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Well............I think you actually did consider what I had to say. That's all I asked.
One thing, my man. I don't discount Brady being a factor. I simply have never thought as highly of him as you have. You know what my concerns are w/him. They haven't changed. I'm not saying I am right, but those concerns remain. Hell, him dropping in the draft and him not pushing DA out the door has actually strengthened those concerns. Not by a lot, but I certainly don't feel better about him now than I did before the draft.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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"It's bull for you, me or anyone not to admitt or make an effotrt to represent that you have not had differences with decisisions made by the FO or CS's in the past."
Well thats a load of Bull...  As stated in the QB debates I have been consistent - don't get this BULL about not ever disagreeing with anything the FO n staff have done Bull. The subject at hand is about QBs...if you can state one reference of my posting past where this is BULL then so do it...If you can't then you are playing some kind of game that doesn't come close to thick skin...I don't mind debate but thick has nothing to do with making something up about my character and basically call me a Liar...Which is exactly what Bull in this reference does. I didn't Lie, Misrepresent myself nor miscommunicated. Thats why I just don't get it. It has nothing to do with thick skin or not. Just Where is the Truth in this???
"Any other perspectives or factual representations that expand on these statements are total speculation,"
You mean like "FOOTWORK" - you telling me I cannot see - No MATTER IF HE"S PLAYING AGAINST Studs or Not For Long guys - footwork isn't footwork.
So what are you saying the representations for BQ have to be dummied down to what ever level you can summize? And nobody elses. I stated one fact about BQs play...His footwork is excellent! This is fact from my eyes...not speculation.
The rest - I stated we haven't seen enough of his play to even have drawn up questions about his game. But sorry footwork is footwork.
"As of now DA is the stud. I know you know that."
Nobody Knows that...not even our staff - how many stud QBs at 24-25 get re-signed for 3 years...and not even sniffed at in negotiations for 5-7 years...its not like we settled for 3. We refused to even talk about Long Term...so quite frankly that "KNOW" stuff is a bunch of BULL 
Honestly...outside of having a clear cut respect for Paul Zuk - I have shown no bias to any Browns player except for the fact that they are great (Brown n Orange glasses) because they adorn our colors! And yet here I am and I welcome DA becoming a stud - but I fear the opposite about him cause there are so many UNSTUDLY things about his game and questions. And anyone who doesn't recognize those questions being there are truly lost in credibility on the QB subject.
I'm not saying anyone who believes DA to be the future is not credible...I'm saying those who believe there are no great questions about his game that need to be improved or he will not be our Franchise QB.
He has started 18 games and has beaten one team with a winning Record...SeaHawks - possibly I'm wrong on this account as I didn't double check just going on memory...don't want to misrepresent One playoff team Seahawks...thats it. This worries me.
When a pocket breaks down I need to see him make something out of nothing...so far he shows Zero, Nada, Zilch skills in doing so. One time I saw him not move and step into a rush bravely and got killed while making an excellent throw downfield. I can praise the good. But I'm talking about escapability and movement to buy time then making the team pay...If he just stands there and bravely steps into a rush and throws...he ain't going to last long - he will get killed!
What I need to see is accurate passes especially within the 10 yard range...these are gifts from the D game plan...and to open up the verticle game you got to make them pay there. 50% is Horrific in this day and age There probably isn't one starter in the NFL who is below that standard! He must improve and this scares me. I also have to laugh at those who Lie and state DA's 56% is because of all the Bombs he throws...  Now that is a bunch of Bull its the 50% accuaracy he has within 10 yards. And its nothing you can say - we can live with that...no we can't - Its actually Unexceptable.
I hope the best for DA...I cherish the thought that he could be a stud. But to state I and everyone KNOWS he's a stud is pure BULL! 
Got to run...JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Vers... I know you weren't big on Quinn before the draft and nothing he has done since then has improved his stock in your eyes, but I'm just curious... Given that, before last year's draft, we had Frye, Anderson, and Dorsey as our QBs, what direction would you rather us have gone? Do you think drafting Quinn was a mistake, especially considering what we gave up to get him? I'm just curious really.
Because I think there are some people that think it was a mistake, especially now that DA had his coming out party. But those people need to remember that we didn't have any idea DA was as good as he's turned out to be. If we could go back in time, I bet we don't go anywhere near Quinn. Unfortunately though, we didn't know enough about DA to make an informed decision at that time. We knew we had Frye, who was turning into nothing more than a career back-up. And we had an unknown entity in DA. He showed some glimpses of greatness at the end of '06 when Frye got hurt, but c'mon... nobody ever saw him as the answer. It's hard to go back and get a feel of the pulse that was the Browns QB situation at the time because so much has changed since then. But, if I'm not mistaken, it was generally perceived that Cleveland had one of the worst QB situations in the NFL.
So I'm just curious as to what you thought would have been a better option on April 28, 2007, knowing only what we knew then about our QB situation at the time. I mean, I guess we could have stood pat and gone into the season with Frye, DA, and Dorsey but it seems clear that the FO wasn't exactly comfortable doing that. And seeing as how camp went last summer, with no one to take that step forward, I think it may have yielded a different result after that Pittsburgh game. Without Quinn, we never would have traded Frye. DA may have still gone in and did what he did against Cincy, but we don't know that. Maybe he played the way he did, and will continue to do so, partly because he feels Quinn breathing down his neck for the starting job. We all know how DA can play when the chips are down and the pressure is on. Without Quinn, maybe DA doesn't feel the pressure. And maybe he doesn't play as well. Maybe we go back and forth between him and Charlie for the entire 2007 season never really establishing a solid QB to lead this team. And then, we're drafting Matt Ryan in the 2008 NFL Draft. (Okay, so MAYBE I went too far with the 'maybes', but it is interesting to think about what could have happened if Phil felt the same way you do about Brady Quinn.)
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Quote:
Vers... I know you weren't big on Quinn before the draft and nothing he has done since then has improved his stock in your eyes, but I'm just curious... Given that, before last year's draft, we had Frye, Anderson, and Dorsey as our QBs, what direction would you rather us have gone? Do you think drafting Quinn was a mistake, especially considering what we gave up to get him? I'm just curious really.
I was ecstatic when we drafted Joe w/the third overall pick. However, the move to get BQ quickly dampened that feeling.
I made it very clear off the bat that I didn't like the trade. And at that time, I had NO idea DA would ever amount to anything. I just didn't think Quinn was worth that much.
Kard, I won't say it was a mistake, because I don't know. I've always maintained that he might be a franchise qb, but I have had serious doubts about his game for a long time. Therefore, what I can say is that I think it was a "gamble" to give up so much for BQ.
We gave up the # 36 and # 22 picks for him. That's a ton. And let's face it, guys who are picked in the area where BQ was.......have been pretty awful.
I think teams passed on BQ for the same reasons that made me skeptical about his game. Numbers 1 and 2..............he never handled pressure very well.....whether it be from a pass rush or in big games. I saw him fold over and over when pressured and I saw him look like a lost, little boy when he played in a couple of bowl games.
People can talk about ND not having the talent to compete and that is true. However, BQ didn't compete very well either. And he put most of his big numbers up when ND completely outmanned teams, such as Air Force, Navy, etc.
I don't think BQ is very accurate at all, especially when he faces pressure. And despite what some claim, he will face pressure in the NFL. Our line is very good, but you have to throw w/pressure coming.
I also don't think BQ will ever stretch the field. I don't think he has a quick release. I think his accuracy is a huge question mark. Brown's players didn't give him the nickname....Wild Thing....for no reason. I also think he struggles to make some throws on the field.
I don't see BQ as "a guy." Meaning, I don't see the guys really liking him or stepping up for him. I also see his footwork as a major area of weakness when he is pressured. I actually saw him do a hop and skip in the LSU game, and that was w/very little pressure on that particular play.
He has several strengths and those have been told a thousand times on here. Many have been exaggerated. Like I said.........I think he has a chance and I am glad Phil made the deal he did w/DA. I'm not sure which QB will end up being better, but I certainly don't have nearly as much faith in BQ's game as most of the posters on this board.
One more thing...........I know this sounds crazy, but I am as sure as I can be w/out really knowing........that there is no way BQ has as much potential for growth as DA does. In fact, I think he is much closer to a finished product than DA is. Now, don't confuse that w/me saying he is a finished product, but because of the systems they played in; the coaching they got; their physical capabilities, etc........I think DA has way more upside than BQ does.
Not asking you---or anyone---to agree. But that is how I see it.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Eo, What the heck is going on with you...? Duh, the subject at hand is what it is... Are you at the Browns facility? Do you witness any of the Browns QB footwork? Do you first hand know for a fact what progress is being made by any Browns player? You have truly been totally supportive of all decisions by the Browns organization and players decissions and production as well? Never a complaint or disagreement with any one about the Browns? Hum... I didn't attack you at all... Everyone on here has had their differences in many different areas... If BQ had the year DA had last year, IMO, this discussion wouldn't be taking place... What you need to see is important to you... Not to me. The Browns organiazations critieria is different that yours as well. My criteria for for QB porduction and improvement is different than yours. If and but stats are what they are...  Look at the W's, the decisions, TD's, picks, completions, the drives, big plays... Instead of DA's second down pass attempts and completion %, on the 2nd posseion in the 3rd quarter against teams that are 500...   When you say honeslty, that means but, if and or however... That is a qualifier or a justification... Or an admition of that you have had disagreements/differenses here... IMO. DA is the Browns QB stud right now... 10-6, numbers that rival the best CB QB's of all time,2007 Team MVP, Pro-Bowl selection... If that not enough proof, then we are wasting our time... Later... 
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I made it very clear off the bat that I didn't like the trade. And at that time, I had NO idea DA would ever amount to anything. I just didn't think Quinn was worth that much.
I'll say this about that; I remember that your opinion was then exactly as you now say it was. You didn't care for the trade to get Quinn at the time so your opinion now is not one made with the advantage of hindsight. You've stuck to your take all along.
About the rest of your post; I don't agree with some of it but you laid it out as well as anyone could expect in how you evaluate Quinn. Opinions without valid reasons behind them are running rampant around here. At the least you are backing yours up with football talk.
I do think the "Wild Thing" reference is a bit reaching though because if I remember correctly that was jokingly said about him during his first week with the team after not playing football since the end of his final ND season. (Balls were missing the mark and hitting the ground from all three QB's at that time as well). I'm wondering and even doubting that the name has stuck with him all this time. It could have. But I'm doubting that unless you know better.
At any rate, I think you've made yourself and your opinion very clear all in one single post without writing 3 pages as I would have.
#gmstrong
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Hell, anyone who doesn't know how Vers feels on this topic must not be paying any attention at all...... 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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If BQ had the year DA had last year, IMO, this discussion wouldn't be taking place...
As true a statement as can be made.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Good enough Vers. There is not one thing in your post that I can really disagree with. I can't tell you how to feel or what to see. I just wondered if you thought it was still a bad decision to draft him given what we knew about our QBs at the time. Sure, it was a risk. But nothing ventured, nothing gained. JMHO.
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Quote:
Quote:
If BQ had the year DA had last year, IMO, this discussion wouldn't be taking place...
As true a statement as can be made.
I don't agree with that at all. If he had the same last half of the season that DA did, I'd be just as worried about him.
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BQ didn't even have a season...so we still can't say what he could or couldn't do.
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just clickin....
All I know is that I hope and pray like all hell that BQ flat out beats Anderson straight up and takes the job from him. Period. Aside from one of our UDFA's turning out to be better than Champ Bailey, it is the one thing I really, really, really want to see happen this summer.
Now that I'm sure I've ruffled feathers, why?
Because from the early articles, it seems that Anderson is doing well thus far, and if he is doing well - as in, he is progressing - and BQ flat out beats him... that is nothing but good, wholesome gravy for us fans and a good omen of things to come for this season.
Additionally, it would (finally!) spell the end of QB controversies in Cleveland for at least a few years.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Now that I'm sure I've ruffled feathers, That never stops anybody..except Daman..  My feathers aren't ruffled..if DA doesn't improve in his short accuracy and decision making..it is a known fact what will transpire.
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We gave up the # 36 and # 22 picks for him. That's a ton. And let's face it, guys who are picked in the area where BQ was.......have been pretty awful.
I disagree with pretty much everything you say, but this in particular doesn't make a lot of sense to me. We gave up the #22 and #36 for a #22 pick. In essence, the 22's were a wash, so we really just gave up a 2nd round pick for Quinn, right? You could argue we could have picked another player with that 22, but who? After last season, it was pretty apparent that we didn't have a QB on our roster. DA's performance was totally unexpected, even if you consider the amount of talent surrounding him. Taking BQ made perfect sense at that time, and basically only giving up only a 2nd round pick to get him was a steal. Even if you don't like Notre Dame.
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BQ didn't even have a season...so we still can't say what he could or couldn't do.
I am not saying he can or can't. I am simply reading a thread full of conjecture and picking out one of the statements I think hits a valid point.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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"What the heck is going on with you...? Duh, the subject at hand is what it is."
 I'm just stating my position and debating the issue...is this not allowed. I referenced the use of the term "Bull" in a like manner with a joking fashion...and truly joking around with it. I'm accused by you of not having thick enough skin and then when I put out a debate of my opinion your first reaction is the Above???
And your inferring that I have to be at Berea daily to have any concept and opinion regarding our QBs footwork is rediculous. Possibly its not up to date but I have seen both and can judge both. How much will change in the Offseason...I truly doubt BQ will get worse. DA? Well I welcome the miracle at hand.
"You have truly been totally supportive of all decisions by the Browns organization and players decissions and production as well? Never a complaint or disagreement with any one about the Browns? Hum."
Again I'm pretty confused by this insult to my posting character.
Is this not a QB thread?
How many times must I repeat myself?
I stated that my history as a fan and poster has been consistent with the
QB position and I have always backed the one who has been touched by the coaches to be our Starter.
Why do you continue to try to discredit my claim with this absurd inclusion of Every player Every Position since posting from 2001??? Its totally irrelevant to my claim and proves absolutely nothing except some sort of Smug exposure of me lying in my claim? I don't understand your insisting to bring this up even after I explained it in detail.
"I didn't attack you at all."
Well I have the above insulting remarks but if you feel that is not an attack in any form ok...And I have attacked you? Why if I debate somebody and prove them wrong it goes from debating football to attacking somebody. Don't play this silly game. You can debate me as hard as you wish in your style and I will not lose any respect for you as a message board friend. I don't understand if I strongly state my case...which was almost all football involved and not personality issues in there be thought of as an ATTACK...sorry I'm just debating. btw - did you reference that I don't have a thick skin...lol 
"If BQ had the year DA had last year, IMO, this discussion wouldn't be taking place."
I can't speak for others...but you better believe if BQ:
1. Fell short in his game at very crucial moments the 2nd half of the season. (specifically Steeler and Bengal game #2). His game not some wild expectations.
2. BQ was one dimensional in his footwork.
3. Hit 50% accuracy with all passes for the season from 10yard and in...considered by the NFL as taking what the defense gives you...as in high percentage and in turn low percentage in turnovers.
Are you insinuating that I idolize BQ and for that reason and that reason alone I have these questions about DA and if BQ started and had the same results I would not question them? That is a major insult - and insinuating that is most definitely attacking my character.
"What you need to see is important to you... Not to me. The Browns organiazations critieria is different that yours as well. My criteria for for QB porduction and improvement is different than yours."
To each their own...so just what are you telling me, no matter how well I prove my point you are a stone wall and won't budge...lol its sort of funny cause you actually go and accuse me of having some sort of blinders on in the subject and yet...I'm the one with an open mind - I don't see a similar reaction from you???
Most of the rest you posted I really don't comprehend what you are trying to communicate and rather try to read into it and do you an injustice I'll just skip over it.
This however is quite clear.
"DA is the Browns QB stud right now."
Thats just an incorrect statement. Not opinion and a right to an opinion.
He's a young QB with very possibly prospects of becoming a stud. But until he corrects and improves or progresses to some degree on some very Glaring Issues he is not a stud. Just a "PROMISING YOUNG PROSPECT".
As I said technically BQ looks way ahead but you are correct to summize until we see him play and a little more then 8-10 plays its absurd to state there could be no quiestions about him as well. But he too likewise is a PROMISING YOUNG PROSPECT as well...just that DA has clearly shown us enough to have questions.
He is who he is...I've said that before. DA is simply DA and got reamed for it. But its an honest statement. And what he is - definitely isn't an established "STUD".
Can he be...the door is wide open and he will more than get his shot to prove it!
Do I wish it to be...come on. You should know by now my love for the Browns supersede all other variables on individuals. I would love it to be!
Wasting time in debating??? Usually that means I'm kicking butt 
U know I love ya Boise  Its a darn QB debate, don't take it personal 
As always JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I guess anything can be said or represented if you want only to look at parts of the entire body of work...
Everyone has areas to improve in... I choose to focus on what is done well and effort to improve in those areas... I hope DA and BQ do the same... Being aware of areas to improve is important, but spending to much time on those is a poor decission. IMO.
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J/C....what's all the hub ub, bub(s)? No matter who ends up the starter or who is the backup, don't we want our backup to be confident he can lead the team? I certainly don't want the backup to feel he can't get the job done if needed whether it's BQ, DA, Ken Dorsey, or anyone else on the roster.
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Coach, you know what all the fuss is about. You're too smart not to know. One thing I wanna add here...............I have ZERO problems w/how BQ dealt w/last year's regular season and this off-season. In fact, I am impressed w/his attitude. He isn't making waves. He isn't pouting. But, he really believes in himself. That's all good.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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I love you too man... You and I are just out of sink... Thats all...  You think I'm fired up and I'm not, or I'm kidding around with you... I am in disagreement with many of your positions on this topic. But that is cool... Everyone on this board you and me included has disagreed with the FO, a draft pick made, another posters views, pimped a player what ever... I am not making any attempt to insult your in any way... You and I and many others here used to go at it here with much more intensly than we have recently. IMO. The thick skin statement was clearly joking around... I used to be far more harsh here than I am now... I'm not insiuating anything... BQ has done nothing, yet for us to make much of any comment about. I would love to see him become who we all hope he can and earn the opportunity to do so. I loved the pick and have high hopes for BQ. That being said DA had one hell of a year last year all things considered and still people have seriouis doubts... Which is fine but why bleed before we are cut. We all need to improve and grow... "When your green you grow and when your ripe you rot". "If you are not getting better you are going backwards". If DA being voted the 2007 team MVP, going to the Pro-Bowl in your first year as a starting NFL QB, putting up the numbers DA did last year and where those numbers rank amoung the all time great CB QB's does not justify DA 's stud staus as of right now what will? His 3 year deal is for what, 7 mill per? Not bad cabbage for a guy who can't play according many accounts here... I know as well as anyone here what DA's draw backs are... He grew up and played ball an hour or so plane ride north of Boise... I saw him play against Boise State, Cal, Stanford, UW, USC and the Ducks. One of my best friends is a Beaver alum so we have watched him several times live and on Direct TV for the past 5 seasons. My buddy has seen more of him, since high school than I have... Da has improved tremendously since his OSU days... But there are inherent parts of his game that we will have to live with... Every QB has drawbacks and shortcommings. IMO It will be very, extremly difficult for you or anyone else to prove much of anything about BQ and his actual proven production or NFL QB abilities... I love to see that though... IMO, it is very hard to place much credence on what BQ was able to do in his limited action against the 9'ers. It should have been a TD drive not a FG! I was impressed by his performance overall, which is big, IMO. That is not enough body of work for me to state or even prognosticate anything more than I have. Nor do I think anyone should be representing any more than that... Yet people do... Why & with what cause? IDK... Wasting time generally means the opposite of what you think it means... Peace be with you my Browns Brother.
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j/c
All I can say is, I wouldn't want to be DA this season (unless I was standing in line at the bank teller).
The 6th round draft pick QB with the 1st round pick Golden Boy from Notre Dame standing on the sidelines waiting to take his place. High expectations for the team, MANY prime time games, intense media scrutiny on everything he does wrong...
Lot's of ways to fail...not too many to succeed.
![[Linked Image from members.cox.net]](http://members.cox.net/flyinc5/smallsigpics/frcburnout.gif) AL 29 76 14 R_K
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To me he always seems relaxed, at ease and largely unaffected by things he can't have any effect on. Not that he's above it all or immune, but one thing that impressed me last year was his ability to shake off the last play. He kept an even keel throughout and usually found a way to perform, keeping the huddle loose by cracking jokes. And that seems to be his attitude in general, all part of the package. It was effective too, he didn't get rattled and the other guys made plays, sometimes spectacular ones. I'm not sure he really cares about who's in the wings any more than he has too. There's nothing he can do about it, it's better for him this way than the other way around, and he's probably first and foremost concentrated on performing better and winning, same as everyone else.
I imagine DA and BQ challenge each other, study together have fun doing it and I'd bet they're both too busy working to worry about perceptions or imposing undue self pressure . I would also think that what ever while elephant might been in the room has already been dealt with. JMHO.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Fair... I see your position... I'd love to be in the position DA put himself into! He has earned his current position. He and the Browns overall have performed at a level to be where they are. The O has more new and better toys, signed more proven quality depth on the O-Line, WR, and drafted a good solid TE prospect. Players, good and great want to perform on the biggest stage against the best competition. These guys believe they can win and did last year. Hasn't this offseason been great? Resigned key players added some substantial FA's and did a nice job in the draft again. Remember the low expectations? Remember the poor team & QB play? Remember the losing? Remember a team that wasn't good enough to compete? Much to look forward to and many ways to succeed. IMO. We shall see...  P.S. Being DA in line at the bank would be nice...
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All Pro
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All Pro
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There really isn't any rub in the, on the hub bub... My points are the QB pecking order is what it is for a reason. The order has been earned. All 3 QB have strengths and areas to improve in. But they are 1,2, 3 for very clear reasons. Coach, if you are the best person for the job @ statrting QB for the Browns Great! If you can lead the team to a 10-6 record or better this year and get the Browns to the playoffs FANTASTIC! I'll make sure the rub on the hub bub here is realizing that we should be supporting you!
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Legend
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Legend
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Good glad we cleared up any tension involved...I know I wasn't tense and I'm glad you weren't either - not to beat this to death - like it hasn't already...lol
"BQ has done nothing, yet for us to make much of any comment about."
Just develop within the boundaries given to him. I think we agree that he certainly hasn't seen enough action to bring up any possible "question" we have on him as a Franchise QB...and yes, I agree there might be a certain faction who post and believe since there are no Questions on him right now...none could possibly arise after he would start playing. That has not been me and you can't glom all BQ supporters onto me cause I question DA.
"If DA being voted the 2007 team MVP, going to the Pro-Bowl in your first year as a starting NFL QB, putting up the numbers DA did last year and where those numbers rank amoung the all time great CB QB's does not justify DA 's stud staus as of right now what will?"
Possibly we have a slight different Interpretation as Stud.
Numbers is just numbers...I attest a lot of the Numbers to the Environment as much as I do to DA. btw there were just as many if not more numbers to attest that DA actually is not a stud. Lets just call that one a wash.
Voted Team MVP...btw was Couch ever voted the Team MVP? Was he also a Stud? I know no stats like DA's season of course no environment as well.
Which brings us to the Pro-Bowl. Got in as the Alternate as he was slated 4th in the AFC by votes and his peers. Of course most of the voting was done before the 2nd half DA collapse was completed...but still a great accolade none the less.
Got great reviews in the Pro-Bowl practices....then took the field and got more reps than any other QB. Was the most familiar with the Offense being ran...had two go to WRs out there for him in BE and KW2...had a no blitzing and soft defense intended to make the Pro-Bowl a high scoring exciting venue.
And yet DA look awful...I really don't think if you actually look at the Pro-Bowl experience that it is TESTIMONY that he is a "STUD" - if anything it smacks us in the face that he truly isn't...YET...I'll give you the "YET" syndrome in your argument.
And as I stated - he will get the opportunity for that "YET" and trust me as a Brown's fan I welcome that as a Result...with heart and soul. But to claim it is here just ain't so. He is who he is....A young prospect who will get a chance.
But as I stated...BQ seems to be developing within or actually beyond expectations. This doesn't mean he will be the starter.
I've clearly noted its almost an impossibility. DA is too good in practice to lose the job. DA will not get many reps in Pre-Season as he has been slated the Starter and will be afforded the Starter status of Pre-Season games. That means just a series or two and then the Back up gets the bulk of the Reps.
Just the 3rd game do the Starters play probably an entire Half...this will be against the Lions a team that DA should have good success against and I just don't see much failure as he is too good of a QB to fail to the Lions to any great proportions to lose the job. And if not that sharp...the lack of action and flow is an honest explanation.
So in regards to BQ becoming the starter...I think his chances really are slim to none...That is testimony to the respect of what DA has shown us.
Now BQ if he studs out in his reps...will get more n more public outcry for him to start...even the media will probably wholesale call for his insertion...But real Football people don't cowtow to fans or the media. DA will start.
But in real Football terms...because of how well BQ has progressed the Leash on DA will be very short.
Then we have the history of DA...he has not bode well in the past under pressure. This actually will be a very good test to this viewer on his progress in that area. Will he fold under the pressure thus having BQ get the starting nod shortly into the season. Or will he overcome it and by doing so solidify any claim of STUDOM.
It will be what it will be. But the grounds that I have just laid I will bet whatever are pretty accurate. I cannot predict what these two young Prospect will do. Its all in their hands one way or another.
As always...JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Good points as always Eo. One thing I thought about while I was reading your post... Since DA will have the 'starter status' during the pre-season, he will get very limited time during pre-season games and Quinn will get a lot. I'm afraid of this scenario because DA has been known to start games slow. Let's say he goes in for two series and stinks up the joint because he gets yanked before he ever has a chance to develop a rhythm. And then Quinn goes in and plays for a half and scores 2-3 TDs. We now have a problem on our hands with the fans and the media, do we not? They will bash DA and say Quinn should start. I can see it now. We have to account for what DA does in practice, NOT in the pre-season games, if we want to be realisitc about where he is developmentally. But many fans and media people will not do this. They will judge each's performance solely on the pre-season games and then we could be looking at a QB controversy heading into the reg. season. I know it's a bit premature to start worrying about this now, but it just dawned on me that this could very well happen and I want to remind everyone what we should focus on as we head into August.
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2nd String
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2nd String
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Well if what he does in pratice does not translate to the field of play, how can you expect fans not to hold him accountable. I know what i think your trying to say, but to be honest most fans will only see him in pre-season games...where he will be judge and not on the pratice field.
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Yeah, it's kind of a catch-22. We just need to remember that he's not going to have a whole lot of time to develop a rythym out there. But it should be a good indication of how well he can start out of the gate, which is one area I hope he really improves on.
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Rookie
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Quote:
I'm afraid of this scenario because DA has been known to start games slow. Let's say he goes in for two series and stinks up the joint because he gets yanked before he ever has a chance to develop a rhythm.
This is a problem of DA's...it often takes him a series or 2 or 3 to find some rhythm. I would not be surprised at all if Quinn looks much better, or at least a little better, in the preseason games, mostly for the reason you point out. But I doubt it will have any effect in the coaches' minds. DA will start against Dallas, and I'm cool with that. He just needs to start showing improvement starting in game 1.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Let's say he goes in for two series and stinks up the joint because he gets yanked before he ever has a chance to develop a rhythm. And then Quinn goes in and plays for a half and scores 2-3 TDs. We now have a problem on our hands with the fans and the media, do we not?
Not if it happens once.. if it is a trend through 3 or 4 of the preseason games, then yea, it will be a problem.
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We have to account for what DA does in practice, NOT in the pre-season games, if we want to be realisitc about where he is developmentally.
Funny you should say that since last year, DA was unable to seperate himself from Frye in practice, looked better in preseason games and then looked really good once he got his chance in regular season... but now all of the sudden we should eliminate preseason games as a means of comparison and go solely on practice.... I'm not sure I follow that logic at all.
yebat' Putin
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Okay, I guess I should have said, we need to account for what DA does in practice, IN ADDITION TO pre-season games. You're right, that didn't make a ton of sense.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Voted Team MVP...btw was Couch ever voted the Team MVP? Was he also a Stud? I know no stats like DA's season of course no environment as well.
The difference is that we had a guy who rushed over 1300 yds., 9 TDs and a good ypc avg.
We also had a pro bowl reciever who caught for over 1300 yds.
We also had a rookie left tackle that was a stud
We also had a pro bowl special teams player
We also had a stud TE
This arguemeny of yours has no merit. Not to say your others do or don't, this just stuck out to me.
#gmstrong
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Hall of Famer
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OP
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Quote:
Got great reviews in the Pro-Bowl practices....then took the field and got more reps than any other QB. Was the most familiar with the Offense being ran...had two go to WRs out there for him in BE and KW2...had a no blitzing and soft defense intended to make the Pro-Bowl a high scoring exciting venue.
And yet DA look awful...I really don't think if you actually look at the Pro-Bowl experience that it is TESTIMONY that he is a "STUD" - if anything it smacks us in the face that he truly isn't...YET..
Just an observation- I couldn't possibly care less how a QB performs in this "game." As much as I hate the QB rating formula I hate trying to assess a player by using this "game" as a tool even more. Totally and unequivocally meaningless.
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2nd String
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2nd String
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don't we want our backup to be confident he can lead the team?
I hear the Colts would be willing to tade back-up QBs even up! Go Brownies!!!
Who Let Da Dawgs Out? Woof, Woof, Woof!!!!!
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To me he always seems relaxed, at ease and largely unaffected by things
This is true. Almost to a fault. (I said, ALmost).
AL 29 76 14 R_K
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Quote:
I couldn't possibly care less how a QB performs in this "game." As much as I hate the QB rating formula I hate trying to assess a player by using this "game" as a tool even more. Totally and unequivocally meaningless.
This, of course, is the prevailing thinking of the pro bowl. But to me, it's a 'football game'...with very talented players...of which DA looked to be one of the least talented players playing in that 'football game'.
Something else I remember. After Timmy Couch was drafted...they had that 'QB Challenge' thing. Where they throw balls through swinging tires, targets crossing the field...etc. Well, Timmu was horrid in that...one of the worst...but I brushed it off thinking that it's just a gimmicky thing anyway.
AL 29 76 14 R_K
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Did Couch really win the team's MVP? I don't remember that. I know the media loved him, but I didn't think they had that much audacity. What year did he win it?
One more thing...........there is some BS floating around about DA not handling pressure. Hell, I thought he played some of his best ball when there was a lot of pressure........you know.......like at the end of games when he had to move the team. I guess I don't remember that one correctly, either. *L*
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Quote:
I thought he played some of his best ball when there was a lot of pressure........you know.......like at the end of games when he had to move the team.
...again, this is true. Almost to a fault....like ignorance is bliss.
It's a redeemable quality...but it can almost be perceived as detachment.
AL 29 76 14 R_K
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So which is it? He can't handle pressure or he can't perform until there is pressure?  I hate laughing at you guys........well, not really...........but, it's pretty hard not to. The arguments change to fit your needs all the time. And the need is always to bad-mouth DA. How about this stat from another thread? Last year, the Browns averaged 351.3 yards a game, up from 264.6 in 2006. They also scored a near record # of pts. They challenged several franchise records while playing w/a pathetic defense. Yet, all I ever hear from many of you is "another of DA's weaknesses is........" I know you don't think you sound stupid.................but damn man...........we go from 4 wins to 10. We go from having about the worst O in the league to a damn good one. We go from having one of the most boring teams in the league to having one of the most potent and exciting offenses in the league............and all I hear from you guys is baloney about DA's weaknesses. Not credible at best. Hilarious in a preposterous sense at worst. And Vette, I actually like you. Can't say that for all of the BQ crowd. But hey man, think about what you are saying.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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All Pro
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All Pro
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Good points...
We had two Pro-Bowl ST players... Pont and Cribbs...
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