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You ponted to a 3 year deal as evidence of the FOs belief in DA. I would seriously not hang my hat on a 3 year deal. If they were "sold" on him, why wouldn't they have locked up a 6 year deal, like DA and his agent wanted?
As I've posted before, the owners opting out of the CBA put new rules into the mix. Players must have 6 accrued seasons to become a FA as opposed to 4. By signing DA to a 3 year deal the Browns will still have rights to him if he pans out to be "the one."
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The bottom line is that there are holes in DA's game. Can he improve? Yes. Will he? That remains to be seen.
No doubt about it. Boise keeps getting his panties in a wad because folks are bemoaning DA's shortcomings. The FACT is he does have shortcomings, he has HIMSELF admitted these shortcomings and is working on them. Though Boise said DA has improved, we will not know that for a while yet.
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I do know that I am very comfortable with the QB situation. DA may improve his weaknesses. If he doesn't, we have a tremendous prospect, for lack of a better word, waiting in the wings.
Bottom line is I don't care WHO the franchise QB ends up being as long as he IS a franchise QB.
And that is why this "debate" rages on.....we all want the same thing, essentially. There are those that feel player "A" gives us a better chance over player "B" but we all want the same thing........and until camp opens up we won't know for sure who is doing better than whom.
And, as I've posted before as well, this is a great way to handle it by Savage and RAC. By naming DA the "starter" that allows him to work on his shortcomings while not looking over his shoulder and it also pushes BQ to attempt to overcome DA by working his ass off.
Win/Win.
This competition is not going to go away, nor are threads like this.......
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And that is why this "debate" rages on.....we all want the same thing, essentially. There are those that feel player "A" gives us a better chance over player "B" but we all want the same thing.
Sometimes I question that.. I'm not sure we ALL want the same things.. I really believe that some folks just want to be RIGHT.. Damn the team and the records..
Take DA for instance.. He has flaws in his game,, but he's 24 Years Old with 18 starts.. Go back and look at any QB in this league, and you'll find flaws at that stage of thier development. (some more pronounced than others, but flaws still).
Oh then you hear, but he has 3 years in the league.. So what,, all that means is that he's had time to process the mental part of the game. Doesn't mean he can perform on the field.
I actually love our situation. We have two guys under contract that we can win with. DA has proven it, and with Quinn you just feel it. I'm as happy as a pig in slop.. I feel as if should DA go down, Quinn will step in and do a fine job.. Of course, he may expose his flaws  And we may just have to live with them.....
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I think part of the reason why DA gets so much flak is because of the overinflating the value of the rest of the team. His short game needs work but who other than JJ actually caught the dump down passes when it hit them square in the numbers on a fairly consistent basis. This is a good group of receivers that make highlight real catches but they drop way way to many easy passes.
Just like the offensive line. the line had several bad games last year but was bailed out because DA gets rid of the ball quickly sometimes to quickly. The Bengals game was a perfect example. DA catches all the blame but the receivers backs and OL had a very poor game as well.
Everyone needs to kick back relax and let the quarterback situation play itself out. for starters this isnt the schedule that I want to see Quinn break into the league against. 2 years of preparation isnt going to destroy him. I believe he is the quarterback of the future but the Browns have made the right decision for now.
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I can totally live with that Mour..... Thanks
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Pit, wrong again... I have since prior to day one of the DA acquisition, not been a big fan... I was one of the, if not the biggest opponent of the move... Based on what I personally watched live, on TV and on tech on DA... I’m still not completely sold... But he proved me wrong last year with his play. So I am behind him, because DA is our guy right now. He has earned that. Regardless of what anyone here says... So the credibility issue is on you man... 
His areas of concern are still there... He has improved them, but they still need work and probably always will... His positive areas have improved too... They need to be polished too...
The credability issue does not "lie with me". Tucker had played G before. Anyone who knows football knows a T can play G. It takes far more of a skill set to play T than G and Tucker had played G before, although quite sparingly. So he was not "new to the position" and it was an easier position to play.
Steinback was a GREAT G BEFORE he came here. And in case you forgot, JT had the same status as DA, alternate. And he was a rookie.
Are you trying to say that last years OL was NOT the BEST we've had by a LONG shot since 99?
If you are, then you sir are the one with the "credability issue", not me.
Are you trying to say that Jamal WASN'T the "best RB" we've had since our return by MILES? That oposing D's didn't HAVE TO "respect" Jamal? Once again, let's see "just how credable" you are..............
Can DA scramble? Does he posess the ability to "throw on the run"? And you've already admitted he lacks the fundamental ability to throw the short pass. ( the highest percentage pass in the NFL )
Do I hope DA does well IF he ends up starting the regular season? Of course I do! Do I have signifigant reservations about him doing so based on sound reasoning? Of course I do!
He has "one win against a team with an above .500 record". And that's with a VERY healthy OL and healthy stud at RB. This year won't be so easy and God I hope I'm wrong, but I highly doubt we'll go two years in a row with a healthy Jamal and OL in tact for the season.
It is what it is. Like it or not. Reality dictates that we will find out just how much he has or has not improved. And very quickly I believe.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Do I have signifigant reservations about him doing so based on sound reasoning? Of course I do!
I think that's a fair statement - and you've stated what that reasoning is. Anyone who gets upset at someone taking this stance is just out to argue.
But I do have to ask 'what does this say about Quinn?'.
I'm sure the FO has some reservations about DA as well. Maybe the same ones as you. But I think that also means they have some reservations - maybe not the same ones - about Quinn as well, and I don't think it has anything to do with not wanting to play him against this schedule.
That leaves us as fans no choice but to hope and pray that one of these guys can be it. And we have no choice but to support the guy that's out there and wait and see.
Quinn is not going to be some magical savior. He's not Manning or Brady. If he was, he'd be in there.
It also seems that some people that take the anti-DA side of things are fueled by the fact that they believe Quinn is the better QB - and I just don't see any evidence at this time at all to suggest that. And I'm not just talking about evidence on the field either.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Thank you for the football post Boise even if it wasn't directed to me. just some notes:
"If something where to happen and DA was done as the Browns QB right now it would be a shame. It would be interesting to see what that would be like here...?"
I Can't speak for other DA Questioners but I for one wish DA to succeed and especially succeed as our starter this season. This however does not thwart my assumption and opinion that BQ is our QB of the future. And you basically have hit upon WHY in a nutshell...ty
"DA has been missing the short ball and touch passes for longer than many of you have known he was alive... He has never thrown on the run well... He has always forced the ball and thrown too many picks, made questionable decisions and locked on to his WR's."
Yet he as always won...and your reasons are quite accurate as far his qualities. But it is the above recognition of his faults that will prevent him from being a Championship Franchise QB. Who in the tough ones rise to another level and pull out a win. All those QBs I have seen over the years were able to adjust in the pocket and move and THROW ACCURATELY to deflate a defense who works to perfection but gets burnt anyways. He has always been good enough to beat the teams that his outmatches talent for talent. Enough in college and enough in our 10 win season last year.
But what is his successes against teams that match up with our with talent...the playoff teams? He was 0-3 in his starts with our offense that was in shambles. He has had his worst games against teams with Playoff defenses - its not like he played well and we lost cause our team was simply over-matched. He stunk in those games.
In your statement above about DA's deficiencies and how they have been with him throughout his career is what I have been talking about. NFL defenses that are good and can execute game plans...you know - Playoff team Defenses. Will almost always win against him. Cause when a QB is as one dimensional as DA is game planning is so, so easy and successful.
Ergo - my often cry of DA is who he is...nothing more, nothing less.
Sure he is our QB of the present...that could change although documented by even me. That would be near impossible as we are not set up for a QB competition - leaving just a very small window of opportunity for that to happen. DA must fail or get hurt...neither one is good for the Browns, although I have stated the perfect scenario would have DA going well, get a small injury that gives BQ 3 games...BQ does great and gives the FO/coaches game film to be positive of who the future franchise QB is. DA comes back and does not lose his starting status...does great and takes us deep into the playoffs. I don't want DA to get hurt but its the only way we can get game film of BQ - enough to be secure in the future decision of WHO...I want DA to do well - more than well cause if he plays great and takes us Deep intot he playoffs he could become a Multi-Draft pick asset for our future.
Why do I covet this? Its simple.
No I'm not a BQ heart throb.
No I don't hate DA.
Its because in the last two Dynasty's in the NFL - in this age of parity that dynasties are just not suppose to happen. The Cowboys of Jimmy Johnson/Switzer and the present Patriots. What tipped the scale for both teams to become dynasties were premium extra draft picks.
Cowboys got a mega haul from the Herchal Walker trade and broke parity with those picks.
The Pats with a young team that won a SB but was not a dynasty traded away Bledsoe and got two 1st round picks - these picks are what broke the parity and gave them the opportunity to build a dynasty.
Savage has done well with FA...but we finally have reached our apex of finances and the moves he made would have been of the dynasty formation via FA except we didn't have a foundation of a team... These moves have given us that foundation and we are a competitive team.
The only thing that will make us into a DYNASTY is that little extra. Getting 2 first round picks or a First rounder and several other picks is just the kind of parity breaker that we can get to become a dynasty!!!
This is my wish - Its not a dream either as it can happen. But DA failing or injuring himself for the season does not make the dream come true...only one thing does.
Success.
So don't mistake my non-adoration for DA as our Franchise QB as an act of treason. I am simply debating my opinion on who our Franchise QB of the future is and why.
Don't mistake my non-adoration for DA as some mis-directed chaos wished upon us and change in our QB once again. I have observed and calculated at the best of my football knowledge who would be the best QB for us to lead us.
The BIG TIME BONUS is in the process we could obtain the Dynasty Making variable and that is what my ultimate dreams on our QB situation is all about
Now isn't this much more better than the nonsense and bickering?
As always JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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But I do have to ask 'what does this say about Quinn?'
I have no definitive answer. Only my own beliefs on the matter. I know I may get beat about the head and face with implements of destruction causing secretions of pain to flow throughout my body.
But here goes anyways!
Last year was a joke in refrance to the QB situation. People wearing orange glasses failed to see it, but the media and football fans across the country were LTFAO at us! The coin flip was not something that was "NFL material". More like Pop Warner at best.
DA and "this team" won ten games last year. So it seems obvious that the logical thing to do is to make DA the "named starter". I see no garuntee by anyone that this situation "could not change" between now and the start of the season or shortly thereafter. Nor that it will. But it takes the degree of "circus" out of the air we saw last year.
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I'm sure the FO has some reservations about DA as well. Maybe the same ones as you. But I think that also means they have some reservations - maybe not the same ones - about Quinn as well, and I don't think it has anything to do with not wanting to play him against this schedule.
And IMO, the first game of the season has not came yet. So to this point, we do not know who will be commanding the huddle "then". All we "know", is at this "moment in time", DA is our named starter. Nothing more and nothing less.
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That leaves us as fans no choice but to hope and pray that one of these guys can be it. And we have no choice but to support the guy that's out there and wait and see.
I always "support whoever is out there". But you seem to have jumped to the conclusion that it will be DA and we haven't even gotten to the pre-season. He has earned the right to be "the named starter heading into camp" by the W's last year". So far, everything else is conjecture.
Many believe that DA as our starter is "etched in stone" for the season. I have seen nothing to support that theory. All I've seen is, at "this moment" he is. Or would you prefer to see the same circus as last year by not naming a starter"?
I think it's wise on the part of our FO to "name a starter". Wheather that lasts until pre season, openning day, or the entire season. Which ever the case may be. We don't need our players, coaches and the media distracted and in turmoil because it appears we have no direction IMO
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Quinn is not going to be some magical savior. He's not Manning or Brady. If he was, he'd be in there.
With a GOOD OL and RB, you don't need a "savior". You just need someone who is smart and above average. That has a multitude of skills. That can scramble if your OL gets banged up. Who can throw on the run should your dominate RB go down. An "above average QB".
And are you saying that Brady was drafted to start, or started out of necessity? And are you saying that when Manning was drafted, that IF Indy had "a reasonable alternative" they would not have given Peyton a "year to learn the system"?
You are making odd comparisons IMO. Indy had NOBODY when Peyton was drafted. Brady started because Bledsoe was stinking up the joint and injured. So it was pretty much "forced into" the starting role. So I see no "real comparison" in either of these cases.
Maybe you should actually "wait until he plays" to declare what he "is or is not"?
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It also seems that some people that take the anti-DA side of things are fueled by the fact that they believe Quinn is the better QB - and I just don't see any evidence at this time at all to suggest that. And I'm not just talking about evidence on the field either.
He has a better rounded skill set to be an NFL QB. He can scramble, throw on the run, etc.......
Now Will that equate to a great NFL QB? Who knows. But one was drafted in the first round and one was???????????
Are you saying there's "no reasons" for that?
There are. Because the "potential for greatness" is there with Quinn. Like I said, that is no garuntee. There is no such thing. But the potential for greatness is. Which is it? Was Phil wrong, or you? Because he paid a damned hefty price for Quinn. Without just cause?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Pit, a lot of good points and very valid arguments. Made me think. BTW, my post was responding to you, but it was a general response to the board ... but I'm glad you responded anyway. The T.Brady vs. BradyQ. comparison was a bad one. But I don't think the Manning vs. BradyQ. was. Manning had stud written all over him out of college. First overall pick. There are no guarantees, but he was pretty close. Quinn had question marks all over the place and slipped to #22. Now that's not saying Quinn can't be as good or even better, but I have to believe that if he has shown Manning-like ability that DA would be gone. I don't even think it's a question. We take the 1st and 3rd this year and thank DA and wish him luck. But reading in between the lines, Quinn has some question marks that the FO is still uncomfortable with. I think it's interesting that you believe Quinn has the chance to be the starter opening day. I think it's basically 0%. I know the Browns don't want another circus in relation to naming the starter, but I don't think that's why they named DA the starter. They believe he is their best option right now, and I don't believe there will be anything that transpires over the course of TC and preseason to change that. I could be wrong. I just can't recall a situation with our team or any other team in recent memory that named a starter heading into TC and preseason, only to change it before Week 1 because the backup guy looked better. I'm not talking about open competition, I'm talking about a complete changing of the minds. I would be very surprised if this happened. I see what you're saying about the potential for greatness with Quinn and the skill set. I just don't know. DA has a nice skill set too. Sure, he can't throw on the run as well as Quinn, but he has a bigger arm, he gets rid of the ball quickly, and doesn't get rattled in crunch time (he's just a pocket full of nerves when the games start ). Quinn isn't a complete player, neither is DA, but it seems they both have nice skill sets -albeit different ones - that could make them a great QB for years to come. It's going to be interesting. I think this QB situation could be our downfall this year. Everyone is saying how much they love it. I don't. I want to know who the guy is for the next 10 years.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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The one and "only" place I see DA having the edge over BQ in regards to skill set is the REALLY deep ball. And one thing I think you might wish to keep in mind. When your team wins ten games, it is pretty much a "given" that the QB who accomplished that will be "your named starter" until and unless he is unseated. And DA was the "named starter" before mini camps, training camp or anything else. So how would the FO "know which one was best" without even "seeing them this year"? So it is your contention, that without seeing either "this year" and after DA's last two "terrible outings", somehow "they just knew" that DA is better this year? IMO- When a team wins ten games, the QB who was starting during that period "earned" the "named starting" position based on last years wins. The incumbant would simply need to be "unseated" by being outplayed. It's the nature of the beast in the NFL. Will Quinn "unseat him"? Who knows? But for the sake of our Browns, may the best man win. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Go watch DA's OSU West college stuff... Then take a look at what he did last year and we can talk... 
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Go watch DA's OSU West college stuff... Then take a look at what he did last year and we can talk...
I was referring to the improvements he needs to make from last year. I didn't realize you were talking about all the way back in college. My bad.
According to articles, him and Scherer know what his problems are, and they are being addressed. But at the same time, I've read he hasn't made any improvements through mini-camps. We'll be able to see for ourselves in about 2 weeks.
![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Pit,
You and I are disconnected on this... I have written plainly and clearly what I think and why. So why you would feel the need to question what I have written in the way you have is surprising. The so are you trying to say technique is a little off base don't you think? Not necessary and kind of insulting...
You are going in a couple directions and I don't know why. Why are you lecturing me on the 0-Line and JL? You have read my stuff for years... And I know the who, where, why, when and how of the Browns current 0-line players and the overall situation. Point of contention is when I wrote that the 0-Line was rebuilt and had how many new additions for the 2007 season...? You tried to write or strongly imply that it hadn't been... It did happen... The 0-Line jelled nicely. Very solid, top 10 in the league at this point. IMO.
DA is not solely responsible for the losses against 500 or better teams. I'm not buying that now matter what you say... No one should. That’s total crap. No sale bro... Not going to happen...
I have written here countless times about my requests and opinions about building an 0-Line. The requests and wishes have been answered over the past 3 years... I have supported and praised the moves on the O-Line that have taken place. And am thankful for the success...
I was and am one of the biggest JL folks here... I backed the move from day one... I hoped he would carry the load like he did in his early NFL career. He did big time... His production was one of the biggest reasons for the success on 0 last year... JL was my MVP last year... Check out the Jets and Bills games at the end of the year... JL got better as the season went on...
The BS and lack of support for DA here more than bothers me. And I thoroughly despised the pick up of DA, for many of the reasons people are complaining about... I watched him do "this" stuff for years in college... DA has improved since college to now by leaps and bounds... DA makes better decisions now, gets rid of the ball much quicker, doesn't hold on to the ball near as long, checks off, looks off safeties and coverage much better, doesn’t just stare down one WR nearly as often and he doesn't throw off his back foot nearly as much either... Just to name a few... He does have a way to go in his improvement process. He knows this too. He has said so.
What I don't get is; DA never has been a poor citizen on or off the field, he has been an unselfish team guy, a hard worker. He had an outstanding year behind a solid 0-Line playing in front of JL. He is not a perfect QB, there never has been one. DA in his first year as a starter plays the way he plays and gets chosen to go to the PB as and alternate... And all some people here want to do is find fault, put him down, pick apart his areas of concern and disrespect him... Let alone some are making stuff up as there going along...
This crap doesn't make sense... He's 6th or 7th round waiver wire pick up for cripes sake... Which if he pans or keeps improving may turn out to be a better long shot, low PO story than TB...It's not like he came in with high expectations, like a couple of our recent 1st round picks did @WR/TE... Those two came in needing check ups from the neck ups, had selfish crappy attitudes, and were disruptive to the team, poor examples and questionable citizens who didn't produce right away... Yet these two nearly get free passes for years until they shut up and put up...? I'm calling BS on the double standard for some players and the unrealistic perspectives and opinions of some posters... Don't care if folks don't like it... It's the truth and that’s just the way it is...
And I'm not sold completely on DA yet... But I have his back now because he's, as that old financial commercial used to say, “he’s earned it".
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I understand... I was writing about where he has come since before your or anyone else here knew who DA was... The point I am trying to make is he has had these challenges for years and years... So for you, me or anyone else to expect that is flaws are fixed over this offeseason is totally unrelaistic. If he continues to improve in his areas of concern we should be happy. I'm quite sure that Scherer and DA are spending most of their time on improving what DA does well within the 0 scheme and thats what is best for the 0 & the team. All we'll see in two weeks is how much more work DA needs on his areas to improve and how much he has improved on his strenght areas over the offseason. We really won't know until the live bullets fly, when the real season starts. IMO..
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This crap doesn't make sense... He's 6th or 7th round waiver wire pick up for cripes sake... Which if he pans or keeps improving may turn out to be a better long shot, low PO story than TB...It's not like he came in with high expectations, like a couple of our recent 1st round picks did @WR/TE... Those two came in needing check ups from the neck ups, had selfish crappy attitudes, and were disruptive to the team, poor examples and questionable citizens who didn't produce right away... Yet these two nearly get free passes for years until they shut up and put up...? I'm calling BS on the double standard for some players and the unrealistic perspectives and opinions of some posters... Don't care if folks don't like it... It's the truth and that’s just the way it is...
Who gave them a "free pass"? Certainly not me. I gave credit where credit is due just LAST YEAR to BE because he finaly "earned it".
And my point about the OL, is they were "all FA signings" with vast OL experience and talent" ACCEPT JT who made it to the same level DA did last year. ( pro bowl alternate ) Just so we're clear. This wasn't a bunch of young kids playing "totaly out of position" and or lacking in talent.
Once again I ask......................Are you trying to say this wasn't the BEST OL we've had by MILES since 99?
I don't believe we are that far off from agreeing. I DO support DA when he is playing on the field. His success equates to "our success".
But in all honesty, as you say "like it or not" there are MANY holes in his game! And many are the exact same one's he had coming out of Oregon. Not much has changed a lot on that front.
Just because you can honestly see and bring up his weaknesses, doesn't mean that you do not wish him to do better. But it is what it is. I don't "blindly" give credit where it's "not due". Once he "becomes" a relatively complete QB, I will be happy to say so. But the facts dictate he is FAR from that.
An honest evaluation is not trashing a guy. Unless that evaluation points out true weaknesses that can not "honestly" be disputed. At that juncture people make pretty much the accusations you are making about me. "That I don't support him".
That's simply not reality.
Are you trying to insinuate that I'd rather see the Browns lose just so Quinn can play? I certainly hope not.
Would I like to see DA improve? Of course I would. But I'm a realist. And I honestly believe a kid three or four years removed from Colege who has many of the very same issues? The odds are stacked against it.
As you so aptly put it....................................
"Don't care if folks don't like it... It's the truth and that’s just the way it is..."
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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What I don't get is; DA never has been a poor citizen on or off the field, he has been an unselfish team guy, a hard worker. He had an outstanding year behind a solid 0-Line playing in front of JL. He is not a perfect QB, there never has been one. DA in his first year as a starter plays the way he plays and gets chosen to go to the PB as and alternate... And all some people here want to do is find fault, put him down, pick apart his areas of concern and disrespect him... Let alone some are making stuff up as there going along...
Now hopefully this isn't directed at many people on here, but just a couple. I've been known to chime in on this debate, but I don't disrespect or put him down.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with picking apart areas of concern with him. We're on the verge of become one of the better teams in the NFL, and you best be sure you have the right guy at the helm. If there wasn't another viable QB with tons of potential (and yes, that is the keyword, potential) sitting in the wings, these conversations wouldn't be taking place.
But because we DO have a Brady Quinn waiting in the wings, some people want to be absolutely sure that we have the proper guy on the field to give us every possible chance of making it big time. I read an article today that the author predicted the Browns to be in the Super Bowl. That's at least the second person nationally who has said that. We're no longer rebuilding. We're no longer trying to find an identity. We're no longer trying to find players to give us national exposure.
This is it.
We can't screw this up.
We can sit here and go through all the positives of the guy, but where's that going to help? It's not, just like arguing the negatives won't either. But at the same time, it's the offseason, and we have potentially 2 great quarterbacks who can hopefully take us to where we all have been longing. Nobody wants to see what happened in 2007 happen all over again in 2008. The team put the wrong guy on the field to start the season, and it was ugly. Thankfully, it was immediately recognized and righted by shipping out Frye. So of course we're going to have concerns. Nobody wants to see a repeat of last year's battle. One of these guys clearly has to look better in camp and preseason, and that is the guy I want playing. So that is why we talk about it.
With a tough schedule that is bad right out of the gate, we can't afford to screw up even once.
So the debate will go on until we see it with our own eyes, and may not even end then.
I have never disrespected DA. I have, however, pointed out his flaws and my concerns with him. IMO, there is nothing wrong or disrespectful with that. Maybe others have done otherwise.
"The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Plenty gave BE and Jr. pass after pass and made excuses after excuse for years... Come on man... You've been here a long time and know this... I didn't write that "you" did or accuse you did I? I did make general factual staetments that others did. And they did... Still don't know why you're preaching to me about our 0-Line... The 0line had 3 new starters on it form the year before in 2007... Thats another 60% turnover. Far from an experienced and jelled unit. Never wrote that the players were of poor quality, unproven... Once again I'll write... The 2007 0-Line was a rebuild, unproven group at the start of last season... What a great year to watch 0-Line play as a Browns fan...  I agree about the agreeing statement... Not that we have too... I believe I know as much or more about DA's areas to improve or draw backs as any or most here... I have been watching them for as long or longer than anyone here too... I have never denied his deficientcies either and was one of the first to point many of them out... I was pissed the day the Browns picked DA up...  But after his play in 2007 he deserves his current status with the Browns and less of the pounding he gets. Those areas of concern have been there and probably always will be... Read my reply to Dawg017... DA can improve them and has. I hope he continues to focus on what he does well and improves upon those too. BTW, did Bernie ever change his release or delivery? Did he throw well on the run? Hell BK could barely run period. There is a big difference between a bashing and a good evaluation... That we agree upon... Too much bashing going on from people who don't know QB... IMO. Again... "Don't care if folks don't like it... It's the truth and that’s just the way it is..." I'm not insinuating anything. If I think you are I'll tell you. I love the BQ move and I love how he is handling his business. I would like to see him become the QB we all hope he can be. Until next time...
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You seem to be a sharp person... I believe you know full well who my statements are directed at. When I direct statements at you you will know. I have been here for a very long time... Well over 8000 posts on the old board and the new few... I have been wrong plenty... I have been correct and accurate more than I've been wrong... I have made friends, peeed folks off and made them laugh as well. It isn't OK to pick apart aras of concern with anyone. It's counter productive, provides no benifit to anyone or anything. Discussing areas of improvement and steps to get better is cool... But bashing, over exagerating is not acceptable... Throwing out misleading stats and half truths is BS too. Not you or Piit... BQ is where he should be according to the people who put the Browns "on the brink"... I believe that BQ being groomed as he is now is what is best for all involved. I love the BQ move and how he is takeing care of his bus... Can't wait to see him carve some NFL D's up... But not now, not just yet... BQ will be ready when he gets his shot... NICE! The Browns very well could screw this up... What if DA blows up for some reason? What if BQ is all hype? Then where are the Browns? Camp means nada this year @ the QB position. DA is the starter, period. Barring something very unforseen happening. PB QB's don't lose their jobs in camp. When the bullets fly, in the regular season and if there is significant failure by a starting QB then there will be a dicission to be made... Until that happens this is all BS and subjective conjecture... Which is why the board is what it is... I really hate this time of year... Until next time...
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Thought this might belong here instead of in its own thread . . . http://myespn.go.com/blogs/hashmarks/0-8-77/QB-Derek-Anderson-trying-to-get-faster.htmlQB Derek Anderson trying to get faster July 8, 2008 10:00 AM Posted by ESPN.com's James Walker Derek Anderson of the Cleveland Browns will never be a Donovan McNabb-type of quarterback. But the lanky, strong-armed signal caller is doing everything he can to improve the weakest part of his game. Anderson, coming off a Pro Bowl season in 2007, is currently working out at a SPARQ (speed, power, agility, reaction, quickness) training facility in Oregon that focuses on improving his mobility. He also watches a lot of game film and is spending a little time on the links playing golf as training camp practices begin in Cleveland on July 24. As the Browns' high-powered offense continues to evolve, second-year offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski is installing more rollouts and screens into the playbook this season to give opponents different looks. That will require Anderson, a traditional pocket passer, to be more fleet of foot to execute the additional plays. He also has to work on his touch on short throws.
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As the Browns' high-powered offense continues to evolve, second-year offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski is installing more rollouts and screens into the playbook this season to give opponents different looks.
Two big weak points for the Steelers defense....I like it!
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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Hmmmmm..................who could already do well with Screens and rollouts??
Hmmmmmmm
Lol, IT"S A JOKE!
I hope whoever we start does awesome!! I hope whoever doens't does thier job. One day I hope we pick one and ship the other for two first round picks!
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Installing a more Brady Quinn friendly offense lol
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Wow...putting him over Carson Palmer!?!?!?
Even you have to admit that's a little far-fetched.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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 Just bustin' your chops man.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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Installing a more Brady Quinn friendly offense lol
Unless DA does a 180 in these areas, fact may be stranger than fiction.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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"Unless DA does a 180 in these areas, fact may be stranger than fiction."
Actually a different system - BQ friendly - etc.
Simply would not exist. We've been told several times that any transition in changing the QB would be seamless cause nothing would have to be changed.
If there is a debate or argument its in who can do most with the existing system we got. Not so about IF so and so is the QB Chud has this whole other part of the play book to utilize. Not so at all. DA has been able to Bootleg and does so surprisingly well considering his mobility weakness.
Possibly in an incredible pressure situation from teams Chud has a rolling pocket series - but we just haven't faced a situation where that was necessary. And nobody really designs that as a big Scheme its done out of necessity - either deficiency of the QB so that he only has half the field to read or in the OL cause the QB is dead in water sitting in the pocket. We have neither case with either QB.
The playbook and Game plan on Offense basically stays the same regardless of QB.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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j/c
I am SO looking forward to watching my Browns this year. Except for this kind of crap. First time DA makes a bad throw this place will go through the roof with Quinn threads.
DA could go 29-30 for 350 yds and 3 tds, but if the game is lost people will be calling for Quinn cause he "would've completed that one pass", or "he would've managed the game better", or whatever.
Whoever is at qb is the one I want there. I'll let the coaches do the coaching and decision making. After all, their tails are on the line as well. I have no doubt they'll have the best qb in. And I'm guessing most of you know that as well. Sad thing is, this debate will rage far longer than the couch vs. holcomb debate.
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DA could go 29-30 for 350 yds and 3 tds, but if the game is lost people will be calling for Quinn cause he "would've completed that one pass", or "he would've managed the game better", or whatever.
That's a bit of an exaggeration...
"The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Simply would not exist. We've been told several times that any transition in changing the QB would be seamless cause nothing would have to be changed.
I hear the Browns FO and coaches say this all the time, but I got eyes and I see a difference in the way both these guys play. And I think that DA does some things better then BQ will ever do them, due to his arm strength, but then again I think BQ being more mobile offers a whole different set of skills from DA. No I think they say it, but if it comes down to BQ playing will see a different sort of offense from the one we have with DA.
I'm certain many of the plays will remain the same, but then again I actually see BQ's strength as being a more ball control type offense that takes much smaller bites then the one we currently have with DA. As has been pointed out many times by you yourself EO, DA's strength is the 10 -25 yarder, and I think BQ's will be the 0-15 range, thats different in itself and a smart coach is going to have to adjust his game plan and play calling to the strength of the QB, it should change and most likely will at least to some degree..
JMHO
BTTB
AKA Upbeat Dawg
Can't believe I am in a group that is comprised of the best NOT just fans but people on the planet.
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Quote:
Quote:
Simply would not exist. We've been told several times that any transition in changing the QB would be seamless cause nothing would have to be changed.
I hear the Browns FO and coaches say this all the time, but I got eyes and I see a difference in the way both these guys play. And I think that DA does some things better then BQ will ever do them, due to his arm strength, but then again I think BQ being more mobile offers a whole different set of skills from DA. No I think they say it, but if it comes down to BQ playing will see a different sort of offense from the one we have with DA.
I'm certain many of the plays will remain the same, but then again I actually see BQ's strength as being a more ball control type offense that takes much smaller bites then the one we currently have with DA. As has been pointed out many times by you yourself EO, DA's strength is the 10 -25 yarder, and I think BQ's will be the 0-15 range, thats different in itself and a smart coach is going to have to adjust his game plan and play calling to the strength of the QB, it should change and most likely will at least to some degree..
JMHO
Don't count on it "BB"...
We don't need to see Quinn in 30 NFL Games to know what kind of arm he has...He has what he has...And it ain't a "Noodle"...
Will he be launching it 30+ downfield all day long???...NO...Neither does Anderson...
I don't care what any Anderson pimp says about "Touch"...Quinn wins this one by a LANDSLIDE...He can throw the touch pass...He can gun it 20 yards down the seam...He can launch it 40 yards when need be...And when NEED BE means when it's OPEN...
When you've got the likes of Lewis/Edwards/Winslow and Stallworth...U don't eliminate ANYTHING when going from Anderson to Quinn...Chudzinski SHOULD keep the playbook wide open if Quinn gets his shot...He knows this O now...He can make ALL THE THROWS...
The beauty of this is these guys aren't LEARNING and THINKING now...Now they're REACTING and letting the natural athleticism and talent they possess take over...THIS IS HUGE...For the Defense also...
This team is set up with guys who are approaching the time for it all to click...And when it does...WATCH OUT...
The ONLY thing I wanna see Chud do MORE of if Quinn gets his shot is SHORT tosses across the middle to all 3 targets...YAC could be HUGE with those 3...More of Lewis and Wright out of the backfield...But DO NOT STOP stretching the field with Edwards and the newest weapon in Stallworth...That opens ALOT...
Go Browns!!!
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The ONLY thing I wanna see Chud do MORE of if Quinn gets his shot is SHORT tosses across the middle to all 3 targets...YAC could be HUGE with those 3...More of Lewis and Wright out of the backfield...But DO NOT STOP stretching the field with Edwards and the newest weapon in Stallworth...That opens ALOT...
Strange but I sense you saying pretty much what I said, it will likely change, DA throws the ball better then BQ and can make throws BQ won't even attempt. Then again BQ is more mobile and will take what the defense gives him more so then DA does, and thats different in and of itself. Certainly BQ is no copy of DA and DA is no copy of BQ, they are different and possess different strengths and weaknesses and if for no other reason that means the offense will be different under the leadership of either QB. How could it not be ??
And it is actually pretty important in my view that Chud have a handle on those strengths and play call accordingly. But hey thats just me.. I think if there is any change at QB, the game plan and play calling will change as well. That is to say if BQ were to take over as a starter vs replacing DA due to injury we will see a change..
JMHO
BTTB
AKA Upbeat Dawg
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they are different and possess different strengths and weaknesses and if for no other reason that means the offense will be different under the leadership of either QB. How could it not be ??
It will look different because of their differing styles of play. Not a single play will need be changed in the playbook, however.
Truth be told, this will probably be an exciting O to watch no matter who plays QB. If DA keeps up his Farve-like act there will be plenty of highlights on Monday. On the other hand, it was a thing of beauty to watch Steve Young run that well-oiled 49er machine back inda day.
Quinn/Anderson? It's all good for this Dawg.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
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Agreed Clem. It's not like comparing two piles of crap anymore. Each of em have legitimate strengths and weaknesses. I'll be content with whoever the braintrust chooses, I just believe DA catches way too much flak around here. He got us 10 wins last year with NO defense.
"I don't remember any of my catches. I remember the drops." - Kellen Winslow II
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Everyone needs to kick back relax and let the quarterback situation play itself out. for starters this isnt the schedule that I want to see Quinn break into the league against. 2 years of preparation isnt going to destroy him. I believe he is the quarterback of the future but the Browns have made the right decision for now.
They made a logical decision..DA is the starter..he earned it going into this season..I agree..let ot play out..if he fails Quinn goes in..if he succeeds..thats another story..another saga..because that really will change a lot of stuff.
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Actually a different system - BQ friendly - etc.
Simply would not exist. We've been told several times that any transition in changing the QB would be seamless cause nothing would have to be changed.
But we also have no idea "how much of that playbook is being used now". That's the point I believe. Did we "use the entire playbook last year"? Could it be that's WHY they drafted Brady Quinn? That HIS skill set far more closly resembled what Chud would need to implament his "entire playbook"? I don't believe either of us have a "pat answer" for that one.
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If there is a debate or argument its in who can do most with the existing system we got. Not so about IF so and so is the QB Chud has this whole other part of the play book to utilize. Not so at all. DA has been able to Bootleg and does so surprisingly well considering his mobility weakness.
Weakness and doing well "considering that weakness" are key elements in the equasion. I believe the entire FO breathed a heavy sigh of relief over EVERYONE staying so healthy in regards to our OL and RB last year. I believe they also know this was far more of a rarity than a regularity.
So yes, I believe when they drafted BQ, it was TO "fit their system". Why would you invest that highly in a QB who "doesn't? And it's obvious that their skill sets contrast a great deal. I feel it's quite logical to deduce that Chud's "system" is VERY conducive to BQ's skill set given this thought process IMO
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Possibly in an incredible pressure situation from teams Chud has a rolling pocket series - but we just haven't faced a situation where that was necessary. And nobody really designs that as a big Scheme its done out of necessity -
And injuries on the OL or at RB would bring about such "necessity". What do you honestly feel the odds are of NOT sustaining injuries in these departments?
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The playbook and Game plan on Offense basically stays the same regardless of QB.
JMHO
I strongly disagree. Why wouldn't you use "all of the skills a QB posesses" given the oppertunity? I believe the "playbook would stay the same". Just that it could be openned up to "include more of it".
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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