Your only problem seems to be that I never said he reported to berry. Let's try again shall we?
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG Stefanski follows the corporate structure just as his job title describes. In the pecking order he works under the GM. The decisions a GM make are not under the purview of the HC. A GM is supposed to be talented at what his job is which is totally different from what the HC's job is.
Any way you try to dice it up in the corporate structure the GM is higher on the pecking order no matter who they report to. Stefanski isn't Andy Reid. Their jobs have separate responsibilities and different decisions rest with each man depending on his jobs responsibilities.
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No my assertion was that Stefanski doesn't report to Berry as you said.
Now where did I say that again?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Your only problem seems to be that I never said he reported to berry. Let's try again shall we?
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG Stefanski follows the corporate structure just as his job title describes. In the pecking order he works under the GM. The decisions a GM make are not under the purview of the HC. A GM is supposed to be talented at what his job is which is totally different from what the HC's job is.
Any way you try to dice it up in the corporate structure the GM is higher on the pecking order no matter who they report to. Stefanski isn't Andy Reid. Their jobs have separate responsibilities and different decisions rest with each man depending on his jobs responsibilities.
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No my assertion was that Stefanski doesn't report to Berry as you said.
Now where did I say that again?
Originally Posted by PitDawg
Stefanski follows the corporate structure just as his job title describes. In the pecking order he works under the GM.
Edit: They have different jobs. Neither has the decisionmaking power over the other. They work together to ultimately come to consensus. Haslam can and apparently does (if the Breer story on Van Pelt is true) overrule both of them.
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/01/2502:12 PM. Reason: Fixed the tags then added further thought
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Originally Posted by PitDAWG Stefanski follows the corporate structure just as his job title describes. In the pecking order he works under the GM. The decisions a GM make are not under the purview of the HC. A GM is supposed to be talented at what his job is which is totally different from what the HC's job is.
Any way you try to dice it up in the corporate structure the GM is higher on the pecking order no matter who they report to. Stefanski isn't Andy Reid. Their jobs have separate responsibilities and different decisions rest with each man depending on his jobs responsibilities.
Edit: They have different jobs. Neither has the decisionmaking power over the other. They work together to ultimately come to consensus. Haslam can and apparently does (if the Breer story on Van Pelt is true) overrule both of them.
So does Stefanksi report directly to Haslam or do he and AB work together to come to a consensus? At least you've warmed up to the idea of them having different jobs and responsibilities.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
So does Stefanksi report directly to Haslam or do he and AB work together to come to a consensus? At least you've warmed up to the idea of them having different jobs and responsibilities.
Stefanski still reports directly to Haslam. He also works alongside Berry. Just as I've said from the beginning.
The only thing warming up in this exchange is your pants, in a liar, liar sort of way.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
So does hand size change anyone's opinions on the QBs?
The sub-9 on Milroe at the Senior Bowl definitely dampened my enthusiasm. 9 and 3/8 is perfectly acceptable. I had wondered about Ward's hands. They're about the same as Burrow, so it's not an immediate fail or anything, but I do wish Ward did a better job keeping both hands on the ball or at least not waving it away from his body while scrambling. He had a lot of fumbles in college.
Edit: That's coachable, though. I do need to go back to accuracy/placement though. Maybe I swung too far towards giving room for new places/new faces and it is a control issue from hand size. (That could be magnified more with a power thrower vs more touch with Burrow)
...I hate trying to figure out QBs.....
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/01/2503:02 PM.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
So if you can restrain your childish emotions, let's give this a try.
It makes sense that Stefanski would confer with AB about thy type of player he needs at a position. Such a G who is a pulling G for the zone blocking scheme. Or a quicker, smaller more agile LB'er rather than a slower more physical type. The best style of QB that fits into the system Stefanski wishes to run. The style of WR he is lacking and needs to add to the roster. That all makes perfect sense. But what do you think they really have in their duties beyond that that makes you believe they build this consensus on as you claim? What is left in their appointed duties that makes for such discussions?
Stafanksi doesn't have an analytics department. AB does. Stefanski doesn't have control or input from the scouting department. AB does. Stefanksi in no way handles the salary cap or has a say in how player contracts are written up. AB does. AB has no part of coaching the team. According to what we've been told AB has no say in setting the line up, making the O or D schemes or anything else related to coaching this team.
So what are these things they meet about to find consensus on?
It's fine to just make general statements but that's all they are. So can we keep this to an adult discussion now or is that beyond your scope at this juncture?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Mike Florio and Chris Simms interviewed Ward, Sanders, and Dart.
I really liked all three guys and would feel good about having any of the three.
It was interesting to listen to Sheduer. I had not heard him talk freely for any length of time. He is an impressive young man. He has been schooled by a host professionals for a long time. Guys who know all the in and outs of the pro game. Deion was methodical in his training. Make no mistake Sheduer is a driven young man who will put in the work to reach his goals.
Ward is a serious competitor who has worked his butt off to get to this stage. He comes off as being driven and accountable. He is a natural leader who leads by example. He has that aura of a guy who will earn respect.
Dart is likeable. He is smart and knows what he needs to do to be successful. He has an infectious personality. It is clear why he has the reputation of being a great teammate and leader.
This is only about them and how they come across not on the field.
I have not been studying this years draft much more than reading reports and opinions - I have not watched any tape on any QB. I know you have.
If I had to guess - TN won't take Hunter, why would a team in need of QB and as much help across many positions take the guy who can play both ways when you want the most impact you can get. My guess is they trade down - and someone take Carter or a QB. If TN draft at #1 - Carter seems to be the consensus best player and it's a position that is secondary to QB in importance. It would seem like a reasonable fit.
That said - assuming we have the choice of Ward or Sanders. And above and beyond what is available in the draft reports, is there anything 'special' you like about either a the Browns #2 pick? I'm not against reaching for either - but my concern is Ward isn't a fit for Stefanski. KS is pretty damn conservative - and that has been the case no matter who was at QB. Ward's high ceiling seems predicated on big play ability. Is that a fit for CLE?
And then I guess - if the choice is just as you say above, Ward Sanders or Carter. Who would you most like to see, given that I suspect 2025 and 2026 are going to be Meh seasons.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
So rather than address backing up your assertions you simply ignore all of this? Try to stay focused on the topic at hand and the claim you made this time......
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It makes sense that Stefanski would confer with AB about thy type of player he needs at a position. Such a G who is a pulling G for the zone blocking scheme. Or a quicker, smaller more agile LB'er rather than a slower more physical type. The best style of QB that fits into the system Stefanski wishes to run. The style of WR he is lacking and needs to add to the roster. That all makes perfect sense. But what do you think they really have in their duties beyond that that makes you believe they build this consensus on as you claim? What is left in their appointed duties that makes for such discussions?
Stafanksi doesn't have an analytics department. AB does. Stefanski doesn't have control or input from the scouting department. AB does. Stefanksi in no way handles the salary cap or has a say in how player contracts are written up. AB does. AB has no part of coaching the team. According to what we've been told AB has no say in setting the line up, making the O or D schemes or anything else related to coaching this team.
So what are these things they meet about to find consensus on?
It's fine to just make general statements but that's all they are. So can we keep this to an adult discussion now or is that beyond your scope at this juncture?
So this isn't an adult discussion? That's pretty lame excuse to avoid this.
And this "I did show you" when you didn't is lame as well. Now can you please stop acting like you're 10 and address the topic?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
The Browns have to come out of the draft with at least one quarterback.
Where they select that quarterback is the question.
Number One. If the Browns rank one quarterback significantly higher than the others. Then they should explore trading up to get their guy. If the price is reasonable. Yes, they should trade up.
If they feel two quarterbacks are close in their grades and they are ranked in the top 15 then obviously stay put.
If they believe that none of the quarterbacks grade above say around pick 15 or so. They should explore trades.
If they trade Myles before the draft. It will alter their approach in the draft.
I give Ward the edge as the best QB in this draft. Although it is not like he is way ahead.
Sanders is growing on me. There is a lot to like about him. He knows how to play the position. He has had the advantage of being the son of Deion. That is an advantage. Shedeur has been groomed by true professionals his entire life. He is a driven young man who could lead a franchise.
Ward is damn good. He has many skills that translate to NFL play. He is a natural leader. That normally is just talk and not defined. In his case it is real. He is not a rah rah guy like Winston. He is a work hard, earn respect leader by example. There is an edge to to him. He will demand accountability from his teammates. He will push teammates to perform at their best. He has the physical tools. He needs to clean up some decision making. That goes for every prospect.
I really like Jaxson Dart. I believe in him. There is something about him that sticks to me. I like his play style. He has a linebacker type mentality. He is a tough competitor. I also believe he is smart and very coachable. He does everything well but nothing is elite. At the same time he has no weakness. I think he will be a damn good NFL quarterback. A guy you can win with.
I guess it's harder any of us to actually know this, but given that we have some quarterbacks of possibly close ability at the top of a draught board, my preference would always be for somebody very cerebral and smart.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Sheduer does not overwhelm you with his physical tools.
His physical tools are not elite but they are good enough. Think Purdy.
Sheduer knows what to do with the ball. He is calm under pressure. He knows where to go with the ball and he is accurate.
He has played with bad lines and weak running games. It has put him into positions where he holds the ball and drafts in the pocket.
Drifting backwards and not holding the ball with two hands is not good but is correctable.
His strength is ball distribution.
Ward is also a smart player. He has more natural ability than Sanders. He can play in structure. But he is also a more creative play maker. In some ways he looks like Mahomes.
Ward has the higher ceiling because of his play making ability.
Sanders is a safe bet because he will play well in structure.
Bone your starting to change my opinion on these QB's but I still don't think I want Sanders because of his father and the drama it will bring here. I just hope whomever we draft they will be productive for us.
Until I listened to Sheduer in an interview with Mike Florio and Chris Simms I was apprehensive about Sanders.
We can only guess what life was like being "the son."
When I listened to him it kind of put that to rest. Deion has a job. Sure he will monitor what his sons do but I think Deion and Sheduer are ready for him to begin his journey.
Sheduer is himself and he is confident in his own abilities.
I really do not think Deion will be an issue. Of course the press will make it a priority to cover his every move.
Sheduer has had a camera in his face his whole life. He is way past being uncomfortable with the attention.
I like his makeup. He has been coached by Tom Brady, Mike Vick, Pat Shrumur. He has been around the very best.
Yet I really believe he knows himself and where he intends to go in his career.
It was not until yesterday that I began to feel good about where we draft and who we will select.
I think the Deion think is getting overblown. Yes, as a player he was Prime, but now he is Coach Sanders - JMO
Having said that, I am not high on Shadeur: I have watched some of his play and my assessment is vastly different than most others.
Here are my issues:
1, The sacks. everyone says his o-line sucked. It wasn't great but it wasn't terrible. There are a few plays where Shadeur has zero time, and those are the plays that get shown on all the talk shows. However, the majority of the sack seem to come from his holding the ball.
2, Another thing he does that contributes to the sack is as Bone mentioned, the drifting. When he drops, he tends to not stand tall in the pocket but rather drifts back and to the right I am not sure that he even realizes that he is doing it.
3, His accuracy is overrated. He has a high completion percentage but (I heard) a large number of those completions are <10 yards. But what I see with my eyes is that he throws tha ball and Travis Hunter goes and gets it. To make it simple, when you watch his highlights, do so with the announcers call not the pumpjam music ones. So many of those highlights are followed by the announcers saying something along the lines of whoa what a catch, or great catch ...
These are my personal opinions
Am I perfect? No Am I trying to be a better person? Also no
The more information i’m processing the more I’m having trouble coming to a decision about what avenue we should take. There are a few different ways we can go to bring about a positive outcome for the team. I hope whatever the FO decides is successful.
It is rare that a college player coming into the NFL is ready to go.
No college experience makes you ready for the NFL.
Sanders has been prepared to be ready. Yes, his clock needs to be sped up.
Yes, there is room for improvement. However, IMO Sanders can play. He throws a good ball. He understands ball placement. He throws with anticipation. I think he is well suited to a rhythm WCO type offense. I think his tape at Colorado has to be filtered through what was around him. I don't care about the stats that much beyond being a reference point. Sanders can play.
Ward has more natural ability to create.
It is hard to say which guy will be better in the NFL. They could both succeed.
That said - assuming we have the choice of Ward or Sanders. And above and beyond what is available in the draft reports, is there anything 'special' you like about either a the Browns #2 pick? I'm not against reaching for either - but my concern is Ward isn't a fit for Stefanski. KS is pretty damn conservative - and that has been the case no matter who was at QB. Ward's high ceiling seems predicated on big play ability. Is that a fit for CLE?
It is a no brainer and has always been a no brainer. The answer is Cam Ward. You draft the most talented QB available. If Stefanski cannot figure out how to make it work, that is Stefanski problem.
There is a very real possibility this is 5-7 win team next year with a rookie QB and a roster with many holes so it is possible Stefanski is not here in 2026. That is another reason you do not draft a QB to fit Stefanski offense. Quite, frankly, there is nothing Ward cannot do that would make him a non-fit for Stefanski.
Geez, they change daily. Scouting reports are all over the place. There is no consensus.
Today these are my thoughts after the Combine.
I feel like there are three quarterbacks who will be drafted in the first round. Ward, Sanders, Dart.
Tyler Shough is a guy who may come up the Boards. He was really impressive at the Combine IMO.
The top of the draft is wide open. It could go any number of ways.
Free agency will play a big role. Darnold, Fields, Wilson, Rodgers all could shake things up.
Ward and Sanders are not locks at the top of the draft. As I really dig around I have found that some people listed as scouts are not all that high on Ward or Sanders. Seeing them as bottom of the round talent.
Teams at the top of the draft could easily take a safe route and not gamble on a quarterback. Especially with players like Carter and Hunter who are considered by many to be the top players in the draft.
There is no way you can get into the heads of organizations and find out their thoughts.
We have the second pick. We should land an impact player. It would be huge if we finally solved the quarterback position.
Geez, they change daily. Scouting reports are all over the place. There is no consensus.
Today these are my thoughts after the Combine.
I feel like there are three quarterbacks who will be drafted in the first round. Ward, Sanders, Dart.
Tyler Shough is a guy who may come up the Boards. He was really impressive at the Combine IMO.
The top of the draft is wide open. It could go any number of ways.
Free agency will play a big role. Darnold, Fields, Wilson, Rodgers all could shake things up.
Ward and Sanders are not locks at the top of the draft. As I really dig around I have found that some people listed as scouts are not all that high on Ward or Sanders. Seeing them as bottom of the round talent.
Teams at the top of the draft could easily take a safe route and not gamble on a quarterback. Especially with players like Carter and Hunter who are considered by many to be the top players in the draft.
There is no way you can get into the heads of organizations and find out their thoughts.
We have the second pick. We should land an impact player. It would be huge if we finally solved the quarterback position.
Tyler Shough is also a very tough guy. A little older but Tivis Powell Ex Ohio State Linebacker and frequent on Cleveland sports shows said he did a game a few years back and said Tyler Shough was QB of Texas Tech and broke his leg. It was actually found later that he broke his leg bone in half. And tried to stay in the game. He did not want to be taken out of the game. Ultimately could not and then the injury was found. He looks the part of a franchise QB but he will be 26 at the start of the season has had a few injuries like the one mentioned and a shoulder. Was Justin Herberts back up in Oregon when Herbert was there. Played at Oregon, Texas Tech, and Louisville this past year. 6'5 strong arm, mobile. If he was 22 and did not have that devestating injury hostory he would be a 1st no doubt. I would not be upset if the Browns selected him at 33 or even traded back into the first a few spots to get him.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
We should draft a Franchise QB. Maybe Mayfield… oh yeah we botched that one.
Did the Jets botch in Darnold when they didn't re-sign him?
The players they are now aren't the players they were then. Baker was messed up when the decision was made.
Unfortunately it works from good to bad, too. (Watson)
Edit: Hopefully we will draft a franchise QB.
I'm coming back around on Milroe again. lol. Don't like how the mocks where I take Ward turn out as much as the ones where I take Hunter.
I don't necessarily disagree with your overall point, but you're not doing your argument favors comparing the Browns to another trash franchise that found itself in the exact same situation doing the exact same thing.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
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