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Actually, Butch resigned.
How many teams do you know of that can their coach with only 3 games left?
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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Dude, I know that you are young and passionate, but also impetuous as I was a few years ago.
I want Romeo gone too, but it really wouldn't do any good to fire him with 3 games left.
If the interim guy coaches with a sack and tries to be innovative...then yes it would make a difference.
Plus, I think it'd lift the black cloud over this city. I remember when I went to the Browns/Pats game the week after Botch was canned and it was like there was an air of relief over the stadium.
You mean when we got beat something like 44-10? 
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I think it'd lift the black cloud over this city. I remember when I went to the Browns/Pats game the week after Botch was canned and it was like there was an air of relief over the stadium.
What the hell are you talking about? First BD resigned, second the rest of your statement is your opinion. An air of relief please. 
Canning RAC now does nothing, absolutely nothing for the city or team, it might make you feel better, but for the city and team? Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh No.
You guys should have read Ammo's classy emails he wrote to Savage (he posted them in chat), man he made many of us Browns fans sound like fools. 
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I think it'd lift the black cloud over this city. I remember when I went to the Browns/Pats game the week after Botch was canned and it was like there was an air of relief over the stadium.
What the hell are you talking about? First BD resigned, second the rest of your statement is your opinion. An air of relief please.
Canning RAC now does nothing, absolutely nothing for the city or team, it might make you feel better, but for the city and team? Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh No.
You guys should have read Ammo's classy emails he wrote to Savage (he posted them in chat), man he made many of us Browns fans sound like fools.
Firstly, I told you...I sent ONE e-mail. My friend sent the other one. You don't believe me but I don't have the mental incapabilities to write something as dumb as he wrote.
Mine was MUCH classier.
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So you and your friend fired off negative emails to Savage........
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Childish not negative, both emails even if he claims they were separate sounded as if a 5 year old wrote them, seriously both lacked class and football knowledge.
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So you and your friend fired off negative emails to Savage........
Not negative e-mails.
Here's what I sent, verbatim (with my username substituted for my real name).
Dear Mr. Savage,
I write this e-mail with the utmost respect for the professions of coaching and personnel management in the National Football League. In fact, it would be an honor and dream to one day have a job in the NFL. Because of this respect, I write this with a frustrated temperment. After today I cannot possibly see how you can keep Romeo Crennel for another day, let alone for the rest of the season.
The mismanagement of challenges and personnel has reached a boiling point. Cribbs should have played QB more when it was clear that Dorsey couldn't move the chains and it was clear that Cribbs at least gave the offense a pulse. It is so bad that Dan Fouts was openly criticizing our coaching staff.
I'm not sending you hate mail and once again would like to reiterate my respect for the people in charge of the pro game, I just really think I and this fanbase can't stand another week of this garbage.
Signed,
Ammo
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Dude, you and anyone else that sends an e-mail to anyone involved with the Cleveland Browns are a joke. That's pathetic.
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I disagree. I would send emails to The Browns if I had the email address and if I thought it would accomplish anything. I just don't think they would listen.
But if sending them an email has a cathartic effect then more power to the sender.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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I disagree. I would send emails to The Browns if I had the email address and if I thought it would accomplish anything. I just don't think they would listen.
But if sending them an email has a cathartic effect then more power to the sender.
Exactly...
I want them to hear my opinion, and I feel I was tactful and classy while doing it. Respectful and no name calling.
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Canning RAC now does nothing, absolutely nothing for the city or team, it might make you feel better, but for the city and team? Ahhhhhhhhhhhhh No.
Sorry, but what does keep him do? There's a 99.9% chance he's not going to be the coach next season. So keeping him around does nothing for him. He continues to send out guys who shouldn't be playing (AD to name one). Why not get an interim in there to try out new things, new players, new schemes etc. to see what works. With Romeo we know what he's going to do , and it's not going to work.
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Why does any Browns fan need to send emails to the GM. Is it not clear enough by our record and the BOOs at the stadium and the thrashing by the media that we suck and the fans have had enough ?
I'm sure Phil Savage has more important things to do then respond to fan mail. Actually I wouldn't think that would even be part of his job description. I mean, I want him working on the team instead of typing emails to Ammo. LOL
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I'm sure Phil Savage has more important things to do then respond to fan mail.
You must've missed the "Go root for Buffalo $%^$ you" comment? lol
Last edited by Psydeffect; 12/07/08 10:12 PM.
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I didn't miss it and it made me wonder why any fan has access to him in the first place. PR is not his job.
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I didn't miss it and it made me wonder why any fan has access to him in the first place. PR is not his job.
Hey if the President reads our e-mails so should the GM of the team I love as much as my country.
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Ammo, he very well may have read it, but you know what he did? He shook his head, laughed, and thought about just how naive it was for a guy sitting on his couch to think he knew what was the right way to caoch a team, and hit delete. You did no more than give him a chuckle, and rightfully so. No ofense, as everyone gets so offended when I state the truth about this, but you, I, nor anyone on this board have enough football knowledge to tell Savage, RAC, or anyone else on the staff what is obvious on how to run the team. With that statement, you blew any chance of Savage or anyone else in the organization from doing more than rolling their eyes when they saw your email.
Trust me, I would bet my entire salary for the length of my contract that Savage did not read your email and then pick up his cell and call Lerner and say, "Hey, this guy Ammo sent me an email and said we should fire RAC because it's obvious RAC should have benched Dorsey and played Cribbs. We should fire him. Ammo said so."
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Meh, whatever floats your boat.
I don't agree with your opinion, but I found nothing inflamatory about the email.
Ummm.....but Ammo.....yes, it WAS negative. 
If you want to write Savage emails, Hell, write Savage emails. It's your time to spend as you wish, though there's no effect to be had.
You aren't aware of it, but the FO people throughout the league spend FAR more time reading through legit forums than they do random fan emails.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Ammo, he very well may have read it, but you know what he did? He shook his head, laughed, and thought about just how naive it was for a guy sitting on his couch to think he knew what was the right way to caoch a team, and hit delete. You did no more than give him a chuckle, and rightfully so. No ofense, as everyone gets so offended when I state the truth about this, but you, I, nor anyone on this board have enough football knowledge to tell Savage, RAC, or anyone else on the staff what is obvious on how to run the team. With that statement, you blew any chance of Savage or anyone else in the organization from doing more than rolling their eyes when they saw your email.
Trust me, I would bet my entire salary for the length of my contract that Savage did not read your email and then pick up his cell and call Lerner and say, "Hey, this guy Ammo sent me an email and said we should fire RAC because it's obvious RAC should have benched Dorsey and played Cribbs. We should fire him. Ammo said so."
Doesn't matter. I like to voice my opinion, and as long as I'm tactful and respectful about it I feel like I have the right to do so.
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Hey shoot lets ride Romeo into the ground and secure that top 5-7 pick 
Go Browns!!![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/BrowniePoints/AndersonSnowPic.jpg)
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Post delete´ by Referee 3
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I think I was ok with milkdud, but might not be ok with that.......
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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He has had the benefit of building this team from Scratch..... He has to have a pulse on this team
As you said eo it is the primary qualification.
He doesn't even have to have veins popping or be animated in some way. He must be able to manage which means that if you have any doubt how hard someone is going to play and they still see the field, well.......
I tend to think that Romeo is a fine teacher. He just defined his ability to manage.
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Canning RAC now does nothing, absolutely nothing for the city or team, fans sound like fools.
With respect my friend, I think it would have some benefit.
At this point, Romeo knows he is pretty much done. The only glimmer of hope is for him to win some games down the stretch, and winning games down the stretch at this point is meaningless.
Romeo isn't going to be very accommodating by helping his potential successor by doing what needs to be done at this point....seeing who can play and who can't. He is going to keep doing what he has been doing.
What we should be doing is:
-Seeing if Beau Bell (if healthy) has the speed and football sense to play LB in the NFL
-Seeing if Alex Hall can really be a sack machine
-Seeing if Harrison can be an every down, or at least a 50/50, type of back
-Seeing if Rucker has any chance of replacing Winslow
-Seeing if Orr is in, or a wast of time
You guys can add anything else to the list you want.
At this point, Willie McGinnist shouldn't play another down all season..what's the point?? He is gone after the season.
We need to get a few things sorted out and find out if some of these other guys can play, or if they need to hit the road.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I want them to hear my opinion,
You are assuming they care about your opinion which is probably a stretch to begin with...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Whats the purpose?
I mean you act as though your anger is going to change anything..it's not.
At this stage I'm not ticked...I understand whats going to happen..
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He changed that email to a degree, but the other one he wrote was way more childish, but either way it is a waste of time and highly doubt either of his emails were read my Phil.
Peen, I understand what your saying but all the things you want to happen could happen with RAC at the helm if Phil wants him to go that route. I honestly don't see any logical reasoning of turning this team over right now just to do so without a plan, this would make Phil look clueless and I don't see him putting himself in such a position.
Soon after the season I figure RAC will be gone, I just can't find any sound reasoning to make a move such like this now by the FO unless RAC quits then it is another story, but if Phil fires RAC he better have a plan in place and not make an off the cusp move many fans want though can't justify. Don't fire a guy for the sake of firing him, have a plan then make a move and that is my guess as to what Phil is doing, putting his feelers out there to see who is or will be available as a HC.
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just how naive it was for a guy sitting on his couch to think he knew what was the right way to caoch a team
In fact, I think it's you that is naive. I think it's extremely reasonable to believe that as much as 50% of the "average knowledge fanbase" could coach this roster to a 4-9 record.
There's just too much talent to do worse. Furthermore, this roster would likely have the same record or better without a HC at all.
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Just clicking...
I can see that some of your feel that firing RAC will give YOU SOME CLOSURE but it does nothing for the betterment of this team and their future.
The ONLY and I MEAN ONLY thing that it could be a possible positive for the organization is if a Minority Coach was placed as the Interim HC and then subsequently interviewed immediately at season's end for the 09 job. But that would be it and quite frankly Rip and Chud are probably the first 2 who come to mind in taking the Interim job MOSTLY RIP and that would not give us the only advantage of an interview. But seriously outside of some PERSONAL fan's need for closure really there is no value in firing RAC now.
The other thing is most, MOST of the players want to play HARD for RAC and will so I don't see a better product going out there these last 3 games cause RAC is out.
Ammo...no the email was not classless. Just the notion that you know better is what makes the communication valueless to Savage or any NFL Staff. I think that is why you are getting ridden hard for it. But not classless.
RAC will ride this out unless he has a nervous breakdown like said Butch, but that is cause Butch never thought that possible. Where as RAC has said from day one...he could go at anytime.
It has grown obvious that RAC is gone...actually if he is not gone we would be digging ourselves such a hole that RAC would have to Win and get in the playoffs or else we would be considered Total Buffoons for keeping him on.
The thing that disturbs me most is our OL. They are the only unit that don't seem to want to play for RAC - led by Fraley and I think RAC lost them when he changed to BQ. I just don't like that at all.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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The thing that disturbs me most is our OL. They are the only unit that don't seem to want to play for RAC - led by Fraley and I think RAC lost them when he changed to BQ. I just don't like that at all.
Man... I'm sure glad to see someone else on this board thought the same thing.
The entire unit seems to be going through the motions, of late. Of course we posters have no actual "take it into court" proof that these guys have quit, but to the eye it certainly seems to be the case. No holes for RB's. A "face full of defender" for Dorsey.
I know this OL has is banged up and has suffered under Tucker's absence, but damn... this unit looks like the '04 bunch right now. To be honest, I'm not even sure that we'll finish the season with Dorsey on the field.
I know this group is playing hurt, against D's that put last year's competition to shame, but there really should be better play coming from these guys.
___________________________________________________________
I'm not given to rants usually... and I won't go on one now. I'll simply let my next statement describe where I am, as a fan:
" I'm well past the point of even being perturbed at this team. I gave up being angry long before that. Now my Sundays consist of staring numbly at familiar colors flopping about, while slowly shaking my head. "
I think I'll try to find a more exciting, action-packed hobby to occupy my time for awhile... maybe decoy carving.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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The thing that disturbs me most is our OL. They are the only unit that don't seem to want to play for RAC - led by Fraley and I think RAC lost them when he changed to BQ. I just don't like that at all.
If there's a shred of truth in there and I said about Frank in your thread a few weeks ago..maybe it's just two players..the left side doesn't appear to be as bad as the right side is with Hadnot/Shaffer.
Those two together are horrible..I know Tucker is missed at RG to cover up Kevin's blunders.
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Dude, you and anyone else that sends an e-mail to anyone involved with the Cleveland Browns are a joke. That's pathetic.
Yea.. what's the point? Savage is a professional. He knows whats going on. He doesn't need irrate fans telling him, or giving him advice, on issues of his team.
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Peen, I understand what your saying but all the things you want to happen could happen with RAC at the helm if Phil wants him to go that route. I honestly don't see any logical reasoning of turning this team over right now just to do so without a plan, this would make Phil look clueless and I don't see him putting himself in such a position.
It could......but will it???
I don't know if Savage can dictate to Romeo who plays and who doesn't. It is almost counter productive for the coach to do that...wins is what he wants...be it to cling here past this year, maybe land another job somewhere else, or just plain old pride.
Don't misunderstand where I am coming from...I am not calling for his head(now)....but there are advantages in moving him now.
I am sure he will finish out the season....maybe at the directive of Lerner.....maybe he wants to see how Savages players respond...do they quit or not??
Face it guys..there is going to be some rebuilding around here...be it with just a coach, or a coach and a GM.
No new coach walks in the door of a losing football team, looks around and says everything is hunky dory and just keeps on with the current players/system...they are dumb if they do and proves it before they even start playing games.
This isn't all "just" coaching . I don't like Romeo, but he isn't totally inept.
There are some serious holes in scheme, coaching, AND personnel.....and some of those are in areas they shouldn't be.
We have had enough time to see some results...I don't care what anybody says.
Just looking in to my crystal ball...Romeo is out, and Savage takes a reduced role or he is out as well.....he isn't going to have final say over the roster any longer, and he isn't going to have the draft trump card.
My guess is he will hide behind his contract and end up gone as well.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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The thing that disturbs me most is our OL. They are the only unit that don't seem to want to play for RAC - led by Fraley and I think RAC lost them when he changed to BQ. I just don't like that at all.
Are you trying to infer that Hank and the line would delibertely sandbag because of the QB change?
I am asking a question based on how I read your post. I don't want to jump to a conclusion.
#gmstrong
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"Are you trying to infer that Hank and the line would delibertely sandbag because of the QB change?"
No I'm trying to say that their Hearts my not be in it and feel mentally that their season is DONE. All you need is that loss of edge to do bad.
But the OL should have gotten better due to their continuity of playing together. But since the demotion to DA the OL has progressively gotten worse as in they seem to be a UNIT that has quit. It is Fraley who made the comments, Anonymously but we know he made them, those were strong words and cannot reflect that he and if he speaks for OTHERs will have them playing with entire, Blood and soul. In other words what I see from the unit is going through the motions....not deliberately - just Mentally and the results of that "EDGE" being gone. The Heart just doesn't seem to be there as a UNIT. Hank is their Leader, I'm pretty sure of that. Where he goes they will follow.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Hey shoot lets ride Romeo into the ground and secure that top 5-7 pick
Exactly. 
Firing rac now does nothing. I've never understood why any team would fire a coach near the end of a miserable season. Let him continue to hang himself....or show he can coach his way out of this problem. And on top of that, you'd have to "pay" another head coach the rest of the way.
Heck, firing any coach in any sport during the season is sort of stupid (unless you're the owner of an NHL team, for some reason coaches get fired all the time regardless of record and it seems to work out ok).
And the dumbest is when a team announces they'll fire a coach before the season is over....lame duck. You hired the guy, let him finish the season.
Of course I agree on letting rac go 1 day after the final game of the season.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I think that was Fraley who made those "unanimous" (sp?) comments about how it wasn't fair to bench DA.
Fraley needs to go.
Jamal Lewis needs to go.
Stallworth needs to go. I'd rather bring in Roscoe Parrish.
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What comments are you talking about?
#gmstrong
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I think that was Fraley who made those "unanimous" (sp?) comments about how it wasn't fair to bench DA.
Fraley needs to go.
Jamal Lewis needs to go.
Stallworth needs to go. I'd rather bring in Roscoe Parrish.
I could see Fraley.
What did Lewis and Stallworth do to warrant cutting?
Lewis is just trying to run behind an OL that is a revolving door and following Chud's playcalling.
Stallworth while disappointing hasn't been much in the game plan either, again on Chud.
Same goes for DA - hard to be a good QB if your OL isn't doing it's job.
Last edited by CDawg; 12/08/08 03:16 PM.
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Quote:
I think that was Fraley who made those "unanimous" (sp?) comments about how it wasn't fair to bench DA.
Fraley needs to go.
Jamal Lewis needs to go.
Stallworth needs to go. I'd rather bring in Roscoe Parrish.
I could see Fraley.
What did Lewis and Stallworth do to warrant cutting?
Lewis is just trying to run behind an OL that is a revolving door and following Chud's playcalling.
Stallworth while disappointing hasn't been much in the game plan either, again on Chud.
Same goes for DA - hard to be a good QB if your OL isn't doing it's job.
Lewis can st²y, as long as he knows his role will be reduced. He is not an every down back.
As for Stallworthless, when he actually made it on the field, he has been no factor. I don't know if it's because his routes are awful, if the QB's just don't want to throw it to him, or if it's a gameplan, but he has been awful. And I don't expect him to all of a sudden play 16 games.
Hank has always been a player who I think plays hard and to the best of his talent...but between his off field actions of saying how RAC made the wrong move and his on field performance, I would like to see someone else come in.
At this point, anyone outside of Rogers and Thomas could be replaced and I would not have a problem with that.
Edit: Let me also say this.
Keep Romeo and Firing Romeo right now makes little difference to me. Neither Romeo or the interm is going to play to win.
Firing Romeo right now doesn't do a darn thing. Keeping Romeo right now doesn't do a darn thing. He's going to be fired at the end of the year anyway.
I'm really indifferent and I don't think it really matters, one way or the other.
Last edited by Thebigbaddawg; 12/08/08 03:57 PM.
you had a good run Hank.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Lewis reminds me too much of Droughns in 2006.
He has holes, I swear to God I see some WIDE OPEN holes that close quickly because he takes forever to get there!
I don't think the line is playing as poorly as people make it out to be in either run blocking or pass blocking.
Yesterday was by far their worst performance, but that's also the strongest front four they've played all year.
Fact is Lewis is done.
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