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I'm really not all that upset with moving Garko. I think he's an "OK" player ..... but probably not anything really special.
Garko belongs in the NL because of his ability to play multiple-positions.
He doesn't belong in the AL because at any of those positions he brings an inferior bat and an inferior glove.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Because Victor is a mere average first baseman when it comes to hitting. Victor was/is a great asset as a catcher, but as a first baseman, his value is not much more than Garko's.
What you aren't considering is what Garko.........or any "mere average first baseman"........would hit if they had to play catcher 100 games a year.
Take the wear-and-tear off of Martinez as a catcher and he's a better hitter. With a career OPS of 803 versus 832, it's hard to call Garko close to Martinez. There's also a leadership factor involved.
I get the "deal him before his value slides" arguement because it's legit, but as a pure DH or first-baseman, Martinez is going to have very good numbers, numbers that we can't replace very easily.
It doesn't help he's due to make huge money next year, and that we're looking to dump payroll to the point where we're just a half-step higher financially than the Royals 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Because Victor is a mere average first baseman when it comes to hitting. Victor was/is a great asset as a catcher, but as a first baseman, his value is not much more than Garko's.
What you aren't considering is what Garko.........or any "mere average first baseman"........would hit if they had to play catcher 100 games a year.
Take the wear-and-tear off of Martinez as a catcher and he's a better hitter. With a career OPS of 803 versus 832, it's hard to call Garko close to Martinez. There's also a leadership factor involved.
I get the "deal him before his value slides" arguement because it's legit, but as a pure DH or first-baseman, Martinez is going to have very good numbers, numbers that we can't replace very easily.
It doesn't help he's due to make huge money next year, and that we're looking to dump payroll to the point where we're just a half-step higher financially than the Royals
Over the past three years: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=5007&type=batting3
Victor Martinez has a .791 OPS at first, .291 AVG. He's not going to get any better when he gets older either.
Victor's power, or lack there of, and age is going to harm his chances of being anything more of than an average 1bman when he gets traded.
Victor is a good guy and would do anything for his teammates...but, his value just isn't as high as it was two years ago anymore. He's a very tradable asset to the Indians.
you had a good run Hank.
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Legend
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It doesn't help he's due to make huge money next year, and that we're looking to dump payroll to the point where we're just a half-step higher financially than the Royals
Cmon Toad, you are better than that.
Dolan shelled out cash to be the #15 payroll in MLB this year....team fell apart and we have the #27 attendance. He ain't running this team for the fun of it. We were at $81mil payroll for the year before this week....even after it we'll be in the mid to possibly low 70's.
Yes, that puts us in the neighborhood of KC, but you make it sound like they are at the bottom of the barrel in MLB salaries which is no longer true (KC #21 payroll). It would still be nearly 2x the salary of the Marlins and ~$25mil above the Pirate/Padres.
#gmstrong
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1) Including the year where he had less than half of the at-bats he averaged in the previous four because of injury..........when he shouldn't have been playing at all...........isn't exactly creating a fair comparison.
2)
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Victor Martinez has a .791 OPS at first, .291 AVG.
Yet he still played catcher, which still puts more stress on his body than any other position.
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He's not going to get any better when he gets older either.
Based on what assumption?
He was curving upwards before injury derailed him last year. With a permanent switch away from catcher, it's more likely that he'll be more productive than it is that he'd curve backwards.
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Victor's power, or lack there of, and age is going to harm his chances of being anything more of than an average 1bman when he gets traded.
He's 30. Not 35.
Including his injured year, these are his career numbers and where they'd rank for current MLB first-basemen (for players that have more than just a few at bats):
Average: .284 15th (in front of Konerko and behind Texiera)
On-base: .389 12th
Slugging: .463 18th
HR's: 15 15th
Strikeouts: 51 29th (That means 28 1B's have more strikeouts)
Walks: 51 10th
Hits: 107 9th
Doubles: 21 14th
RBI: 67 7th
Total bases: 175 15th
Considering that his numbers as they stand right now are better than an average MLB first baseman, it's hard for me to accept what you're saying when the basis of the discussion revolves around moving him from behind the plate and making him a full-time first-basemen.
It's also hard for me to accept that at age 30 he's going to decline. That's true for catchers. Not for first-basemen.
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Victor is a good guy and would do anything for his teammates...
Yeah, and we saw how well that did for Varitek. He quite-nearly didn't have a job this year  Quote:
but, his value just isn't as high as it was two years ago anymore.
Nope, but I don't think it's as low as you believe it to be. Quote:
He's a very tradable asset to the Indians.
The MOST tradeable asset, unfortunately, and even more-so because we want to dump him because of his salary. 
Baseball needs a salary-cap. This business of the "Have's" always getting while the "Have-nots" are always giving makes it a sport that's only interesting to me because football isn't on. 
I stopped paying for anything baseball years ago.........
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Cmon Toad, you are better than that.
Yes, I am (but not tonight  ) Quote:
Yes, that puts us in the neighborhood of KC
So........I wasn't really off the mark, was I 
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but you make it sound like they are at the bottom of the barrel in MLB salaries which is no longer true (KC #21 payroll).
Bottom of the barrel...........bottom third.............it's all the same when you're talking about who's leading each division and who's at the bottom. *shrug*
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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this suggestion is out there on a bunch of other sites...but I like it.
anyone that wants VIctor doesn't have to give us a ton of great prospects....some decent guys expected to make it to MLB in AA are fine.
as long as they take Hafner and his contract with Victor.
opens the door to spend money elsewhere (hopefully either shapiro gets it right this time or we find someone else who will)....and yes, Dolan has shown he is willing to spend money, not Yankee/RedSox/Dodger/Phillies money, but it's not like we can expect that in the current MLB situation.
#gmstrong
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Gotta agree about Hafner.
What odds would you give me that when the last 95 names on that MLB positive test list are revealed his name is on there..............
Our problem with Hafner is that nobody will take that $12 million dollar anual salary.
The good news is that his projected pace, if he played in a full season, would equate to 35 home runs
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Joined: Oct 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Gotta agree about Hafner.
What odds would you give me that when the last 95 names on that MLB positive test list are revealed his name is on there..............
I'm not sure....on one hand, you know he was taking "something"
on the other hand, we don't know if he was smart enough to either be taking something they weren't/couldn't test for....or if he was able to get lucky with when they tested (there are times in the 'cycles' that he would have tested clean).
and I am someone that almost always gives the benefit of the doubt to guys
#gmstrong
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Garko Traded to SF Giants
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