Welcome to the off season. Before we get into wishes and hopes, Berry has to eliminate a minimum of about 31M in cap cost before March 12th. Of course, that doesn't leave any money or cap room for FA's and the draft, so it'll have to be substantially more than 31M. During this time frame, Berry must also decide which of the Browns 27 current FA's he intends to sign. Though it goes without saying that the Browns need QB help, a bigger need would be OT where 5 of the 7 rostered are FA's with all of the LT's on that list. The defense technically returns all starters from 2024 where the offense could lose 4 starters in WR Moore, LT Hudson, QB Watson and RB Chubb. Depth is also an issue on th OL with only 1 G-Zinter, 1 C-Wympler, and 1 RT-Jones under contract. The offense also has 4 more starters becoming FA's in '26. A lot of maneuvering needs to be done by Berry. who do you think he should keep or not? There's certainly a lot of holes, which are the most important?
LEGEND Green - 2025 FA's (27) White - 2026 FA's (21) Yellow - Rookies this past season (9) Orange - Under contract for '25 & '26 excluding PS (18)
OFFENSE LWR 19 Tillman, Cedric 23/3 - 81 (RFA26) Woods II, Michael 22/6 - 80 (R) Thrash, Jamari 24/5 RWR 3 Jeudy, Jerry T/Den - 11 (UFA) Proche II, James SF23 - 89 (ERFA26) Davis, Kaden SF24 SWR 8 (UFA) Moore, Elijah T/NYJ - 18 (UFA26) Bell, David 22/3 LT 66 (UFA) Hudson III, James 21/4 - 71 (UFA) Wills Jr., Jedrick 20/1 - 65 (UFA) IFEDI, GERMAIN SF24 LG 75 (UFA26) BITONIO, JOEL 14/2 - 68 (UFA) DUNN, MICHAEL SF20 C 55 (UFA26) Pocic, Ethan U/Sea - 56 Wypler, Luke 23/6 - 53 (UFA) Harris, Nick 20/5 RG 77 (UFA26) TELLER, WYATT T/Buf - 70 (R) Zinter, Zak 24/3 RT 78 CONKLIN, JACK U/Ten - 79 Jones, Dawand 23/4 - 74 (UFA) Adeniji, Hakeem U/Min - 72 (UFA) Christian, Geron P/LAR TE 85 (UFA26) Njoku, David 17/1 - 88 (UFA) AKINS, JORDAN U/Hou - 84 (UFA) SWAIM, GEOFF U/Arz - 86 Whiteheart, Blake SF24 - 82 (R) Bates, Brenden QB 4 Watson, Deshaun T/Hou - 2 (RFA) Zappe, Bailey P/KC - 17 Thompson-Robinson, Dorian 23/5 - 5 (UFA) WINSTON, JAMEIS U/NO RB 24 (UFA) Chubb, Nick 18/2 - 34 (UFA26) Ford, Jerome 22/5 - 20 (UFA26) Strong Jr., Pierre T/NE - 27 (UFA) Foreman, D'Onta U/Chi - 22 (UFA) Hines, Nyheim CC/Buf - 42 (ERFA) Kelly Jr., John SF24
DEFENSE LDE 95 Garrett, Myles 17/1 - 91 (UFA26) Wright, Alex 22/3 - 99 (UFA26) Thomas, Cameron W/KC LDT 94 TOMLINSON, DALVIN U/Min - 90 (UFA) Hurst II, Maurice U/SF - 92 (RFA26) Kamara, Sam SF22 RDT 93 (UFA26) HARRIS, SHELBY CC/Sea - 51 (R) Hall Jr., Mike 24/2 - 97 (R) Briggs, Jowon 24/7 - 62 (ERFA) Dwumfour, Michael SF24 RDE 57 McGuire, Isaiah 23/4 - 54 Okoronkwo, Ogbo U/Hou - 96 (RFA) Houston, James W/Det WLB 6 Owusu-Koramoah, Jeremiah 21/2 - 30 (UFA) Bush, Devin U/Sea - 39 (UFA) Hudson, Khaleke P/NO MLB 58 (UFA26) HICKS, JORDAN U/Min - 59 (ERFA) Reid, Winston CF24 SLB 43 (RFA26) Diabate, Mohamoud CF23 - 40 (R) Watson, Nathaniel 24/6 LCB 21 Ward, Denzel 18/1 - 31 (UFA) Ford Jr., Mike SF24 - 35 (R)Anusiem, Chigozie P/Was SS 9 Delpit, Grant 20/2 - 12 (UFA) MCLEOD JR., RODNEY U/Ind - 41 (R) Edmonds, Christopher CF24 FS 1 (UFA26) Thornhill, Juan U/KC - 33 (RFA26) Hickman, Ronnie CF23 - 37 (RFA) Bell, D'Anthony CF22 RCB 23 (UFA26) Emerson Jr., Martin 22/3 - 38 (UFA) Brown II, Tony SF24 NB 0 (UFA26) Newsome II, Greg 21/1 - 29 Mitchell, Cameron 23/5 - 26 (R) Harden, Myles 24/7
SPECIAL TEAMS PT 13 (UFA26) Bojorquez, Corey U/GB PK 7 HOPKINS, DUSTIN T/LAC LS 47 HUGHLETT, CHARLEY P/KC - 50 (ERFA26) Sunahara, Rex SF24 H 13 (UFA26) Bojorquez, Corey U/GB KO 13 (UFA26) Bojorquez, Corey U/GB PR 11 (UFA) Proche II, James SF23 - 8 (UFA) Moore, Elijah T/NYJ KR 34 (UFA26) Ford, Jerome 22/5 - 20 (UFA26) Strong Jr., Pierre T/NE - 89 (ERFA26) Davis, Kaden SF24
RESERVES (PS) FUT 67 Cohen, Javion OG 28 Dean III, Trey S 98 Haynes, Marcus DE 87 McKitty, Tre' TE 60 Pearl, Julian OT FUT 61 Mbaeteka, Roy OT 69 Thompson, Lorenzo OT 52 Smith, Elerson DE 10 Szmyt, Andre PK Latham, Brady OG FUT Holley, Ralph DT Hairston, Troy FB
I've said this before (and I doubt it's going to happen), but I wouldn't mind seeing Wills back to compete for the RT spot on a manageable deal. Somebody is going to pay him to be a LT, though.
I'm also fine losing Hudson, but that leaves a very injury-prone stable of OT's. If we're strapped for cash, finding a solution for the LT position is going to be really tough.
I'm curious what they're going to do with Moore. I could see him either coming back on a manageable deal or signing back with us after striking out elsewhere. This offseason could be the end of the line for David Bell.
Really hope they keep the DL together.
Looks like the RB room is going to go through another clean sweep (other than Chubb, I imagine). I hope one of the new faces in there is a drafted rookie.
One person that is a good candidate to move on would be Teller, IMO. He's been on a steady downward trend, I think. Nick Harris is probably gone too, but I hope they hang onto Dunn.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Cleveland Browns general manager Andrew Berry has proven yet again to be an exceptional manager of the financial side of football.
The Browns enter the 2025 offseason with $41.9 million in rollover salary cap, the second most in the NFL. This financial buffer offers much-needed relief from the immense pressure Deshaun Watson’s massive contract puts on Cleveland’s cap space.
As matters stand today, the Browns are $29.9 million over the salary cap for 2025, however, with Andrew Berry at the helm the team should be able to navigate smoothly along.
It is common practice in today’s NFL to renegotiate contracts to convert guarantees into performance bonuses and extend the money saved in the current season across multiple seasons down the road.
The process to get under the cap ceiling has already begun as back in December, Deshaun Watson’s contract was extended by one year with no added money. Expect more of the same manipulation of contracts already on our books over the coming months leading to free agency and the 2025 NFL Draft.
Cleveland Browns general manager Andrew Berry has proven yet again to be an exceptional manager of the financial side of football.
The Browns enter the 2025 offseason with $41.9 million in rollover salary cap, the second most in the NFL. This financial buffer offers much-needed relief from the immense pressure Deshaun Watson’s massive contract puts on Cleveland’s cap space.
As matters stand today, the Browns are $29.9 million over the salary cap for 2025, however, with Andrew Berry at the helm the team should be able to navigate smoothly along.
It is common practice in today’s NFL to renegotiate contracts to convert guarantees into performance bonuses and extend the money saved in the current season across multiple seasons down the road.
The process to get under the cap ceiling has already begun as back in December, Deshaun Watson’s contract was extended by one year with no added money. Expect more of the same manipulation of contracts already on our books over the coming months leading to free agency and the 2025 NFL Draft.
This article is just fine and dandy for some. What it isn't telling you though is Berry has generated Total Existing Dead Money of $39,744,384 with his playing with the contracts. It's not telling you that the rollover salary cap from 2024 just barely covers the dead money in 2025 so far.
DEAD MONEY SO FAR IN 2025 Amari Cooper - $22,584,000 Za'Darius Smith - $14,233,000 Quinton Jefferson - $1,960,000 Siaki Ika - $428,756 David Bell - $212,255 Nathaniel Watson - $122,043 Jowon Briggs - $66,423 Michael Woods - $42,073 Javion Cohen - $20,000 Lorenzo Thompson - $16,666 Ahmarean Brown - $13,334 Michael Dwumfour - $12,500 Winston Reid - $10,000 Treyton Welch - $10,000 Chris Edmonds - $6,667 Aidan Robbins - $6,667
TO BE ADDED IF FA's NOT RESIGNED Jedrick Wills - $11,812,516 Jameis Winston - $2,232,000
So, if Wills and Winston leave, that Dead Money for 2025 balloons to $53,788,900 and the rollover salary cap from 2024 of $41.9 million now fails to cover.
Of course I figured in the cap increase. It is projected to be between 265M and 275M and I used the high number of 275M for all my calculations. In 2024, the NFL Cap was 255.4M. Using 275M for 2025 is a 19.6M increase or 7.7% increase in the cap. 2024's increase was 30M because they were trying to catch up with the COVID reductions. The Browns had $14,972,782 in dead cap for 2024. This year's projected Dead Cap of $53,788,900 is 359% higher than 2024 and 2026's Dead Money is projected to be higher than this year's total.
That's why I continue to stress, the increase annually in the cap doesn't come close to covering the dead money Berry is generating. Remember, the Browns had the highest spend in the NFL last season and it got the team a 3-14 record. Kicking the Can Down the Road eventually has to be accounted for on the cap.
Of course I figured in the cap increase. It is projected to be between 265M and 275M and I used the high number of 275M for all my calculations. In 2024, the NFL Cap was 255.4M. Using 275M for 2025 is a 19.6M increase or 7.7% increase in the cap. 2024's increase was 30M because they were trying to catch up with the COVID reductions. The Browns had $14,972,782 in dead cap for 2024. This year's projected Dead Cap of $53,788,900 is 359% higher than 2024 and 2026's Dead Money is projected to be higher than this year's total.
That's why I continue to stress, the increase annually in the cap doesn't come close to covering the dead money Berry is generating. Remember, the Browns had the highest spend in the NFL last season and it got the team a 3-14 record. Kicking the Can Down the Road eventually has to be accounted for on the cap.
Only if the cap goes down. Then the team has to pay the piper. As long as the owner is willing to pay up front $ in signing bonuses. With that said they will not be going out and signing 20 million a season free agents but their cap is manageable. Only 2 things will change that. Haslam becomes unwilling to spend $ up front or the salary cap goes down.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Cleveland Browns general manager Andrew Berry has proven yet again to be an exceptional manager of the financial side of football.
The Browns enter the 2025 offseason with $41.9 million in rollover salary cap, the second most in the NFL. This financial buffer offers much-needed relief from the immense pressure Deshaun Watson’s massive contract puts on Cleveland’s cap space.
As matters stand today, the Browns are $29.9 million over the salary cap for 2025, however, with Andrew Berry at the helm the team should be able to navigate smoothly along.
It is common practice in today’s NFL to renegotiate contracts to convert guarantees into performance bonuses and extend the money saved in the current season across multiple seasons down the road.
The process to get under the cap ceiling has already begun as back in December, Deshaun Watson’s contract was extended by one year with no added money. Expect more of the same manipulation of contracts already on our books over the coming months leading to free agency and the 2025 NFL Draft.
So either fans want to believe Berry is a Cap Genius that can do things no other GM can do - bearing in mind that contracts are public and the NFL is a copy cat league - OR maybe what Berry is doing to massage the numbers each year is not actually that desirable unless you need to massage and manipulate contracts that are problematic.
Yes the salary cap keeps going up - but every dollar commited to paying players over their value to the team (eg Watson) is money that can't be spent on acquiring better talent from the FA pool. And I don't mean stars and elite FA's I mean free agents that can be backups or in the rotation. Dead money is simply money we aren't getting any value from whatsoever - every team has some but limiting it is obvioulsy the goal. CLE is currently 2nd on the Dead Cap list for 2025.... and we still have DW on the books.
How you handle DW and eventually move on from him is an issue - but you could reasonably argue based on his performance and the fact CLE would have cut him if not for the contract, his entire contract is dead money. If you did that you'd more than double our offical Dead space and we'd be double any other team. Great stuff and certainly nothing to worry about as long as talking heads and fans keep reminding us that Berry is a genius.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Bugs - comment was not aimed at you specifically, we see a lot of praise and posts telling us Berry is brilliant. He might be great at manipulating the Cap ... but he might need to be because player evaluation and acquisition has been bad?
The more things change the more they stay the same.
The Browns find themselves in one of the worst cap situations in the league. Deshaun Watson's contract is cumbersome, and the Browns have managed their books in such a manner that they will need to continue to kick the can down the road to clear immediate cap space. Occasionally, that means parting with talented players to get some breathing room.
Jack Conklin could be the first to go. He's one of the few players who could be cut before June 1 and clear some cap space. There's only $4.6 million available in cap relief, but every bit is going to help Cleveland. If they make him a post-June 1 cut, he would clear $14.6 million.
Conklin's injury history and Dawand Jones' ability to take over at right tackle make Conklin a likely cap casualty.
2. LB Jordan Hicks - $4.2 million
The Browns have limited cut options to clear cap space, so Hicks stands out. Cutting him ahead of free agency would clear $1.5 million in cap space. It's not much, but Hicks will turn 33 ahead of the season and missed five games this season with various injuries.
The Browns are going to need to develop some younger starters at the position. Mohamoud Diabate did some good things to show he can have a role next season, and there are always veteran linebackers available in the summer when the Browns should have more cap room.
3. G Joel Bitonio - $19.1 million (Post-June 1)
The Browns have enjoyed the benefits of one of the best guard duos in the league for several years in Joel Bitonio and Wyatt Teller. Unfortunately, all good things come to an end eventually. The curtain may close on the pair this offseason as they are set to account for a combined cap hit of nearly $35 million.
Bitonio is the more likely of the two to be moved. Ideally, there would be a trade market for him, but he will turn 34 during the next season. The Browns could only cut him with a post-June 1 designation, though. That would clear $8.4 million in space, while there is no space to be made with a pre-June 1 cut.
The above tells us that there is very limited cap space savings on a pre-June 1st cut of these players. Clearly not enough to put a dent in the $32.7M the Browns must recover in cuts by March 12th. Post June 1st will net about $26M in cap savings but again, it does not address the $32.7M the Browns must reduce by March 12th or the funds to participate in Free Agency or the draft.
Bugs - comment was not aimed at you specifically, we see a lot of praise and posts telling us Berry is brilliant. He might be great at manipulating the Cap ... but he might need to be because player evaluation and acquisition has been bad?
I chuckle every time I read that AB is some kind of cap guru. He's not any smarter or more-plugged-in than any other GM when it comes to the cap. It's all about Jimmah's money.
I shake my head when I read that we are not in a cap-crunch because the cap goes up every year. The cap goes up every year for EVERY TEAM. So every other team has more money to spend on actually improving their roster...rather than just flying under the cap...and living with dead cap money due to poor talent evaluation.
At least he's gotten the most important position in sports under wraps for all that money spent with a properly-aged roster ready to compete for the playoffs...no...scratch that.
The only thing AB has a good handle on is spending Jimmah's money.
Here's a link to the Browns mission statement...or vision...or whatever they call it.
Cleveland Browns general manager Andrew Berry has proven yet again to be an exceptional manager of the financial side of football.
The Browns enter the 2025 offseason with $41.9 million in rollover salary cap, the second most in the NFL. This financial buffer offers much-needed relief from the immense pressure Deshaun Watson’s massive contract puts on Cleveland’s cap space.
As matters stand today, the Browns are $29.9 million over the salary cap for 2025, however, with Andrew Berry at the helm the team should be able to navigate smoothly along.
It is common practice in today’s NFL to renegotiate contracts to convert guarantees into performance bonuses and extend the money saved in the current season across multiple seasons down the road.
The process to get under the cap ceiling has already begun as back in December, Deshaun Watson’s contract was extended by one year with no added money. Expect more of the same manipulation of contracts already on our books over the coming months leading to free agency and the 2025 NFL Draft.
I tend to agree with the position that it won't be too difficult to get under the cap. Also, if the reports are true, there is an expected $33MM coming off the cap due to Watson's 2024 injury.
Quote
Based on what has been reported, Cleveland would recoup around $33 million in salary cap space this offseason due to missing most of the 2024 season. Another $44.3 million will be added in 2026 if Watson misses all of the 2025 season with the injury, based on reports.
And I'd expect more contract restructures to take place as per usual. That's not to say guys won't get cut do their their 2025 cost compared to performance and/or age, but that really doesn't correlate to the "cap hell" narrative floating around here for the 4th consecutive offseason.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
Some more info, if not already shared earlier.....
Quote
The CBA labels insurance proceeds as a “refund from the player,” which qualifies the amount as a cap credit for the club for the following season. In the simplest terms, if a player who eats up a significant portion of a club’s salary cap misses significant time with injury or illness, a club doesn’t have to take it as a total loss, but can recover space for the following year. Plus, insurance premium payments don’t count against the salary cap.
According to the article, Cleveland insured just over $58 million this year. With the season halfway over, that could mean the Browns would save $29 million in salary cap space next season. If Watson were to miss games next year due to the injury, which could depend on a number of variables, cap space for 2026 could be saved as well.
Last year’s injury to Watson gave Cleveland another $4 million in cap space in 2024 based on how much they insured in 2023.
We will continue to keep you up to date on how Watson’s injury impacts the Browns cap space as more information and reporting become available.
Bugs - comment was not aimed at you specifically, we see a lot of praise and posts telling us Berry is brilliant. He might be great at manipulating the Cap ... but he might need to be because player evaluation and acquisition has been bad?
I chuckle every time I read that AB is some kind of cap guru. He's not any smarter or more-plugged-in than any other GM when it comes to the cap. It's all about Jimmah's money.
I shake my head when I read that we are not in a cap-crunch because the cap goes up every year. The cap goes up every year for EVERY TEAM. So every other team has more money to spend on actually improving their roster...rather than just flying under the cap...and living with dead cap money due to poor talent evaluation.
At least he's gotten the most important position in sports under wraps for all that money spent with a properly-aged roster ready to compete for the playoffs...no...scratch that.
The only thing AB has a good handle on is spending Jimmah's money.
Here's a link to the Browns mission statement...or vision...or whatever they call it.
I can no longer scoff at suggestions that the Browns aren't focused on winning.
This is correct if the owner is willing to pay $$$ then that allows the GM to manipulate the cap the way Berry does. Other teams do this also. Some owners do not pay the big $$$ and the cap effects them differently.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Bugs - comment was not aimed at you specifically, we see a lot of praise and posts telling us Berry is brilliant. He might be great at manipulating the Cap ... but he might need to be because player evaluation and acquisition has been bad?
I chuckle every time I read that AB is some kind of cap guru. He's not any smarter or more-plugged-in than any other GM when it comes to the cap. It's all about Jimmah's money.
I shake my head when I read that we are not in a cap-crunch because the cap goes up every year. The cap goes up every year for EVERY TEAM. So every other team has more money to spend on actually improving their roster...rather than just flying under the cap...and living with dead cap money due to poor talent evaluation.
At least he's gotten the most important position in sports under wraps for all that money spent with a properly-aged roster ready to compete for the playoffs...no...scratch that.
The only thing AB has a good handle on is spending Jimmah's money.
Here's a link to the Browns mission statement...or vision...or whatever they call it.
I can no longer scoff at suggestions that the Browns aren't focused on winning.
This is correct if the owner is willing to pay $$$ then that allows the GM to manipulate the cap the way Berry does. Other teams do this also. Some owners do not pay the big $$$ and the cap effects them differently.
Where I give the FO credit is the ability to recognize this potential edge when addressing contracts. I have no idea if it was Berry's idea, DePodesta's, or even something drummed up when Sashi was in charge of the cap and our GM. It is not like the Haslem's are the richest owners in the NFL and, as a result, can manipulate their cap situation everyone else cannot. According to the site referenced below (perhaps others have different conclusions), the Haslems are essentially the middle of the pack when it comes to wealth. I suppose that is different to owners considered more liquid than others, but I wouldn't be surprised if wealthier owners don't have the same model as the one the Browns are implementing. I suppose research would need to be done to see that but I'd go out on a limb and say the top half of owners wealthier than the Haslems are not addressing the cap, and contracts, the same way we are.
What I haven't seen mentioned is the fact that as the salary cap increases, so do player salaries. The price of contracts and players in the FA market increase as the salary cap does. So this theory that salary cap increases will cover the increased money deferred every year will in fact work as a roadblock to having the cap money to sign top FA's. You can't spend the same money on two things at a time.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
What I haven't seen mentioned is the fact that as the salary cap increases, so do player salaries. The price of contracts and players in the FA market increase as the salary cap does. So this theory that salary cap increases will cover the increased money deferred every year will in fact work as a roadblock to having the cap money to sign top FA's. You can't spend the same money on two things at a time.
Ditto, this is the exact reason the Browns currently sit $32.7M over the cap and have 27 Free Agent positions to address whether that's a resign, FA, or draft pick. I would also suspect that 90% of those contracts will cost more than the 27 contracts of the FA players made last year. It is true that the Browns can recover about $26M from cutting the 3 players I listed in a previous post but that's 3 more bodies the Browns will have to replace, and that money isn't available until after June 1st. Another huge drawback would be the Browns heading into free agency with only 1 OT under contract from last year's team. If the Browns are going to carry 7 OT's again, that would mean the addition of 6 either through FA and/or the draft. At guard, if they bounce Bitonio, the Browns will only have 2 guards that were rostered last year in Teller and Zinter. That would mean adding 2 either through FA and/or the draft. That's 8 players needed either through FA and/or the draft just for the o-line. With Berry's record on talent evaluation, not feeling too good about him selecting 8 FA's or draftees for just the o-line not to mention the other positions. JMHO
What I haven't seen mentioned is the fact that as the salary cap increases, so do player salaries. The price of contracts and players in the FA market increase as the salary cap does. So this theory that salary cap increases will cover the increased money deferred every year will in fact work as a roadblock to having the cap money to sign top FA's. You can't spend the same money on two things at a time.
Ditto, this is the exact reason the Browns currently sit $32.7M over the cap and have 27 Free Agent positions to address whether that's a resign, FA, or draft pick. I would also suspect that 90% of those contracts will cost more than the 27 contracts of the FA players made last year. It is true that the Browns can recover about $26M from cutting the 3 players I listed in a previous post but that's 3 more bodies the Browns will have to replace, and that money isn't available until after June 1st. Another huge drawback would be the Browns heading into free agency with only 1 OT under contract from last year's team. If the Browns are going to carry 7 OT's again, that would mean the addition of 6 either through FA and/or the draft. At guard, if they bounce Bitonio, the Browns will only have 2 guards that were rostered last year in Teller and Zinter. That would mean adding 2 either through FA and/or the draft. That's 8 players needed either through FA and/or the draft just for the o-line. With Berry's record on talent evaluation, not feeling too good about him selecting 8 FA's or draftees for just the o-line not to mention the other positions. JMHO
There are players that will be getting cut that are not in the FO's plans for 2025 no doubt. Juan Thornhill or others for example maybe someone you had listed maybe not. There will be players traded Greg Newsome. He was almost dealt last year. Then there will be players that will restructure or sign new contracts to free space for 2025. Also, Watson's 2024 season was insured and the fact he missed half the season they will get some insurance $ for that and it will free more space. Again, they are not going to be able to go get a 20-million-dollar free agent this year. But the Browns are not cap strapped in 2025. They will resign a hand full of their own players and get some decent one-year rental type players to fill gaps. The sky is not falling or they would have traded away Myles Garrett and Denzil Ward and started over.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
I’ve been wondering about that. There’s probably some going-on that we won’t hear much about until the hammer falls. How he was re-injured might be the big one, iirc from reading here.
If he cannot play next year there is a policy that would pay out something like $40 million .... but it would not count against the cap until 2026.
Our best possibility is that he hurt himself skydiving, so we could cut him without horrible consequences, and still recoup the insurance policy for what he had already pushed forward.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I chuckle every time I read that AB is some kind of cap guru. He's not any smarter or more-plugged-in than any other GM when it comes to the cap. It's all about Jimmah's money.
I mean, Jack Duffin, some Londoner who has oddly adopted the Browns, can foresee the cap moves because he has the time and inclination to play with numbers on Over The Cap and/or Spotrac.
It doesn't take a brilliant mind to know that the Browns are going to sign Garrett to the largest DE contract in the NFL, and end up with a paltry cap hit because Jimmy will pay the majority of the first year in the form of a signing bonus to give the FO cap flexibility.
I mean... give him credit for the original idea. The rest of the NFL was also collectively losing its mind because Berry weaponized Haslam's ability and willingness to spend unlike most other owners. It WAS a novel thing.
That said, it's now biting us because some of the players this was used on aren't delivering. Watson, obviously, but I'd also include Conklin. Conklin's contract is also a salary cap boat anchor... and this REALLY becomes a problem (IMO) because he is (arguably) our most solid tackle. Wills is likely gone, leaving us with Dawand Jones, Conklin, and.... depth guys(?)... and neither of those starters have been reliably available. We need (at least) a solid LT for the upcoming season... and if we try to get that via FA, it's going to cost a pretty penny.
So I do credit him for leveraging an advantage we have in a way that other GMs haven't, but in the end it's still all about identifying and acquiring talent.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
I chuckle every time I read that AB is some kind of cap guru. He's not any smarter or more-plugged-in than any other GM when it comes to the cap. It's all about Jimmah's money.
I mean, Jack Duffin, some Londoner who has oddly adopted the Browns, can foresee the cap moves because he has the time and inclination to play with numbers on Over The Cap and/or Spotrac.
It doesn't take a brilliant mind to know that the Browns are going to sign Garrett to the largest DE contract in the NFL, and end up with a paltry cap hit because Jimmy will pay the majority of the first year in the form of a signing bonus to give the FO cap flexibility.
Funny thing, AB may actually be a Cap Guru. If Haslam made him do the deal for Watson, then it was Haslam that is the person responsible. AB has other than that, done a pretty nifty job with the cap
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
I mean... give him credit for the original idea. The rest of the NFL was also collectively losing its mind because Berry weaponized Haslam's ability and willingness to spend unlike most other owners. It WAS a novel thing.
Eh, the Saints had been doing this for awhile. Haslam just gave Berry an open checkbook. I do not believe NFL teams and GMs were losing the minds. The NFL talking heads and fans were, however.
Browns and QBs- we just get hossed every time- Johnny Drugs and Liquor and Deshaun Exposed Johnson....we can sure pick them.....just to go for the trifecta.... the Brown need to pick Milroe-- he of the slow brain and can't hit an open man more than my 76 year old butt.....Go Browns!!!
"You've never lived till you've almost died, life has a flavor the protected will never know" A vet or cop
if we indeed go for a bridge QB, we should try to get Aaron Rodgers. i mean...at this point, why not?
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Honestly, I'm not sure if the talent of any player we add really matters. We need to figure out how to inject confidence and belief into (/throughout) the franchise.
I think we need to figure out how to get Myles to buy back in. Players look to the team's best guys. Unfortunately, I think that was part of the problem last season. Nobody really seemed to buy into the offense. When players aren't confident/are hesitant, it doesn't work in the NFL.
Is there a plan that the team will buy into? Or are we stuck in the belief that we'll always sink back to the "same old Browns"?
Are the problems the "plans"? Or the "psychic suckhole"?
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
All of what you’re saying at this point makes sense and seems to be true. However, our QB problem will probably be solved unexpectedly. We will simply sign a vet QB, draft one in April and when DW gets healthy and his confidence back we will plug him into our new offense and he will become the guy we expected to see when we traded for him. Problem solved!!!
QB Index Ranking all 59 starting quarterbacks from the 2024 NFL season: Lamar Jackson or Josh Allen at No. 1? Published: Feb 13, 2025 at 03:57 PM Nick Shook - Around The NFL Writer
Just another reason why Berry and Stefanski should have been left go. That Top 10 QB they craved so much was already a Cleveland Brown, and they traded him away.
Yet the GM, HC, and Haslam mortgaged the team for a so-called elite QB when they already had one on the team. It was Berry and Stefanski's job to support and groom the QB skills to elite status. Obviously, he must have had the skill set as demonstrated by his performances in Tampa. You may call it hindsight; I call it piss poor performance by a GM and HC. 5-years in charge and the Browns QB situation is worse now than when they arrived!
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
Can you explain it then? Because to me I can't find any reason other than Haslam purposely wanting to lose. It was the worst trade of all time and most of us knew it and called it out at the time not just in hindsight.
Even if Watson was fully healthy and playing I wouldn't have spent 3x #1s on him, let alone not playing for a year, holding out with tons of court cases pending.
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
Can you explain it then? Because to me I can't find any reason other than Haslam purposely wanting to lose. It was the worst trade of all time and most of us knew it and called it out at the time not just in hindsight.
Even if Watson was fully healthy and playing I wouldn't have spent 3x #1s on him, let alone not playing for a year, holding out with tons of court cases pending.
That is moronic. Nobody made the trade to purposely lose.
Hopefully after a night's sleep you will wake up and realize how stupid that sounds.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
Can you explain it then? Because to me I can't find any reason other than Haslam purposely wanting to lose. It was the worst trade of all time and most of us knew it and called it out at the time not just in hindsight.
Even if Watson was fully healthy and playing I wouldn't have spent 3x #1s on him, let alone not playing for a year, holding out with tons of court cases pending.
Baker's shoulder was jacked up at the time, and they weren't willing to bet on it. PFT: Baker on Injury - Link
After we moved on, He also worked on changing his throwing mechanics that off-season (due to the injury? range of motion loss post-surgery? Yes, it was the non-throwing shoulder, but Baker threw with his whole body), and finally started using a dedicated QB coach (same as Mahomes) in the off-season after years of making fun of them while with us.
I think people underestimate how much the medical evaluations play into decision making. Not wanting to pay big money to a guy with a major injury made sense at the time. The other options that were available at the time were ...not good. Lack of options drove up the price of the one that the QB needy teams thought could be and had been good.
Baker was at a crossroads, he put in the work and appears to have come out the other side better. We don't know what the medical looks like now. To me, the contract he signed indicates it was still a bit of a consideration (Less than Carr by APY, only 3 years, lots of incentives.) We do know that he still recklessly throws his body around on angry runs. As a fan, that's fun. As a teammate, that's motivating. As a manager invested in the QB, that's kind of scary.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
And that's the bottom line.
What I feel most people ignored in the decision making or at the very least underestimated the gravity of, and that includes this FO, is all the baggage that came along with DW.
All of the civil suits involving the abuse of women. Not, 1, not 5, not 10, but well over 20. Excuses were made to the point that his victims became the target of fans. The entire thing as it played out on this very board was nothing short of disgusting. Then there's the fact that for some reason which has been disputed as to the exact cause, is that his last season at Houston he didn't even play. Something had manifested itself so deeply that he didn't even see the field for an entire season. Both of these were huge red flags that anyone could see if looking at it objectively.
The numbers and the tape looked impressive. But that was over a season removed from all of the other factors. Some understood why they went after DW. Some felt it was a huge mistake. It seems as those who felt his personal issues weighed heavily and would be near impossible to overcome were right. And they weren't even NFL GM's.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
Can you explain it then? Because to me I can't find any reason other than Haslam purposely wanting to lose. It was the worst trade of all time and most of us knew it and called it out at the time not just in hindsight.
Even if Watson was fully healthy and playing I wouldn't have spent 3x #1s on him, let alone not playing for a year, holding out with tons of court cases pending.
Baker's shoulder was jacked up at the time, and they weren't willing to bet on it. PFT: Baker on Injury - Link
After we moved on, He also worked on changing his throwing mechanics that off-season (due to the injury? range of motion loss post-surgery? Yes, it was the non-throwing shoulder, but Baker threw with his whole body), and finally started using a dedicated QB coach (same as Mahomes) in the off-season after years of making fun of them while with us.
I think people underestimate how much the medical evaluations play into decision making. Not wanting to pay big money to a guy with a major injury made sense at the time. The other options that were available at the time were ...not good. Lack of options drove up the price of the one that the QB needy teams thought could be and had been good.
Baker was at a crossroads, he put in the work and appears to have come out the other side better. We don't know what the medical looks like now. To me, the contract he signed indicates it was still a bit of a consideration (Less than Carr by APY, only 3 years, lots of incentives.) We do know that he still recklessly throws his body around on angry runs. As a fan, that's fun. As a teammate, that's motivating. As a manager invested in the QB, that's kind of scary.
My intention isn’t to disagree or to say you’re wrong but Mayfield’s stats from 2020 and pre injury in 2021 isn’t something to sneeze about. With the right kind of guidance and believing in the process that age and experience would help him it isn’t fantasy to thing that he could have become the QB we see today in Tampa if he had stayed with the Browns. To Browns FO could easily have given him a fifth year contract extension and let him prove himself again when he was free from injuries. In my world that would be a wiser decision than going all in on 230m and 3 + 3 first and third round picks.
Anyway that’s history now but there’re reasons why some of us find it so hard to stand behind Berry and Stefanski after such a wild rodeo.
Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by lampdogg
I understood why they went after DW. It just turned crappily.
And that's the bottom line.
What I feel most people ignored in the decision making or at the very least underestimated the gravity of, and that includes this FO, is all the baggage that came along with DW.
All of the civil suits involving the abuse of women. Not, 1, not 5, not 10, but well over 20. Excuses were made to the point that his victims became the target of fans. The entire thing as it played out on this very board was nothing short of disgusting. Then there's the fact that for some reason which has been disputed as to the exact cause, is that his last season at Houston he didn't even play. Something had manifested itself so deeply that he didn't even see the field for an entire season. Both of these were huge red flags that anyone could see if looking at it objectively.
The numbers and the tape looked impressive. But that was over a season removed from all of the other factors. Some understood why they went after DW. Some felt it was a huge mistake. It seems as those who felt his personal issues weighed heavily and would be near impossible to overcome were right. And they weren't even NFL GM's.
That’s a really good post PitDAWG! I appreciate that you can think outside the box and see things from a neutral standpoint without losing perspective.
OBJ’s Daddy did that… we then completely screwed ourselves trying to bend over backwards for a rapey talentless turd because Baker got scapegoated. And if that crap about Ski pulling the plug on paying Baker over his arrogance/commercials/abrasiveness or whatever it was, is true, then we shipped the wrong guy. The whole damn thing made me start hating this team and I’m sure others felt the same.
We should sign whomever we can in FA to help us. Use the draft prudently, hopefully, to find players that can help us now and others that have talent that can be developed for the future. Incorporate them into our system and line up and play and do the best we can. As far as Myles I would try and work out a trade as much as it pains me. This team is in a tough situation and it’s going to take a lot of work and effort to get us out of it.
I heard Stafford is getting uppity about his contract in LA.
How would we pay someone like him?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Who is this guy? He's clearly engagement farming for likes and follows.
Stafford would throw himself on the 480 bridge before agreeing to come to Cleveland. He'd just head to booth for a payday. He and his wife absolutely love L.A.
I called the Stafford thing a month ago. (Love tooting my own horn, lol) If they give him stupid money who knows. I know they can’t justify that tho. But he’s about as solid a citizen as there is and you draft a young guy you see a little something in and let him ride the pine under Stafford, that’s not a bad idea.
Weighing in on the DW/ Baker thing. The problem is as I see it, ownership is hella cynical. No faith. In game theory you can always get that guy to move rather than stick with what he’s got, under values what he has, over values what he ain’t got. Easy to play. You’re right Pit, there were SOOOOO many “wrong way” and “do not enter” signs getting on this road and they pushed thru regardless. And they have to eat the turd sandwich. I hope they learn the right lessons. I doubt they will.
"Team Chemistry No Match for Team Biology" (Onion Sports Headline)
Stay away from Kirk Cousins! Great guy. The right attitude. 100% professional.
Despite that both the Vikings and the Falcons decided to take another route. Stefanski/Cousins partnership!? They know each other….yada yada yada. Forget it, The only stats that’s relevant for the Browns FO is what happened last season. Stay away.
Joe Flacco? Stay away. 2023 was 2023. Be smart and accept that time is our enemy in this case.
Shedeur Sanders? Stay away. When things go well the media will be all over the place and hail him as the new savior. When results go south the tune will change and the media circus and his social media followers will blame the Browns and everything in between Berea and Huntington Bank field. The opposite of the happy ending that our latest FQB liked.
Be smart for once Andrew Berry!
If your idea is to go right, go left. If you’re planning to jump, stand still. Do the opposite to every thought you have and things will be fine.
I wouldn't mind Joe as a 2nd FA QB. As much as we need a starter, going into the season again with a QB room that has DTR as the first viable backup would be a fire-able offense.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Putting this here instead of the draft thread because Breer briefly talks about both the Browns FA and draft hopes re: QBs at the beginning. His comments mirror what I would consider an ideal situation for the Browns-- getting Cousins on the vet minimum and then drafting Cam Ward. Not to mention him stating that the Browns don't believe they are in full rebuild mode, which I also agree. Now, that being said, Berry usually comes out swinging with a couple early deals in FA and if he doesn't this year, that might indicate what the Browns are thinking in terms of their current roster makeup.
Towards the end of the interview Breer mentions Cousins to the Browns again making sense. He mentions the dollar amount already invested by the Browns in the QB position (Watson), but the Stefanski connection makes sense too. The issue would be, for the second year in a row, Cousins would be considered a bridge to a much younger QB and it seemed he didn't like seeing Penix drafted after he had signed with ATL a month earlier. Not sure how he would view the prospects of Cleveland and the potential repeat of the situation he was in last year.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
I know we're in the thick of silly season right now, but last we heard out of ATL was that they are going to hang onto Cousins and keep him as a backup. Even the Cousins route isn't guaranteed to happen.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
If we can't get Cousins Daniel Jones is an option with us drafting a QB at some point. DJ can't be any worse than what we have now and would probably be an improvement.
If the only improvement we end up making at the QB position is Watson -> DJones, I'd be so disappointed. Better hope your draft pick is ready to play sooner rather than later.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Honestly, I think I'd rather go Fields or Trey Lance than either of those two. I'm not saying I'd love it. I just think they have better chances of improving from what they were. (Fields (26) is still only a year older than Bo Nix.) I also think a run heavy offense would benefit from the threat of their legs. With the way defenses have been trending, I think opponents might stick in two deep, with running games coming back in vogue. If they want to go single high coverage I think those two have the arms and escapability to make opponents pay (not necessarily consistently, but scoring in one play can afford offense to be more sporadic.) I definitely don't think the passing game would be pretty all the time, but would have more deep shot potential.
I just think Cousins is on the decline and Jones has pretty much proven that he's a turnover machine. I don't think Cousins has the longevity to be worth trying to build around. I don't think Jones has a trait.
I think Fields/Lance to Ward/Milroe lead to the most straightforward transitions. I think Ward/Milroe are the two prospects in the draft with the potential to become top 10 at the position.
Edit: Financial considerations are a sizeable part of the reason I'm landing on Fields/Lance. Not just the lower price tag, but also potential value. The outcomes on the field are "risky," but the cost to ceiling possibility could be a nice surplus. With where we are at, might as well try the cheap-ish lotto tickets. I think the floors on those two are higher than some think.
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/04/2511:53 AM.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I think I would be leaning toward signing Cousins/Jones in free agency to start. Sign Jacoby Brissett as the backup and then drafting Dart at #2. I think Dart fits Stefanski's system best and watching the combine has the tools to be #2 overall pick. Then follow the Chiefs philosophy and let Dart sit and learn the entire 2025 season behind the veteran with Brissett as the backup and teacher to the rookie. In 2026 Dart is the starting QB with one of the veterans remaining as his back up.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
I can definitely see the allure of Lance. I think he's the kind of QB you're looking for when you're going for a reclamation project.
-he'd be cheap -he has some talent (highly drafted)
bonus -already VERY familiar with Shanny/Kubiak concepts
I'd be curious if the injury issues that held him back in SF will rear their ugly head again.
Also, in order to have a run-heavy offense then we'd have to retool somewhat in order to get back to having an effective running game. I think the interior should mostly return to form with a scheme reset (assuming Bitonio is still on the roster) but our OTs still need at least 1 starter and probably some more depth (I'm assuming we're penciling Conklin in as a starter next year). We also will need at least 1 starter-caliber RB (I'm assuming Chubb either won't be on the roster or won't return to form).
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
If the only improvement we end up making at the QB position is Watson -> DJones, I'd be so disappointed. Better hope your draft pick is ready to play sooner rather than later.
It seems like Cousins who fell like a rock being thrown off of a cliff at the end of 2024 is a poplar idea so why not DJ too?
This is the desperation fans have reached to.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Cousins has shown the ability to read the field and deliver the ball. He's also familiar and has had success with Stefanski and the O we've been running.
Daniel Jones has done little to none of those things.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Cousins ran the Falcons O well to, until he didn't. It wasn't a matter of him not being familiar with it or having success in it. He didn't get pulled for the rookie because he was reading the field and delivering the ball well.
Many QB's do things well until they hit a wall. At 36 for all the world it appeared he had a head on collision with that wall. If you think he will improve to what he once was at age 37 I hope you're right.. But by and large that's not the way things work.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I can definitely see the allure of Lance. I think he's the kind of QB you're looking for when you're going for a reclamation project.
-he'd be cheap -he has some talent (highly drafted)
bonus -already VERY familiar with Shanny/Kubiak concepts
I'd be curious if the injury issues that held him back in SF will rear their ugly head again.
Also, in order to have a run-heavy offense then we'd have to retool somewhat in order to get back to having an effective running game. I think the interior should mostly return to form with a scheme reset (assuming Bitonio is still on the roster) but our OTs still need at least 1 starter and probably some more depth (I'm assuming we're penciling Conklin in as a starter next year). We also will need at least 1 starter-caliber RB (I'm assuming Chubb either won't be on the roster or won't return to form).
I think this is a good draft to get RBs (plural, multiple teams might take multiple RBs.) Ollie Gordon and Brashard Smith look like a later attainable duo that I'd be happy with. OT is the question mark for me. I see a world where Dawand Jones is fine. I'd prefer having another option, I'm just not sure the draft falls that way because of other teams' needs and the way the board falls. I do need to dig into the later OTs, I've mainly focused at the top. I do feel if you go run heavy, you have a bit more wiggle room at tackle. You still need one, but a more run focused tackle is a bit easier to find.
Trade back and go Membou/OT could be an option.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Cousins ran the Falcons O well to, until he didn't. It wasn't a matter of him not being familiar with it or having success in it. He didn't get pulled for the rookie because he was reading the field and delivering the ball well.
Many QB's do things well until they hit a wall. At 36 for all the world it appeared he had a head on collision with that wall. If you think he will improve to what he once was at age 37 I hope you're right.. But by and large that's not the way things work.
Carl Dukes: Browns have the leverage over Myles Garrett; Kirk Cousins 'not a good teammate' for playing through injury with Falcons By The Ken Carman Show With Anthony LimaTom Withers,
4 days ago
Carl Dukes (92.9 The Game/Atlanta, Infinity Sports Network) joins Anthony Lima and Tom Withers to discuss the Cleveland Browns' situation with Myles Garrett, and what made Kirk Cousins "not a good teammate" during his tenure with the Atlanta Falcons.
This is the headline of a podcast that I tried to link but couldn't. I listened to Baskin and Phelps talk about this. According to Dukes Cousins tried to play through an injury which resulted in his poor play. Dukes said he was a bad teammate for not sitting when injured. He says he was being selfish.
Cousins ran the Falcons O well to, until he didn't. It wasn't a matter of him not being familiar with it or having success in it. He didn't get pulled for the rookie because he was reading the field and delivering the ball well.
Many QB's do things well until they hit a wall. At 36 for all the world it appeared he had a head on collision with that wall. If you think he will improve to what he once was at age 37 I hope you're right.. But by and large that's not the way things work.
Carl Dukes: Browns have the leverage over Myles Garrett; Kirk Cousins 'not a good teammate' for playing through injury with Falcons By The Ken Carman Show With Anthony LimaTom Withers,
4 days ago
Carl Dukes (92.9 The Game/Atlanta, Infinity Sports Network) joins Anthony Lima and Tom Withers to discuss the Cleveland Browns' situation with Myles Garrett, and what made Kirk Cousins "not a good teammate" during his tenure with the Atlanta Falcons.
This is the headline of a podcast that I tried to link but couldn't. I listened to Baskin and Phelps talk about this. According to Dukes Cousins tried to play through an injury which resulted in his poor play. Dukes said he was a bad teammate for not sitting when injured. He says he was being selfish.
Selfish? I thought these decisions are ultimately up to the HC?
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
The only reports I've seen on this are people quoting MKC. As far as I know she is the only one actually reporting that's true. I'm not saying the report is false. I'm just not sure that if the story were true that she would be the only one to have some inside source confirming it. The fact that other, what I consider to be more reliable sources have not come out with their own independent reports about this make me at the very least somewhat skeptical at this point.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
You pay DW a guy facing a suspension for a year $230 guaranteed.
Myles slanders the team all over town and demands a trade.
You give money to Wills and he decides not to play.
And you cannot give a few million to one of the best players the team has ever had? A guy of Nick's character and work ethic.
A guy who has earned a second chance after coming back from a horrific injury early.
This makes me sick. I don't care about well it's business. BS. He is worth the money. He will be better because he is Nick Chubb.
If Berry is behind this I hope they fire him asap.
What news? I see a tweet with a mischaracterization/simplification of someone outside the team's opinion. Was there something other than the Mikey McNuggets tweet I missed? I did see some talking heads saying something in passing, but I think it's someone's speculation that keeps growing further from the original opinion like a bad game of Telephone.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I thought they said they were going to let him find his value in FA, and then sign him.
They are in penny-pinching mode, sure, but they don't know what his market value is... so they will let the market tell them.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
Her name. Not an unknown source. She works as the official reporter. She breaks news.
That is all I know.
At least, that’s how NFL insider Jeremy Fowler feels.
Talking to Ken Carman and Anthony Lima on 92.3 The Fan, the renowned insider stated that the Browns were leaning towards a divorce with their former star running back.
AD “It looks like it’s trending toward a potential divorce there…I do think they’re going to pound the run and get more explosive,” Fowler said.
AD GM Andrew Berry recently stated that the team would most likely allow Chubb to test the market and gauge his value.
Now, a report by Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com states that the team will likely part ways with him.
This is a business first and foremost, and there’s no place for emotion when you’re making the calls.
I just think you should ask yourself why after well over 24 hours later nobody else in the media has confirmed her report with any reliable source. Everything you posted was predicated solely on what MKC said.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Her name. Not an unknown source. She works as the official reporter. She breaks news.
That is all I know.
At least, that’s how NFL insider Jeremy Fowler feels.
Talking to Ken Carman and Anthony Lima on 92.3 The Fan, the renowned insider stated that the Browns were leaning towards a divorce with their former star running back.
AD “It looks like it’s trending toward a potential divorce there…I do think they’re going to pound the run and get more explosive,” Fowler said.
AD GM Andrew Berry recently stated that the team would most likely allow Chubb to test the market and gauge his value.
Now, a report by Mary Kay Cabot of Cleveland.com states that the team will likely part ways with him.
This is a business first and foremost, and there’s no place for emotion when you’re making the calls.
Trending towards potential divorce. MKC's initial report said "probably." Yet, others are acting like Chubb leaving is a done deal. Would you feel better if we lowballed Chubb? Let him see what he's worth and go from there. Nothing's decided yet. Berry and Stefanski love Chubb.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Nick stated publicly that he wants to remain with the Browns.
Negotiate a deal with him. Give him a fair shake with incentives.
Sit down with him and his agents and state to him that we want you. Let's get a deal done.
He deserves a fair shake. Especially when you look at Haslam and his willingness to spend on others.
If there is a player that deserves being treated fairly for what he has brought to Cleveland as a player and a member of the community. Nick is that man.
I just think you should ask yourself why after well over 24 hours later nobody else in the media has confirmed her report with any reliable source. Everything you posted was predicated solely on what MKC said.
Chubb had posted this to his IG account shortly after the news came out that the Browns were letting him hit free agency. He knows the Browns aren’t bringing him back.
Nick stated publicly that he wants to remain with the Browns.
Negotiate a deal with him. Give him a fair shake with incentives.
Sit down with him and his agents and state to him that we want you. Let's get a deal done.
He deserves a fair shake. Especially when you look at Haslam and his willingness to spend on others.
If there is a player that deserves being treated fairly for what he has brought to Cleveland as a player and a member of the community. Nick is that man.
What if someone else will give him guarantees? Offering incentives sounds great. Actually structuring them is a bit more complex. Do you really want to give him the carries to meet marks in line with his previous play? How many carries do you want to take off his plate with rookies? How much of old Nick Chubb is there? Is writing an incentive you don't plan on him meeting fair to Nick? Let him see what's out there. If someone out there is willing to pay Chubb more than you think he's worth, you wish him the best, thank him for his time here, and let him know he'll always be welcome back.
What's best for the team and what's best for Nick possibly don't align. Everyone would love to have him back. The business is the business, though. Is signing Nick for less than he's worth fair to Nick? How much less? How much are you willing to pay him for being Nick on top of his expected play? How do you project the play?
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I just think you should ask yourself why after well over 24 hours later nobody else in the media has confirmed her report with any reliable source. Everything you posted was predicated solely on what MKC said.
Chubb had posted this to his IG account shortly after the news came out that the Browns were letting him hit free agency. He knows the Browns aren’t bringing him back.
Or he's just saying he's bloodied, but not broken and wants his fans to know he's still Batman.
Hard to know what he means by a picture.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I just think you should ask yourself why after well over 24 hours later nobody else in the media has confirmed her report with any reliable source. Everything you posted was predicated solely on what MKC said.
Chubb had posted this to his IG account shortly after the news came out that the Browns were letting him hit free agency. He knows the Browns aren’t bringing him back.
Or he's just saying he's bloodied, but not broken and wants his fans to know he's still Batman.
Hard to know what he means by a picture.
... or he's just simply not getting the cornerstone-of-the-franchise treatment because Browns have doubt he can fully come back.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
I thought that was the plan all along. See what his market value was and act accordingly with an offer comparable with the market. I know plans change and it could be the Browns are ready to move on but I think that falls in lne with what they have said all along
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I just think you should ask yourself why after well over 24 hours later nobody else in the media has confirmed her report with any reliable source. Everything you posted was predicated solely on what MKC said.
Chubb had posted this to his IG account shortly after the news came out that the Browns were letting him hit free agency. He knows the Browns aren’t bringing him back.
Or he's just saying he's bloodied, but not broken and wants his fans to know he's still Batman.
Hard to know what he means by a picture.
... or he's just simply not getting the cornerstone-of-the-franchise treatment because Browns have doubt he can fully come back.
Yep, Chubb's always been that "me guy" wanting that special treatment.
He probably just jabbed himself with that Monte Blanc fountain pen on his way to work out a new deal and posted a bloodied Batman!
In his Athletic article, he wrote about how the Browns had his back the whole way during his recovery and had told him they were committed to him. I don't think he's being a diva or anything, but just that he's using people doubting him as fuel.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg)
![[Linked Image from media2.giphy.com]](https://media2.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExNWpxdm9sYW83c3AweDFxdGozOXp5OHhlNDNpcTNrMzg1aHJlYmFpNiZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZfYnlfaWQmY3Q9Zw/5xtDarmwsuR9sDRObyU/giphy.gif)
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg)
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
Haha.