DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Derek Anderson.......Still on the hot seat?

Quote:

---

First, a one year tender would have brought NOTHING back in trade, as DA would have been a a FA after that and you get very little in trade for that situation.

---

Taking it a step further, the only alternative would have been to hit him with a tag that would have meant HONEST big money. As it stands today, if he gets hot and becomes the man, we have him at a reasonable rate or can redo his contract. If he's not, it won't cost us hardly anything moving forward when we trade or cut him. Lastly, despite what many think, this time on the bench is most definitely NOT hurting Quinn. One look at Kyle freakin' Orton will tell you that's true.....KYLE FREAKIN' ORTON!

I'm going to try and point out that the most important thing is to try and make sure we have a starting QB. That's more important than draft picks, salary cap space, or players in return. But I suppose that's just a waste of my time, since the lesson is liable to fall on def or resistant ears......

B, I'm not liking this. Not one bit. Agreeing with you all the time now is making me nervous. It's like Bizarro world in here

Quote:

---

"because as Edwards admitted, he dropped the ball because his head wasn't in the game. Because his head wasn't in the game, he failed to read a blitz pickup. Who knows what else he did wrong during the game because he essentially quit on the team during the game. Then there's the confidence factor on Anderson's behalf. We all know he needs help from his receivers. If he doesn't have any confidence that Edwards will catch the ball, it'd be tough to argue that such a thing wouldn't creep into a QB's head."

Sorry I think you have this all backwards.

This "poor DA" stuff has to stop.

The scenario that you just described. BE's head wasn't in there. WHY?

Cause DA SUCKED! Its called Leadership and the Franchise QB you want is to make everyone around you Better...NOT WORSE. DA has the "ANTI-IT" leadership qualities. I'm not cadoning BE's lackluster performance...but this all goes into the file of DA as well as BE. It is DA's duty as a starting QB to make everyones performance better...not worse.

Was BE's head not in it cause of Girl problems? Financial problems? Canceled endorsement problems? No his head wasn't in it cause his QB came out and Sucked it up....AGAIN.

You don't call out the WR and state see, its not as much as DA's fault as you presume...but it is. Its not all about starting out 3-17 and having around 3 passes dropped in that time frame. Like 35% is better on short high percentage passes.

It was the fact that we had a game plan and prepared for it. And it was obvious to all that it was correct and there. WRs were open, they were playing the D we expected. Plays were to be had but we had DA doing terrible with a game plan that Matt Cassel would of probably passed with 70% completions. Johnson of Dallas, 70%....Collins of Titans...you know all the Backups playing the game. Well Johnson might be a stretch...his days have come n gone I think.

But who put BE state of mind in that not there state? Leadership is a big, BIG part of the position. Just another reason why DA ain't our Franchise QB.

JMHO

---

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

The most disturbing thing is how obvious it is that the Browns offensive staff sees DA's issues and actually plan for them.....I dont understand what else has to happen before somebody grows a pair and puts Quinn in.

We made mistake with DA and his big contract....it happens....bench him and MOVE ON.

---

Ok. I've seen it numerous times, and I can't ignore it anymore because I think it's a falacy.

Z, explain the "big mistake" we made with Anderson's contract, and why you feel that way.......

---

Quote:

---

Taking it a step further, the only alternative would have been to hit him with a tag that would have meant HONEST big money.

---

Quote:

---

Savage & Crennel aren't the ROCKS some think they are...THEY SEE WHAT'S GOIN' ON...

---

Quote:

---

And we have a decision to make BEFORE February...And that ain't that far off...Damn time flies...

Why before February???...That's when that 5M Roster Bonus comes into play...And if we're dumb enuff to pay it...He becomes a...Ready???...Damn near 9M Cap Hit...NEVER GONNA HAPPEN...

---

That's the info that people seem to have forgotten when the deal got signed, probably because it took several weeks for it to finally come out.

Here's the one thing that keeps alive a possibility that we could carry Anderson one more year on that contract: Quinn's deal.

His contract's big money was based on a 55% playing time escalator over each of the first two years, or 70% in the 3rd year. According to Rotoworld, there's $11 million available in '10 and '11 if he meets one of the two escalators noted above. His actual salary is only $655k.

So in theory (keep in mind I don't have his exact contract details in front of me, as it's not listed that finely on Rotoworld) if we send Anderson packing and Quinn becomes the man, his salary is probably close to $6 million. If Anderson stays, he's the starter, which means Quinn costs us his pro-rate SB plus $655k.

So Anderson's cap hit would be about $9 mil if he stays, and about $2.3k if he's cut.

Quinn's cap hit is $655k if Anderson stays, and around $6 mil if he's the starter.

(Keep in mind it's 6:30am and I can't sleep, so feel free to correct these assumptions if my sleepy-time meds are causin' me to lose my marbles )

So here's the bottom line: If Anderson stays he's the starter. Combined with Quinn, their total cap hit would be around $9.6 million. If Quinn is the starter, Anderson is sent packing, and some other boo-boo is brought on board at minimum money, Quinn will hit his escalators and the total cap hit would be around......$9 million.

So while it'd make a ton more sense to redo Anderson's deal if he's staying, the scenario to keep them both with these contracts as-is isn't as far fetched as we might think.

Quote:

---

I believe the slack Anderson is getting is because so many of the other pieces aren't in sync.

---

Quote:

---

The plan has failed,

---

Quote:

---

You can Paleeeze all you want. How bout getting a clue Its right there in front of you smacking you in the face and you can't see it. Otay.

---

Quote:

---

when u make DECISIONS or TALK out of anger/frustration .... do u usually make SOUND DECIONS/STATEMENTS??? ...

---

Quote:

---

Solid, post, Diam. You are right on the money.

---

So when he says none of you have any idea about the plan, you agree that you don't really have any idea either and this info you have really isn't solid information?

Interesting.

Quote:

---

I don't think we're quite there yet, Shep. However, I feel this week like I did with the Bengals game, which is that if Anderson is really doing poorly and we're out of the game, Quinn will get his shot.

I believe the slack Anderson is getting is because so many of the other pieces aren't in sync.

His job is about on a snap-by-snap basis......

---

Quote:

---

And does part of the plan entail checking your progress along the way?

---

It doesn't appear so. From what I can see, it's some long term, idealogical type plan with no concept of week to week accountability.

Quote:

---

it's not all braylon's fault anymore. it's all kellen's fault now

---

By some of the quotes, I'm thinking it may all be Chud's fault... It least we all agree it is not DAs...

Quote:

---

Lets say BQ comes in this week...lights it up and we win big...

---

Quote:

---

...what then?

---

Simple, we give him 2 years to find some consistency.

Quote:

---

Plans are great as long as you win.

---

True. And it reminds me of the only enlightening thing ever uttered by Mike Tyson.

"Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the mouth."

Arm Chair QB time:

I think 99% of the board will agree the correct course of action in the offseason was to give DA the one year tender. With his play thus far we could have hoped that he would have received an offer and we would have a 1st and 3rd. That would have been ideal.

But it's unfair to play hindsight 20/20. Did they make the right decision at the time? Maybe. I thought it was wrong but there was a chance that it could have worked out in their favor.

The problem now is that the plan has not worked and that is CLeaR!

What should you do now? The best thing for the team short term and long term. What is that? It is obviously making the change to Quinn in every scenario.

Maybe DA needs to get his head on straight. Maybe a break would do him good. We need to see what Quinn has at some point. Make it today!

Pure Heldawg opinion/speculation: My observation of Quinn is that they guy is a winner. He has immense respect amongst his peers. He's athletically gifted and better yet he pushes those gifts to their limit. I think we will see a huge change in the complexion of the team as Quinn will take the reigns of this offense and take charge in the huddle. He'll stand up to BE in the huddle and he'll shake some sense into the guy. I think he'll give us a measure of consistancy that is sorely needed.

It's so painfully clear even a DoLt can see it!

Quote:

---

Quote:

---

Lets say BQ comes in this week...lights it up and we win big...

---

Of all the scenarios possible, this is the only one that seems to get any action/repetition.... as if it's the only possible forgone conclusion.

Let me be (perhaps) the first to float this one out there:

Suppose DA gets benched, Brady sucksitup like a Dyson Cyclone on steroids, and we lose by three touchdowns? (24-3)

...what then?


...just curious.... or is it absolutely impossible?

---

Quote:

---

Lets say BQ comes in this week...lights it up and we win big.....what is every media person and 99% of the fans gonna be saying? We told you so!

And Phil and RAC will get hammered....

---

On this board? Nah..................

Here is what we would hear........................

"See, we told you there was a plan."



You see, it's easy to say there is a plan but refuse to devulge it. Because no matter the outcome, without any details, they can say they were right all along. It's the perfect catch 22.

Vague concepts like "When they give up on the season". Now what the hell does that mean? After six losses, eight losses, next week? It's an open ended statement that could mean about anything.



I know it would be a welcome relief to me. For you see, if this team figures out a win "despite DA", we may end up with a sub par performance year in and year out at the QB position. That's what worries me.

I either want to see good DA or bad DA. Winning on a semi-regular basis with bad DA scares the hell out of me!

Quote:

---

You see, it's easy to say there is a plan but refuse to devulge it. Because no matter the outcome, without any details, they can say they were right all along. It's the perfect catch 22.

Vague concepts like "When they give up on the season". Now what the hell does that mean? After six losses, eight losses, next week? It's an open ended statement that could mean about anything.

---

I'm not really sure who you are talking to or about there. The first paragraph sounds like you are talking about Savage and RAC. The second one sounds like you are talking about some fans who say there is a plan. I'll address them both as if you were talking to both.


First the team:

There has to be a plan. No one would venture into this without one. The team cannot just incoherently bumble game to game having no idea what they are trying to accomplish. That would be absurd. So yes, there is a plan.

They cannot and will not devulge their plan. Making the plan public would not only alert the fans to what's going on but put undue stress and pressure on the QB's. They don't need to know that plan. They only need to carry out their duties. So no, they are not going to devulge it to us.

Now me:

I know there is a plan as explained above. I don't know exactly what it is. How could I. How could anyone not entrenched in the organization. I'm positive the players don't even know. So asking for the plan from anyone but Savage and RAC will get nothing in return. I don't fear being wrong so that's not the reason I don't carve my idea of what the plan will be into solid granite. I don't care about being right either. So I'm not making a stance one way or the other. It's hard to make a solid stand when you don't know what's going on.

Even so, I've tried to lay out several possibilities that don't include calling Savage and RAC clueless. We don't like how the season has gone so far so we say the plan is at fault. We see only one alternative and that is to play Quinn starting right now.

Savage and RAC don't like how the season has gone so far either. But it's likely they don't think their plan is at fault. Unlike us, they see more than one alternative. We talk like they don't know to, or haven't adjusted their plan as it's progressed. How could we know that if we don't know the plan? It may have already gone through a couple of changes/adjustments since the season started. None of us know.

The easy thing to do is to is to make clever statements that add no possible insight whatsoever into what is going on. The harder thing is to try and understand what it is they are doing or what they are trying to accomplish. My mind changes everyday as to what I think they might be thinking.

Right now I'm thinking Quinn starts game 9 if DA doesn't play like he did vs. the Giants in the next two games. He might not even get two games for all I know.


I don't like the idea of a mediocre DA talking us throught the rest of the season either. Neither do I think that will happen. Why? Because of the plan. What plan? I don't know.

I just know there is one and so long as people believe there isn't they will also believe that Savage and RAC have no clue at all as to what they are trying to do.

Nah.

Quote:

---

Suppose DA gets benched, Brady sucksitup like a Dyson Cyclone on steroids, and we lose by three touchdowns? (24-3)

...what then?


...just curious.... or is it absolutely impossible?

---

100% absolutely no bout adoubt it IMPOSSILBE ... NO CHANCE .. NADA .. ZIP ... ZILCH .. NO WAY JOSE ..

did i make myslef clear enough .. if not let me know ...

its been a LONG ASS TIME XINCE I PIMPED MY BOY ... well I just gotta do it ... for U Hel ...

BRADY BRADY BRADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

damm that felt good .. one more time baby ....

BRADY BRADY BRADY!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote:

---

The simple fact is that NONE of us, myself included, could be a special teams coach in the NFL, let alone make the decisions some are claiming are so clear.

---

You said something really well there. That there are fans, and even media members, who see some decisions as so clear as to be no brainers. Yet the team does not move in that direction and they take heat for it.

Some think head coaching is as simple as knowing the basics of football, to be able to manage the time clock and intuitively know what decision, in certain situations, is etched in stone as being the one and only way to go.

Some think the OC's job is as easy as calling plays to either fool the opposing defense or ones that play to our strengths. The trouble with that is the opposing defenses are thinking the same thing so it's not so easy as it might appear.

It's all so darn simple to some.

The truth is there are so many variables that if I knew them all enough to name them in a list it would look like an 8 page thread of me and Pit exchanging replies. And that might be just on the run defense.


None of this is simple. Especially the decision regarding the future franchise QB. That's not to say they should postpone that decision due to indecision. But we all heard Savage say that we would postpone that decision as long as possible and he said that last season!

So now here we are at the cusp of that decision, nearing the end of all this QB management and we find ourselves getting antsy and wanting a decision now! I said in another thread that I believe that most people who give up and fail do so shortly before they would have been successful. We are nearly half-way into this season. This QB thing has been going on for nearly a year-and-a-half. It is almost over. As Toad said, patience and faith. It will get done and both Savage and RAC will be staking their jobs on their decision. Because if they get that wrong it will set this team back for the next 5-7 years. And before you argue with that; think deeply about it.

There is a plan. It's almost over. Let's try to understand what they're thinking without claiming them clueless and we'll all learn a lot in the process. Everyone on this board has some valuable football knowledge that goes beyond calling the regime idiots. When you call someone an idiot it is usually because you can't understand what the hell they are thinking. But this isn't Billy Joe Jim Bob sitting on the outside of a tree branch sawing at the inside of it. Something will happen very soon and the QB controversy will be behind us for a long time.

Then we can get down to the business of winning games: Period.