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One thing is this,, I'm no big Bball fan, but those of you who are, do you think the Cavs have significantly improved themselves with these moves?
I don't know that we significantly improved, but I think we improved. The best part of the deal is that Ferry DIDN'T morgage the future just to "make a move". If anything, he put us in a great position to maneuver these next two years because we'll have $33 million in expiring contracts to play with next year and $30 million the year after that. We'll be able to trade for just about anyone we want to.
The players in the trade itself is somewhat lateral, but I think they fit our team needs a lot better.
Wallace for Hughes breaks down to one horrible contract for another. As happy as we are to unload Hughes onto Chicago, Bulls fans are just as happy that they unloaded Wallace onto us. The big question: Is Wallace playing poorly lately because he's unmotivated and not getting along with the coach ... or because he's old and breaking down? But the thing is, we KNEW the Hughes experiment wasn't working. We swapped it for the Wallace experiment, which at least has a *chance* of working. Also, Ben has a few more playoff rings and All-Star appearances. We've got two former All-Star centers now! ... sure they are both on the downsides of their careers, and polar opposites of each other, but at least we can see how it works out, rather than knowing the outcome (like with Hughes).
Gooden for Smith ... I originally though of Smith as a bench scrub that would see no signifigant minutes, but then reading about what Chicago fans have said about him, this might be a good thing. Yes, he's older and less talented than Gooden, and it's likely a downgrade ... but what Smith lacks in talent when compared to Gooden, he makes up for in consistancy. Something tells me that he could start at PF, and with Lebron constantly feeding him ... he could put up similar stats as Drew. At any rate, he's likely going to come off the bench, so that means we've got some good depth at PF now!
Thinking about the previous roster ... I think the two guys that Lebron would of wanted off the team would of been Hughes and Gooden. They seem like the two he was always angry with for botching something simple. Hughes for taking rediculous shots, and Gooden for being wildly inconsistant. Maybe we just fleeced the Bulls for getting rid of two guys we wanted to unload anyway?
So back to the trade ... Wally for Marshall. This is a straight upgrade. I think Wally fills the same roll as Marshall ... a forward who is a 3-threat when we need offense. Except Wally is a much more consistant 3 point shooter. He doesn't play defense at all, which is why I think he's not going to start but be a 3pt role-playing bench option. (which is a good thing to have)
Shannon Brown/Ira Newble/Cedric Simmons for Delonte West ... West is the real X factor here. He's the point guard we've needed for awhile, but can he be a true point guard? He's sort of a tweener. If he can step up and be a solid starter, this deal was a steal. Brown/Newble/Simmons just weren't in the plans for us, and weren't getting signifigant minutes (except for maybe Newble). West could possibly be the starting point guard we've been missing.
So a lot hinges on how well West and Wallace pan out, but it's a calculated risk. The fact that we didn't hurt ourselves at all in the future makes this a good trade. 
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All Pro
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Hey LeBron James.....why don't you fly in 2morrow and go w/me to the game....but instead of using my season tixs to watch the game.....me and you can suit up and help our boys', since they only have 6 players on the roster......... 
i would but i have a hockey game
and i can't let my guys down
sorry cavs!
One day if you come to the 'land,we'll have to get to the"Q".....sometimes my son doesn't wannna go......
![[Linked Image from i73.photobucket.com]](http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i209/JC21721/sig_40.jpg) "What's up? All you Haters!"
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Legend
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Cool.. Frankly I have no idea.. don't pay that much attention to B ball... But always glad to hear the home team is improving.. I did see PTI on ESPN last night,, Cornheiser or whatever his name is didn't like the deal.. he said it was NO improvement whatsoever,, the other guy thought it was a great improvement.. I don't know the difference
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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We are also in a much better place for next year with expiring or at least tradable contracts. The talking heads on TV haven't mentioned that part....which to me is the best part of the trade.
To me that's the MOST IMPORTANT statement......we will have lots of cash money when its time to re-up LBJ and put his supersquad together.......and when that happens, scoot over Oscar....... 
"What's up? All you Haters!"
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Kornheiser knows nothing about basketball...Wilbon on the other hand, covers basketball.
This move made a lot of Piston fans scared...and for good reason.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Detroit still scares me a little with the match-up. However, I feel like we match-up 20x better with Boston now.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
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Yeah, Tony K is the last person you want to get yuor sports information from.
Eat it Phil...
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Detroit still scares me a little with the match-up. However, I feel like we match-up 20x better with Boston now.
Detroit still has the better bench, which will definitely give them the advantage over us...but I think we are in much better shape with some scorers
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Gooden for Smith ... I originally though of Smith as a bench scrub that would see no signifigant minutes, but then reading about what Chicago fans have said about him, this might be a good thing. Yes, he's older and less talented than Gooden, and it's likely a downgrade ... but what Smith lacks in talent when compared to Gooden, he makes up for in consistancy. Something tells me that he could start at PF, and with Lebron constantly feeding him ... he could put up similar stats as Drew. At any rate, he's likely going to come off the bench, so that means we've got some good depth at PF now!
Excel,
Just from watching Smith the last month or so, I can say that he's a better player then Drew. Drew is younger and a bit more athletic but Smith is a much more consistent scorer.
He has a great mid-range face up game and is a guy that can easily go off for 20+ if you don't pay attention to him. Since he started playing more minutes with the Bulls, he's posted I believe 4-5 games of 20+ since the new year and averaged a little over 17 PPG in his 7 or 8 starts in February. The last few weeks he was Chicago's best/most consistent performer when I had a chance to see them play.
I watched him most recently last week against Miami and he was just fantastic. Something like 8/14 from the field, 20 points and 10 rebounds. I'm excited to see him play with a superstar that will attract a lot of attention. He'll be stroking baseline and foul line extended jumpers all day.
He has plenty of life left in his legs/game and I think he'll actually play much better then Drew did. We'll lose a little rebounding but his defense obviously can't be worse then Gooden's. Plus, Big Ben will pick up the slack on the glass.
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Legend
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Smith really is a pro's pro.
He's been around .... can rebound ..... and has a nice game from about 15 feet facing the basket. He's not a superstar type .... but throw him out on the court with a player who demands a double team, and he can be very productive.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Yeah, Tony K is the last person you want to get yuor sports information from.
It still amazes me to this day how he got the MNF job.
"My opinions and feelings are mine and shall not be influenced by anyone....especially liberals."
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I have a HUGE ear to ear grin on my face over this trade. Danny has already done a better job as a GM then he ever did as a player. Now the new guys have a ton or work to do to learn the offense and get use to each other before the playoffs start.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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I hear ya GM! Makes me wonder if he feels guilty over that contract he had! Maybe he feels like he still owes the Cavs.
Whatever........I'm glad to have him
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Legend
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Yeah, Gilbert isn't afraid to spread a little dough around,, that's for sure..
One thing is this,, I'm no big Bball fan, but those of you who are, do you think the Cavs have significantly improved themselves with these moves?
yes, i don't know about significantly, but we're a better team then we were a day ago...
espn is playing it down (big surprise there) but the cavs didn't take on any longer contracts (hughes and wallace are similiar, wallace makes more, but his contract is front loaded which means his salary will go down 1 million each year, but both guys end the same year) and they were able to add depth in areas where we needed it...
the key is ben wallace, if he becomes motivated, and plays like he can, then this whole deal looks a hell of a lot better, if he doesn't, then we've traded one really bad contract for another, and a couple of useless pieces for complimentary players, i don't think we got screwed at all... this trade, for cleveland is going to be good or great...
and i believe that danny ferry has a plan, the more i think about it... he didn't get that elite perimeter guard, or the all star hall of fame point guard, but, what he did do was get some pieces to help his superstar, and set himself up, where next season, he will have teams begging them to take their superstar players...
so, quantity this year, and quality next year, and i believe what happens next year with those contracts, and in the offseason following, will make or break the cavaliers.. if they can add that premier player, tracy mcgrady, michael redd, and then get yourself another point guard, there will be no way in hell lebron leaves the cavs, because this team will be too good for him to pass up (not to mention that 6yr 150m contract that only the cavs can offer)
they would go from being a team that scratched and clawed their way to the finals, to a team expected to go to the finals and dominate the way the old bulls used to....
i didn't like this trade at first, but the more i think about it, the more i like it
and i think it's because i'm a defensive guy, doesn't matter what sport it is, i always prefer a good defense to a good offense, and we will not be as good on the perimeter as we were, but not as bad as these morons like tim legler are saying...
i also heard stephen a smith spewing garbage on kenny roda's show yesterday about how his sources tell him lebron wants out
i wonder if these were the same sources that 2 years ago, said lebron james wasn't going to sign an extension with the cavs? remember that whole deal?
he also said that his sources said iverson would be traded, and 3 years later it finally happened
don't buy into his garbage, every year he talks about that, and it's no secret he's a new york guy...
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Legend
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Nice,, Thanks LBJ,,, Thanks for explaining it to me.... I don't know Jack about B Ball,,,
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Here's what Bill Simmons had to say about the trade on ESPN.com: As for the other big trade this week, kudos to Danny Ferry for somehow getting four of the best five players in an 11-player trade. That has to be some sort of record, right? I already made the case for Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West helping the Cavs in my Trade Machine piece Wednesday (scroll down to trade 4a), but the Chicago guys pushed the deal over the top for me. First, Drew Gooden needed to go -- he was too inconsistent and too much of a bonehead, and we neared the point where a fed-up LeBron might punch him in the face during a game about three months ago -- and Joe Smith gives the Cavs steadier minutes and reliable production with those minutes. (Maybe Smith's ceiling isn't as high as Gooden's from game to game, but when you have LeBron, you need consistency from the rest of the guys more than anything else.) Second, the fact Ferry was able to trade an overpaid guard who actually drove a frustrated Cavs fan to create a site called www.heylarryhughespleasestoptakingsomanybadshots.com and update it every day ... I mean, even if you got back a dead body for Larry Hughes, it would have been a moral victory.
Instead, the Cavs got back the Artist Formerly Known As Ben Wallace, someone who stopped being an elite rebounder and shot-blocker about three years ago, but someone with playoff experience and the ability to defend bigger guys like KG, Shaq, Duncan or whomever. He certainly makes more sense for the 2008 Cavs than Larry Hughes did. Anyway, I thought the Cavs could win the East before this trade, simply because none of the Eastern teams have someone who can match baskets with LeBron in a close game. Now? They're the favorites. Look, I love the Celtics, I watch them every game, it has been the most enjoyable season in 15 years ... but a playoff series almost always comes down to one question as long as both sides are relatively equal:
Which team has the best guy?
Well, LeBron is better than anyone else in the East. So if you were beating Cleveland this spring, it was happening because your supporting cast was significantly better than LeBron's supporting cast. That's why this trade was so dangerous for Boston and Detroit; it shortened the sizable gap between guys 2 through 12 on Cleveland and guys 2 through 12 on Boston and Detroit. Now LeBron has four shooters who have shot 40-plus from 3-point range at least once in their career (Wally, Delonte, Boobie Gibson and Sasha Pavlovic), three playoff-proven forwards who can defend and rebound (Wallace, Smith and Anderson Varejao), a scoring center (Zydrunas Ilgauskas), and best of all, no Larry Hughes screwing everything up. LeBron is in a much better place than he was last year, and what's even more frightening is that he has been playing out of his mind since last April. I know the Celtics are 41-11, and I know the Pistons have been there a million times ... but still, how could you bet against LeBron in the East when he's playing like this?
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Legend
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dude, is bill simmons giving the cavs props?
i think i just saw satan ride by in a snowbile...
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Hall of Famer
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ERIC SNOW a player in this win. recognize,
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Legend
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Quote:
ERIC SNOW
a player in this win. recognize,
Um ... yeah, so was Kaniel Dickens. Snow played awful, I thought.
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check the replay on the LB dunk at the end of the 1st QT
eric made that dunk. way to box out.
its the little things.
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Both announcers mentioned the Bronx cheer Snow got when he made that long j somewhere near the end of the second early part of the third. Talked about how bad snow's been shooting recently. Snow took it pretty good.
Today was the first time I heard anybody on ESPN think the trade was good. Legler and somebody else blasted it yesterday after it happened saying that the Cavs lost their two best perimeter defenders in Hughes and Newble to gain some defense in the middle.
And then today, Woody was the only one that liked it on Around the Horn, Plascke, Marriotti, and Blackistone all sold the trade cause they thought Wallace was washed up. Adande said it was good today on PTI Korheiser hated it. Then on NBA Shootaround both Walton and Stephen A said it was a great trade for Cleveland cause they dumped Hughes and picked up Ben Wallace. Stephen A. was raving about Delonte West saying he's a great PG and he was the best part of the deal for the Cavs.
I liked how the announcers at the game tonight talked about how the trade would impact the team after Andy, Sasha, and Boobie get back. They said that the Cavs will be REALLY deep at that point.
LIbertatem Defendimus!!
2010 Dawgtalkers NCAA Bracket Challenge Champ!!
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Man I haven't posted on here forever. Gotta weigh in on this for sure. I have been hoping to get a physical center for years now (down low anyhow because he will be playin PF) and last year when Ben was available I was wishing the Cav's would go after him. I have wanted a physical attitude on this team and Wallace fits the bill. As much as I hate detroit I have always liked Ben Wallace. I couldn't be more happy to see him here. Im glad to see Marshall go and Smith is definately an upgrade over him. I hope West can be the PG we have been looking for and I have a real good feeling about him. I don't know much about Wally if anything but if he can shoot the ball and he can do it anywhere from the floor instead of just the three point line then i'm excited to have him. The best thng about this whole deal is having alot of wiggle room with expiring contracts and to have this years FA market absolutely LOADED is really what makes me so excited. Has anyone seen how many phenominal players are going to be Fa's this year? Chauncey Billups, Gilbert Arenas, Allen Iverson, Barron Davis just to name a couple. I will try to find the list. Here it is. Careful you might need a change of underwear. http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008FreeAgents
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Legend
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Man I haven't posted on here forever. Gotta weigh in on this for sure.
I have been hoping to get a physical center for years now (down low anyhow because he will be playin PF) and last year when Ben was available I was wishing the Cav's would go after him. I have wanted a physical attitude on this team and Wallace fits the bill. As much as I hate detroit I have always liked Ben Wallace. I couldn't be more happy to see him here.
Im glad to see Marshall go and Smith is definately an upgrade over him. I hope West can be the PG we have been looking for and I have a real good feeling about him. I don't know much about Wally if anything but if he can shoot the ball and he can do it anywhere from the floor instead of just the three point line then i'm excited to have him.
The best thng about this whole deal is having alot of wiggle room with expiring contracts and to have this years FA market absolutely LOADED is really what makes me so excited.
Has anyone seen how many phenominal players are going to be Fa's this year? Chauncey Billups, Gilbert Arenas, Allen Iverson, Barron Davis just to name a couple. I will try to find the list.
Here it is. Careful you might need a change of underwear.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?page=2008FreeAgents
the problem is, we don't get that wiggle room until 2 offseasons from now...
next year, we have very little cap relief, and with what we do have, we will probably use to re-sign restricted FA boobie gibson...
it will be a quiet offseason for the cavs, BUT, when next season starts, up until the trade deadline, the cavs should be able to acquire the best player on the trading block, and with whatever they have left, which should be a lot, they could sign a top 2, top 3 free agent in the '09 offseason
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But with expiring contracts couldn't we trade away some people for a possible superstar?
Lets say Gilbert Arenas wants to leave Washington could we make a trade with them and send some of our guy's there way for him since he has an early termination option?
How does this work? This stuff is confusing.
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The Cavs have no cap room this offseason, plus a few free agents (Daniel Gibson, Dwayne Jones, and Delonte West who is a RFA). They will not be a player for anybody that isn't those guys, looking at the MLE, or at the veteran minimum. Like was said, after next year, the team will have ~$25-30 million in cap room, or some of that could be dealt for a player during the season. Then, following the '09-'10 season, there would be another $30 million in LeBron, Wallace, etc. becoming FAs. It'll be a quiet offseason, but next season could be a lot of fun.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
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Quote:
But with expiring contracts couldn't we trade away some people for a possible superstar?
Lets say Gilbert Arenas wants to leave Washington could we make a trade with them and send some of our guy's there way for him since he has an early termination option?
How does this work? This stuff is confusing.
after this season, when free agency opens up, the cavs will be able to very little, the most important thing will be to get boobie gibson re-signed, and that won't be hard, he's restricted, and he will be paid...
i personally would like to see devin brown re-signed, other then that, the cavs will remain quiet this summer
now, when next season starts, that's when ferry's phone will be ringing off the hook...
and like you said about gilbert arenas, any player who isn't happy, or any team who wants to start the rebuilding process, will be calling danny ferry...
next season we will have 33 million in expiring deals, consider eric snow, damon jones, and most likely joe smith gone, that's 16 million right there.
now, people have talked about michael redd, michael redd makes 18 million a year, should the cavs covet him, and should the bucks want to unload him, you can make that work... it's a tough decision, because while michael redd is a cold-blooded scorer, 18 million for a guy who doesn't play a whole lot of defense is quite a chunk of change...
milwaukee would pull that deal in a heartbeat, because instead of having to pay redd their money, they'd get the cap relief from jones, snow, and smith coming off the books...
the problem is, talking about it now is tough to do, who's going to fall next season? who's going to be unhappy with their team? you just don't know, but i will tell you that january and february of '09 will be an exciting time to be a cavs fan, because they will be getting someone...
let's assume the cavs pull that deal off, the season ends, and with redd already acquired, the contracts of wally z and anderson varejao come off the books, in which that is almost 18 million more coming off the cavs books, you can decide what to do with andy (but with wallace, we'd be more than ok if he walks) but you'll be able to acquire another very good player...
and what cavs fans should hope for is that they strike gold at the deadline, and then sign another player, so that in the summer of 2010, lebron james will sign an exclusive 6 year, 150 million dollar deal, keeping him in cleveland for his prime...
it all depends on what the cavs can do with those expiring deals (ben wallace comes off the books, which is 15m more, so on top of signing lebron to more money, they should have a little bit more
the cavs will be very very deep 2 seasons from now, which is good
the cavs organization has done a tremendous job of setting themselves up to try and keep lebron in town...
it's not about market size, it's about winning, if it was about playing in a bigger market, lebron would have never extended 2 years ago, he wants to win, bottom line, and the cavs have to get it done next year with those resources...
i've been trying to find the 2009 nba free agent list, but can't, that is the list you want to look at, on top of seeing who's made available at next year's deadline
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edit: michael redd only makes 14m a year, i thought it was 18, my mistake...
well, at least it's 14 this year, i don't know if his contract is back-loaded or not...
it's only my opinion, but i think the player the cavs should go after next year should play the 2 guard position...
i know people talk about point guard, but i think the 2-guard position has been our biggest weak spot... lebron plays a lot of point, and you've also got the big question mark that is delonte west, he's promising, and i love his size and skills, but you just don't know until you see him play, you've also got boobie gibson who could one day develop into your point guard
but the 2-guard position is very important in the nba, and you've gotta get very strong there, you need a big time guy, michael redd fits that bill
west
redd
james
wallace
z
bench: gibson, wally, sasha, andy
that could be our team after the deadline next year, that could get you a championship.
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i've been trying to find the 2009 nba free agent list, but can't, that is the list you want to look at, on top of seeing who's made available at next year's deadline
RealGM Page
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Quote:
i've been trying to find the 2009 nba free agent list, but can't, that is the list you want to look at, on top of seeing who's made available at next year's deadline
RealGM Page
that's a pretty good class
elton brand? oh man...
baron davis, shawn marion, andre miller, gilbert arenas
wow...
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Don't forget CP3!!
Thanks for the sunday school lesson. I just don't understand the whole NBA deal of contracts but that helped alot. The main thign I thought was by people saying expiring contracts was that they were expiring at the end of this season leaving us with alot of room to make moves. But I guess the majority is expirng after next season.
But with Arenas, Baron Davis, Corey Maggette, Allen Iverson and a select few others they have an early termination option this season so they could very well be with another team or re-signed by this time next year. Is that correct?
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
How many of those guys are ever going to hit the free agent market though? The NBA bargaining agreement is setup so that it's easier for current teams to retain their players. That's why we didnt' get Michael Redd the last time he hit free agency ... because he could get $15 million more staying with the Bucks.
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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I don't know. The Cav's have one of the best organizations in the NBA it seems for player luxury and we have the best player in the NBA. (pffft Kobe Bryant). Those things alone should draw players here if the money is similar.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
Don't forget CP3!!
Thanks for the sunday school lesson. I just don't understand the whole NBA deal of contracts but that helped alot. The main thign I thought was by people saying expiring contracts was that they were expiring at the end of this season leaving us with alot of room to make moves. But I guess the majority is expirng after next season.
But with Arenas, Baron Davis, Corey Maggette, Allen Iverson and a select few others they have an early termination option this season so they could very well be with another team or re-signed by this time next year. Is that correct?
i wouldn't even bother with cp3, he's restricted and the hornets would be dumb to not match
the only thing the cavs could do, is offer him big time money, and hope that the hornets, with their future in doubt, don't match, very very very unlikely...
the cavs won't have much of a chance to acquire someone who's before their prime, they have a better chance of getting someone in their prime/on the tail end of their prime...
also, jason kidd is a free agent that season, depending on what he has left, he'd maybe sign a 1 year deal with us to try and get that ring...
i'd love the idea of getting elton brand... brand at the 5, wallace at the 4, and maybe z comes off the bench at that point, considering he's getting up there in age, probably too much money in the frontcourt though, we need help in the backcourt too much...
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,281
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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Posts: 1,281 |
Quote:
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But with expiring contracts couldn't we trade away some people for a possible superstar?
Lets say Gilbert Arenas wants to leave Washington could we make a trade with them and send some of our guy's there way for him since he has an early termination option?
How does this work? This stuff is confusing.
after this season, when free agency opens up, the cavs will be able to very little, the most important thing will be to get boobie gibson re-signed, and that won't be hard, he's restricted, and he will be paid...
i personally would like to see devin brown re-signed, other then that, the cavs will remain quiet this summer
now, when next season starts, that's when ferry's phone will be ringing off the hook...
and like you said about gilbert arenas, any player who isn't happy, or any team who wants to start the rebuilding process, will be calling danny ferry...
next season we will have 33 million in expiring deals, consider eric snow, damon jones, and most likely joe smith gone, that's 16 million right there.
now, people have talked about michael redd, michael redd makes 18 million a year, should the cavs covet him, and should the bucks want to unload him, you can make that work... it's a tough decision, because while michael redd is a cold-blooded scorer, 18 million for a guy who doesn't play a whole lot of defense is quite a chunk of change...
milwaukee would pull that deal in a heartbeat, because instead of having to pay redd their money, they'd get the cap relief from jones, snow, and smith coming off the books...
the problem is, talking about it now is tough to do, who's going to fall next season? who's going to be unhappy with their team? you just don't know, but i will tell you that january and february of '09 will be an exciting time to be a cavs fan, because they will be getting someone...
let's assume the cavs pull that deal off, the season ends, and with redd already acquired, the contracts of wally z and anderson varejao come off the books, in which that is almost 18 million more coming off the cavs books, you can decide what to do with andy (but with wallace, we'd be more than ok if he walks) but you'll be able to acquire another very good player...
and what cavs fans should hope for is that they strike gold at the deadline, and then sign another player, so that in the summer of 2010, lebron james will sign an exclusive 6 year, 150 million dollar deal, keeping him in cleveland for his prime...
it all depends on what the cavs can do with those expiring deals (ben wallace comes off the books, which is 15m more, so on top of signing lebron to more money, they should have a little bit more
the cavs will be very very deep 2 seasons from now, which is good
the cavs organization has done a tremendous job of setting themselves up to try and keep lebron in town...
it's not about market size, it's about winning, if it was about playing in a bigger market, lebron would have never extended 2 years ago, he wants to win, bottom line, and the cavs have to get it done next year with those resources...
i've been trying to find the 2009 nba free agent list, but can't, that is the list you want to look at, on top of seeing who's made available at next year's deadline
Boy Lebron, You have sure changed your stance on whether Redd would be an option at this point next year. Last week in that other thread when I mentioned him for this time next year, you told me you thought no way Milwaukee would trade him to a team in their own division.
Now you are saying things like "they would do it in a heartbeat". I tried telling you that with rebuilding they are going to be looking for "the best package". If we have it, they are not going to give a rats ass if that deal comes from the Central 
I heart winning
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
well, i was using redd as an example, but, based on what a friend of mine who is a die hard bucks fan has told me, i'd say there's a really good chance of that happening next year...
i didn't realize how bad it was, but apparently a lot of the group isn't talking to him in the locker room, and unnamed sources (he thinks it's bogut) has told reporters he no longer wants to play with him
but, if milwaukee can deal him to the western conference, they'll do it, but the cavs could offer a package of all expiring contracts, which i don't know how many teams in the west can do that...
a lot happened when jason kidd went to dallas, i said it was a sure thing if he stayed in new jersey this year, that next year he would be a cavalier, now he's most likely there until the end of next season
but yeah, i think it could happen, you do have to realize other contenders will want redd as much as us, and if milwaukee can get him out of the central, and/or out of the east, they'll do it...
i still think tracy mcgrady is a possibility, i don't think houston needs him, and would probably like the cap relief to bring in another player the following year...
but he has his own issues, i'd love to see him paired with lebron though...
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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I think both Redd and McGrady are chemistry killers. I don't think either would fit in very well w/this team.
We need a guy more in the Ray Allen mode, i.e.-------he doesn't need to be the star; he doesn't need to be the # 1 option; he doesn't need ALL the attention......he just contributes in a big way on most nights.
The only position I would take a star at is point guard. Point guard is a different breed and a star at that position could really help LeBron.
I do have to add this though. Kevin Garnett is the one superstar who could have meshed well w/LeBron. The guy is a superstar, but he doesn't have that selfish mentality that most scorers have. They would have been something together.
There is another superstar who could mesh w/LeBron. That's Duncan, but he will never go anywhere.
My point is that guys like Redd and McGrady would not be good fits here. We might be more entertaining, but we wouldn't win the championship w/them. Give me a guy w/Ray Allen's talent and mindset and I will give you the championship.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,681
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,681 |
I agree. Super players many times have super egos honed by years of being the best player on the team, city, or state.
It takes a personality that doesn't mind sharing the wealth so to speak. You have to look real hard when you start talking about bringing a couple of those guys together...especially if you do it mid career. If you somehow manage to do it when they are first coming up it can sometimes work because it is easier for them to fit into whatever role develops. Sort of a natural progression.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
I think both Redd and McGrady are chemistry killers. I don't think either would fit in very well w/this team.
We need a guy more in the Ray Allen mode, i.e.-------he doesn't need to be the star; he doesn't need to be the # 1 option; he doesn't need ALL the attention......he just contributes in a big way on most nights.
The only position I would take a star at is point guard. Point guard is a different breed and a star at that position could really help LeBron.
I do have to add this though. Kevin Garnett is the one superstar who could have meshed well w/LeBron. The guy is a superstar, but he doesn't have that selfish mentality that most scorers have. They would have been something together.
There is another superstar who could mesh w/LeBron. That's Duncan, but he will never go anywhere.
My point is that guys like Redd and McGrady would not be good fits here. We might be more entertaining, but we wouldn't win the championship w/them. Give me a guy w/Ray Allen's talent and mindset and I will give you the championship.
you never know what could happen when a guy changes situations...
redd is on a bad team in milwaukee, he's unhappy, he wants to win, if he comes into mike brown's system, he could change (i still don't like his defense)
but redd or mcgrady could be the best available to us next season
and i honestly think this team could use a bit of a ballhog... lebron has no problem passing the ball, i don't see why it wouldn't work, outside of both of those guys not playing defense...
to be honest, the guy i'd like to have, is ron artest, i wish he could get his head on straight, he's the perfect fit, both for mike brown, and lebron james, 2 way player, very unselfish on the court, and has said on multiple occasions that he'd love to play alongside lebron james, he even said he'd come off the bench, back when indiana was trying to trade him
but he's got so much baggage, that the only thing the cavs could really do is sign a one year deal for decent money, and hope you get one year, you don't want that guy for more than a year, but that's the kind of perimeter defender we need...
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,445
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
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May I introduce to you...
Mr. Chris Paul...New Orleans Hornets...
Screw Jason Kidd and Bibby...
Go Browns!!!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,027 |
Quote:
May I introduce to you...
Mr. Chris Paul...New Orleans Hornets...
Screw Jason Kidd and Bibby...
we basically have no chance at getting paul... probably not for another 4 or 5 years...
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