DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Anderson/Quinn may continue in 2009

I just wish I knew what the hell we could do to fix 3 OL positions this offseason when we have such glaring needs on the other side of the ball. Maybe we can pick up 1 or 2 of the Ravens 3 LB free agents...?

Not to mention the fact that we also need another RB and a legit #2 receiver.

Micheal Oher of Ole Miss and Andre Smith are 2 guys who will go high....maybe too high....maybe Eugene Monroe of Va has the value where we pick.

Ungar and Mack are 2 centers from out west that carry a high grade, though not at #5 like the others might.

Round 2 guys might include C Antione Caldwell of Bama.

I think it is critical we get some picks back as this is a deep draft, with some good O-line prospect...especially guards and centers.

I agree, we did a good job of building a fairly decent line, then it started to crumble last season. If we don't fix it, we are back to crap, and if we think we can fix it selecting the Sowells of the world in rounds 4-5-6, we might as well forget it.

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That is just from a positional standpoint...who is actually there will play a big part as I don't discount the BPA...sometimes there is a player there you just can't pass even if it doesn't make total sense from a positional standpoint

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Other than the QB's...Can u name any position on this team that would prevent us from taking BPA???

And that right there will be the beauty of this draft...

All the draft talk right now is just fun for these guys...All going off these Scout's Top Boards...We all know that the dumb ass Combine and SR. Bowl will shape teams boards...So when talking about a Curry or Mays in particular...It's majorly hard to project them as even worth a 5 pick...

Curry's up in the Top 10 and even Top 5 all over the place...But Mays is the one that needs to WOW WOW team executives to crack the Top 5...

VERS???...Hope u ain't listenin' cause I'm gonna say sumptin' here that would make u scream...lol...

Savage apparently went VERSATILE PLAYER versus what Crennel woulda preferred for his 3-4 D...I wonder ALOT if he was specifically referring to BRODNEY POOL...He doesn't quite fit the Top 3-4 D mold of a Reed/Polamalu/Harrison now does he...

As much as we need to address the ILB and OLB spots...A Corner with Size...And possibly the 320+LB DE's on this defense if Mangini sticks to that 295 range End as previous...We need to address the BACK END of this defense...And I am very unsure that we will offer Jones a new contract...So there's yet another open spot...

THAT is why Mays might be in the picture at 5...But he better light it up at the Combine cause right now he's in the 10-15 range all over the place...U DO NOT take Safeties and LB's at 5 unless they are bonafide STUD-LIKE...That's just a FACT...

The sweet thing about this draft and the POSITIONS Players rated highly is the fact that we CAN'T GO WRONG...They ALL FIT...

Smith OT
Oher OT
Monroe OT
Crabtree WR
Wells RB (Who I DO NOT LIKE)
Orakpo DE (OLB)
Curry ILB
Maualuga ILB
Mays S
Jenkins CB

We'll end up with something we NEED...

And it would not bother me in the least if we signed a Carlos Dansby at ILB and came right back with a Curry to put right next to him in place of Jackson...

I agree...though I wouldn't exclude qb....but that will sidetrack things, so we can just leave that alone.

My point is if we go O-line,,,some will go nuts.


Now, you have known me a long time, and you know I have a rep as being anti-O-line...unfair...I was just anti Nat-the-Kat and a few of the others being thrown out back in the day

If we can get Smith..I snatch him in a minute....but no doubt...we go Curry...legit pick with a need...same for Jenkins...same for Orapko....same with Mays, Crabtree...the list goes on a few more...a compelling argument could be made for any of them..

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Flacco has 2 playoff wins as a rookie because of the D. He was 9-23 for 163 last week and 11-22 for 140 some today. Let's not act like he's Dan flipping Marino, Peen.

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The ravens are winning now just like they did when Dilfer was the QB... with D.. although, I think Flacco is the real deal.. I think there will come a day that they will rely more heavely on him. JMO however.

I agree. Flacco's been impressive in the role the Ravens need him to play and they have a good enough D they've not had a need to ask him to produce more.

Here's what I think and it's not that far off from your opinions, I think.

We need to pick a QB and trade the other guy. Before the draft, if possible, before the season for sure. I think Quinn is the guy but if Mangini and his staff decide otherwise that's his decision to make and at this point I have no reason to distrust that decision making process.

We need 2 good LBs. Draft, FA, I don't care. If our LBs play like they're 25 instead of 55 then we shouldn't need to worry about our CBs. They can play tighter and actually cover people downfield.

We need a RB with speed. I think Lewis is OK as a backup, now, but his engine is running at 3/4 speed so we need a replacement. I think he still has the fire in the belly but the wheels just aren't there anymore.

I think we need a stud RT. Tucker will break down again even if he does make it through training camp. Fraley will be OK if he's surrounded good players. The left side is OK. A RT will heal the right side.

If, and it's a big IF, we can do this we will win. And probably win big. Especially with a schedule that APPEARS to be much easier. Can we do it? God, I hope so.

how much left does tucker have?

our line play dropped significantly when he got hurt....if he can make it back for a year or two, it will bide us some time to fill some defesive positions...

I think the Anderson/Quinn thing is non-existent, i.e. Derek is trade bait, and if so, therefore, possibly a big part of trading down,....or maybe even just trading for a pick period,....who knows.

Let's get this GM thing over with, so Mangini can go to work.

If you want to know how important Tucker was to us,, look no further than the only game he suited up for and played this past season.... Against the Giants. it was almost a perfect game for our O..

Was it all Tucker.. I wonder. He's the only main cog that was missing before or after. So make your own determination.

I wish I could say he's gonna be fine and come back and be here all season. But I have my doubt.. Man, I never realized how important he really was.

So, that means there is a big giant hole there that needs filled...

We can't rely on Tucker; that's why I will not be disappointed to get Smith/Oher, even at 5 with no other deal(s). This draft is deep.

LOL, talk about too easy. RAC hadn't informed DA that he would be benched. THAT'S why he "named" DA the starter (nice spin on words....the last resort of someone that can't debate). RAC stated that HE made the decision to start BQ. He also stated the the injury WAS a factor in the decision to pull him. You have nothing more than opinion. I provided quotes from RAC. One of us are using facts. The other spouting their opinoin as fact.

Your opinoin doesn't match the reported facts and it certainly doesn't match what was going on in Berea. There were some players that wanted DA, but not all, as you claim. The coaching staff wanted DA to start at the beginning of the season, but as the year went on, they knew it was time to give BQ some reps and see how he progressed. The timing made sense when it actually happened. It had been decided that they would eventually start BQ once the playoffs were a remote possibility. Starting him on the road with a short week to deal with the media and against one of the worst Ds in the league made it the right time.

Now, go back to Fantasy Land where you wanting something to be true makes it so. Here in reality, we use facts like the quote I provided for you.

Unless Mangini has seen enough of both guys to know that Quinn is "it" and DA isn't then I think you are right, we will pay him the bonus. The only proviso would be if someone else out there, like Og and Loyal, have fallen in love with DA and is willing to pay some of the bonus just to get DA in the facility as early as possible. Not sure who that would be but I can't understand why a team like the Bears has 3 QBs like DA yet still haven't drafted a QB lately. So a lot of NFL thinking evidently escapes me.....

It would be nice if whatever trade happens nets us a 3rd round pick this year. Although, I can see the logic of a conditional pick for next year. That would protect both teams somewhat.

I'd love to be able to draft a guy like Oher and a guy like Curry. But my magic wand died many years ago so I guess we'll have to settle for just one of them.

I'll tell you one thing I do expect to see, even though this is somewhat off topic.....I want to see a home opener that looks like it's as important to the team as it is to us. No more sleepwalking through our first game of the season. That'll go a long way towards my opinion of Eric Mangini.

My decision LOL

Crennel: Quinn is 'my decision ... and we're going to beat Denver, that's what we're going to do'
by Tony Grossi
Tuesday November 04, 2008, 5:58 PM

John Kuntz/The Plain Dealer
Browns head coach Romeo Crennel insisted the switch in starting quarterback to Brady Quinn was his decision alone, backed by GM Phil Savage.


It was so out of character for coach Romeo Crennel to change quarterbacks that the prevailing perception is that the switch to Brady Quinn was mandated from above.
"Nobody saw it coming," said linebacker Willie McGinest, who knows Crennel better than any of the Browns. "It's a decision somebody decided to make, or a collective group decided to make. It is what it is."

Asked if he felt it was strictly a coach's decision, deposed starter Derek Anderson said, "I respect Romeo and what he's done, and that's as far as I want to go with that."


Yet Crennel and General Manager Phil Savage insist it was Crennel's choice to begin the Quinn era with the Browns struggling at 3-5.

"I felt we needed a different dynamic on the offense. That's why I made the decision," Crennel said. "Some of the things that had to do with it was our record, offensive ranking and offensive production.


"Some people have talked about the timing [compressed by a Thursday night game]. Well, I don't think the short week had anything to do with it. It was just time. So I did it and we're going forward.

"We're not throwing in the towel, not giving up on the season. We're going to beat Denver, that's what we're going to do."

A lot of the perception is based on Crennel initially telling media shortly before noon on Monday that he didn't plan a change at quarterback. He did qualify it a bit by saying Anderson was the starter "as of right now."

According to a source, Crennel already had met with Savage on Monday morning and the two men did discuss the negative reaction fans had to Anderson's interception that sealed a 37-27 loss to Baltimore. It was mentioned by Savage that the fans could jump on Anderson hard if the quarterback had a slow start Thursday night against Denver.

Crennel said he wanted to discuss the quarterback situation with his coaches before making a final decision. The source said that offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski "was disappointed" in Crennel's thinking, but neither he nor Rip Scherer, quarterbacks coach, attempted to dissuade Crennel.


Al Behrman/Associated Press
Brady Quinn, with Browns quarterback coach Rip Scherer, earlier this season. "We're not throwing in the towel, not giving up on the season," said head coach Romeo Crennel. "We're going to beat Denver, that's what we're going to do." Crennel then met with Savage later and announced he was making the switch.
"It was Romeo's call," Savage said. "He's in charge of the 45 [game-day roster]. I have no problems with it. I told Romeo I could argue either way. I told him I'll stand behind him on it."

After the team tripped over lofty expectations and failed to climb out of the hole it dug, the eventual insertion of Quinn was a decision nearing the front burner. Some in the organization felt the loss to Baltimore was the catalyst for change.

"We've been talking about this for a while now," Crennel said of the almost-weekly questions about Anderson's job status. "Usually I try to be pretty thorough about what I do in evaluating things. I just felt it was time."

Crennel did not buy the argument that Anderson had been playing better in three wins in five games after opening the season with three losses.

"The play was inconsistent, as the record indicates," the coach said. "We're an inconsistent football team. I've told you all along, the supporting cast impacts Derek's play. But he's the quarterback and along with that position comes added responsibility and added scrutiny. It's part of the job and he'll live with it and he'll go on."

Crennel disputed the national perception that the decision was driven by Quinn's immense popularity with the fans.

"Generally, I don't think they have my telephone number," he said. "I haven't been fielding calls from the fans. I made the decision, what I think is best and what I think needs to be done."

One of the outspoken critics of the move has been ESPN analyst Trent Dilfer, the former Browns quarterback who shares the same agent as Anderson.

Dilfer called the Browns a "dysfunctional organization" and said, "It's a knee-jerk reaction by the owner to fill seats."

Through club spokesman Bill Bonsiewicz, owner Randy Lerner responded, "Trent Dilfer running his mouth about a past employer doesn't merit a serious response."

You know why Quinns game plan was so vanilla....because Chud and Rip both know Quinns limitations. Dilfers agent who is also Andersons agent, was lashing out at The front office, because they were coaching from the Luxury suites...Thus the Dysfunctional comment. Coach you can spin it however you like it, the fact remains you obviously don't know too much, and if you can't read between the lines or understand what really went down...I can't help you anymore....Sorry. You can say Quinns finger was hurt, you can say that the short week was the basis for a QB that's been in the system for TWO years to be coddled, you can even say Crennel made the decision...The fact is the players were pissed and it showed, and the coaching staff did not hold Quinn in as high regard as you. They were mad because of the Luxury box coaching moves. Some say this is why Mangini was hired, because he was bullied into taking Favre in NY and can be forced to play seat fillers.

Ya know what I think?

I think you and coachb both need to go take a cold shower. Preferably not in the same place at the same time.

Because until one guy or the other is traded this argument will go on and on and on. And neither one of you will admit it when you're proven wrong. So we'll get treated to a rehash of these posts until at least April, if not forever. That horse is way past dead by now.........give it up........

Thanks for using the links to prove my point. RAC said that HE was the one that made the decision. Read your own quotes and not some crap made up by a journalist. The simple fact is that RAC made the choice. He hadn't informed DA that he was going to be benched, so he wasn't going ot announce it to the media. That would be classless and RAC has shown nothing but class. Keep the tinfoil off your head and stop posting your OPINIONS as facts.

You are going to use TRENT FREAKING DILFER as proof?!?!?!?!

This is the same guy that threw a tantrum when he was benched due to ineffectiveness and lashed out like a child when he was dumped from the Browns. Add to that the relationship with DA"s agent and, gee, there's no bias there.

I will just say that I consider the source. RAC has shown that he is a class guy and a man of integrity. Dilfer, not so much. I'll trust the words from someone that has earned respect and shown integrity over a guy that is bitter and lashing out because he has a national audience. I'll also trust the people WITHIN the organization that I know and that know what happened over a troll on a messageboard basing opinions on his biased view the DA is some sort of superstar QB.

I've been saving and you can thank me when Quinn is backing up Charlie Frye for the Argonauts.

I'm not even sure that makes sense........

Do you really think Dilfer gives a hoot about Derek Anderson? Wow, RAC also made a prepared statement from above that Quinn is the starter for 09'. You are lost and so Naive it's funny. Coach, keep living in Fantasy world..Crennel said Quinn and his little finger were fine to start..until...the 8/18
44%, 94 yards, 2 ints, 21% rating on a game plan full of short throws. HAhaha. I can't help you anymore coach, you obviously don't know as much as you think you do.

You like stats? Look at DA's thrird start and get back to me.....



And he really hasn't improved..................

And when BQ has twenty some starts? Then get back to me...

LOL, so when you can find something that supports your warped view, you trust RAC's words. When they don't, you ignore them and chant DA RULEZ while wearing a tin foil hat. Here in REALITY, we hav RAC's words that verify all that I've said. You have....well, you've said basically "nuh uh" alot. Yeah, great job of backing up your slanted view with stats.

Wow, you use 2 1/2 games worth of stats as if they prove something....yet you dismiss all the stats I posted showing that DA can't make 'all the throws" as you claimed.

I don't need your help. I would rather discuss fotball with someone that has a clue about the game. Now, run along, Troll. The other board (village) misses you.

Pit, he's just a troll trying to argue for the sake of arguement. Everything he's stated has been proven wrong. The good news is, school is back in session so he can only post after and on weekends...and hopefully mommy has set an early curfew.

J/C

This thread is about the most redicoulous thing I've seen on here since the Holcomb Couch days.

I find it funny that the DA guys will not listen anything that proves the BQ guys point. It is all pointless IMO.

My opinion is that DA is gone and probably can't wait to leave. He knows the fans here hate him, and he will never get a fair shake again. I don't know if Quinn is going to be any better, but I do know that DA didn't improve.

The QB of the Browns has to be the worse job in the NFL. I actually believe we could win the Superbowl with a QB, and if the next year he has a bad game the fans would boo him.......it is a sad state, but true.

Post deleted by Referee6

Yep, you defined a troll, which is exactly what you're posting. You have posted "unsubstantiated claims" and have an agenda. Again, you prove my point with your post.

Where have I ever said BQ was going to be great? Where have I pushed BQ? Oh, that's right, you're a troll that either got kicked off of the other board or got it handed to you so many times you thought you'd bring your tired act over here. I DEFENDED DA when he was the starter and people made false and inaccurate claims about him. I also said that we DON'T KNOW what BQ can do and 2 1/2 games isn't enough to evaluate him. I have said that DA has terrible footwork, mechanics, and will not fit into the system that is being brought in. 2 years is enough time to evaluate a player that regressed instead of improved. It's pretty sad that I know the crap you're going to spew before you even type it. You state your opinions as facts and when they're refuted resort to lying or calling anyone that can see DA's weaknesses as BQ pimps. New troll, same pathetic tactics.

Why do you want to know what ball boys do in the winter....looking at a step up from flipping burgers? It's good to have a goal.

Oh, and those that "know football" have been discussing it. Anyone that claims they can evaluate a QB on 2 1/2 games obviously doesn't know the game. Feel free to add on more juvenile reply since you can't talk football. Trolls always feel the need to get the last word so they can feel like they showed em. After all, you can't out-debate anyone here. So, get one more good shot at how anyone that dares not say DA is HOF bound is a BQ lover. It's all you've got with such a limited knowledge of the game.

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Anderson fails the eyeball test in a different way. Look at how many passes are too high, too far left or right. He's not accurate, especially on the short passes. Even when he was putting up monster numbers, it didn't "look right." As in the accuracy just wasn't there.

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Just to chime in here, I'm not a BQ lover by any means but I wish there was a stat for wicked catches because quite a few of Anderson's '07 numbers were results of this from BE and KW2.( Some were near impossible catches) Hell even JJ made some mean grabs.

JMO of course

You are absolutely correct. Some of those catches were absolutely amazing. Before the season began, there was much discussion about how DA would fare without such incredible catches by his receivers. We found out this year.

I've never said BQ is a definate. I have stated that we don't know what we have in him. I also never said DA couldn't eventually overcome his weaknesses and be a starter somewhere (though I think it's unlikely). DA simply will not fit the systsem that is brought in here and, frankly, we can't afford more developmental time for him when he has digressed. Why put a square peg in a round hole, beat it with a hammer for 2 or 3 years, have it still not fit, and then discard it and look for a better solution? It makes no sense.

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That'd be the same kind of stat as an "NQF" interception,...Not QB's Fault.

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Hell they have stats for everything else. If they can count drops, they can count misses that lead to INTs..........man could that change the fantasy landscape