|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555 |
Quote:
why is saban the bottom of the scum bucket??? I really dont understand that and would like u to explain to me how someone thinks that ...
Perhaps my comments are a bit harsh, but this man took the job of HC of the Dolphins what,, two years ago.. and he gets them going in the direction he feels they need to go,,, Then in the middle of it all, he jumps ship. Leaving Miami a rudderless ship that it might take years to turn in the right direction.
I really do understand that sometimes, the right thing for a person, may not be the right thing for the organization.. At that point the decision is, do I as the employee keep my commitment to the organization or do I follow my heart...
It's a tough call,,, But I don't believe for a second it was a "follow my heart" thing,,,, it was the money.. I don't know that, but it seems like that's what it was with him..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618 |
Yep. Go check your prediction thread and look up where I predicted we would be 5 and 11 and got called negative for it. 
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555 |
Quote:
Daman, have you worked for the wealthy long enough to know that they can make it virtually impossible for someone to show proof of what really happened?
Not sure what your getting at? yes, the wealthy have the ability to mask or at least confuse the truth,, no question about..
But what's that got to do with Vers proving what he's saying is the fact he makes it seem to be. He makes a statement and cannot verify it,,, which is fine with me,,,just don't pass it off as fact.. You gotta put a disclaimer in there otherwise,,,it's a bunch of bull in my eyes.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 844
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 844 |
hey mac, just making a curious obsrvation. I thought Fazio resigned because he was pissed off at Butch for running the prevent defense instead of allowing Fazio to attack the Steeler offense, which btw, is what should have been done as our defense at that time was better suited for attack mode. imo
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618 |
Quote:
But what's that got to do with Vers proving what he's saying is the fact he makes it seem to be. He makes a statement and cannot verify it,,, which is fine with me,,,just don't pass it off as fact.. You gotta put a disclaimer in there otherwise,,,it's a bunch of bull in my eyes.
LOL.............you cry because I said you hob nob w/the rich and then come back w/this. You were the one who made up BS and claimed another poster was way off base because he said Junior was in on the firing of Savage.
Dude..........you are a phony. And no brother of mine.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,309
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,309 |
OK, let's keep him. How many draft picks can Lerner get for him? Maybe if we throw in a few coaches too? Da Browns: Turn the corner! Mercilessly crush opponents! Maybe in Madden . . .
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
It seems more like trying to discredit an opposing opinion than being fair-minded and in the search of truth.
Like you'd know a DAMNED thing about being "fair-minded"
You lie to push your own agendas, then get all in a huff when people call you on it. You can't handle discussions that don't go your way, so you lash out and start with all kinds derrogitory crap, when a simple discussion would have handled things. Even now, you're going to stick to your childish mantra of not speaking to me, yet you just can't help but call me a name 
You have an anger problem, and you need help. I don't know what's on that island of yours, but I feel for anyone who's close to you 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555 |
Quote:
You were the one who made up BS and claimed another poster was way off base because he said Junior was in on the firing of Savage.
OMG,,,, What exactly did I make up...
In the first post regarding this thread and something that someone said, I indicated that I doubted for one second that Randy or any NFL owner for tht matter would care about public outcry,,, if they wanted a guy gone, he'd be gone..(of course I'm paraphrasing here)
But my intent was clear and it's also clear from another comment I made that I wasn't in the room when these discussions took place, so I don't know anything for sure...
YOU on the other hand indicate that you DO know somethiing for sure yet you offer no proof... None..
Vers, your right, your no brother of mine either!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618 |
It's the same people year after year after year who suggest that I make things up, lie, mislead, etc. And each time it is proven that I was correct, none of you guys are to be found. You then start the same thing again. I wonder how many people still buy it?
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
Not me. I been around long enough to seperate the wheat from the chaff.
This "shoot the messanger mentality" is contagious,but it doesn't change the fact that after all is said and done,you've been right all along. Some just have short term memory loss when it suits their agenda.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618 |
Thank you, Pit. I appreciate that. Very much!!!
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
Vers has been right on some things and not on others. Just like many people on this board. Not to you Pit, but I don't know why you guys have to attack each other so personally.  There really is only one guy on this board that has been consistently almost dead on about this team for years, IMO. I won't say who because he's already got way too big of a head as it is. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,524
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,524 |
Thanks!! 
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
Quote:
Thanks!!
LMFAO...
I figured she was speaking of GM.. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
I knew several on here would do that, I wasn't thinking it would be you.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,869
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,869 |
I was very tempted, but figured it' was too early in the morning to respond to one of your posts. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555 |
Oh Good Grief,,,
First, I don't ever remember calling you a liar.. If I ever did, please accept my sincere apology....
I also don't remember saying you make things up,,,, I may have suggested it when I wanted some proof however.
See Vers, to me, if you (or anyone) makes a statement,,,, for instance...
"The Browns are Moving to LA"
And says it's a fact simply because they have been right in the past,,,, but offers no other reasoning or offers reasoning that is based on gut feel, intuition... That to me is just plain irresponsible. (not to mention that if you or anyone said that, how many heart attacks would that cause on this board).
The difference, (at least I hope it's a difference) between me and you is that if I make a statement like that, I'll tell you where the info came from. If it came from a gut feel, I'll tell you... If it came from a news article, I'll link it. If it comes from the guy that's married to the sister of the guy who does Randy Lerners uncles landscaping,,, I'll tell you that. That way you can decide for yourself how much weight to put behind it.
I'll concede that you may be right.. That Randy may have been ready to fire Savage or demote him or remove some of his responsiblities (as was widely reported at the time)... But stopped because of public pressure, If you'll concede that I may be just as right in my contention (based solely on my experience working for several wealthy men) that if Randy wanted him gone, he'd have been gone dispite public pressure..
Beyond that, I have nothing more to say on the subject..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
I have a damn good record on LT prospects. Other than that,I'm lucky to break .500! So I know I'm not the one. From everything I've read for years on these message boards,I respect Verse,Diam (accept when he gets infatuated with underacheiving glamour boys),and when the chips are down,which is often times the case, }"E"ternal 'O'ptismist tab. And Toad usually has a fairly realistic and common sense approach to things. Daman does a pretty good scouting job. And I could go on. But IMO,many posters have their strong suits. But I don't care for sugar coating as a general rule. I'm not into "homerism". I want the unbridled truth,no words minced bottom line. And that's most likely going to be Verse and Diam. Do I expect everyone to agree with that? Why hell no! And if they did,it would be a FIRST! But I think most every poster has their strong suits and in most cases I agree with Verse and Diam on almost everything to varying degrees. There's people who truely know the game,then there's those that think they know it. This is simply my opinion. Leon is getting Baby'd by Savage. This is not good from a "team" aspect,nor is it good for Leon. It simply re-enforces his already shameless,ignorant behavior and is unnacceptible on both the part of Savage and Leon. I do still support the current FO and coach for ONE MORE YEAR! If I don't see things turning around,I will most likely no longer support them. If you have a five year plan,you should be seeing some evidence of this by year three. If not,you don't have a plan at all. JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160 |
This is simply my opinion. Leon is getting Baby'd by Savage.
Maybe from a outside perspective..Opie knows the media is hungry for any info that speaks about how they're handling Brababy..
Opie may want them to think that they are being lean on him and behind the scenes I think they're setting matters straight with him..perhaps relaying what future outbursts will result in.
I think sometimes Phil's responses are meant to sound..transparent..
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 01/15/07 12:38 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,832
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,832 |
Quote:
Quote:
Thanks!!
LMFAO...
I figured she was speaking of GM..
NAAA I was wrong once in 1944
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,524
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,524 |
Quote:
NAAA I was wrong once in 1944
Not too bad.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403 |
Quote:
Quote:
This is simply my opinion. Leon is getting Baby'd by Savage.
Maybe from a outside perspective..
I know nothing about how they are handling him internally, but I think this is a valid point, attack.
Look - it sure looked to me like Edwards lied to the media about a finger injury in an effort to hide the fact that he was being disciplined. The pride some of these guys have is hard for us common folk to relate to.
Its easy for us to sit here and say "deal with it, Braylon" but many of these kids are emotionally volatile and how this situation is handled both internally and publically could be the difference between getting things turned around and not. Its that important. I could care less what they tell us about the situation and whether its truthful or not. I just want it to be handled.
Sometimes its hard to remember that there's not necessarily a correlation between what they say publically and what they are doing. Its all just a means to an end.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
See,that's the kind of "far reaching excuses" that I don't care for. Saying "nothing at all" about the situation,is far better than seemingly "rationalizing it". This is pro football,not Kindergarden. And Savage is a GM,not an elementary school guidance counselor. And in theory,Leon is "supposed to be a pro and a man" not some sniveling spoiled assed brat.
To send ANY other message to the public,or anyone else for that matter than that,is sending the wrong message. There are no "far reaching excuses" to give Savage a free pass on those comments,period. There's no need for Leon to change anything if Savage is publicly covering his ass. And in reality,Savage is covering his own ass as well. He drafted Leon and wants to put a positive spin on a screw up,at least to this point.
It's time the fans quit covering his ass too. It's time we expect both Savage and Leon to man up and straighten this out. I don't "know" first hand what goes on behind the scenes,but no team can flourish with a cancer in the locker roome. You either cure the cancer,or cut it out.
It's past time people actually address it,rather than rationalise it.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,618 |
j/c:
This is embarrassing. These posts shouldn't be about me.......or any other poster. They should center around the Browns.
I hope I didn't give the wrong impression that I mean I am always right. That's not what I meant. There is a difference between opinions and facts. All I'm saying is that I do not lie. When I know something to be a fact, I pass it on...well.....at least most of the time.
Daman........I can't tell you exactly how I know these things, and I'm sure you are smart enough to know why. All I'll say is that I do know two people who work for the Browns.....in different capacities. I never ask them questions, but I do hear things.
Let me also say that I guarantee Maverick knows someone on the team. I can tell by the things he says. They ring too true and sometimes come out before that information has been released. In fact, although he won't admit it........I know who he knows. But, it would be wrong for either of us to tell anyone who we know. It's breaking a confidence.
I just want to get back to talking about football and the Browns. I admit that I get highly steamed when someone calls me a liar, or even suggests that I am making things up. Character is important to me. Much more important than looking like I am right.
So, I ask...........can we just talk about the Browns and football and leave the other [censored] out of it?
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
Quote:
The pride some of these guys have is hard for us common folk to relate to.
I can relate to it.
I know eghotistical idiots myself. It's a characxter flaw that must be rectified. And people are people. To hell with your "common folk" remark
.
Quote:
Its easy for us to sit here and say "deal with it, Braylon" but many of these kids are emotionally volatile and how this situation is handled both internally and publically could be the difference between getting things turned around and not. Its that important. I could care less what they tell us about the situation and whether its truthful or not. I just want it to be handled.
So basicly,Savage drafted a head case? If so,I agree he made a mistake drafting an eghotistical brat. Bad move on Savages part. He should be more studious in his draft annaylisis.
Quote:
Sometimes its hard to remember that there's not necessarily a correlation between what they say publically and what they are doing. Its all just a means to an end.
And the means to an end means covering for a problem child and decieving the public? That's acceptible. A big "no thanks" to what ever world you live in.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403 |
Quote:
There's no need for Leon to change anything if Savage is publicly covering his ass. And in reality,Savage is covering his own ass as well. He drafted Leon and wants to put a positive spin on a screw up,at least to this point.
That seems like a reach, Pit. You think Braylon is more accountable to his team and the coaching staff or the public? There's a balance.
Public humiliation is a tool that should be used wisely - with great caution, IMO. There's a reason why a lot of internal issues, fines, etc are not made public.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,555 |
Quote:
Daman........I can't tell you exactly how I know these things, and I'm sure you are smart enough to know why. All I'll say is that I do know two people who work for the Browns.....in different capacities. I never ask them questions, but I do hear things.
Believe it or not, that's all you had to say to me,,,,, You have some insider info,,, Naturally, you can't say who they are because that might betray a confidence.. and since you can't, we are free to make up our own minds..
Thank you!
and yes, we can leave the other stuff out of it. Back to the Browns!
So I heard a rumor,,,They are moving to LA!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160 |
Rac's response when he was questioned about is was like"Well he didn't miss any practices, all our guys are dinged..etc"..lol
Sometimes its hard to remember that there's not necessarily a correlation between what they say publically and what they are doing.
Agreed..my next comment is mostly for Pit..
Its not a excuse, Pit..I will add to my comment , Phil KNOWS..HE KNOWS the perception MOST have of Edwards and he still holds value to the team for the length of time he remains here..soooo to lighten the hard view Phil tries to paint a picture of Braybaby to get OUR VIEWS SOFTENED abit..
Not that he expects to make it work but he knows he has to say something that shows at least he doesn't have the trash and can him view that a lot do..
As long as they can harness his big mouth and get production from Edwards whatever they do is what needs to be done..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403 |
We've got to be the most polar opposite people on this board, Pit. I don't think we've ever agreed on anything - and we'd both say "Thank God" to that. lol Quote:
Quote:
The pride some of these guys have is hard for us common folk to relate to.
I can relate to it.
I know eghotistical idiots myself. It's a characxter flaw that must be rectified. And people are people. To hell with your "common folk" remark
One of the primary flaws of human development is the general inability to truly understand something one has not experienced.
Its why our young have to re-learn the same lessons over and over again in each generation.
"Common" is not derogatory. Would "typical" or "average" be less offensive?
The whole premise of your response is ignorant, IMO (ignorant <> stupid - I get blasted for using that word unnecessarily, so I've started using this disclaimer)
Quote:
Quote:
Its easy for us to sit here and say "deal with it, Braylon" but many of these kids are emotionally volatile and how this situation is handled both internally and publically could be the difference between getting things turned around and not. Its that important. I could care less what they tell us about the situation and whether its truthful or not. I just want it to be handled.
So basicly,Savage drafted a head case? If so,I agree he made a mistake drafting an eghotistical brat. Bad move on Savages part. He should be more studious in his draft annaylisis.
You think most of the kids in these drafts aren't head cases in one capacity or another? lol
What about movie stars and musicians - most of them are just normal down to earth people, right? lol
Based on what we know publically of Edwards and Wimbley, I'd consider Edwards closer to normal of the two. We probably differ in that view.
Quote:
Quote:
Sometimes its hard to remember that there's not necessarily a correlation between what they say publically and what they are doing. Its all just a means to an end.
And the means to an end means covering for a problem child and decieving the public? That's acceptible. A big "no thanks" to what ever world you live in.
As if his responsibility to be upfront with the public is on the same level with his responsibility to deal with the situation in the manner that he feels is best for the organization? lol
We're in "different worlds" alright - and again - thank goodness for that.
I'll agree to the extent that, if Phil's public statement truly is a reflection of how the situation is being handled internally - it doesn't bode well for the organization.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
As I stated in one of my above posts,Savage also had the oppertunity to "say nothing".
He "chose" to try to spin it to rationalize Leons behavior. That's my issue here in this post. He made a concious choice to make a feeble attempt to somehow rationalise and or at least minimise his behavior.
Maybe you see that as necassary? I don't really agree with you about "public humiliation" but that's not the issue here at all. The issue is,you don't rationalise and excuse bad behavior. If you feel that is acceptible,we simply don't see eye to eye.
Leon has an egho problem. Stroking that ego isn't a way to help it in any positive manner. So while he didn't have to embarass Leon publicly,he didn't have to make rationalisions about the situation either.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 403 |
Quote:
As I stated in one of my above posts,Savage also had the oppertunity to "say nothing". He "chose" to try to spin it to rationalize Leons behavior. That's my issue here in this post. He made a concious choice to make a feeble attempt to somehow rationalise and or at least minimise his behavior.
Now we're getting into separate issues - and I can't disagree with you here. Not at all. I didn't like the way Savage presented the situation in his press conference AT ALL.
Part of Savage's job (as is RAC) is PR. I don't think that Public relations and player relations always require the same path. They can be opposites.
Quote:
Maybe you see that as necassary? I don't really agree with you about "public humiliation" but that's not the issue here at all. The issue is,you don't rationalise and excuse bad behavior. If you feel that is acceptible,we simply don't see eye to eye.
No - I agree on the press part. I don't think he has an obligation to be honest - but I don't like how he handled/presented it either. Maybe trying to rally support for the kid since almost everyone seems to want to trade him away? No idea.
Quote:
Leon has an egho problem. Stroking that ego isn't a way to help it in any positive manner.
Stroking - no. Managing - yes. I agree that if this is how they are choosing to handle things internally as well - it doesn't bode well.
To clarify my earlier statement also - I was too general in saying we disagree on everything.
We often agree on strictly football topics (player evaluations, what the team needs, etc) - but we are philosophically very different people.
Makes things interesting to read such a different view point.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160 |
Maybe trying to rally support for the kid since almost everyone seems to want to trade him away? No idea.
Maybe not rallying support but softening it until they determine he can no longer be here...and saying he is firmly not giving up on him..
There were things he said that didn't need to be said..sometimes if ya talk too much ya say the wrong thing...
Perhaps another person would have just said that Brababy is not a cancer and any issues we have with him are being addressed ...and he'll know where he stands with us and his behavior..thats it..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
"There really is only one guy on this board that has been consistently almost dead on about this team for years"
I might be dead on with my football but know I'm way too much of a Homer to be dead on about the "TEAM".
But that remark to me resembles DIAM.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 282
1st String
|
|
1st String
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 282 |
Quote:
As I stated in one of my above posts,Savage also had the oppertunity to "say nothing".
He "chose" to try to spin it to rationalize Leons behavior. That's my issue here in this post. He made a concious choice to make a feeble attempt to somehow rationalise and or at least minimise his behavior.
Maybe you see that as necassary? I don't really agree with you about "public humiliation" but that's not the issue here at all. The issue is,you don't rationalise and excuse bad behavior. If you feel that is acceptible,we simply don't see eye to eye.
Leon has an egho problem. Stroking that ego isn't a way to help it in any positive manner. So while he didn't have to embarass Leon publicly,he didn't have to make rationalisions about the situation either.
Oh, and you're the sport psychologist, are you? You've evaluated all the clinically-researched methods for dealing with young men, thrust into fame and fortune at a critical period in their maturing process, facing the pressures of professional sports?
Please elaborate on your research and provide references to studies that back your claims that your method would be better than the method that Phil is using (which, most of us have already admitted, is next to impossible to know since it's happening behind closed doors.)
Phil comments were nothing. He came out, opined a few thoughts in response to an impromptu question about Braylon's behaviour that was anything but a spin-job or a prepared statement written by a crack team of speach writers. You don't accept his reasoning, but you have absolutly no idea what Braylon's issues are. Maybe he does actually cry himself to sleep every night about leaving Michegan or the successes of the Buckeyes.
You don't know that, I don't know that and neither of us has enough information to say that what Savage said is BS. If Phil had come out and said nothing, the same number of people would be enraged -- as evidenced by his lack of commenting about Bentley.
Phil is smart enough to know that he can't simultaneously tell a troubled player not to air his dirty laundry to the media -- and then rake that same player over in the media himself.
Don't get me wrong -- I'm not defending Edwards in the least because I found most of what he did this year was inexcusable -- but Winslow responded well to whatever early-season discipline the Browns chose, and there is no reason not to give them the benefit of the doubt with Braylon.
They (Savage/Crennel) clearly have an opinion as to how it should be handled, they've been down this road before, and if things are better next year, than it doesn't matter how it's been done or what your or my opinion is of the words Savage choses to speak publicly about it.
When you're running your own NFL team, you'll have the freedom to deal with things as you see fit. With all the currently open positions across the NFL, I'm sure something will come your way soon.
**Insert clever signature here attributed to some historical figure that sounds interesting but has been taken completely out of context.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 79,840 |
Quote:
Oh, and you're the sport psychologist, are you? You've evaluated all the clinically-researched methods for dealing with young men, thrust into fame and fortune at a critical period in their maturing process, facing the pressures of professional sports?
All you need to do is name ONE TIME that rewarding or excusing bad behavior has helped a situation. It's not rocket science. It's common sense.
Getchya some.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Quote:
Phil comments were nothing. He came out, opined a few thoughts in response to an impromptu question about Braylon's behaviour that was anything but a spin-job or a prepared statement written by a crack team of speach writers.
As others have often pointed out to me, seeing the statements made under the correct context is important.
On the surface, does it sound as though he's somewhat coddling Edwards? Yeah, it does. Yet we've seen time and time again that while Savage's ability as a talent evaluator tends to be as good as anyone's in the league, his ability behind the mic and in front of the media is most certainly not.
There's too much here suggesting that Opie is going to bat for one single player, the rest of the organization be damned. Such a belief is foolish. Vers even went so far as to say that Savage reinforced negative bahavior by firing Bozo after he challenged Edwards who didn't respond. Again, that's foolish.
We're all trying to read WAY too much into what's going on here. Edwards is not well liked by the fans or his teammates. That's a given. It doesn't take an "Insider" to reveal that bit of knowledge to us. The organization isn't happy with him. They've made plenty of comments to let us know he needs to get with the program. Coaches weren't fired because of him, and the organization isn't taking the stance that they are going to bend all the rules for Edwards, the bottom line be damned.
Savage said that if this team is going to move forward they'll need to build around Edwards and Winslow. HE'S RIGHT. The key is to get Edwards on board with the program. It has nothing to do with letting him get away with all this crap, and everything to do with getting production out of two guys who were top-10 selections and offensive talents like few others in the league.
Here's something else for people to remember. It's not necessarily up to Savage to punish Edwards. That job belongs to RAC. If someone is supposed to take the bull by the horns, it's the head coach. If there's blame to be handed out for not taking a stronger hand to Edwards, people need to look towards the position coach and then the head coach. If they let this thing get bigger than it should have, then they need to take the blame, not Opie and not Lerner.
Opie will carry the cross for this one if Edwards doesn't pan out. Nobody is giving a pass, and nobody is excusing him because he's the GM  He and his staff need to correct what's a listing ship, and it can done just as easily as it can fail. Time will tell. But times are different. Dealing with today's players isn't like dealing with players in the 80's. It's a sad reality of how the world now works, but that doesn't change the reality of the situation. Edwards doesn't appear to be the kind that can have a heavy hand smack him and be expected to respond. That's something Opie should have considered before he drafted him, but that also doesn't change the reality of the situation. Edwards is going to have to be handled a little differently if we're going to get the most out of him.
No matter how much an organization tries to get a guy to turn the corner, it's ultimately up to the player to mature and take the next step. Most of this will be on Edwards, and nobody else.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 |
they may have and i said MAY HAVE given Brey to much rope duing the year ... but IMO in PUBLIC they are handling this 100% the right way (I agree with u dang .. *L* .. ) .. at this point today .. heres what it boils down to me ... 1. SUPPORT HIM PUBLICLY w/o condoning his behavior ... and thats what there doing ... Opoe says he UNDERSTANDS and that the BEHAVIOR NEEDS TO CHANGE .... nutting wrong with that ... if he CHASTISES him publicly that does NO ONE ANY GOOD ... it backs Brey up against a wall and thats never good ... it makes him think we arent supporting him (and remember Pit this is how it appears to Brey not to us RATIONAL HUMAN BEINGS .. *L* .. ) ... also U want him to stop DETRIMENTAL BEHAVIOR (and one of those behaviors is going to the press to air dirty laundry) and U are trying to put a stop to this detrimental behavior by doing something that is VERY DETRIMENTAL by going to the press with it andmaking it publicly .. do u respect your parents when they tell u not to smoke while there puffing away as they tell u?? *L* .. 2. he needs to made aware that his behavior needs to change or it wont be tolerated and their will be consequences .. and this needs to be done face to face and in private .. and IMO thats what they did ... I believe since the season ended they have done EXACTLY THE RIGHT THINGS the way they should have been done .. if i'm wrong we'll find out next year when he starts acting like a jerk .. HOPEFULLY WE'LL NEVER FIND OUT and we can all speculate as to why he calmed down and why we were right .. *L* .. I also dont believe they handled things in season near as bad as most .. but i can see why u would think they didnt .. i dont agree wioth u guys .. but i completely understand your thoughts and won't tell u why your just wrong .. *LOL* .. cause u may not be ... this is Breys make or break off season in C-Town .. if he dotn get it this year .. my gues sis if he ever "gets it" .. it will be somewhere else .. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 15,188 |
Quote:
Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Phil comments were nothing. He came out, opined a few thoughts in response to an impromptu question about Braylon's behaviour that was anything but a spin-job or a prepared statement written by a crack team of speach writers.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As others have often pointed out to me, seeing the statements made under the correct context is important.
*LOL* .. could u imagine what those answers would have been if it was bOtch or the Don answering the questions ...
its so nice to have the LIARS (spinmasters is way to nice for them .. they were just plain flat out liars) .. out of town ..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 282
1st String
|
|
1st String
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 282 |
Quote:
All you need to do is name ONE TIME that rewarding or excusing bad behavior has helped a situation. It's not rocket science. It's common sense.
The world is full of morons who use "common sense" as justification for a myopic world view or opinions they are unable to express with fact.
So you think the best course of action is to rake a player over in the media for lack of maturity, while espousing the merits of a family-style football team and saying the discipline is an internal matter at the same time?
Interesting philosophy.
Personally, I believe (and luckily, Savage seems to as well) that a confrontational or corporal punishment technique is only going in increase the liklihood that Braylon will further isolate himself from the team and truly make a T.O. of himself.
**Insert clever signature here attributed to some historical figure that sounds interesting but has been taken completely out of context.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Well, with Botch, we'd have had an honest answer *L*
Afterall, he came out and said that you don't franchise tag punt returners (Dennis Northcutt, exit stage left)
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Titans to interview Phil Savage???
|
|
![[Linked Image from i89.photobucket.com]](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k233/marctheshark1969/thrandelelisafaggot.jpg)
