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Honestly, I see more and more Republicans becoming like this. It shocks me that so many of them have been nannyized. What happened to small government? It was the only positive draw for me to the Republican party.....and now that is gone.
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There is hope for you yet!! 
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In my home province, it was a Progressive Conservative government (Republicans, basically) who launched a 'smoking in public places' ban, a couple years back.
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Well Jules, IMO it's the pot calling the kettle black. Tree huggers vs morality police.  The religious right, IMO, wants to inflict their beliefs and will upon others. I mean, I'll bet half the people who voted FOR the "smoking ban" NEVER go to bars. However, they find it "socialy unacceptable and a sin". So rather than have a law that allows both smokers AND non smokers to have "choices", they inflict their will on everyone, everywhere. Wheather they go there or not. On the opposite end of the spectrum, you have liberals and the "scientific community". Known by the religious right as "The Godless Hoards".  Funny thing is, they talk about each other like dogs, yet are after the same goal in regards to smoking, or "not smoking" as it were. One group uses science like a two dollar hooker.............. Second hand smoke causes cancer because science proves it. Yet, when it hurts big business..........(environmental regulations,green house gases,etc)????? They'll say, "Science is wrong! It's not proven" So science is their friend when it suits their agenda, but otherwise, they're "The stupid Godless hoards". So IMO, the Dems get blamed for the EXACT same thing the Religious right is doing. When the simple fact is, they simply use science to further their agenda suits them, and spits them out like gum after it's lost its flavor when science doesn't suit their agenda.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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That's rather odd.
When the "smoking ban" was put to a vote, we had a GOP Gov. and a majority GOP in the state legislature. And Bush won Ohio in the last election. Are you SURE it's all "the Dems" playing "morality police?
Considering I hardly ever agree with you, this is hard to do, but........ 
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The religious right, IMO, wants to inflict their beliefs and will upon others. I mean, I'll bet half the people who voted FOR the "smoking ban" NEVER go to bars. However, they find it "socialy unacceptable and a sin".
Good God...twice in the same thread even....but you are right. They are most certain the one's who are responsible for the 5 foot rule or whatever it is in Ohio as it relates to the Strip clubs.
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Why don't these people focus their unbridled energy on issues that are actually important instead of resolving to resolve problems that don't need resolving?
wouldn't work, the democrats would have nothing to do.
That's rather odd.
When the "smoking ban" was put to a vote, we had a GOP Gov. and a majority GOP in the state legislature. And Bush won Ohio in the last election. Are you SURE it's all "the Dems" playing "morality police?
And it was the voters who had the final say.
If the people have the opportunity and ability to vote on issues like this, I have no problem whatsoever with them. The issue is constitutional, and a majority of voters approved it.
Despite claims by some that there was somehow "confusion" over the wording of the issue, there has been zero voter demand for a repeal. Some special interest groups have whined and cried ...... but the people (the ones who count, for those playing along at home) have been quite content with smoke having been taken outside.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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So you find it perfectly acceptable for people to inflict "their morality" in places they don't even go to upon those who DO go there?? 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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The religious right, IMO, wants to inflict their beliefs and will upon others. I mean, I'll bet half the people who voted FOR the "smoking ban" NEVER go to bars. However, they find it "socialy unacceptable and a sin".
You got the first part right - probably MORE than half that voted for it don't go to bars.
The second part? The "religious right" finds smoking socially unacceptable AND a sin? Gimme a break. I'm religious, and I sure don't find smoking a sin, and I've never heard of any "religious" person that does.
No pit, the smoking ban was not put in place by the "religious right" as you call it. The smoking ban was put in place by non smokers regardless of religious affiliation.
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So rather than have a law that allows both smokers AND non smokers to have "choices", they inflict their will on everyone, everywhere. Wheather they go there or not.
No law was needed what so ever, concerning bars or restaurants. Let the business owner decide. If there was money to be made by being smoke free - trust me, some entrepreneur would have been smoke free and he/she'd have filled their pockets with cash.
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On the opposite end of the spectrum, you have liberals and the "scientific community". Known by the religious right as "The Godless Hoards".
What is this "religious right" you speak so dispassionetly about? I'm religious. I knock science when it needs knocked. That makes me a zealot? 
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Second hand smoke causes cancer because science proves it.
Not proven. There may be a link, but it is not proven. On the other hand, science is now saying that eating red meat, pork products, or processed meats causes cancer. Should we go ahead and ban those?Quote:
Yet, when it hurts big business..........(environmental regulations,green house gases,etc)?????
They'll say, "Science is wrong! It's not proven"
What does environmental regulations, or green house gases have to do with big business? I'll tell you - NOTHING! Although that doesn't fit your bias, it's true. Laws and regulations don't hurt businesses. Businesses raise their prices to abide by the law. Regulations can help consumers, but they also cost consumers - not businesses, as you mistakenly infer.
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So science is their friend when it suits their agenda, but otherwise, they're "The stupid Godless hoards".
Wrong.
So IMO, the Dems get blamed for the EXACT same thing the Religious right is doing. When the simple fact is, they simply use science to further their agenda suits them, and spits them out like gum after it's lost its flavor when science doesn't suit their agenda.
Not even sure where you were going with all of this, other than "religion" is bad.
Science can and has proven a lot of things. Science has not proven that global warming is caused by humans. Science once told us the ozone layer was depleted, there was a huge hole. Inexplicably, a few years later, science told us the ozone layer hole was shrinking. Science told us in the 70's that an ice age was imminent. Today "science" tells us that we will fry if things don't change.
Sorry pit. The "religious right" as you so fondly state it, absolutely believes in science. So do the dems, the libs, the republicans and the conservatives.
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I think we should just ban People from Places and be done with it.
Too many stupid people with too much power and too little ability to think.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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The second part? The "religious right" finds smoking socially unacceptable AND a sin? Gimme a break. I'm religious, and I sure don't find smoking a sin, and I've never heard of any "religious" person that does.
I can tell you as one growing up in a Baptist environment, SMOKING was/is most definately a sin, at least according to the preachers I was FORCED to hear at a few different churches. They went on the premise that your body is a temple and nicotine is "doing drugs", its no different than weed, blah, blah blah.
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nicotine is "doing drugs", its no different than weed, blah, blah blah.
But nicotine IS a drug. Just like alcohol. Just like sugar. Just like caffeine.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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I can do you one better: I grew up Mennonite!!!! You know, as close to amish as you can get! Baptists have nothing on us "Mennonites". Each religion, and moreso, each denomination, has its good and bad. I don't know of anyone, although I'm sure there are some, that voted for the ban because of religion. People voted for the ban regardless of religion. If it were up to the "religious", strip clubs would be banned, bars would be banned, porn would be banned, alcohol would be banned, .........the list goes on and on. My point is, the "religious" did not ban smoking. The state did.
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porn would be banned
This board would probably triple in the number of members (or at least posts) if that were the case. 
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So you find it perfectly acceptable for people to inflict "their morality" in places they don't even go to upon those who DO go there??
How do you know who goes and doesn't go to these places ? I know Christians that smoke and I know Christians that drink alcohol,your linking a religion to this is crazy
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Note the at the end of my statement, I made it in jest man. I do agree though with some of the stuff you say.
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Here's my point Arch. Religion is not bad. People that ARE religious are not bad. But a certain portion of that "religious right" does use their vote to further their religious agenda. Many of those same people will use science as a tool to further their agenda, then in the next breath, debunk science when it does not fit their agenda. Believe it or not, I actually know DEMORCRATS who attend Church regularly! Point being, the GOP has a LOT of support from the Religious right. And to appease them, much of the legislation submitted is geared toward making them happy. It's strictly politics. But believe it or not, the GOP does cater to their whims a great deal. And I do believe not ALL religions believe smoking is a sin. But the Church I grew up in thought it was. They said that God expects you to "treat your body as a temple". And that by smoking, you are helping to destroy that temple. Being Religious doesn't "make you a zealot". Nor does it exempt you. Each individual decides that of their own accord. JMHO BTW- Arch, I knocked on "The Tree huggers" and blamed them as well. I was trying to be an equal oppertunity offender!
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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So you find it perfectly acceptable for people to inflict "their morality" in places they don't even go to upon those who DO go there??
How do you know who goes and doesn't go to these places ? I know Christians that smoke and I know Christians that drink alcohol,your linking a religion to this is crazy
Not crazy at all. Actually, I blamed the tree huggers AND religion on many bills brought before the legislature.
If you guys have ANY point at ALL???????? Why so many "dry counties" in Kentucky? Oh that's right, peoples Religious views have nothing to do with how they vote. I keep forgetting..............
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Here's my point Arch.
Religion is not bad. People that ARE religious are not bad.
But a certain portion of that "religious right" does use their vote to further their religious agenda. Many of those same people will use science as a tool to further their agenda, then in the next breath, debunk science when it does not fit their agenda.
Believe it or not, I actually know DEMORCRATS who attend Church regularly!
Point being, the GOP has a LOT of support from the Religious right. And to appease them, much of the legislation submitted is geared toward making them happy.
It's strictly politics. But believe it or not, the GOP does cater to their whims a great deal.
And I do believe not ALL religions believe smoking is a sin. But the Church I grew up in thought it was. They said that God expects you to "treat your body as a temple". And that by smoking, you are helping to destroy that temple.
Being Religious doesn't "make you a zealot". Nor does it exempt you. Each individual decides that of their own accord.
JMHO
BTW- Arch, I knocked on "The Tree huggers" and blamed them as well. I was trying to be an equal oppertunity offender!
So, to sum up your whole post - religion doesn't matter, as "religious" people are in both parties, and people in both parties don't necessarliy agree with science when science is proven to be doubtable (certain aspects of science).
So, my question is, why bring religion into it at all?
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Because, when you get enough religious people and tree huggers on the same directive, it spells "Nanny State".
One's no better or worse than the other. But every once in a while, when the stars align just right, they share the same objective. At that juncture? Your personal freedoms go to hell.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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If you guys have ANY point at ALL???????? Why so many "dry counties" in Kentucky? Oh that's right, peoples Religious views have nothing to do with how they vote. I keep forgetting..............
Hey bud I'm not talking Kentucky....I'm talking about your quote here:
"So you find it perfectly acceptable for people to inflict "their morality" in places they don't even go to upon those who DO go there??"
And again I just ask how do you know who is going there and who isn't ? I respect your opinion just like anyone elses I just thought this comment was a little out of whack considering I know Christians who drink and smoke cigarettes(although hypocrites wouldn't consider them Christians because they are holier than thou )
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Because, when you get enough religious people and tree huggers on the same directive, it spells "Nanny State".
One's no better or worse than the other. But every once in a while, when the stars align just right, they share the same objective. At that juncture? Your personal freedoms go to hell.
Interesting. Yet, in your initial post, you blamed the smoking ban on "the religious right". Funny how you change your views......
It doesn't matter really, as the discussion at hand is - or should I say "was" - swearing in public. And should it be banned.
"Religious right" or not, scientist or not, my answer is "no, it should not be legislated". Just as I don't think religion should be legislated. Just as I don't think smoking should be legislated.
On a side note - I'd love to see all smokers quit - tomorrow. Then, I'd love to see how the state deals with their loss of revenue from the tobacco tax. Then, to make it even better, 6 months or 1 year from now, I'd LOVE to hear the current non smokers bellyaching about how their taxes have gone up.
One needs to be careful what one wishes for.
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I'll try to type slower this time................ MANY religious people "vote by their religious beliefs". Which in MANY CASES includes banning of alcohol and or tobacco. It was stated that "was not the case". All you need to do is look at dry counties in Kentucky to SHOW that's true! Not everyone who is religious, but many of them. Or are you trying to tell me that "non religious people" as a whole are the one's sending tens of thousands of dollars in tax revenue to adjoining counties without any "real reasoning" behind it? The point is, many people DO vote according to their religious beliefs. And MANY religions DO view drinking and smoking as wrong. It's fairly obvious.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Well Arch, it seems as though you are Religious, but not a zealot. But please quit being in denial about how many religious people ARE. As OSU seemed to point out, for the most part, it's the hypocrites. But they ARE many Arch.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Well Arch, it seems as though you are Religious, but not a zealot. But please quit being in denial about how many religious people ARE.
As OSU seemed to point out, for the most part, it's the hypocrites. But they ARE many Arch.
My whole discussion with you is: hypocrites exist everywhere. Not just religion. For you to say the smoking ban was due to the "religious right" is wrong. It was due to people having a vote, and voting. Religion or not. Hopefully you can accept that. Religion did not ban smoking. The people did - and if you honestly think smoking was banned because of religion - well....not much I can say, other than "Go Mennonites"
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Again, the topic at hand is swearing and table dancing. Now, if you feel that the attempted ban is due to religion, then say so. Let's get off the smoking thing, and back on topic.
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Smokers are mentioned in the thread title.... 
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Smokers are mentioned in the thread title....
Yup, it was. You know the context it was used in also. That may matter to you, it may not.
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Relax, Arch...sheesh. I was KIDDING.  Some of you guys are just no fun anymore.
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Relax, Arch...sheesh. I was KIDDING. Some of you guys are just no fun anymore.
Hmmm...where do you get that I'm no fun?
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The topic may be swearing and table dancing in bars, but the larger issue remains the incremental erosion of our property rights. That's why I have argued many times here about smoking bans in privately owned restaurants and bars, and that's why I posted the article above about the State of California considering remote control of thermostats in private residences and businesses. The point remains that we are just a hop-and-a-skip away from allowing government to enter our homes and regulate legal behavior. That should scare people, but instead I get this feeling that it only matters to some people when its a legal behavior that they indulge in. If its somebody else's legal behavior, well then, hey, sucks to be you. People need to realize that they WILL be coming for you and your legal behaviors too. Its not about religious zealots, conservatives, liberals, etc ... its about control and the power, status, and wealth they get from achieving that kind of control.
I remember reading about the Holocaust when I was younger and wondering "how could this happen?". It becomes clearer and clearer to me that fascism comes in many forms, but it is almost always couched as being for "the common good", and so good people give away their freedom and allow government to become ever more intrusive in their lives, because, after all, it doesn't really affect them ... yet.
Sorry for the rant.
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The topic may be swearing and table dancing in bars, but the larger issue remains the incremental erosion of our property rights. That's why I have argued many times here about smoking bans in privately owned restaurants and bars, and that's why I posted the article above about the State of California considering remote control of thermostats in private residences and businesses. The point remains that we are just a hop-and-a-skip away from allowing government to enter our homes and regulate legal behavior. That should scare people, but instead I get this feeling that it only matters to some people when its a legal behavior that they indulge in. If its somebody else's legal behavior, well then, hey, sucks to be you. People need to realize that they WILL be coming for you and your legal behaviors too. Its not about religious zealots, conservatives, liberals, etc ... its about control and the power, status, and wealth they get from achieving that kind of control.
I remember reading about the Holocaust when I was younger and wondering "how could this happen?". It becomes clearer and clearer to me that fascism comes in many forms, but it is almost always couched as being for "the common good", and so good people give away their freedom and allow government to become ever more intrusive in their lives, because, after all, it doesn't really affect them ... yet.
Sorry for the rant.
No rant on my part. I agree. When people see that the smoking ban, and then the swearing ban have lead up to the thermostat control, and then realize that 40% to 50% of their income goes to the gov't., when people finally realize that they have no freedoms because any freedom they thought they had infringed on someone else and consequently was taking away - well, it will be too late.
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Shotty I agree with everything you said. Everyone thinks something is legit as long as it benefits them, but find reasons why a ban is so bad once it hits home. I say take us back in time to the 80's when things were fun and the government had less hand in our lives. I am only 29 so the 80's were the best times I remember. we are losing control of our own lives, and the sick part is the people like asthma man do not see the problem.
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This topic also reminds me of the post I put up about the Verichip. Google it, you will be disgusted if you enjoy freedom. This idea is already being impimented in some humans. The government will know your every step if/when this chip gets put into full swing.
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So you find it perfectly acceptable for people to inflict "their morality" in places they don't even go to upon those who DO go there??
You do realize that the smoking issue didn't just apply to bars ..... right?
It also applied to stores ..... restaurants ..... and all kinds of businesses. It applies to gas stations ..... convenience stores ..... auto dealerships and repair shops ..... and all other kinds of places where someone may go and not want to be subjected to noxious fumes.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Do you mean places like in the cab of a truck, when the driver is the only one in it??? Yep that nasty truck driver all alone in his rig for 8, 10, 12 hours a day, who is not allowed to smoke all alone in the rig.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Relax, Arch...sheesh. I was KIDDING. Some of you guys are just no fun anymore.
I think in order to make that statement they would have had to have been fun at one time. 
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Actually, I blamed the tree huggers AND religion on many bills brought before the legislature.
Why would you BLAME them? Are they less of a citizen than the moderates because their views are more extreme one way or the other? Do they not deserve to have legislation brought because they aren't "moderates"? Perhaps they don't deserve legislation brought because they just arrive at their opinions differently than the moderates, thus making their opinions less worthy....
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If you guys have ANY point at ALL???????? Why so many "dry counties" in Kentucky? Oh that's right, peoples Religious views have nothing to do with how they vote. I keep forgetting..............
Peoples religous views should have everything to do with the way they vote... if they seriously believe in their religion. I would assume that those who do not believe in a religion allow that to influence their voting... so why can't I? If you believe strongly in a religion, then it is what you are about, it affects your every decision... but people are supposed to forget about that when they go in the voting booth? I don't.
yebat' Putin
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You tree huggers are so sensitive.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 12,059
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 12,059 |
Quote:
You tree huggers are so sensitive.
I would rather hug a tree than burn down a church. 
#gmstrong
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum But if I go outside, I might
offend the smokers
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