DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2024 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 18 Jaguars 13 Postgame Thoughts

that was an ugly heart attack ... but a great win

Watson was markedly better, though not always "good"

Foreman gives us a bit more in the backfield, but man did he have a terrible penalty

Speaking of, the penalties are just so bad right now. That's the NUMBER ONE issue for our team

Defense faltered late in the 3rd, but just stepped up enough

I thought Bojorquez punt was the play of the game

j/c Bojorquez for game MPV!

One team being allowed to hold and the other team not makes games way closer than they should be, just like Vegas and the league want it.

Our punter singlehandedly changed the destiny of the game.

Watson started great then went down hill. I don't know why he won't throw downfield. Are our WRs not open or does he not see them?

Poorly coached team lucky to get away with a win.

Onto week 3.

Trevor Lawrence does not deserve the money he got. Coaching is a MAJOR issue. No discipline. Bad penalties. But a win is a win.

Jeudy had a great game. Watson's favorite target.

How funny is it that a single punt can snatch momentum away from a team that had built it over several drives?

That was a monster punt.

I don't think Cooper has ever played a worse game

Last week, the oline probably had 12 penalties.. This week, they almost blew the game... That is the story that no one is talking about

the string of penalties starting with Foreman's face mask, then two OL holds really set a franchise record .. we had the ball at the 15 and moved back to midfield lol

When you don’t do much during training camp other than mental reps, 7on7, and a boondoggle to WV, you have to spend the regular season getting ready to play. After getting kicked in the teeth last week, it looks like they fixed a few things this week. Hopefully the focus of this week is the rules of football.

We are missing two starting tackles, but our interior linemen are taking a boatload of penalties, which suggests they are having trouble beating - or even stonewalling - the guys in front of them.

Clean that up, it’s embarrassing.

That penalty on Foreman was huge, we could have put it away right there. And then we kept backing up.
Watson wasn’t great but made some really nice throws at crucial times.
Defence played well for the most part, Delpit seemed to be everywhere.

we got the W, and the beer tastes better tonight.

Anyone who doesn't think Callahan is missed is fooling themselves. Kevin, or whomever is calling the plays, have to stop getting so cute and have a killer instinct. The rollout on 3rd down while in field goal range to ice the game with one of the worst Left Tackles in the league is a fireable offense. The Oline was gone from one of the best to one of the worst. At this rate, we will set the NFL record in penalties. I beleive we completed 4 out of 25 3rd downs in 2 games. The Offense has no identity. The Defense is decent but not nearly enough pressure or QBs. They have a long ways to go before claiming the best defense in the league crown again.

Watson's mechanics were great the first half then reverted to his Game 1 mechanics the 2nd half. He has no rhythm or chemistry with hus WRs. Flacco coming off the couch was hitting receivers in stride consistently and threw more catchable balls.

1-1 is better than 0-2 but man, do we have A LOT of work to do.

Reminded me of the 0-16 Browns Offense.

- Escaped with a win. Any win is a good win.

- Good game plan today from Stefanski. Established the run early and had Watson in shotgun more.

- A marked improvement from Watson today, but no where near he needs to be for this team to make a deep playoff run. His confidence looked much improved.

- Cooper has not been in these games mentally. His best play was drawing the pass interference.

- Hope Ward's shpulder doesn't become an issue. He kept going in and out of the game all day.

- D'Onta Foreman only average 3.0 yards per carry but ran hard. He's a nice Kareem replacement.

- I did not expect a David Bell to be involved early and often before getting injured.

- Nice game out of both Jeudy and Moore.

- Definsive line played well as a unit. Delpit made plays at the LOS. JOK had a nice game.

- Diamond Leg Hopkins is automatic.

Game balls: Bojorquez and Delpit.

Jeers: The offensive penalties. It's a mess that needs cleaned up. Can't afford these mistakes once the Browns start playing quality opponents.

Double jeers: Nicknaming EverBank Stadium, TreverBank Stadium.

On to welcome the lowly G-Men to town.

Go Browns!

Bell shouldn’t be getting any reps.

Don’t understand it.

just thinking of the game in general .. I don't think I can remember a game where BOTH teams had so many blunders, mistakes, blown chances, etc. it was a rollercoaster of dumb things lol

did you watch same game as rest of us?

Stefanski is in charge of the unit that couldn’t stop committing penalties. The offense has no identity and he has no killer instinct. 2-3 times we had a chance to put away and we went into 3 runs and punt. We should have never let Callahan leave or at minimum made them give us a draft pick. This oline plays like it’s the first time they met. I saw zero AB’s in run game. I saw bitonio get manhandled over and over. I saw Jones turn back into the fat slob of college. Can’t believe they didn’t notice this in camp.

We have an issue of catching the ball on both sides. I’ve never seen anything like it. Cooper very much doesn’t want to be here and it shows. I’d say effective immediate , Jeudy is WR1. He atleast catches the ball and knows how to run a scramble drill.

We won by sheer attrition and the defense and punter made the back to back plays that saved the game. But it was still too close. Team has a lot of work to do and it’s very clear they should have been playing preseason

What would it take for you to care less? He didn’t deserve COY last year, he got lucky and caught lightning in a bottle with Flacco and Schwartz defense kept us in every game. Dan Campbell should have won. Nothing special about stefanski. It was not good coaching that won the game..lmao we have a full field+ worth of penalty yards because of Stefanskis unit . In fact we almost lost because stefanski could manufacture a single yard in two straight drives to close it out. You blame tackle and run game. Who is in charge of that? Just curious, same with the drops. It’s his side of the ball

A Win is a Win, especially on the road. Again we still have the KS Hot and Ice Cold play calling. Team is still undisciplined, way to many penalties. I feel like Jacksonville did more to lose the game than we did to win. Great job by our special teams today, Hopkins and Boroquez are outstanding players. For a first time in many years I feel safe that J Proche is our returner who really KNOWS HIS JOB. Our defense seems pretty sound and did a much better job against the run, pass rush is solid and is consistently strong. The Oline is currently a crap heap that doesn't seem to be able to execute much of anything. Don't know what the scheme difference is between Callahan and Dickerson but we dont look very good up front. Overall a good W but if we dont get things cleaned up we could see a whole lot more Dallas type games IMO.

one thing too: we really need to ditch the reverse play near midfield after we have some momentum. You can set you watch by it ... and it is about 10% efficient

Unfortunately, the analytics dept will say deviations in the expected probability dictates that it will be more successful in the short term.

How does Hopkins not know the kickoff rules? Love the guy, but we could have really put the game away without that penalty.

He probably knows it. Or perhaps not. Everyone else is getting mental-mistake penalties, so why not the kicker?

It’s the Browns, man. It is never easy.

They were too busy getting to know each other in WV to review the rules.

yeah, that penalty on the kickoff was a really, really big mistake by us

That Hopkins penalty was something that you’d never see from a Belichik or Kyle Shanahan coached team. Huge play negated by an under coached player. However, Hopkins and the rest of the special teams still get an A in my book. He’s such a great kicker.

Do we have tight ends?

I have no way of knowing of my opinions are true because it involves what is going on in a certain players mind. I have read many times on Facebook Browns pages and on here that Watson doesn't care because he now has his guaranteed contract money and makes his injuries worse than they really are so he can sit.

I find this hard to believe but after watching today, Amari looks like he is just doesn't want to be here, and it isn't because of his big drop. Those things happen. Today his body language just looked like he didn't care. Obviously watching on TV you don't have a lot of access to him, but even 2 shots on the bench he just looked disengaged,

To me, he is an amazing receiver, and I hope I am wrong, and his play improves.

Just my 2 cents.

Could be true. With Flacco he knew he had a QB who could rifle the pigskin down the field. Watson hasn’t been doing that.
Who knows though? Maybe Coop is just off to a bad start. He did drop one today. I was like , “catch the ball!”, as we all were.

He dropped more than one

I think we messed up Cooper’s head trying to trade him. Maybe he’ll come around. We need him.

j/c
A vast improvement in most areas of the game (exception of the penalties).

DW came out "hot" - although on more than a one throw in the initial drive a little lucky ... you need luck but the bigger issue was poor decision making. A bit more hitting WR in stride on a designed play - but lots and lots of bolting from the pocket and making things up on the fly. The OL doesn't help at all - but that is not the only issue.

Gameplan in the first half was better than the second half. Whether that's a Jags adjustment or Browns lack of adjustment - idk.

With the way the game was going it felt like we were saved by a punt that went out at the 2. We've had lots of bad luck to lose games - I don't mind taking some good fortune to seal a game. But essentially the bad 2nd hald performance took away most of the feel good factor from the first half.

Next week we'll see if we are taking steps forward or not - NYG are a team we really should beat "comfortably" at home, although at the moment that's not how it's going to feel come Sunday.

we almost always have a better approach in Q1 than Q3. KS is typically a good script guy. His teams are generally well prepared to start the game and then we kinda try to "hold on"

https://x.com/DanielOyefusi/status/1835643898430984247

Ward just 11 snaps

Way more jumbo packages (which I like)

Way more Foreman (which I also like)

If I posted my thoughts directly after the game, I'd would have led with the Browns didn't deserve to win that game. But honestly, neither team did. I think Trevor Lawrence might be the most overrated young QB in the league and, overall, I don't think JAX is all that good even with all of those WRs they have and Etienne.....just kinda "mid" as the kids say these days. For the Browns, the talent is there, but we hurt ourselves and can stall an offensive drive after the first play with a penalty.

- I think Watson played much better, but still needs to be more consistent. He still looks a bit tentative at times. I liked his performance in the first half but the offense couldn't get anything really going in the second half. Penalties played a big part, obviously.

- I like that we found our Jacoby Brissett 4 and 1/inches replacement QB in Jameis Winston. He clearly can push the line to get that yard, but can also switch it up and make a play the defense might not see coming.....like we did yesterday. I'd expect Stefanski to throw those winkles in all season long.

- The interior of the line is beginning to concern me. They are old at the guard position and got called for way too many penalties. They started off strong keeping a clean pocket but it felt like they deteriorated as the game wore on. Not a good sign.

- Listening to the post-game analysis, someone said that it looked like "Stefanski took his offense back.".....meaning he took it back from Dorsey in the way the offense was schemed. Not sure if this was true but maybe others might be able to chime in on what they say week 1 vs week 2.

- These WR drops are also alarming. Way too many the past two weeks and stalled drives and/or the ability to get at least three points. Something is up with Cooper.....not sure what. I hope he can bounce back.

- And the penalties have been devastating on the offensive end. No need to say anymore than that and it needs correcting.

- Good to see the defense bounce back.

good point about 4th and short ... that's probably why we won the game. We were 3/3 in those situations and it really gave us an advantage

The Jags are one of those team that has talent but can't seem to put it together. I don't think they're bad, but they also aren't a threat to the AFC

I think it's more no official would throw that flag on a Belichick coached team. It had no impact on the play. What's even the purpose of the rule? It's a random flag they can throw late if it looks like one team might start to pull away.

Winston Reid has had some lousy officiating luck. Ejected in the preseason on a questionable targeting call, now gets his forced fumble taken away by that.

I just realized that Pierre Strong left the game and will be out a while. We'll need to find another backup RB for the time being

The Browns need these next three games against the Giants, Raiders, and Commanders (2 of 3 are away games) because the three after that will be much tougher with the Eagles, Bengals, and Ravens (2 of 3 are at home).

Yeah, the games at LV and WAS scare me because they are games against teams that we are better than ... but on the road and not easy. But they're games we have to win

lol, you really are a KS fanboy.. he didn't deserve to win.. and yes..injuries are his fault as well, the ones we are having are a result of his sissy training camp.. as are all the penalties.. you are boasting because we converted a few 4 and inches? How many times has that bit us in the ass under him and cost us points...at least 10-15 during his tenure. Yeah he used 4 QB's big deal..and you remember how bad 2 of them looked? if it wasn't for the defense its a whole different outcome, and Flacco coming in, forcing Stefanski to dial back his playbook and let flacco run a basic offense is what led to that run. But make no mistake, Flacco was the dude making it happen. Your pathetic retort of being curious about the drops.. answer me this, Who's in charge of the offense in Training camp? KS has made it abundantly clear its his offense, his playcalling, his scheme. So yeah sorry, your silly boomer argument didn't sway my opinion at all. KS to me is the same guy as year 1 KS, he's shown no growth. He's good at scripting the first 10-15 plays but loses the thread during the game, the team still has no identity, his clock management is still abysmal, players do not get better under him, we still have TONS of mental errors that are a result of a team not being prepared. Is he the worst in the league? No, I'd say hes' in the middle of the road, maybe a little better than average, but he's still not taken us anywhere. We need him to be better so we can go further.

in terms of KS scripting plays .. I'd like to see the halftime process. Do we script plays again for the 2nd half? Or are they already scripted?

It just seems like our 3Q efficiency isn't as strong

I think the "Stefanski took his offense back" is BS, he's the playcaller and its still his offense. The only thing that was different this week was Watson came out and made plays. I mentioned on game thread that Bitonio was getting destroyed the whole game, I was looking and trying to see if it was because he was trying to help Hudson, nope, he was just getting 1v1 mauled and driven back. Same thing with center, Teller had a decent game but he had a few lapses where he missed his assignment. The tackles were atrocious, Ifedi actually played better than Jones. Jones is so out of shape. But ultimately Dickerson has been a bust. I knew it was going to be an adjustment period and we would have some drop off from Callahan, but its been quite drastic. Callahan was the best there was, Dickerson is a warm body at this point. I'm hoping when Chubb comes back, he's healthy and able to regain his form. Right now teams don't respect the run or pass, with Chubb they couldn't be nowhere near as aggressive as they've been because Chubb will hit that cutback and its off to the races. Chubbs vision hides alot of issues with the Oline

Football is the ultimate lesson in recency bias and being a prisoner of the moment.

RE: Watson - he played average which was a huge step up from where he was. Hopefully a sign of things to come, but i wouldn't bet on it. I don't think I've read anything on here that was too over the top on Watson, but a lot of unfounded optimism imo. He played well from the pocket, didn't make too many plus level throws (I only remember one), and he has lost most of his athleticism. At this point, I'd be careful about putting too much stock in yesterday's performance. I was happy how he played from the pocket though. Actually moved his eyes and scanned the field on multiple occasions.

RE: Cooper - lots of over the top takes on Cooper. If anyone has earned the benefit of the doubt, it's Cooper. Could just be going through a bad stretch that he hopefully comes out of. But in the list of things to worry about with the Browns, it's not even in the top 10. If it continues, then sure. But consistent producers, consistent top level play over a long stretch of time, are entitled to a bad stretch without jumping to conclusions.

This team is weird though -

--Their best QB is a third stringer. We can debate this six ways to Sunday, but there is nothing Watson did in the game yesterday that Winston or DTR couldn't do. I said this before, but the difference between a Bo Nix and a DTR is just where they were drafted and the benefit of the doubt and the number of chances they will get. If DTR played the way Nix did yesterday, he'd see the bench and people would run him out of town (and make declarations like "he's never going to be good"). Nix is going to get chance after chance after chance and hopefully for the Broncos sake improve and become the player they hope he can be. But you cannot look at Nix and tell me anything he does better than DTR. DTR has a stronger arm and is more athletic by a country mile. This is frustrating for me to watch what is going on here with this young kid.
--David Bell is getting a lot of reps, and he's not an NFL wide receiver (and is going on IR over a routine tackle).
--Our younger, better WRs we don't seem to try and get involved much.
--We don't seem to know any rules.
--Our two best players, Ward and Garrett, can't stay on the field and get winded after the first series, respectively.
--By the way, Garrett looks like he's lost a step or he just isn't ready to play. If he can't time the snap, get off the ball quickly, and shoulder dip, he can't seem to get to the QB. Doesn't use his hands, his bull rushes are surprisingly weak for a man his size, and he continues to get dumb offsides penalties.
--In general, we don't seem to be developing any talent on this team. All of the team's best players are FAs or trades. I am a big Berry fan, but I'm starting to have some second thoughts. There is no good young talent on the team that is seeing any significant playing time other than Emerson. Every other Berry pick has been underwhelming, can't see the field, or outright busts.

Bring on NYG!

It's funny.

You see DTR as the best QB on the roster. I see Senaca Wallace. Maybe he ends up somewhere in the middle.

And that's ok Peen. We can have a difference of opinion. I respect your opinion on this. I am way, way in the minority on this particular topic. And in the end, I could be wrong. But I am trusting my instincts on this one.

I also think your opinion would be different had he been a higher round pick. And that's part of my point.

Early Week 3 line on DK:

Browns -7
Over/under 38.5

I didn't get to see the game but had a few questions I had hoped some of you who did could answer.

The Browns seemed pretty productive in the first have and managed to score regularly. It seemed to be quite different in the second half. Also it seemed the Browns were running pretty well in the first half and not so in the second half.

What were the biggest changes you saw from the fist have to the second half that you believe caused that to happen?

Now I hope you can understand that I am only basing that on what the stats and the highlights have shown so I may be way off base here.

But I would also like to thank the defense. After the Jags started coming on you still held them to 13 points. Our O only put up 16 and you added two more. Teams don't win many games when their O can only muster 16 points so thanks for that!

biggest issue in the 2nd half? I'd say we were penalized more in the 2nd half (probably by a wide margin) and we got behind the sticks much more

I also think the first half was more "scripted" with our bigger lineup (extra OL and Foreman)

After week 1, Jake Burns and Andrew Spayde discussed (not in an alarmist way)on their podcast that there seems to be a bit of a disconnect in the vision the FO has for Watson and the Browns offense vs how Stefanski runs his offense.

They noted it is year two of a supposed "revamped offense" and we are still not seeing the RPOs, the motions etc.. They mentioned when things get tight Stefanski tends to revert back to what he knows. Jumbo packages, two TE sets, etc. They mentioned it is something worth monitoring.

You are correct, if anyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, it's him. It was also a rough day to catch the ball (wet weather). I also noticed that the WRs were working really hard on the balls they did catch. Watson, even looking as improved as he did, was still not really hitting his WRs in stride. I saw a LOT of balls where the receiver had to contort or drop down to make the catch.

Maybe so, but he has a better arm than Wallace and maybe more importantly, better spatial awareness and is quicker with decisions. Just my opinion.

I still don't see where you are getting that.. he's got an average arm and he's shown to be a turnover prone QB so that would be contrary to you awareness and decision making.. sure he may make quick decisions but in games its proven to be bad ones

Real premium placed by Ski on docking and fooling opponents, like outwitting 'em nets style points. I agree, around midfield I would look for our reverse. Our fist plays in a set of downs are often predictably inefficient short runs which often leave us behind the chains. Add our penchant for penalties on offense, it kills drives.
The other thing I have seen in his plat-calling career, is the closer to red zone, and especially goal line, chances go up for a fooler gadget play or gimmick. Bring the power KS.