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Of the 3 outcomes you mention I'd have to say that I think GATE (gone at the end) is leading the pack slightly over GAB (gone at bye) and HCBD (head coach by default - sorry couldn't come up with a good one there  ). I also want to echo the sentiment "I don't care if he shows emotion on the sideline or not". Although, I can see where some people might be a little put off by a guy who looks the same ordering an ice cream cone or getting his ass kicked by Dallas. I really hope this is just a bad patch for Romeo and the team. But my gut (an ample one at that) tells me it's more than that. I still say I'd have Marty's phone number on my speed dial if I was Savage.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Maybe the FO will keep RAC on......but heres the thing. If Phil decides to go w/ RAC after a 4-12, 5-11 season...and then RAC fails again...now Phil goes with him. I just cant see Phil putting his head on the chopping block with RAC....I don't see how Phil would actually bet on RAC. If you really look at RAC...think of the pro's and con's of him as coach...and what hes shown so far....what else can you say bout him other than the players "love and respect" him. I'm also looking at it, not just what has he done to get fired, but what has he done to keep his job? 
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I am just talking past Monday or Tuesday.
The only way RAC keeps his job to next year is to win a playoff game this year.
Anything less gets him a ticket out of town.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
If you really look at RAC...think of the pro's and con's of him as coach...and what hes shown so far....what else can you say bout him other than the players "love and respect" him.
..I'm also looking at it, not just what has he done to get fired, but what has he done to keep his job?
You can say that he took over a team in total disarray and even after a complete teardown of the roster in his first year as HC, by the end of the next two years his team had won 10 games. That equaled the best in our division.
I know it's hard to remember after a 10 win season, but that first year Savage stripped the roster of the highest paid, underachieving players and filled their positions with warm bodies whom he never expected to go the long haul. He took that first season to evaluate those players he kept on. He brought in no free agents of mention except for Baxter to replace the surprising exit of A. Henry. There was no building that first year other than the draft where we got Edwards.
So, starting with year two and including year three, there were two drafts and two free agent signing periods used to build the team. The result of the second year of that was a 10-6 record.
When you also consider the low number of players from the Butch Davis regime still on the team it's easy to see that the talent in that first evaluation year was far less than stellar. So in two years of actual rebuilding from nothing, the team won 10 games and came this close to winning our division.
I think you can say that in addition to the players love and respect him.
The beginning of the 3rd season of rebuilding (fourth total) the team finds itself decimated with injuries to key players which makes it tough to compete at the level of competition we've faced thus far.
When you look at that situation closely it's heartbreaking to inagine what this season would look like so far had the roster stayed healthy in the preseason.
No concussion for DA, no stitches/shoulder for BE, no broken hip for Tucker, no injury to Stallworth, no bad shoulder for Steinbeck, no hamstring and ankle injury to Lewis and no high ankle sprain/shoulder/hamstring injury to Cribbs. And all of them would have missed no practice.
Think about that list:
Derek Anderson
Braylon Edwards
Joe Jurvicious
Jamal Lewis
Eric Steinback
Ryan Tucker
Dante Stallworth
That's seven of the eleven starting, key offensive players.
When you toss in Josh Cribbs, who has been the best tackler on special teams, the threat to take it to the house at any moment, and the sure fire field position set up man and of one who it was said in the offseason will begin to play a bigger role in the offense, is it any wonder the Browns offense didn't come out of the gate looking like the scoring machine they did last season?
So I guess you could also say about RAC that he sure drew some unlucky cards in the final weeks heading into the regular season with so many high expectations set upon the them by the fans and media.
You sure could say that.
And what does he get for his accomplishments? He gets called a dumb ass and the demand for his firing is rampant because 7 of the 11 key starters on offense are either out or playing hurt and the team is off to a slow and embarassing start because of it. Even though that is totally out of his control he is blamed. He is expected to take a team of injured players and second stringers and accomplish the same thing he did with a full compliment of a healthy and talented roster.
Apparently, if he can't do that he is a dumb ass and should be fired.
He's said it himself because he's been around long enough to know that that's how it is in this business. And I'll add to that that the reason that's how it is in this business is because the "talk" is generated by those who know little to nothing about the game (fans and media) and all they have are expectations and do not want to hear what they call excuses. Since they want to win (some of them think they want to win more than the team wants to win) they want nothing to stand in the way of that. And if something does stand in the way many refuse to acknowledge the reality of that and look for someone to blame. League wide the blame goes to the QB and the HC.
No one is a genius for analysing the situation and coming up with the conclusion that the HC is the problem. It's been going on for as long as there have been sports. The HC is the easiest one to blame as in the end the whole team is his responsibility. But it's never as easy as that as the situations and circumstances are usually multiple and in many instances have absolutely nothing to do with the HC.
Injury? No excuse. Inexperience? No excuse. Tough schedule? No excuse. Unfavorable circumstances and situations? No excuse. The fans in general, fed by the media, want to win and they want to win now!
And if daddy doesn't have enough money to buy them the shinny new bicycle because a tree fell on the house and it cost all the money daddy had to repair the damage they whine and cry and call daddy a freakin' loser.
#gmstrong
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All Pro
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if the players truly love him, they can save him. they can stop committing false starts and line up correctly. they can catch the ball. DA could conceivably stop staring down his receivers, put some loft on his deep ball and get the play figured out before the play clock expires. in a perfect world he could read a defense after the snap. the coordinators could help save him too. we could actually scout the opponent during the week and properly adjust during the game, calling plays that exploit perceived weaknesses and repeating plays that are actually working . it really could be possible to disguise our pass rush and/or improve it by teaching a little patience before the snap. so, yea its a great thing to be loved by his coaches and players. certainly they will try to rally. if they can execute and stop beating themselves this team might be able to save its beloved head coach. ultimately it will be up to these guys. honestly the good news for romeo is that he has zero chance of being fired by a fan. my father in law, who coached for the local high school said the best advice he ever heard was not to worry about who liked what he was doing because "your enemies can't get to you when you're winning, and your friends can't help you when you aren't". here's to you RAC. i'm rooting for you and the team to prove me wrong. there should be some kind of cheers graemlin.... 
A man is not old until regrets take the place of dreams.
John Barrymore
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And what does he get for his accomplishments? He gets called a dumb ass and the demand for his firing is rampant because 7 of the 11 key starters on offense are either out or playing hurt and the team is off to a slow and embarassing start because of it
But that's not why I'm not in Romeo's camp.
I'm aware of all of the injuries. I watched preseason and determined that we were not going to be able to compete against the kinds of teams that we had on our schedule.
It's his decision making that gets me. He's got to be one of the worst at using the red flag. Sure, last year he looked good. What coach wouldn't when your offense scores that many TD's. Makes it easy to forget short comings. -- by the way, I didn't like the call for that long field goal in the snow storm against Buffalo last year. The kick was good (barely) and I'll never forget how good a kick Phil made there....but the odds of that kick being good were not good...and we really couldn't afford to give Buffalo that kind of field position. It was a VERY important game. We won that game, so everything is hunky dorrey.
Do we ever see Romeo coaching somebody up when they come off the field. I don't mean yell at them like a Ditka, but just explain what should've been done in that situation. I never have. He just stands there. It's almost like having nobody there....a hologram.
He's a nice guy...and I respect nice guys...but where do most nice guys wind up?
![[Linked Image from members.cox.net]](http://members.cox.net/flyinc5/smallsigpics/frcburnout.gif) AL 29 76 14 R_K
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Do we ever see Romeo coaching somebody up when they come off the field. I don't mean yell at them like a Ditka, but just explain what should've been done in that situation. I never have. He just stands there. It's almost like having nobody there....a hologram.
Do you attend the games and watch RAC for 3 hours? That would be the only way that I know of where you could validly state that is what happens or does not happen......I know when I'm watching the games on TV they don't show RAC in a side window on the screen, do you get this on your telecast to be able to know he is a hologram??????????
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by the way, I didn't like the call for that long field goal in the snow storm against Buffalo last year. The kick was good (barely) and I'll never forget how good a kick Phil made there....but the odds of that kick being good were not good...and we really couldn't afford to give Buffalo that kind of field position.
Let's look at this "bad decision".......
The Browns had a 4th and 10 at the Bills 31 with 1:25 left in the first half. If the kick was missed, the Bills take over on downs at their own 38. Keep in mind that at that point they had amassed 68 yards of offense in the snow through the first 2 quarters........
What was wrong with that????
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For me - Romeo kinda' lost me last year when he flipped a coin to decide on his starting QB. This sends the starter into the game with no confidence. And, of course, it was the wrong decision since the coin flip winner was replaced early in the game for poor play and then was traded across the country the next day.
That is entirely factually incorrect....... 
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For me - Romeo kinda' lost me last year when he flipped a coin to decide on his starting QB. This sends the starter into the game with no confidence. And, of course, it was the wrong decision since the coin flip winner was replaced early in the game for poor play and then was traded across the country the next day.
That is entirely factually incorrect.......
Correctamundo Shep, but Vette dont let facts get in the way of a good rant. Romeo never flipped a coin to decide the starter in game1 of the regular seaon, he flipped a coin in the preseason to decide which QB was going to get the first shot,playing with the first team offense. What he was saying is both DA and Chuckie Frye were on equal ground,neither was the starter going into that pre season game. In game two the other QB would get the nod to go out first. People blew the coin flip way out of proportion and are now just makin stuff up.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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And what does he get for his accomplishments?
Accomplishments? How did he exactly...mold and fit a new roster? You mean the players that Phil has brought in. I think Phil has done a great job of overhauling the roster...made a few mistakes...but overall has increased the talent on this team since year one.
However where is the improvement?
Our pass rush is gettin worse, instead of better...we still cannot beat good teams....we are doing the same things as year one. We not getting better results even though the talent is increasing.
And guess what ddubia?...ya know what Romeos record compared to the great Butch Davis's after 3 seasons? And how would you rate the talent of this team when Butch took over versus when RAC did? Its very, very similar!
But as for how they stack up after 3 seasons!?
Its exactly the same...21 wins...only diff gonna be in there 4th year? The fact that Butch resigned after going what...3-8? So RAC has to win 4 games, this year to just match the Botch!...but he'll never be able to say he made the playoffs...or beat anybody, even considered "good".
Not to mention atleast, Butch beat the Steelers....yet we all know how awful the Botch was.....the entire city wanted him axed!
But RAC has accomplished SO MUCH!!! 
Hes takin a more talented team, and gotten the same out them as a team with no talent. Hes taken a better team than Butch had and lost, and will once again, have a double digit losing season! I see the big difference tho, RAC is a good human being, no doubt...his layers love and respect him, not disputing that. Butch was a jerk, his players hated him....after that...what the differences? Results?
Lets throw RAC a party, get him on the HOF ballet, and increase his extension from 5 years to life! We cant let another team rob us, they might promote him to HC and GM....better safe than sorry! 
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Really I would have no problem with Marty. However, If this decision is totally Savage's call I think you need to look around the league and find guys he has either worked with or has had some relationship with.
The one guy I really like is Mike Singletary. However, I have no idea how Savage views him. The one problem with Mike could be that he may want to run a 4-3 defense. PS I believe is committed to the 3-4.
If Chud was an interim coach and the team responded; he would be a strong consideration. He was a Savage hire and there would be some continuity there. Plus from a philosophic point of view they would probably be compatable.
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For me - Romeo kinda' lost me last year when he flipped a coin to decide on his starting QB. This sends the starter into the game with no confidence. And, of course, it was the wrong decision since the coin flip winner was replaced early in the game for poor play and then was traded across the country the next day.
That is entirely factually incorrect.......
Well, that was what was reported at the time. And it was discussed here. Do you know differently? If you do please enlighten...
So, I'm not at the games....but I've watched every one on TV and I have never once seen him talking to players (that I can recall). Kind of odd don't ya think?
So let's here from someone at the games. Does Romeo do anything but stand there on the sidelines? Does he actually coach anyone during the games?
AL 29 76 14 R_K
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[
Well, that was what was reported at the time. And it was discussed here. Do you know differently? If you do please enlighten...
So let's here from someone at the games. Does Romeo do anything but stand there on the sidelines? Does he actually coach anyone during the games?
In the post after SHeps telling you that your statement was incorrect didnt I tell you what was actually the case?
I go to the games, and I watch on TV.I see RAC talking to players all the time.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Well, that was what was reported at the time. And it was discussed here. Do you know differently? If you do please enlighten...
The infamous coin flip to decide who is the better QB took place before a pre-season game. It had no effect prior to or during the Steelers game.
you had a good run Hank.
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Our pass rush is gettin worse, instead of better...we still cannot beat good teams....we are doing the same things as year one. We not getting better results even though the talent is increasing.
So you're back to this drivel.
I mistakenly thought you understood that by not having so many of your key starters on the field early in this fourth year and having some of them playing hurt is the reason this team has failed to get a good start. But apparently, even since the beat down you took from Diam, you are going to keep up with the same ridiculous junk you've been tossing about all season.
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Accomplishments? How did he exactly...mold and fit a new roster? You mean the players that Phil has brought in. I think Phil has done a great job of overhauling the roster...made a few mistakes...but overall has increased the talent on this team since year one.
Apparently you have not been following the program. Savage brought no one in that first year. He had a draft. So far we've gotten Edwards and Pool from that draft and Edwards has just last season come into his own and Pool is still a question mark. I explained it all in my post and it is pretty damn accurate. Savage didn't even bring in a quality free agent until the offseason after the first season. Pay attention. The first season he brought in only Baxter. Yeah, that really upped the talent level that first year. 
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However where is the improvement?
The improvement is a 10-6 record in the third year. This year is no ones fault unless you are considering that RAC himself injured so many of our players the few weeks heading into the season.
You consider him a dumb ass becasue he and the rest of the coaching staff cannot take the team who is missing key players, others are playing hurt and a few second stringers are thrown in and make them play like the full healthy roster we enjoyed last season.
The rest of your post is nothing but a mental masturbation of which you are famous.
#gmstrong
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Well, that was what was reported at the time. And it was discussed here. Do you know differently? If you do please enlighten...
I'll try.
What he meant was that the coin flip was to determine the starter in the first preseason game. You had it placed to determine the starter for the first regular season game.
That's all it was.
#gmstrong
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I dunno who will be the next guy...but there'll be a next guy after today....RAC is the Mo of HC's....we should be whipping up on CInci.
This HC is a joke...DA shouldnt be on the field....we will lose by 30 point in our next 3 games.
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You're really big on predicting doom and gloom into the future, sometimes far into the future. It sounds like on bitter dang fan to me. I don't hear any hope or any cheering for our struggling team. All I hear from is fire this guy and bench that guy because we are doomed if we don't. Look at the big picture here.
btw...Great game today. RAC did nothing you wanted him to do and we won the game in spite of that. DA actually came alive for a bit towards the end of the game when it was most needed when all the while you were sure that it couldn't happen.
Who knows what the Giants game will bring. For for today I'm a happy Brorwns fan. Try it you may like it.
#gmstrong
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I pretty much agree.
A win is a win...may not change some opinions but it isn't the time to drub that up.
Actually, Z is sounding more like his displeasure is because Quinn doesn't play.
As 337 said in another thread....it looked like something started to clink with DA and the others in the 2nd half.
Maybe that is the spark......we will find out next Monday night.....err...2 weeks Monday night.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I'm sorry, but we can't have a QB that takes 3.5 games to get HIS game going. Now with a week off is it gonna take another 3.5 games?
Today, I saw Romeo be a coach. I saw him talking to players on the sidelines multiple times....something I haven't seen before. I didn't care for him going for it on 4th down at the 45 yard line though. To me, he does those things at the wrong time and doesn't do it when it's called for.
This was a bad performance by our team today. We won, but the hapless bungles with no Carson Palmer should've been routed by a good football team today.
AL 29 76 14 R_K
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We aren't a good football team right now....but I think we can be.
I saw Romeo too.....started to look like Steve Spurrier on the sidelines...the difference is Romeo is changing himself....that doesn't work....and I think DA found that out this season.....I explained it in another thread you are probably reading as I type this.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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LOL, you really have shown your true agenda haven't you? You are whining after a win. That's the difference between you and a guy like Peen. Peen is happy we won and actually looked at the positives. You refuse to because you want to be right. Again, please go back to the other board where intelligent football conversation is the exception and not the rule. You'll feel right at home there.
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LOL, you really have shown your true agenda haven't you? You are whining after a win.
There are a lot of people, I wouldn't say I'm whining but I'm generally disgusted by how we played and how the offense looked.
A win's a win and I'm glad that I get to be in a good mood tomorrow, but this wasn't a win that inspired sheer joy in me.
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I didn't like Romeo after the season before last.....but we won last year, so that changes the deal......just like Couch if you remember....I wasn't exactly kind to the guy but I really didn't say much about him after we won a game. You just wait and watch and see if you need to think about changing your position.
I don't see the point in bringing up a bunch of crap after a win....that is what we are out there to do isn't it???
Ugly wins are better than pretty losses in my opinion.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I'm happy about the win, but can you honestly say you are happy with that performance? Outside of Cincy and St. Louis, can you think of another team in the NFL we would have beaten today? We were lucky we got Cincy today.
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I am happy with what I saw as progress. I saw adjustments to the game plan to take advantage of the Bengals weaknesses. I saw an aggressive D. I saw an emotional RAC on the side line. I saw DA start to look like things were finally coming back.
Most importantly, I saw the Browns score more points than the opposing team.
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LOL, you really have shown your true agenda haven't you? You are whining after a win.
For me being the small minded ignorant football guy...you actually liked what you saw today? If Carson was playing, we lose...we would not have gotten the turnovers....not scored 20 points.
DA was awful most of the game...he went 11-14 for 110 yds.....in the second half, against a bottom 5 defense.....
Its not doom and gloom...fact is this team will get pasted its next 3 games...if we dont get beat by 20 in each game, ill be surprised.
Im sorry you feel that im being a "doom and gloomer"...im not gonna put on Brown and orange glasses and run around sayin I think we can beat the Giants...or anybody else for that matter b/c we roughed up one of the worst teams in the league without there best player...and won by a whopping 8 points.
RAC shouldnt get fired now..but in time...unfortunatley when this team is at 2-9 or w/e...even the staunchest RAC apollgists will see, hes no diff than Botch...except he hasnt beat the steelers...or went to the playoffs!
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Yes, I enjoyed watching the Browns win a game. You didn't, obviously. BTW, since you have that crystal ball out, Doc Brown, could you give me the winning numbers for the mega millions this week? After all, you can see alternate realities and see what would have happened if Palmer played, you should have no problem seeing those numbers.
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BTW, since you have that crystal ball out, Doc Brown, could you give me the winning numbers for the mega millions this week? After all, you can see alternate realities and see what would have happened if Palmer played, you should have no problem seeing those numbers.
Well if Im way off on my "doom and gloom"...put your money where your mouth is and tell me we are gonna beat any of our next 5 opponents!
But you know as well as I do...we have almost no chance of winning more than one of those...IF...we play a perfect game. The difference between the Bengals team today, and a healthy... rested Giants team..u know as well as me what will happen.
Did DA play "better"...sure...thats saying almost nothing as hes played as bad as any QB in the league. Had we destroyed Cinic...id see the light...but it was the same old no pass rush defense and the same old bad offense b/c DA cant string 3 good qtrs together.
So are you saying this team is gonna go forward and win after the bye week?...because they beat a Palmer less Cinci team by 8?
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No, I"m not saying they will win because of that. I'm saying they can win because of many factors you ignore because you want RAC gone. The Browns could turn it around, win out, and win the Super Bowl and you would still be whining about the team.
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Posts: 7,189
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,189 |
Quote:
The difference between the Bengals team today, and a healthy... rested Giants team..u know as well as me what will happen.
That logic you used right there is the exact same logic you refuse to accept regarding the Browns. There is a big difference between what we have put on the field the first four games and a healthy... rested Browns team.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177 |
Yeah....Id be whining...no you confuse my displeasure of this team right now with not being happy with the win...which I am...gotta get what ya can.
RAC hastn shown me anything...results certainly aren't there...his performance is right in line with Butch, only Butch made the P-offs, and then fell apart. When RAC gets this team to show improvement, not up and and down all over play...ill be happy.
The "free pass" b/c on no talent is over...hes got talent, had it last year...
Just once I wanna see this team do something it should do, play over its head...beat somebody superior to it b/c we were more prepared...more intense.
That stuff hasnt happend since RAC has been here....beating looser teams is great, we better do that...but that is not what defines a good team.
call me whatever u want...I want results...RAC aint gettin'em...this team is going backward, not forward. U can beat around the bush all ya want...RAC is 10 games under .500......u are what your record says u are...(Bill Parcels)
If we were winning...yeah ud have a legit claim...calling me whiner....we arent...I want this team to be a winner (like playoffs)...aint happening...if thats makes me a whiner cuz I want a winner and RAC isnt gettin that accomplished...and im mad about that...then by all means...call me a whiner...cuz I do wanna win...and wont be satisfied till we do!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,659
Poser
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Poser
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,659 |
Shhhh, don't interrupt rants with reality. It makes it less fun.
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177 |
Quote:
That logic you used right there is the exact same logic you refuse to accept regarding the Browns. There is a big difference between what we have put on the field the first four games and a healthy... rested Browns team.
Your comparing a healthy Browns team to the Giants?
Your the one w/ whacked logic...the Browns arent even in the same zip code....and last tinme i checked...we arent missing anybody key now...JJ...is a good player..but not like say Osi...is to their D.
So a rested, prepared Browns team should come out smokin again NYG....right? All the RAC "haters" will rn and hide then.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,849
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,849 |
O yea.. that LG we have thats injured is not key... whats his name?
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177 |
Steiny looked pretty good yesterday.....know hes hurt...but he played great yesterday....the team we played was hurt too...as were the Steelers...etc...
Everybody is hurt...every team has injuries, everybody has guys knicked up playing...some win anyway...the others blame everything on them.
Really dont matter...you guys drink your own coolaid all day long regardless....
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 7,531 |
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O yea.. that LG we have thats injured is not key... whats his name?
I think what he means is we have the depth to where losing Steinbach may hurt us, but it doesn't KILL us because we can pull a starting-caliber guy like McKinney off the bench. Is he as good as Steinbach? Oh HELL no. But it's not as bad as the days of surprise starting Damion Cook, a former DT who just got switched to LG to start a game.
At least that's my interpretation of it.
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Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149 |
Quote:
Quote:
That logic you used right there is the exact same logic you refuse to accept regarding the Browns. There is a big difference between what we have put on the field the first four games and a healthy... rested Browns team.
Your comparing a healthy Browns team to the Giants?
Your the one w/ whacked logic...the Browns arent even in the same zip code....and last tinme i checked...we arent missing anybody key now...JJ...is a good player..but not like say Osi...is to their D.
So a rested, prepared Browns team should come out smokin again NYG....right? All the RAC "haters" will rn and hide then.
I don't hate RAC, but I won't run and hide,...I'll be here. Now what I won't do is sit still, shut up and pretend we still don't need better coaching even after he and DA throttle the Giants to go 2-3 and be exactly where the Browns were last year after 5 games,....
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,177 |
Quote:
I don't hate RAC, but I won't run and hide,...I'll be here. Now what I won't do is sit still, shut up and pretend we still don't need better coaching even after he and DA throttle the Giants to go 2-3 and be exactly where the Browns were last year after 5 games,....
I dont hate RAC...its just an apple is an apple....RAC istn a good HC...now everyone who disagrees with RAC..is labeled a hater.
So you really think we are gonna take the Giants? Like honestly? 
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