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Interesting. I wouldn't make any connections to his movies and his death, but I would like to consider it as an isolated topic. Playing a role in a movie is like becoming what one portrays. So in his case, it may have caused some problems for him because he literally was playing a gay man. I think that has more to do with it than the fact that people saw him doing it. He is an actor, it is his job to be seen. But the role itself could have affected him.
I also think it is different than Hopkins playing Hannibal because he did not actually carry out the realistic actions of a serial killer. Also, playing a character that is psychotic would seem insignificant because there is no realism in it - it is fake. But Brokeback Mountain was real, so I could see how that could cause him problems.
All just speculation though.
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are you saying psychosis is a myth? just for clarification...
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Legend
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Wow, that's really too bad. Very sad to see a young person die.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Quote:
Interesting. I wouldn't make any connections to his movies and his death, but I would like to consider it as an isolated topic. Playing a role in a movie is like becoming what one portrays. So in his case, it may have caused some problems for him because he literally was playing a gay man. I think that has more to do with it than the fact that people saw him doing it. He is an actor, it is his job to be seen. But the role itself could have affected him.
I also think it is different than Hopkins playing Hannibal because he did not actually carry out the realistic actions of a serial killer. Also, playing a character that is psychotic would seem insignificant because there is no realism in it - it is fake. But Brokeback Mountain was real, so I could see how that could cause him problems.
All just speculation though.
I can't help with disagree with you. Your post is your opinion, and that's totally fine, but I fail to see how this is any different than other parts in movies. Actors, especially ones who has been in a few big movies like Ledger, take the part knowing what to expect. These people play their roles, and they know that it is simply a role. Playing a gay man is still just a role, the same as a man playing a killer. Ledger isn't really a gay man, and Hopkins isn't really a cannabilistic killer.
I think it is more with the pressure that comes with being a celebrity and who knows what else he had going on in his life. It's a sad tragedy that seems to strike way too many people in Hollywood today.
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So Hopkins playing a psycho was fake but Ledger playing a gay cowboy was real?? Sorry, that does not equate. They're both movie roles. How is one real and the other not?
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The theory is plausible, but I hope he could separate life from work. You don't see Hopkins offing himself because of the Hanibal movies. Charlize played a lesbian serial killer. Idk, I'm not saying your wrong I would just hope that isn't the case.
In theory...Hopkins never actually killed any one in the movie...nor did Charlize....
Heath actually took part in physical acts with another man...Okay it`s the movies...no big deal.....
Look at some others who have had some mis fortunes after they had made a movie....If I remember right...Linda Blair...after the excorsist..had many problems..
And not wanting to become a movie bluff...I`m sure there are others that had wished...they had not done the movie...
And movies are`nt even the case always.....Kid actors...how often do you here of suicide...drug and alcohol problems among them....And now we are hearing of sorry...but Brittney Spears.....
Hollywood is a planet of its own....and this could be a topic of discussion on it`s own....
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I can't help with disagree with you. Your post is your opinion, and that's totally fine,
Mantis post was more of a reply to a post that I had put up...I respect the way he replied back to me....
You disagree with him...but if you would read his post...You may notice that you are saying the same as he is....
I would like to point one thing out that you stated in your post...If that would be okay....
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Actors, especially ones who has been in a few big movies like Ledger, take the part knowing what to expect.
What big movie experiance did Heath have before making BrokeBack...Any thing that would prepare him for this type of role ?
Even though you think you may know what to expect...by taking a role...Does not
always mean that the outcome is what you expected...or were capable of handling.....jmo....
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And movies are`nt even the case always.....Kid actors...how often do you here of suicide...drug and alcohol problems among them....And now we are hearing of sorry...but Brittney Spears.....
These are world wide problems, have been for generations. It's not just our precious celebrities. The sadest part is we don't always know why these things happen. They just do.
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All just speculation though.
Very true....good post !
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j/c/
Maybe he gets a little high and takes a couple of sleepers to bring him down but maybe he just takes 2 or 3 too many . He dies, oopps .. sounds plausible to me .
Then again he could of had this complex life being tormented by his fame and success and after getting lost in his latest role decides the world is not a good place for him to be and decides to end it all.
Naaa I like my version.
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What big movie experiance did Heath have before making BrokeBack...Any thing that would prepare him for this type of role ?
The Patriot, A Knight's Tale, 10 Things I Hate About You
Then also as a teen on a sitcom he played a homosexual (which really destroys this "Brokeback" idea)
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This is so sad...
The roles he plays are always against the grain... kind of odd-ballish in a way...
besides broke back mountain, I always remember him in Monster's Ball, and we all know what happened to him in that movie.
RIP Heath... You were a very talented actor, and will be missed on the big screen by many.
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I know its still early but are they calling this suicide?
They're saying he was found with pills all around him. I can't imagine what else it would be, though I'm not going to jump to conclusions.
Who makes an appointment for a massage and ODs? somethin's fishy here
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For those making this "Brokeback" argument: Already a small screen veteran in his native land, the tall blond had been featured as the gay cyclist Snowy Bowles in the Australian TV drama "Sweat" http://www.hollywood.com/celebrity/Heath_Ledger/191871#fullBio
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are you saying psychosis is a myth? just for clarification...
No, I am saying that when acting, one can only pretend to be psychotic because one does not have the actual symptoms. But in Ledger's case, when he played the role of a gay man, he actually went through the realistic experiences of a gay man. Now I don't know if that makes a difference, but there seems to be a subtle distinction between the two.
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Playing a gay man is still just a role, the same as a man playing a killer. Ledger isn't really a gay man, and Hopkins isn't really a cannabilistic killer.
Yes, they are both fake to a certain extent. The difference is that Hopkins never killed anyone while playing his role. Ledger actually acted out his part as it really happens. I think that makes a difference.
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So Hopkins playing a psycho was fake but Ledger playing a gay cowboy was real?? Sorry, that does not equate. They're both movie roles. How is one real and the other not?
Yes, they are both roles, but in the one case, there is actual realism in the performcance of actual acts.
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You know it is possible he just OD'd accidentally. Theres no proof he killed himself. Its also been reported he had pneumonia at the time of his death.
I'm not getting involved with this "he may have killed himself because he made out with a guy" theory. All the news I'm taking right now is with a grain of salt. I'll wait until an actual investigation and autopsy are preformed before jumping to conclusions.
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
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For those making this "Brokeback" argument:
Already a small screen veteran in his native land, the tall blond had been featured as the gay cyclist Snowy Bowles in the Australian TV drama "Sweat"
Wow I had no Idea.......So this could be why his marriage did`nt work....
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that statement was just plain... not smart
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.
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Yeah, too much homophobic stuff being thrown around surrounding his death (from every angle).
He's an actor, he played the part of a gay man and did so under his own power. Hundreds or even thousands others have done the same. To insinuate the playing the role of a gay man disturbed him enough to eventually kill himself is just way too far off the deep end.
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I wonder if this will garner extra support for him winning an award for his upcoming role as the Joker. Because, by all means, The Dark Knight looks like it will be an amazing movie, pushed over the edge by a simply stunning performance by Ledger as Joker. I think there was buzz about awards talk that could go either way, since this is a comic book movie after all. But now, I've got to imagine he'll posthumously win something if this movie breaks some box office records.
In any case, this is sad news to me. I'm not a huge fan of his, but any time someone is taken so young, it gets to me. This sucks.
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He's played the part of a gay man a couple of times prior to Brokeback. I don't believe that one role would have pushed him over the edge. And personally, I thought Hopkins was VERY convincing as a psychopathic killer. All these years later and that movie still creeps me out.
While initial reports make it appear as though Ledger may have killed himself, I don't think that's the final word on this situation. If he was distrubed from his portrayal of the Joker and taking meds, he could have accidently OD'd. If he really did have pneumonia (as has been reported), he could have had a bad reaction to a medication/or again, accidently OD'd. Or he could have commited suicide. At this point, there just isn't enough information out there other than he's dead and there were pills around him.
Hell, he could have had some type of medical condition that no one knew about.
All that being said: I feel sorry for his little baby girl. No matter what happened, she still lost her father.
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Yeah, too much homophobic stuff being thrown around surrounding his death (from every angle).
He's an actor, he played the part of a gay man and did so under his own power. Hundreds or even thousands others have done the same. To insinuate the playing the role of a gay man disturbed him enough to eventually kill himself is just way too far off the deep end.
Thank you for trying to "clear the air" on the "gay/homophobic" speculations...That's all that it is and all that it will ever be. There are so many other films with people who play "gay/lesbian" characters and these actors/actresses have not been pushed to the brink of suicide or even "mass murder"...Now, to change the subject a bit on at least an either "morbid or seemingly weird pattern" that happens when celebs die, Who's next to go? Suzanne Pleshette went this weekend and now Ledger....Just curious you know they usually go in three's (3)...
Last edited by Mike; 01/23/08 05:11 AM.
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Brad Renfro died earlier last week..
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Raven
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Brad Renfro died earlier last week..
Well I guess that completes the "death tri-fecta"..... 
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Brad Renfro died earlier last week..
Well I guess that completes the "death tri-fecta".....
Don't forget Sam the Butcher from The Brady Bunch. Also that Pleschett (sp?) woman from the original Bob Newhart show.
Also, I just read at Aint it Cool that Ledger's work on The Dark Knight was 100% finished and wrapped. http://www.aintitcool.com/node/35367
Comic & film geeks were worried that they might have to recast or do some digital work in order for the film to go on. They did some digital touching up when Brandon Lee died while filming The Crow. Also when Oliver Reed died while filming Gladiator.
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I'm not getting involved with this "he may have killed himself because he made out with a guy" theory.
That is not what I am doing. In my original post I specifically stated that I was making no connections to his death. This is a side discussion that has nothing to do with his death.
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For those making this "Brokeback" argument:
Already a small screen veteran in his native land, the tall blond had been featured as the gay cyclist Snowy Bowles in the Australian TV drama "Sweat"
Wow I had no Idea.......So this could be why his marriage did`nt work....
Hold on, guys. There is a big difference between plarying a role where one is labeled the gay guy and one in which the actor must actually perform realistic acts. I do not know the show, but exactly how he played the part makes a difference.
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Yeah, too much homophobic stuff being thrown around surrounding his death (from every angle).
I cannot speak for others, but there is nothing homophobic about what I am discussing. Once again, this is a side discussion that I started about human experience. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HOW HE DIED.
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All that being said: I feel sorry for his little baby girl. No matter what happened, she still lost her father.
Yeah, that is the first thing that came to my mind. I hope his little girl is taken care of.
And I am doing my best to derail the supposed "Brokeback Theory" that is starting here. I never was making any connection between his acting and his death, as anyone can read in my original post.
From the top of page 2: Quote:
Interesting. I wouldn't make any connections to his movies and his death, but I would like to consider it as an isolated topic. Playing a role in a movie is like becoming what one portrays. So in his case, it may have caused some problems for him because he literally was playing a gay man. I think that has more to do with it than the fact that people saw him doing it. He is an actor, it is his job to be seen. But the role itself could have affected him.
I also think it is different than Hopkins playing Hannibal because he did not actually carry out the realistic actions of a serial killer. Also, playing a character that is psychotic would seem insignificant because there is no realism in it - it is fake. But Brokeback Mountain was real, so I could see how that could cause him problems.
All just speculation though.
Last edited by Mantis; 01/23/08 10:35 AM.
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Yeah, too much homophobic stuff being thrown around surrounding his death (from every angle).
I cannot speak for others, but there is nothing homophobic about what I am discussing. Once again, this is a side discussion that I started about human experience. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HOW HE DIED.
No, I got you dude.  I wasn't responding to anything you said (or really anything specific anyone else said in this thread - though a few have touched on it a bit). I was more or less speaking to what I've heard overall from everywhere, this board included, in the past 24 hours.
I can't speak for Heath....maybe that role took an emotional toll on him. And it may have also been a role that he was very, very proud of. Heck, the hardest part of being an actor is playing a role that "you aren't" and convincing people "you are"....right? That is the overall goal of acting if you will.
To say that his role in Brokeback Mountain had negatively impacted his life is possible......though highly unlikely in my opinion. That role "made him". Other than the homophobic part of society, he was widely praised for his effort. With that being said about how you may technically be right....you'd also have to agree its also possible it was the highlight of his life......being that anything is possible.
While watching TMZ last night, someone mentioned he was sick with pneumonia and was taking medication. This may have been a possible accidental overdoes (or a bad reaction to a combination of pills).
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you'd also have to agree its also possible it was the highlight of his life......being that anything is possible.
Absolutely true. The performance he gave in that film was undoubtedly the best thing he has ever done and will ever do. Everything else is just speculation.
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Also, I just read at Aint it Cool that Ledger's work on The Dark Knight was 100% finished and wrapped. http://www.aintitcool.com/node/35367
Comic & film geeks were worried that they might have to recast or do some digital work in order for the film to go on. They did some digital touching up when Brandon Lee died while filming The Crow. Also when Oliver Reed died while filming Gladiator.
Yes, but I've heard from one of my friends who's really into Batman that the Joker does not die in the Dark Knight. So they will have to figure out some way to tie up the loose ends with the character assuming they make a 3rd installment with Christian Bale.
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Yes, but I've heard from one of my friends who's really into Batman that the Joker does not die in the Dark Knight. So they will have to figure out some way to tie up the loose ends with the character assuming they make a 3rd installment with Christian Bale.
I hope nobody minds us talking about Batman instead of homophobia. 
That's a good point about the 3rd movie, which I think is definitely happening. I would assume that if the Joker isn't killed, he'll be locked up in Arkham Asylum, or just escape. If they have a tease at the end of this new one like at the end of Begins, it will be frustrating w/ no more Joker in 3. I'm almost positive that 2 Face, who will also be introduced in this new one, will be the main villain in the 3rd movie.
Still, a young actor has passed away. That's more important than Batman movies.
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But he's been working on a new movie. I don't remember the name of it. It's an odd name it's something to do with a Doctor. I know "Doctor" is in the title of it. It's a wierd name. But anyway - RIP Heath
The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus
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http://www.canada.com/globaltv/national/...1c4&k=88151Initial Heath Ledger Autopsy Inconclusive Jen McDonnell, Dose An initial autopsy performed Wednesday was unable to determine Heath Ledger's cause of death, according to officials. "The autopsy was inconclusive," New York City Medical Examiner spokeswoman Ellen Borakove said in a statement. "We have to do further testing including toxicology and tissue testing. Neither cause of death or manner of death has been concluded. We expect additional results in 10 days to two weeks." Medical examiners are going to need at least 10 more days to determine Heath Ledger's cause of death after the initial autopsy proved inconclusive. The 28-year-old actor was found Tuesday afternoon in his New York apartment, naked, unconscious and face-down at the foot of the bed. Paramedics were unable to revive him. Prescription sleeping pills were found at the scene, and several media outlets are reporting Ledger was suffering from pneumonia at the time of his death. Initial police reports suggest Ledger's death was caused by a possible drug overdose and appeared to be accidental. Meanwhile, stars connected to the actor continue to express their shock and grief. Model Helena Christensen revealed to Women's Wear Daily she was on her way to see Ledger on Tuesday when she heard the news. "I was on my way over to pay him a visit when I found out," Christensen – who was romantically linked to the actor – said. "I had just left him a message and heard his voice on the machine. He was such a special and genuine person, so extraordinarily talented because he was so raw and honest with his feelings. He was so full of life, so electric ... This is immensely sad." Naomi Watts, who dated Ledger for nearly two years after they met on the set of Ned Kelly in 2002, has canceled all her press appearances today at the Sundance Film Festival, where her new movie is set to premiere at midnight, reports E! News. Perhaps the strangest celebrity reaction has come from Jack Nicholson. When photographers broke the news of Ledger's death to the veteran actor -- who also played The Joker -- in London last night, Nicholson simply said, "I warned him."
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In recent interviews, Ledger had disclosed that in preparing for and carrying out the role of the Joker, he began to contemplate the character's complete lack of any social redeeming qualities. He claimed it bothered him and was causing him to lose sleep...I'm sure this will hit the newswire and eb over-analyzed eventually.
I'm not going to insinuate the guy died because of a fixation with the evil of the Joker, but if you're looking for distress over a movie role, it ain't the gay one.
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He could have fixated over how bad The Brothers Grimm turned out.
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Thanks Phil, that is interesting.
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Heath Ledger Found Dead
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