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Part of an article talking about the draft and miscellaneous things... LINK Brownie bits: It was assumed that newly signed tight end Robert Royal would fit as the Browns' No. 2 tight end, especially when Steve Heiden recovers from anterior cruciate ligament surgery in December. Not so, said his agent. "They brought him in to start," said Rick Smith. The Browns signed Royal for $10 million over four years. . . . Offensive tackle Ryan Tucker agreed to restructure his contract. He was scheduled to earn $3.25 million in base salary but agreed to the NFL veteran minimum of $850,000. . . . The club asked Joe Jurevicius for a similar deduction, but the receiver's base for 2009 is still listed at its original $2.4 million on NFL players association records.
![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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It was assumed that newly signed tight end Robert Royal would fit as the Browns' No. 2 tight end, especially when Steve Heiden recovers from anterior cruciate ligament surgery in December. Not so, said his agent. "They brought him in to start," said Rick Smith.
Sure they told him that....why would they not? I think his agent was meaning that he was givin the opportunty if he could win the job.
I feel he has the opportunity if he beats out Heiden but he might have a tough go against Rucker.
I feel like PURE passing downs you will see Rucker and when its two TE sets you will get him out there with him.
Royal is a very solid TE....he is not just a warm body....he can block and catches very nicely when given the chance. Royal will be a great addition to this team.
You dont have to win every game just the next one!
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If by "Great addition" you mean he'll make two catches a game while blocking better than Winslow but not as well as Heiden, then yes, he'll be a great addition 
I've seen him play plenty over the past several years. When healthy, Heiden is a superior player.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I thought that when we drafted K2, i mean we honestly didnt need him then. I like him as a player but we had so many other holes, and needs a TE wasnt one of our top priorities....we had Heiden and Shea....here is to hoping the new duo dosnt waste picks the way butch did
#brownsgoodkarma
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Had K2 stayed healthy and not blown out his knee before he really got a chance to be coached and play he would have been a game changing beast, a TD machine and very likely a much better, and willing, blocker with the coaching. The only thing he lacked was a brain for the playbook but even that could have been overcome to a degree by his awsome physical talents making him the mismatch from hell.
He ruined his value and his career with one dumb decision.
#gmstrong
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If by "Great addition" you mean he'll make two catches a game while blocking better than Winslow but not as well as Heiden, then yes, he'll be a great addition
I've seen him play plenty over the past several years. When healthy, Heiden is a superior player.
The problem is that Steve can't stay on the field anymore.
Hence the move. It is what it is.
you had a good run Hank.
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 ....Wow !....It's Great to see Tucker put the team first....Let's hope that Jurevicius does the same....
The Mammal
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Tucker is puting the team first Now I wish Stallworthless would do the same 
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....Wow !....It's Great to see Tucker put the team first....Let's hope that Jurevicius does the same....
He got something for this...maybe a few hundred thousand....maybe more
It was that or probably be cut and make league minimum if he could find another team, without any bonus for reducing the salary.
I give credit to him and his agent for understanding the reality of the moment.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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.. " I give credit to him and his agent for understanding the reality of the moment.. " That's about it in a nut shell . good move for both party's
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If by "Great addition" you mean he'll make two catches a game while blocking better than Winslow but not as well as Heiden, then yes, he'll be a great addition
I've seen him play plenty over the past several years. When healthy, Heiden is a superior player.
The problem is that Steve can't stay on the field anymore.
Hence the move. It is what it is.
What do you mean he can't stay on the field anymore? Before he blew out the knee, he'd missed one game out of the previous 61 games.
If his knee is healthy, he's the better player.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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key word Toad is IF .... we have no clue IF Hieden will even be ready at anytime this year ..... and IF he is .. then WHEN becomes a HUGE PART OF THE EQUATION ... is he ready for the opener or is he not ready until week 4, 8 or 12 ...... and then WEHN he is ready .. HOW HEALTYH WILL HE TRUELY BE ... Knees are IMPORTANT for blocking as opposed to running in his case ... *L* .....
this was a NECCESSARY MOVE predicated by the trade of the jackass even if Heiden was healthy .... with Heiden being a ? mark .. that made it a no-brainer ...
Royal is OK ... hes a poor mans Heiden .. and with Heiden being a ? mark ... he is a GOOD, SOLID, SOUND pick up ..
at worst hes a solid back up for Heiden ... and if he needs to start cause steve isn't ready .. we could have done a hell of alot worse ..
good Signing that makes all the sense in the world ...
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If by "Great addition" you mean he'll make two catches a game while blocking better than Winslow but not as well as Heiden, then yes, he'll be a great addition
I've seen him play plenty over the past several years. When healthy, Heiden is a superior player.
The problem is that Steve can't stay on the field anymore.
Hence the move. It is what it is.
What do you mean he can't stay on the field anymore? Before he blew out the knee, he'd missed one game out of the previous 61 games.
If his knee is healthy, he's the better player.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Steve have back surgery in the offseason last year as well?
I'm just saying, Steve is getting older and his body is starting to breakdown, maybe. Back surgery followed up by blowing out his knee, pretty serious surgery. I think it's fair that they look for a replacement and Royal, while not as good, can do a lot of the same things Steve does.
Not that big of a dropoff between Royal and Steve.
you had a good run Hank.
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I think Tucker did it out of loyalty but also we ended his contract with this year. So that he will get his reward in FAgency next year....either signing with us or more than probable getting a decent payday from some spending spree next year.
So basically he helped the team (at what level??? lets see if and how we use the extra space) but also set himself up with a "SHOW ME" one year contract.
He gets injured again and he is in trouble for 2010...but we know how good he is when healthy and at RG should lengthen his career. I betcha he gets an outrageous offer (3 years) in 2010 from somebody. Thats when we'll see if he sacrifices for us by taking less
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Seems stupid to be counting on a big payday next year at his age.
Is this something you know, or is it just painting the guy in the best light??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Tucker is starting his 13th year in the league,,, you gotta wonder, is there even a reasonable belief that there IS a next year for him. I'm not sure there would be a market for him at any greater amount anywhere else right now..
I'm glad he's staying.... If healthy, he's solid.
Wow,, 4th round pick of the Rams... I'd say that if he quit right now, he'd have had one helluva career...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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When he has played he has played Very Well - I see no reason to expect otherwise.
The money they are giving out to INTERIOR OL in the FA market is outrageous.
No inside Info just looking at the recent history...and there is no CAP scheduled for 2010.
Not painting anything....its pretty clear. Healthy in 09 he will get a good payday. Inured again in 09 - he'll get a Show me contract at best.
Daman...OLmen play long yes I agree he could hang em up after this season he has nothing to hang his head about. Seems like the type that will play as long as he can.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I don't disagree on his play or anything like that.
I am just basing it on what history and common sense tells me....he got something extra to restructure....or....he doesn't think there will be a next season, or even a "this" season if not here, and took a league minimum contract.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Quote:
I don't disagree on his play or anything like that.
I am just basing it on what history and common sense tells me....he got something extra to restructure....or....he doesn't think there will be a next season, or even a "this" season if not here, and took a league minimum contract.
Or he doesn't want to move his family, or he wants to start, or he just wants a contract.
Trying to say why he restructured his contract is pointless. No one knows why he did it, so why don't we just be happy that he did it and move on.
you had a good run Hank.
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No one knows why he did it,
I would say it is a pretty good bet he was told to do so or get released.
I don't think he marched in to Kokinis' office demanding a league minimum contract or a release..
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I think Tucker did it out of loyalty but also we ended his contract with this year. So that he will get his reward in FAgency next year....either signing with us or more than probable getting a decent payday from some spending spree next year.
So basically he helped the team (at what level??? lets see if and how we use the extra space) but also set himself up with a "SHOW ME" one year contract.
He gets injured again and he is in trouble for 2010...but we know how good he is when healthy and at RG should lengthen his career. I betcha he gets an outrageous offer (3 years) in 2010 from somebody. Thats when we'll see if he sacrifices for us by taking less
JMHO
I sincerely doubt that loyalty played any part at all in this, especially as late in his career as he is... you don't give up a million-plus just because you like your employer.
Business is business... especially with that many zeroes attached to it.
You only do that if you feel that either you are about to be out the door if you don't do it, or if you feel you will get an earlier opportunity at recouping it by going along with it... which is what this boils down to. He gets to prove himself still capable in 2009 and be free for a new contract in 2010 - a (currently) uncapped year.
Bottom line, however, is that he is still here and he is a lot cheaper than he was.
On the other hand, we could be seeing an indication that J.J. won't be here ... which would make me very, very sad 
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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No one knows why he did it,
I would say it is a pretty good bet he was told to do so or get released.
I don't think he marched in to Kokinis' office demanding a league minimum contract or a release..
I guess I should say no one knows why he accepted it.
It's pretty obvious why the FO offered it.
you had a good run Hank.
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Tucker is puting the team first
Now I wish Stallworthless would do the same
I would rather stallworth restructure then JJ....
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Merit badge for loyalty to Tucker. Team First is OK by me, and he can scrape along on that. JJ should be reasonable in light of injuries & all. Stallworth should go if we can get something on the block. I do NOT care who wins us some games, just so there are notches in the Browns column. 
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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I doubt there was a loyalty card being played by Tucker. More likely, he was given the promise that if he's healthy, he's our starting guard. On the market, his best offer would most likely be that of veteran minimum with the promise of being allowed to compete for a starting gig.
If there's anything that's pro-Cleveland in this deal from his vantage point, it probably revolves around not having to uproot his family.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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& Toad....Loyalty. There are degrees of loyalty - No not the picture that Ballpeen drew. Tucker didn't march into Kokinis office and state..."You guys can use this more than I - give me a cut in pay"
No not that kind of loyalty. But the loyalty to sit down and listen to the reasoning behind it. And agree that it could prove beneficial to BOTH parties and not feel Proud to the extent that he wouldn't here nothing of it.
As I stated he gets the opportunity for a one year "SHOW ME" - and I also stated very clearly that if you wish to really JUDGE him on "LOYALTY" it would be next year after he has a very good season in 09 what he does. Does he sign our deal knowing he would probably get more on the FA market? That to me would be loyalty...taking our FAIR offer and not test the market.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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C'mon, a "show me" year at age 34, for a lineman.......really?
While it may show a certain amount of loyalty to stay rather than be cut I'm really not sure it was all that impressive.
I'm glad he's here. The team will be better with him playing. But like PPE said, a player this late in his career taking a pay cut does so because he thinks that's pretty much his only option not because he bleeds orange and brown.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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So they give Elam 1.5 mil, give royal 2+/per and cut our starting rg's pay to $850 and tell our most-reliable wr to do the same? Man, I'm loving our f.o.
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So they give Elam 1.5 mil, give royal 2+/per and cut our starting rg's pay to $850 and tell our most-reliable wr to do the same? Man, I'm loving our f.o.
How many games did Tucker and JJ play last year? They both need to take a pay cut and prove they can play the entire season and play at thier level of 2007.
Elam and Royal fill a need and you have to pay for that. They arn't making extreame $$ so I don't get why your complaining.
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Hmmmm...........I think meeting in the middle here would allow me to use words such as "comfort" and "familiarity" instead of "loyalty." I say this because with all things being equal, I believe Tucker is handed the starting gig here if he signs for veteran minimum, while he'd be forced to, at best, compete for a starting gig somewhere else while uprooting his family and life. To me, that isn't about loyalty, it's more about comfort and security.
Could be just splitting hairs.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Yeah if you note I stated the "loyalty" to me will come after next year.
Look whatever ignorant posters might think about "show me" contracts to a 34 year olds Vet and they are able to comprehend the nature of the "BUSINESS".
But in the reality of it all. Tucker and JJ for that matter were on IR all last season.
They are at the twilight of their careers. It is very reasonable to ask for a Show Me contract.
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Dude, if you're gonna try and rip me at least have the fortitude to use my name. Have a lovely day........
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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I loved seeing J J play in a Browns uniform, he will always be a Brown. but I do understand it's a buisness, some remember when Greg Pruitt was traded to Oakland, that was hard, or seeing Bernie in a cowboys uniform, Watching Clay Matthews in a Falcons uniform...knife in back...I think I cryed that day.....it's still a buisness and sometimes due to things out of everybodys control favorate players leave, I'll always remember JJ in the snow game to me that was his type of game.....thannks JJ for bring back alittle bit of old times Browns football even if it was for one year, we browns fans love ya and you always have friends in Cleveland. good luck in what ever ya do.
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Except that the move, at this stage, makes no extra business sense at all.
We could have held onto him and not been wanting for roster spots or cap space. I cannot think of a reason that he needed to be cut at this stage, before he had an opportunity to show himself at minicamps.
Roster spots are mostly meaningless until training camp... and even then, we have 80 of them.
Money? We've got so much ununsed cap space right now we could damn near buy another team.
Unless his career is truly over with that knee, there is just no reason for it right now. If he got on the field and couldn't get it done? Hey, I understand.. that happens, but they didn't even go that far. They made a money play when there was absolutely no reason for a money play.
Hell, if we were tight on cap space and we needed the room to sign someone that would really, really help the team... I'd completely understand; but we don't need the space and we're not looking at signing anyone. It makes zero sense right now.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Unless his career is truly over with that knee, there is just no reason for it right now. If he got on the field and couldn't get it done? Hey, I understand.. that happens, but they didn't even go that far. They made a money play when there was absolutely no reason for a money play.
Hell, if we were tight on cap space and we needed the room to sign someone that would really, really help the team... I'd completely understand; but we don't need the space and we're not looking at signing anyone. It makes zero sense right now.
EXACTLY!
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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It makes sense if they determined they didn't want to pay him that much money no matter how healthy he was.
Better to tell him up front what they were willing to pay.
This was purely a money deal. As was said....he could have been cut later on if he showed up for camp using a walker.
Like it or not, the Browns are cutting payroll...at least the areas where the pay is out of whack with production.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Well, yeah they're cutting payroll. The question is why?
They are way under the cap even without the cuts. If anything changes it will be that there is NO cap not a lower cap.
So, I ask, again, why cut payroll at this point? Especially, when the guys you are cutting create holes that we didn't have before.
JJ was gonna make $1.2 Million if he made the team. Frankly, that is chump change in the NFL. Stallworth is gonna make, what, around 6 million? But he's still here!?! Shaffer was gonna make $1.5 million roughly but by cutting him they make over $4.5 million of dead money against the cap this year. Explain the cost cutting sense there.
They are apparently trying to make a point to the players but in doing so they appear to be chopping off a finger at a time until all they have left is a bloody stump for a hand. But they'll still have that hand, by God!
Sorry, it's not making sense to a guy like me that would like to see us win something before I start visiting my grandkids in college.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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The question is why?
A plan we don't know about? Lerner may have had 50 million with Madoff?
There could be 50 possible answers.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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A plan we don't know about? Lerner may have had 50 million with Madoff?
Two things......
I hope they have a plan we don't fully know about. Because if they don't we may wish Savage was back.
You've mentioned Madoff twice. And you could be right. But I gotta think if that was the case some reporter might have figured that out by now and told us. Randy may have lost some dough. Hell, didn't everyone? But when a billionaire loses $10-20 million somehow I don't think he tries to make it back with his football team. He can still afford that caviar. He just can't get that good Russian stuff......
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Or sell his damned soccer team ...
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Ryan Tucker restructures deal,
asks same of J.J.
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