If we pick up one of these QB’s Sam Darnold, Jimmy Garoppolo, Justin Fields In FA and trade down adding picks then I hope they could/would grab Kyle McCord, QB, Syracuse later
I like all three quarterbacks and would feel positive about any of the three.
I think all three could have good careers.
I don't see a whole lot of separation between them.
I give Ward the slight edge because I like his skills and experience. He has played a lot of football. He is versatile and I think can play in any system.
Sheduer is a little more polished. He has great recognition. He throws with anticipation and accuracy. He is a smart player who can carve you up.
I think Dart is a confident guy who plays with an attitude. He is tough as nails. I like his pocket skills and mechanics. He keeps his upper and lower body in sync. He plays with composure and he is not afraid to make plays with his legs when needed, He is a strong runner. He is like a slightly smaller version of Allen.
If Ward can clean up his "bad decisions" he has great upside because he can play in structure and outside of structure.
IMO all the "this QB class is bad." I am not so sure about that.
I like our position. We should get a good player.
You never know until they play but I think there is a good chance these three will have solid careers.
As soon as free agency starts, we MIGHT have a better grasp on what the Browns could POSSIBLY do at the QB position, and how it could affect our approach to the draft.
Because that's intentional. Who wants to read the same order from Daniel Jeremiah weekly or insert any other analyst even if they are firm on their stance. They switch it up every time just to get the clicks even if they don't believe it.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
I like all three quarterbacks and would feel positive about any of the three.
I think all three could have good careers.
I don't see a whole lot of separation between them.
I give Ward the slight edge because I like his skills and experience. He has played a lot of football. He is versatile and I think can play in any system.
Sheduer is a little more polished. He has great recognition. He throws with anticipation and accuracy. He is a smart player who can carve you up.
I think Dart is a confident guy who plays with an attitude. He is tough as nails. I like his pocket skills and mechanics. He keeps his upper and lower body in sync. He plays with composure and he is not afraid to make plays with his legs when needed, He is a strong runner. He is like a slightly smaller version of Allen.
If Ward can clean up his "bad decisions" he has great upside because he can play in structure and outside of structure.
IMO all the "this QB class is bad." I am not so sure about that.
I like our position. We should get a good player.
You never know until they play but I think there is a good chance these three will have solid careers.
This is what it looks like when desperation takes over and common sense is abandoned. It seems you are so desperate for the Browns to get a franchise QB that you have convinced yourself any of the top 3 will work.
It is true that the talking heads are sometime wrong as is everyone else. But there seems to be a 90%+ consensus among almost everyone that this is a mediocre QB class at best. That seems to be something you are ignoring. That's as close to a consensus I have ever seem regarding a single draft at any position. That's something nobody should ignore.
I hope this FO isn't looking at it the same way you are or there is a huge chance we will starting back at zero again.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
To me Sanders is not a first round talent because he takes way to long to throw the ball. I think his avg time of release is some crazy number like 4.2 seconds on average. The NFL will not give him all day to throw the ball like that. He is a good kid and very smart but he is just too slow.
The QB I think is better than Sanders is Jaxson Dart because he decides where to throw the ball FAST. His avg release time is under 3 seconds which is NFL speed. I like that he doesn't try to throw a bullet on a 5 yard pass so that the ball is catchable. His play style reminds me a LOT of Jimmy G who gave the 49ers a superbowl before their terrible o-line let him get beat to hell and back.
I would love to see us trade back and that Dart or move back up into the first to take him. I don't think he sinks lower than say 25 in the first round. There are too many teams that need a QB so they will get taken higher than they should. I would have a hard time passing up Ward though if he falls into our lap at number 2. I just don't want to be stuck with slow mo Sanders at number 2.
I find that a QB's release speed seldom improves fast enough to save the people that draft them if they are slow.
You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
However, IMO Sanders can play. He throws a good ball. He understands ball placement. He throws with anticipation. I think he is well suited to a rhythm WCO type offense. I think his tape at Colorado has to be filtered through what was around him.
I agree that it must be filtered. I just disagree, or at least have concerns, with the direction of the filtering.
I think Shedeur's effect on the OL/running game was more than their effect on him. I think the OL/running game looked bad because of Shedeur. You play a noodle armed, non-running QB (a bit harsh, not quite a complete noodle, not quite a statue) differently than one that can beat you over the top or break off big runs. I think teams were effectively daring him to beat them with his arm. Sometimes he did, sometimes he didn't. Even when he did, I think you have to go back to the filtering. I think it was more his receivers making great plays than his throwing great balls. I'm not saying he didn't have any good throws, he did.
Even when it looks like Shedeur has good anticipation, I feel like a lot of the time it's more Hunter's ability to adjust his timing/tempo to coincide with Sanders' throw than great timing and placement. I know that's a somewhat subtle distinction, but I watched a ton of both. Try to keep an eye on how Hunter adjusts his speed and routes while the ball is in the air/where the holes in the coverage are.
There are definitely some pros and cons in every direction between his teammates and Shedeur. Everything seemed to be tailored to making Shedeur look like a good passer, more than taking advantage of the skills of the rest of the team.
I'm still trying to get more numbers. But Hunter had the second highest contested catch rate in the country. His YAC numbers weren't that great. Yet, I think that's another case of Shedeur having a negative effect. You can see Hunter is quite good with the ball in his hands in space. Unfortunately, space is hard to find when the ball hangs in the air. (link- some Hunter analysis/numbers there, but rather than rate I want to see the raw numbers. How many contested catches did he have to try to make?)
I think Shedeur has charisma. I also think Shedeur thinks he's better than he is because he doesn't really realize how many advantages he was given. Any advantages in the NFL will have much smaller margins than he had at Jacksonville St or Colorado.
I think Will Howard was a bigger part of the team's success (and I think a lot of it was on the surrounding talent) than Shedeur was at his stops. You put Jeremiah Smith at a lower level school and he's going to dominate the competition.
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/04/2501:32 PM. Reason: Backfilled link to avoid potentially losing post
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Considering Klatt played QB at Colorado, and remains close to the program/is close to Deion, I'm not sure he's the most unbiased analyst.
I think Raising his alma mater is an emotional balloon on the eval. Raising Colorado vs raising the Browns are two different animals. The competition is just on another level.
Getting a team to beat Kansas is a lot easier than beating Kansas City.
Edit: Did Shedeur raise the team? Or did the over 90 transfers in two years have a big part of it? link
Last edited by Bull_Dawg; 03/04/2501:51 PM.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
The picture will become clearer when free agency happens and we know where Darnold, Russell, Fields, Jones, Rodgers end up.
After that we should be all systems go and be looking to sign our first choice for quarterback.
If that means moving up; so be it.
I don't know. I think the draft is a lot like poker. The best players aren't always the ones with the best cards. They are the ones that are the best at reading and manipulating the other players. Who might be bluffing to get you to go all in on a loser? Probably not the best analogy because not all "hands"/"pots"/players are worth winning. Just another way of looking at it.
I quite possibly come off as I'm just trying to be contrarian. Really I'm just trying to give more perspectives to consider things from. I do appreciate you putting out your perspective for us to consider.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I like all three quarterbacks and would feel positive about any of the three.
My opinion is very close to that of many. Ward "may" be worthy of a high draft pick. But that's a close call. In a good draft class he would be no better than the #2 QB if not the #3 QB in the draft. He's the best of the bunch but I think that says more about the weakness of this QB class than his actual value.
Sanders is a HUGE gamble with more questions than answers. Somebody will be dumb enough to reach for him but I sure hope it isn't the Browns. Then there's the chaos that will surround the entire thing when the Deion circus comes to town. It has disaster written all over it. There are some people so desperate for an answer at the QB position they seem to be glossing over it though.
When it comes to Dart he does have some tangibles that one would look for in an NFL QB. But then that could be said about many QB's in the draft. He's a project but not a long shot project that you would get later in the draft.
So there it is. The only QB worth taking the gamble on at pick #2 would be Ward. And in most drafts that wouldn't be the case. Nobody else. You can argue what the other two are worth in regards to draft value but it doesn't appear to me that the risk is worth the reward in round 1 and there are certainly enough desperate teams to make that mistake. That's why 3 NFL GM's were fired at the end of the 2024 season.
There's a difference between being hopeful and being positive. I hope every Browns draft pick succeeds but the track record of every NFL team, especially at the QB position shows why being hopeful is a far more realistic position. And this draft class at the QB position just screams that. But to each their own.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I like all three quarterbacks and would feel positive about any of the three.
My opinion is very close to that of many. Ward "may" be worthy of a high draft pick. But that's a close call. In a good draft class he would be no better than the #2 QB if not the #3 QB in the draft. He's the best of the bunch but I think that says more about the weakness of this QB class than his actual value.
Sanders is a HUGE gamble with more questions than answers. Somebody will be dumb enough to reach for him but I sure hope it isn't the Browns. Then there's the chaos that will surround the entire thing when the Deion circus comes to town. It has disaster written all over it. There are some people so desperate for an answer at the QB position they seem to be glossing over it though.
When it comes to Dart he does have some tangibles that one would look for in an NFL QB. But then that could be said about many QB's in the draft. He's a project but not a long shot project that you would get later in the draft.
So there it is. The only QB worth taking the gamble on at pick #2 would be Ward. And in most drafts that wouldn't be the case. Nobody else. You can argue what the other two are worth in regards to draft value but it doesn't appear to me that the risk is worth the reward in round 1 and there are certainly enough desperate teams to make that mistake. That's why 3 NFL GM's were fired at the end of the 2024 season.
There's a difference between being hopeful and being positive. I hope every Browns draft pick succeeds but the track record of every NFL team, especially at the QB position shows why being hopeful is a far more realistic position. And this draft class at the QB position just screams that. But to each their own.
Although the last perceived weak QB draft class produced Patrick Mahomes.
Romans 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and believe in thy heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
Although the last perceived weak QB draft class produced Patrick Mahomes.
If there is a Patrick Mahomes in this draft, I think it is Milroe. You also have to remember that Mahomes sat an entire year, and went to a team that was already good (12-4 in 2016.)
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Actually right now I think he would be a good guy to sign. I think he would play well for KS.
There are many attributes that I like about Dart.
You are right about being decisive and getting rid of the ball quickly. Some of that can be attributed to the offense of Kiffin.
It is a quick read offense and Dart did as he was coached. I love how he keeps his bottom half and top half in sync. His mechanics are repeatable. Watching him at the Combine you can see that. He delivers the ball with timing, touch, and accuracy. He is killer down the seams. He has a smooth quick release. Watch his game against Duke. Damn.
IMO from a rather small sample size of Sanders. I think him holding the ball was because he was trying to win games. He was trying to extend plays and have a guy like Hunter find open ground. He often threw it up and let him take over.
I believe he is a smart player and in a timing offense he will do well. He is not an elite athlete with elite skills. He is a good athlete that knows how to play quarterback. I see him as a bottom half of the first round.
It is rare that a college QB comes out with no need to improve. You can nit pick all these guys. They are not finished products. It is not like Brady or Rodgers never made bad decisions in the NFL.
I can show plays where Ward threw a pass he had no business throwing. But hey, they are learning.
What separates Ward is the wow plays. He can do some things the others cannot do. He sees it well. He can beat you a number of ways. I love his experience. He has that ability to be calm inside chaos. He is not Mahomes but he does some things like Mahomes. He can play in structure from the pocket. He can throw off different platforms and extend plays. He has a strong arm and can pin point throws with an understanding of ball placement.
His flaws are he sometimes drifts and opens his base. He is not disciplined with footwork and mechanics. He plays lose kinda of like Rodgers. If he cleans up some forced balls and learns when to give up on plays and throw it away. He has great potential.
He is in my mind worthy of being a number one pick.
That does not make Sanders and Dart bad players or guys that will be unsuccessful.
If we selected Ward at two. I would have no problem coming back in round three or four and take a chance on Tyler Shough.
He has been unlucky with injury. He looks like a guy with a full toolbox.
For what it's worth, I still like Jaxon Dart.... But not with the 2nd pick.
If we are going to trade Garrett, get a First this year and more. Tale the best DE with 2, take the Best QB available with the other 1st round pick you got for Garrett. I wonder if New England would like to make that trade for Garrett?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
There are positives to like about all three quarterbacks. That does not mean they do not have negatives. Drafting quarterbacks has never become a science.
Nobody knows how any of these prospects will perform. How successful they are is also dependent upon who drafts them.
Sanders, Dart and possibly others in this draft could become good quarterbacks. Last year nobody was talking about Bo Nix.
Bleacher Report: Bo Nix
Nix will ultimately be a dice roll on athleticism and accuracy. With that said, it's a little worrisome that Nix is still unrefined in some areas as an older prospect with a ton of games under his belt. Nix would fit best in a spread-oriented offense that emphasizes RPOs, the quarterback run game and vertical passing.
How good is Bo Nix? I think it's a little soon to say. Would have lost to all the AFCN teams if not for 2 Jameis pick-6s and a missed FG by Hopkins. (A little reductionist, but the backbreaking plays were mostly on our guys messing up)
Broncos only won 2 games against playoff teams unless I'm forgetting someone as I scrolled through the season results. 1st was TB in week 3 where Baker threw an early INT, then got sacked 7 times on the way to 7 points on the board. Only other was KC's backups in the finale. They had a pretty friendly schedule, and the offense looked very different than it had with Wilson, so there wasn't a lot of tape.
We'll see if it's sustainable or if it was lightning in a bottle. It was a weird year where lots of teams had pretty bad seasons and Denver got to face most of the worst. Will be interesting to see if they can keep winning when it's expected. They can beat bad teams, can they consistently beat good teams with Nix.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
It seems you've haven't been paying attention. He has never "turned around a franchise". College ball doesn't have franchises. In case you missed it, being brash and arrogant is not a good quality to have when you are about to enter a sport on an entire new level needing to learn.
I'm somewhat amazed at the lengths you are gong to in order to make excuses and rationalize these QB's. Their warts are quite visible.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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