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Browns looking to add strength at center

By Steve Doerschuk
CantonRep.com staff writer


It did the Browns no good to have one of the more enviable left sides in the offensive line business in 2008.

Knowing that, the new regime seems intent on not wasting left tackle Joe Thomas and left guard Eric Steinbach in 2009.

The Browns could have new main men at four key blocking positions.

Hank Fraley has made 48 straight starts at center, but he turns 32 in September and showed signs of erosion last season.

At last month’s NFL Combine, the Browns were the first team to interview California center Alex Mack, and they have a keen eye on Oregon center Max Unger. Those two are rated as the 35th- and 42nd-best players in the draft by NFLDraftScout.com. The Browns own the No. 36 overall pick.

Both Mack and Unger are seen as mature players who could step in right away. Mack is a year older than Jeff Faine was when he was a rookie starter for the Browns in 2003; Unger is even older, turning 24 in November.

If the Browns don’t draft a center, Head Coach Eric Mangini might consider letting veteran Ryan Tucker or free agent John St. Clair compete for the center job. Both Tucker and St. Clair spent the last two years of their college careers at center.

Right guard has been a revolving door, with Shaun O’Hara, Paul Zukauskas, Kelvin Garmon, Juaquin Gonzalez, Mike Pucillo, Dave Yovanovits, Cosey Coleman, Seth McKinney and Tucker taking turns as starters during the five-year stretch from 2003-07.

Rex Hadnot was viewed as adequate at best as the starting right guard in 2008. Near the end of the season, the fifth-year pro vowed to be better in 2009, saying he was intent on playing at a Pro Bowl level.

Recent signees Floyd Womack and St. Clair both became NFL tackles after playing center in college. Both are versatile veterans who could compete for the starting right guard or right tackle jobs. Tucker likewise is versatile, having started at right tackle for most of his seven-year run with the Browns but starting at right guard in the second half of the 2007 season.

Kevin Shaffer, the starting left tackle in 2006 and the starting right tackle in 2007 and 2008, was released last week.

Tight end will have a different look after Kellen Winslow Jr. was traded and Darnell Dinkins left as a free agent. Newcomer Robert Royal, who spent the last three years with the Bills, will battle 32-year-old Steve Heiden for time as the blocking tight end.

BROWNS SIGN HERRON

The Browns signed free-agent running back Noah Herron on Wednesday.

The 26-year-old has played with Pittsburgh, Green Bay and Tampa Bay since being drafted by the Steelers in the seventh round out of Northwestern in 2005. In 23 career games, the 5-foot-11, 225-pounder has rushed for 273 yards and three touchdowns on 85 carries and caught 29 passes for 211 yards and a pair of scores.



Center of it all

Analysts differ on whether Alex Mack, whose first NFL Combine interview was with the Browns, is the top center in the draft. NFL.com analyst Mike Mayock’s top five centers:

• Max Unger, 6-5, 309. Started 51 straight games at center for Oregon.

• Eric Wood, 6-4, 310. Starred at Cincinnati Elder, four-year starter at Louisville.

• Alex Mack, 6-4, 311. Whiz-kid student from Cal, Pac-10 lineman of the year in 2007.

• A.Q. Shipley, 6-1, 304. Penn Stater won Rimington Award as nation’s top center in 2008.

• Antoine Caldwell, 6-3, 309. Alabama All-American best suited for a drive-blocking scheme.

I like it.

Please don't suggest that our coaching staff and FO have a plan and a method to why they've released certain people and not signed certain people. It just can't be true!

Word is that it just may be true.....we'll just have to stay tuned....

Try not to be so long-winded, it's hard to pay attention when you ramble on like that dawg.....

I only hope we do draft a lineman with one of our first 3 picks . Ryan Tucker at center is something I never really thought of.

Once we got another 2nd rounder for Winslow, I think that locked up a center in round 2.

Its a deep draft in centers, and the top of round 2 is where they usually start to come off the board. We will have our pick of the litter if we use the first pick of the round on a center, and if we decide to wait until the 50th pick, we will still find 2-3 guys who will be better than good NFL players.

Hank has done a nice job, and he may still yet have some time, but to me, Hank is the type of body that when it's done, it will head south fast. It won't be a slow erosion in play....it will fall off the map.

Time to get that young bull in the middle of the line while we have the chance so he is ready to go.....be it this year or next.

What's really exciting is that no one is going to give this team a chance to rebuild, if that's in fact what we're doing. When we don't have a winning record this year, everyone will be calling for Mangini's head, eventually causing him to be fired, causing another rebuild.

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Once we got another 2nd rounder for Winslow, I think that locked up a center in round 2.

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I hadn't thought of that but it makes sense.

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but to me, Hank is the type of body that when it's done, it will head south fast. It won't be a slow erosion in play....it will fall off the map.

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So you're saying he's like us.........

A total rebuilding while inheriting one of the youngest rosters in the league? What´s the point?

For the record, I agree that Fraley can and should be upgraded....but why "waste" a high draft pick on a C with all our other problems at OLB, S, CB and WR (you know who would be our #1 next year from the guys we have now? Steptoe...we have NONE)

what really makes me mad is that we didn´t do anything in FA for the C position...there was some serious talent out there...even a young in his prime C in Brown who only landed in STL beacuse no one else made a real push for him (he reportedly didn´t want to go there)....heck, we signed overaged stop gaps anywhere why not at C where the talent level was MUCH better with Birk, Meester, Saturday and even Groves

Why didn´t we make a play there? We dont have 10 1st day picks and you have to play up the respective strength in FA and the draft...and C was pretty much the only position of strength in FA, ManKok want it upgraded? Fine, I agree....why didn´t they make a move then?

Hank Fraley has made 48 straight starts at center, but he turns 32 in September and showed signs of erosion last season.

Actually he was holding the sign up like you see those guys on the freeway exit.."WORK FOR FOOD"

At last month’s NFL Combine, the Browns were the first team to interview California center Alex Mack, and they have a keen eye on Oregon center Max Unger. Those two are rated as the 35th- and 42nd-best players in the draft by NFLDraftScout.com. The Browns own the No. 36 overall pick.

Yes...but there might be a better solution..so we can draft the best OT/OG...

If the Browns don’t draft a center, Head Coach Eric Mangini might consider letting veteran Ryan Tucker or free agent John St. Clair compete for the center job. Both Tucker and St. Clair spent the last two years of their college careers at center.

Thats not what I had in mind..lol..in fact I think that one is bad..the logical solution is to let Hadnot compete for the spot..he played it not long ago..two years ago..move him there..

Alex Mack.

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but why "waste" a high draft pick on a C with all our other problems at OLB, S, CB and WR

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cant argue with ya that the other positions need upgrading, But can disagree on "wasting" a high pick on a center, picking a o-lineman in the first two rounds is never a waste in my opinon as long as those lineman deserve talent wise to be in the first two rounds. If my O-line can knock your D-line on thier behinds than even a RB like Herron can take the ball and run untouched into the end zone, and if you dont touch my QB when he's dropping back to throw than sooner or later one of my 5th or 6th round wr will get open and if they catch well even better, I think you get my thinking here. If I did the drafting for the Browns I would be drafting a O-lineman every year in the first two rounds,


I want the center from Cal.......hopefully he's still thier with our first pick in the 2nd round.

1st round LB
2nd Center
2nd Lb or DB best player availible.

No, the 5th rounder next year is conditional..the second rounder is Tampa's second..

It all starts and ends in the Trenches....Upgrading our OL is Definitely the way to go....

I don't argue that we have young talent. I just believe that some may have an overinflated sense of just how talented the people were that we let go.

I will say that I wouldn't have minded keeping Jones and Shaffer. Those are two moves that I thought were questionable. But, that doesn't mean I don't see the logic in letting them go.

Maybe you're right, and if I read it wrong, I apologize to django.

I guess I don't see how what we're doing is a complete rebuild. We're signing back-end roster guys for the most part, IMO, and we've let a couple guys go who just didn't produce a whole heluva lot for us.

Yeah, I liked Wright when he was here, no question. I thought Shaffer and Jones were ok. But, I understand why they were let go. JJ also.

I'm just of the different mindset that this isn't a total "rebuild".

JMHO

i loved the article when i read it. i'm getting excited at potentially taking alex mack. don't know much about college players in general but this guy put up 40 some reps on the bench, certainly wouldn't hurt going against the AFCN NTs

I like it too.This article is the only one I can think of that gives credence to the rumors that M&K have a plan and have learned something about football since their ballboy days.

I'm happy to see it, but at the same time I think they could have done a better job communicating with the fans. I don't think speaking in generalities gives away any big secrets.

A little, just a little communication with fans goes a long way toward building goodwill for the new brain trust and avoiding or at least delaying the pitchfork mentality. Unfortunately so far I give Opie a better grade at this than the new guys. IMO watching M&K make moves with no explaination caused more apprehension than hope.

The "don't worry your pretty little head" attitude doesn't work for me.

I would think they would be more than happy to share their secrets as long as we promised to KEEP those secrets and we promised to NOT overreact when we don't understand the secrets.

I think your line of thinking is ridiculous...I prefer they do their thing...NOT show their hand...and go about the business of building a winner.

This attitude that they should share their plan with us is silly...who does that?

Raises an interesting idea but I'm of the camp that I'm not sure if we want to use a second round pick on a centre in a draft where I think the bulk of the talent is in the second round.

I think the top of the draft is pretty damn weak this year and that the second round is really where the paydirt lies. So I'm encouraged we have two picks in it.... but I'm not 100 per cent sold on replacing Hank with that pick.

What am I more comfortable with? Fraley at center or Adams at safety.

Fraley.

What am I more comfortable with? Fraley at center or Hall at OLB.

Fraley

For that matter, What am I more comfortable with? Fraley at center or Hadnot at guard.

Fraley.

Ok, the last one is a bit of a rough call as St. Clair may move in at RT and keep Tucker at Guard.

So I guess its an option if whoever "our guy" is at center falls to us....Its a shame we don't have a pick in the third as that would open up our options just that much more.

Luigs, Luigs, Luigs, Luigs....phew...can't say it enough times.

Mayock is an ass - cause they had Luigs playing RG at the Senior Bowl he doesn't list him as one of the elite Centers Nah just the Remington Award winner (07 n their Offense went south after McFadden n Jones left) - Just one of the Larger Centers, Just one of the Fastest Centers. Just cause he could come in and play at both C and OG.

Tucker at Center??? hmmm very interesting. I've thought about it one time or another over the years.

But I"m sure we will draft a Center somewhere in the 2nd (#36 or #50). Its a strength of the draft and we should take advantage of it.

JMHO

Hopefully we do draft a center, we need more youth on the OL. The problem is we have 10 other holes to fill. I don't see how 2 old RT's are the answer either at center.

Fraley is not what we need anymore, especially if we intend to run the ball. But he's cheap and I think should hang around as a backup.

Simplest solution, we shoulda targeted Jason Brown and Matt Birk heavily....so we have a solid center in case the draft doesnt work out.

Maybe we should have, Z. But, shoulda coulda woulda doesn't do us much good now.

Have to look to the future, I guess.

Gotta disagree..... getting an older established centre doesn;t match with what we need to do which is build up our core through the draft.

In fact, this thread has been running through my melon since I posted last and I think I might have to do an about face and say that considering a center in the second is a legitimate option.

WE desperately need OLB and safety help.... there's two picks...we still have one left. So where else are we best to upgrade?

Running back...almost certainly.... However, one could argue that a stronger centre presence will have more of a benefit to the run game and help open lanes to make Jamal more effective.

Guard.... I think so... but with Tucker and Womack as potentials at RG, we'll upgrade over Hadnot already.

Right tackle.... Theres a few in this draft that could be had, but with the addition of St. Clair, I think its clear that we're not going to address that this year.

ILB...Jackson and Barton as starters.... I don;t think Barton was brought in as a one year stop gap only and Jackson is our best LB.

The more and more I think about it, center makes more and more sense.

That's areally good idea,I'm amazed no one has thought of this before.
Tucker? St.Clair? neither one of those old geezers would make it thru TC.
Hadnot appears to be the best answer from the present roster.
Adding a center at that #50 pick would go along way in improving what's shaping up to be a sub-par o-line.

I think this draft is so deep with running backs an linebackers, we have to take one in the second. Also, if Duke Robinson is around at #36, he has to be the pick.

OLB has to be our first pick, then in the second...we have to go BPA...I just don't see Alex Mack being there, but we'll see.

I too want us build through the draft, but we are so depleted right now, we have to get some stop gap players, or even vets that have a few years left in them. Building through the draft doesn't mean never signing decent free agents when they fit.

Nyah, we missed the boat on the bumper crop of RBs last year.... This year, I think the ones that will be the real deal will be gone by our second round pick. I just don;t see the end to end quality in running backs that there was last year.

With the latest Stallworth news, suddenly wide receiver becomes a real first day option for us.

John St. Clair announced Tuesday that he was leaving the team to join the Cleveland Browns. I spoke to St. Clair about leaving the team and starting over in a new city. St. Clair says his decision was based on the way the Browns treated him when he visited. For talking to him he sound really excited to be a part of the team and is ready to get to work. He want to win!
http://www.mouthpiecesports.com/media/john-st-clair-phoner-19722/