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No playoff tickets? Panthers revoking PSLs Fans are given the chance to reinstate their expensive seat licenses – for a price. By Tony Burbeck Posted: Tuesday, Jan. 27, 2009 The Carolina Panthers are revoking PSLs from fans who didn't buy playoff tickets. Letters started arriving last week via certified mail giving ticket holders that news. As part of the deal with people who buy permanent seat licenses, season ticket holders are required to buy playoff tickets. Those tickets against the Arizona Cardinals weren't cheap. “It's a lot of money for some people,” said PSL owner Mike Stewart, who bought his tickets and tried selling them but had no luck. “I was very surprised.” PSL owners who didn't buy their playoff tickets say they're surprised by the letters, which say their PSLs – which give owners the right to buy season tickets – have been terminated. The letter adds: “Due to your past support, the Carolina Panthers, under no legal obligation, hereby offer you the opportunity to reinstate your account by paying a reinstatement fee.” The amount of the fee depends on the price of the tickets. For one PSL owner, it came to $228. The letters say the Panthers must receive the reinstatement payment by the close of business on Friday. Otherwise, the team would permanently cancel the PSL account, and owners would lose the money they paid for them – in some cases thousands of dollars. Some PSL owners say they couldn't afford tickets this year because of the economy. Others say they simply forgot. “I don't agree with it, but I would hope the Panthers would have some consideration as regards to the economy. Some people are suffering right now and some people maybe didn't have the money,” Stewart said. In the end, keeping a PSL means paying hundreds for something that already cost thousands – and pay it now, even though some people couldn't afford the playoff tickets a few weeks ago. The Panthers aren't releasing the specific number of people losing their PSLs. They do, however, say this year's PSL losses are comparable to the number of revocations in previous years with playoff games. Charlotte Observer Given how the Panthers looked in their playoff game that they wanted these people to pay to see... I'm not sure this is a good idea. 
yebat' Putin
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Well it may suck, but if it was in the contract when you bought the PSL, then you should have been prepared.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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And it is in the contract for the Browns PSL's. Haven't had to worry about that one yet...
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^ Yup, if its in the contract, they should have expected the bill.
I would think the team would just charge them for the playoffs on the original invoice and then refund them at the end of the year (if it's guaranteed in the contract). It saves collecting money twice and they get to collect interest on the money all season.
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Well it may suck, but if it was in the contract when you bought the PSL, then you should have been prepared.
Hard to argue that,...but there ought to be an "out" for circumstances beyond your control,...or some way to make those tickets available to interested playoff-goers who normally cannot afford a season PSL.
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And it is in the contract for the Browns PSL's. Haven't had to worry about that one yet...
Ours is a little different.
If we elect not to pay for playoff tickets, the team has the right to sell those tickets. If they are unable to sell them, then we are on the hook for the cost.
And, the terms of the contract only suspend our right to transfer the PSLs until said cost and applicable late fees are recovered.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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That was good to hear. 
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or some way to make those tickets available to interested playoff-goers who normally cannot afford a season PSL.
There is.. buy them and resell them.
I just think that if you are on a hair string budget where you aren't going to be able to afford a few hundred bucks for playoff tickets and be out the money just long enough to flip the tickets, you had no business buying the season tickets in the first place.
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
Quote:
Well it may suck, but if it was in the contract when you bought the PSL, then you should have been prepared.
Hard to argue that,...but there ought to be an "out" for circumstances beyond your control,...or some way to make those tickets available to interested playoff-goers who normally cannot afford a season PSL.
I think the consumer has an "out". Buy the tickets and sell them yourself. The team doesn't want to take on that responsibility since it's built into the contract that they're already sold.
And heck, playoff tickets are easy to sell for more than face value (or at least AT face value).
The thing that burns me up is that the Bears have this strict conduct policy for season ticket holders (which I am one of). If you're caught smoking, swearing, fighting, throwing stuff, running onto the field or just generally being an ass...you can lose your tickets forever. I don't know how they determine the final penalty (three stikes and your out). Well, aside from being a little drunk and maybe swearing...I'm not going to get in trouble. However, if I sell my tickets online and the buyer throws a beer and gets into a fight, I could lose my seats. And the Bears say they don't care if it wasn't you. The owner of the seats is responsible. Fine....but the Bears are partners with Stubhub as the official place for us to sell our seats.......so, if a bunch of jerks buy our seats through the process that they endorse we're screwed? Lame.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Quote:
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or some way to make those tickets available to interested playoff-goers who normally cannot afford a season PSL.
There is.. buy them and resell them.
I just think that if you are on a hair string budget where you aren't going to be able to afford a few hundred bucks for playoff tickets and be out the money just long enough to flip the tickets, you had no business buying the season tickets in the first place.
I don't buy season tickets in the first place, but I'd like a shot at a playoff game someday.
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Thanks for the clarification, Peen. Honestly, I haven't paid attention to that item in the contract because it isn't something that I've had to worry about yet. I knew there was something in there though.
#gmstrong
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Exactly, there hasn't been much need to worry about the contract details recently. Hopefully, this problem comes back next year. 
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I just think that if you are on a hair string budget where you aren't going to be able to afford a few hundred bucks for playoff tickets and be out the money just long enough to flip the tickets, you had no business buying the season tickets in the first place.
That isn't a fair statement. Things in life change.....maybe they had a job 2 years ago when they bought the PSLs.
Was the guy who died on Wednesday stupid for buying 2 weeks of groceries on Saturday??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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This playoff thing came up for us a couple years ago. The Browns lost a couple critical games before we had to pay, though, so we were told to forget it. Anyone remember that?
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Quote:
Quote:
I just think that if you are on a hair string budget where you aren't going to be able to afford a few hundred bucks for playoff tickets and be out the money just long enough to flip the tickets, you had no business buying the season tickets in the first place.
That isn't a fair statement. Things in life change.....maybe they had a job 2 years ago when they bought the PSLs.
Didn't you know that only those with "gaurunteed success" in their life should buy PSL's?
What were you thinkin'?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Is it me, or does this sound lame to you folks..
I understand they were contractually obligated to buy playoff tickets, and some didnt... But to let this get to the papers and be an embarrasment to the organization,,,,, LOL you wanna talk about stupid... wow.. what a PR blunder.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I vaguely recall something of that variety, but since we never had to actually shell out money, it was a moot point to me. I had the info ready to go if we ended up with a home game, but I never read it and after we were eliminated, I tore it up and threw it away out of frustration!
#gmstrong
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A few people did....I didn't..I started to play the odds we weren't going to get in....and it never reached the deadline before we knew we weren't in.
In some ways paying and not getting in isn't that bad...it is almost like being able to split your fee in to a few payments since the money paid for unrealized playoff tickets is applied to your next years invoice..
Which...speaking of that, should get here fairly soon...seems like last year we had to pay up by 3-1....no?
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Well it may suck, but if it was in the contract when you bought the PSL, then you should have been prepared.
I'm in total agreement with you, this is part of the contract that they signed and Carolina is free to enforce this portion of the argeement, just as do the fans of not having to buy PSL's, I have a hard time feeling bad for people who should have paid closer attention to the contract they signed or their own financial situation to see if this purchase is affordable or is another situation when people live way beyond their means.
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No disagreement about the club. They would be stupid to not enforce a contractual clause.
They are going out of their way to allow people to keep the PSL for a minimal fee. They could just put the seats up for sale.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I wouldn't call it a media blunder, and doubt this hurts Carolina and feel comfortable guessing that they have people ready, willing and able to take over the PSL's. One thing I read is that Carolina is letting those fans who didn't buy tickets to pay a fee (depending on their seat) to keep their PSL's so these people haven't lost their PSL's they still have until Friday to renew them so tha ball is in their court. I don't think Carolina looks bad at all, they look like what other NFL teams look like today and that is a business.
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Thats what kills me is the fans who didn't buy tickets, what were they thinking? They could have made a few bucks and not be into the situation if they paid closer attention. I have a hard time feeling sorry for people claiming that it's the ecomomys fault, when they had money in their pocket (sort of speak) if they just grabbed their tickets. That baffles me, just about every sports fan I know can get to a game they really want to get to but they are going to pay a price, so I am sure these fans could have sold their tickets, at a profit to a degree too. I really think the fans look silly here, and somewhat shows they really didn't read a piece of paper they should have, and I just don't sign my name, I want to know every detail regarding what I am signing, others still seem to amaze me, and I know I would have understood this agreement if I signed it, as probably you, but are we the minority or the majority?
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but are we the minority or the majority
I know I am in a very exclusive minority 
People just don't pay attention is my experience.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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In not trying to take a side either for fans or the Team, isn't "some" of the idea in having a PSL to guarantee you have that opportunity at a playoff seat,..??
I know I would not be happy to be told I COULDN'T FIRST buy that same seat after sitting there all year,...
Just another angle.
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Part of the reason we bought the PSLs and season tickets is so we will be assured playoff tickets....we could wait 100 years, but it is a benefit.  You can make some nice money off of them if you don't intend to go....it's silly not to know about the contract or take advantage of buying the tickets. I'm sure it's not only in the contract but that they sent out notices about it with the playoff ticket invoice. It's the people who are stupid, not the organization.
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I would not be happy to be told I COULDN'T FIRST buy that same seat after sitting there all year,...
I would agree only if this wasn't stated in the contract. I would assume this is mentioed in the agreement and if I signed it I would have to still have to live up to the obligations, either buy tickets or pay a fee to basically renew my PSL's from the business side I can see this being addressed within the contract, I again feel that this info falls on the fan, and not knowing.
I see your point but since this is such big business I can't see this type of information not being in the contract, but I never seen their PSL contract so I can't really say that it's stated, but I think if I was the Carolina Panthers or any other team all this information would be included in the contract, I find this to be common sense material in a contract but I am in a minority with how I conduct these situations I guess.
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As part of the deal with people who buy permanent seat licenses, season ticket holders are required to buy playoff tickets. Those tickets against the Arizona Cardinals weren't cheap.
That's the end of the story because fair is fair.
If you can't afford the insurance, don't buy a Porsche.
If you can't afford the taxes, don't buy a house.
And if you can't afford to buy playoff tickets, you shouldn't buy PSL's.
Rule #1 in the Universe: Life isn't fair. Deal with reality or move on.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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If you can't afford the condem don't purchase a hooker.
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If you can't afford the condem don't purchase a hooker.
Soo! thats where I went wrong? lmao! 
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Yes it is greed, at the same time, unfortunately it's also just business. You know what you're getting into when you buy a PSL.
Yet they wonder why more people can't/don't or even won't come to games...
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Yes it is greed, at the same time, unfortunately it's also just business. You know what you're getting into when you buy a PSL.
Yet they wonder why more people can't/don't or even won't come to games...
Man....it isn't greed. It is simply the way it is.
I am not going to get in to why it isn't wise to not enforce a contract with a minority who break it....it isn't a good road to follow.....and I think you can figure it out if you think about it for say..... maybe 2-3 seconds.
The Panthers are doing nothing wrong, it isn't bad press, and it isn't greed.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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PSL's are a huge scam. Unfortunately many people fell for it and its not only common, but they've grown to the point that they're insanely expensive for some clubs...
#gmstrong
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I don't know if it is a scam.
It is just the way it is.
I didn't fall for it. I wanted season tickets.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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PSL's are a huge scam. Unfortunately many people fell for it and its not only common, but they've grown to the point that they're insanely expensive for some clubs...
Not for bengals fans anymore.......I think it was last weeks S.I. - listed last years psl for tickets at an average of $2700.........but now it's down to just under $600.
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That's the problem... enough people wanted tickets so people bought them...
Capitalism at it's finest.
Before there were PSL's people kept their seasons tickets year after year without problems.
Last edited by YepTheBrownsRule; 01/27/09 08:16 PM.
#gmstrong
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?? You still keep your tickets year after year if you wish.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Right... but you had to pay an extra grand or two (since most people get a pair of seats) to be able to buy them year after year. Before... you just bought them. No extra upfront charge that they can then take away from you if you screw up. 
#gmstrong
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Quote:
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As part of the deal with people who buy permanent seat licenses, season ticket holders are required to buy playoff tickets. Those tickets against the Arizona Cardinals weren't cheap.
That's the end of the story because fair is fair.
If you can't afford the insurance, don't buy a Porsche.
If you can't afford the taxes, don't buy a house.
And if you can't afford to buy playoff tickets, you shouldn't buy PSL's.
Rule #1 in the Universe: Life isn't fair. Deal with reality or move on.
Well you're right, life isn't fair, but for some maybe a couple years ago people could buy that Porsche, people could afford that house and etc.
Life happens sometimes and some people can't afford these things anymore.
They weren't dumb to buy things when they could afford it, maybe everyone should play it safe and buy bread and water all the time cause you never know. Prepare yourself just in case. 
I'm not a disgruntled laid off worker who lost anything or is struggling right now. Thankfully. I just feel really bad for the people that are going through this. It has to really suck.
How in the world can you fix something...
If you don't know how it's supposed to work?
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Wasn't Moddell the one to come up with the PSL idea for the Ratbirds stadium? One MORE thing to hate him for, as if we needed another reason. 
LIbertatem Defendimus!!
2010 Dawgtalkers NCAA Bracket Challenge Champ!!
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Carolina Panthers revoking PSLs
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