapons from the reserve unit,” the sheriff’s office said.


His commander said they were trying to get treatment for Card and that “he thought it best to let Card have time to himself,” the sheriff’s office added.

The next day, on September 17, the deputy spoke to Card’s brother, who said “that he would work to secure any firearms that Mr. Card had access to,” according to the sheriff’s office.

“We believe that our agency acted appropriately and followed procedures for conducting an attempt to locate and wellness check.” Sagadahoc County Sheriff Joel Merry​ said in a statement Monday.

“My office will evaluate our policies and procedures for how we conduct wellness checks with the goal of making any improvements that are in the interest of public safety while balancing the rights of individuals,” Merry added.


Authorities detail firearms found with Card
Investigators said they believe the firearm Card used in the shooting rampage was legally bought in mid-July — just days before he was hospitalized and ordered to undergo a psychiatric evaluation, according to multiple law enforcement sources.

The weapon that was found inside Card’s 2013 white Subaru Outback appears to be the same one fired by the gunman at the bowling alley and a local bar, though a ballistics match has not been confirmed, sources said.

When authorities found Card dead Friday night, they found a Smith & Wesson M&P .40 caliber handgun and a Smith & Wesson M&P 15 rifle with him, according to a news release from the Maine Department of Public Safety.

“Forensic and ballistic testing still needs to be conducted” on the weapons, according to the release.


Although “there’s a mental health component to this,” that would not necessarily mean Card was not eligible to buy a gun, Maine Public Safety Commissioner Michael Sauschuck has said.

Maine gun laws do not prohibit a person from buying a gun based strictly on a mental health diagnosis or treatment, according to Sauschuck.

“Based on what I’ve heard through conversations this morning, I’m told that we don’t have access to any ‘forcibly committed for treatment’ information in reference to Mr. Card,” Sauschuck said Saturday.

Without being required by a court to receive mental health treatment, Card’s name likely would not be flagged during a firearms purchase. “If that didn’t happen,” Sauschuck said, “then … the background check is not going to ping that this person is prohibited.”

CNN’s Mark Morales, Linh Tran, Sara Smart and Andy Rose contributed to this report.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/31/us/maine-mass-shootings-warning-signs-tuesday/index.html

It's so sad how all of the warning signs were there and yet nothing was done to stop him.

It sounds like, despite having some laws/processes in place to prevent someone like Card access to firearms, that authorities' hands were still tied in terms of following through to prevent this from happening.

He also tried to buy a silencer for a rifle but was refused because he had been in a facility for mental health reasons.


https://abcnews.go.com/US/alleged-m...hs-lewiston-shootings/story?id=104453990

And that's the saddest part of all. Just as sad is that we have a very powerful lobbying group like the NRA fighting tooth and nail to keep it that way.

Let us all sing praises to our 2nd Amendment rights and to individual freedom. Those rights cost thousands of lives each year- year after year after year. Assault weapons should be illegal for anyone other than law enforcement and military. Our founders NEVER knew machine gun handhelds and rifles would exist. I cry for those whose hobby is firing assault weapons for fun---NOT. Get good with flintlocks. Let us not forget 50%- or very close to it- firearm deaths are suicides- scary we have that many potential mass killers in our wonderful American gun society.

We aren't doing enough to stop this.. Not nearly enough.

6 kids shot in a park in Cincy last night. 11 yr old dead

Bang, bang.
Splish, splash.
Thoughts/prayers.
Rinse/repeat.

America is who She wants to be, because America was always and forever, free to make Herself whatever She wanted to become. Her potential was boundless.
This is what She chose to be- in 2023.


God help those of us who've chosen differently, all along.

Beaver creek Ohio Walmart about an hour ago-4 shot and transported-shooter killed by police
Scanner traffic said primary scene secured, checking secondary for any other victims but so far haven’t found any

https://www.whio.com/news/local/lar...unty-walmart/ZPDB46MBKZGH5PO7Q2EFUEKOXI/

That's close to home.

Too Close.

Let me repeat, we are NOT doing enough to stop this.. Not nearly enough.

What do you mean? So many thoughts and prayers are being sent. That’ll totally cover it.
Next.

Damon,
I just saw a video of a woman who was shopping for Thanksgiving at this store. She said he walked right in the store with an assault rifle and began shooting

Lol. Yeah well, cities and their population don’t write the state or federal laws. You are aware it’s up to the state and federal legislators and law makers to do something about gun violence in their cities right?

I think a large part of the problem lies in the fact that they don't enforce them either. Not that direct evidence should ever be used as a barometer if there's an agenda to be sold.

You mean like how it's legal in many places to walk around carrying a loaded AR? Those laws?

No kidding. I’d like to know of all the gun laws these red state cities need to enforce.

Holy hell, that's right by my job. I go there all the time.

I (accurately) named another part of the problem, now you want to talk about ARs. Same old, same old.

So now you cry foul because someone shows you just how lax some of these laws are in the first place? That it would be very hard to stop some of these shootings because laws are in place that allow them to carry these weapons open in public and there's really nothing law enforcement can do to stop them? That it's perfectly legal to do this right up until the second you pull the trigger? I mean speaking of triggered.

Not to mention they think the 2nd is a god given right for anyone, children and lunatics alike.

Beavercreek Walmart! Hell, my wife just picked up an order there on Saturday. First and only time either of us has been there. Probably not going back.

Had no idea you were in the area.

I used to work in the Beavercreek area and stopped in there several times over the years.

Small world. I work right there and used to run there to grab a thing or two quite frequently.

Just moved over by Yellow Springs, about 2 miles out. We moved from Lancaster this past summer.

Oh nice. I head up that way to hike John Bryan every now and then. Also go to Young’s Dairy.

UNLV Campus-active shooter;
Fire dispatch just had somebody call in that they are in the 3rd floor stairwell with an unknown number of "419's"-I looked it up and 419 are dead bodies.

UNLV
@unlv
·
Follow
UPDSouth - UNLV
UPD Alert - UNLV
University Police responding to confirmed active shooter in BEH. This is not a test. RUN-HIDE-FIGHT.

It just keeps happening.. Sooner or later, a son or daughter or sister or brother of someone in the Republican party leadership will get killed in one of these, then we'll see if they find the courage to stand up to the Gun Lobby,.