DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Wimbley improving under Ryan..

I like what I am seeing out of Wimbley so far this season. It looks like Rob Ryan is having a positive impact on our former first round pick.

I thought against the Vikings he had the best game he's had as a Brown. He was very disruptive. Pressures, sacks, holding the edge, running guys down, etc. Then the past couple games he's fallen off.

He's still one of the worst starting 34 OLBs in the league....that's all that matters. I like him and hope he can get better but "average" is absolutely his ceiling and I think even that might be a daydream

I like Wimbley a lot and I think he's *improved* from last year.

But where are these new rush moves that he supposedly worked on over the past however many seasons? Seems to me his dip the shoulder move is still the only one he has.

I don't think he's absolutely the worst LB in the history of the game, but he hasn't impressed me too much lately.

You think everybody on the Browns from the owner to the waterboy sucks.. that's why nobody takes you seriously.

i think he plays true to his personality. he's not like a merriman or jared allen where he just wants to kill people. h's intense yet calm.

that said, where i saw the improvement is stronger hands on engagement with the tackles. he punches harder/quicker than i ever saw and doesn't let himself get caught. it's a great jab and move combo now that allows him to keep moving instead of, in the past, he'd engage the tackle, the tackle would get his hands on him and move him back.

i'd love to see him when we have another semi-legit pass rush option on the team.

j/c

although it means nothing....I still found it interesting...

As I was perusing the statistics on nfl.com....I noticed that Wimbley had the same exact stats as Harrison for the Steelers across the board.....Same sacks, Tackles, Solo's, Assist's...etc..

Again..it doesn't really mean anything...but I just found it interesting...

Now you'll have django and a couple others coming in here and picking apart those stats.

LMAO...They are welcome to it!!!!

If they really want to waste their time....LOL

To me Wimbley's been kind of "eh". Nothing great .... nothing bad ......

I did think that Corey Williams played one really good game against the Bengals though.

I can't but help wonder what a freekin' BEAST Kam would be with an additional 25 lbs and his hand in the ground.

I wish Alex Hall was getting significant playing time over Bowens...

Wimbley and Hall would be nice to have at OLB...

There must be something holding Alex Hall back, I dunno what it might be.

the fact that Bowen is an ex-Jet...

I doubt it.

Hall was a 6th rounder that has shown flashes... but we now have two coaches in a row that aren't seeing enough to make him a starter - there's a deficiency there.

If they really want to waste their time....LOL

Yet U wasted your time posting it here..oh the irony..U think they would rather have Wimbley than Harrison?

Don't worry about it, pete.
You thought it was interesting, and posted it here. Didn't waste nobody's time.

i've seen him try to bull rush several times.. he just hasn't had that success yet...

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Yet U wasted your time posting it here..oh the irony..U think they would rather have Wimbley than Harrison?

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Come on Attack you are a hell of a lot better than that...I would expect a comment like that from someone like Ammo but you???? jeez.....

I simply posted something that I felt was was statistically interesting. It has no bearing on the worth of a player....the fact that the numbers came from 2 unlikely sources....is what makes it interesting.....

You take from it what you want....I was neither making a point nor attacking anyones opinion....I simply threw out some facts that some, like myself, would find unexpected and possibly interesting.....I even said twice that it doesn't mean much....but yet we still have posters who will take this stat as me saying Wimbley is in the same as Harrison.......

And we wonder why Diam always says STATS ARE FOR LOSERS!!!!!

thanks for the backup lamp...I have thick skin tho....I guess I should thank him for the laugh....LOL

Sooo predictable...you posted it because U felt that a non factor like Wimbley has the same stats as Harrison, a much better player..so I already saw through it..




And we wonder why Diam always says STATS ARE FOR LOSERS!!!!!

So what loser looked at those stats and posted about it?
Wud not me..

The thing is that he's looked pretty good in the preseason both last year and this year. I mean, is the preseason THAT different? It must be because once the regular season rolls around, his playing time is cut drastically.

I like Wimbley, and he hasbeen covering more ground. His skills have improved some, but were deficient. One-trick ponies are not NFL greats. Might be me, but I would rather see him used like a Ruud (sp?) type rogue set who just is sent to attack passer unless ball comes. It seems we are doing too much RAC stuff dropping him (like on an island in the end zone). If he is light and using one move, I would rather it be a sellout pressure going to the ball than him trying to backpedal and "cover" a back or TE. Maybe I am seeing things, but he seems to be left out of the pass rush often by Ryan. Too cute. cut him loose! Explains lower sacks in part, and only in part, IMO.

Come on Attack...Where did your brain go??? You used to have one....

You know darn well STATS ARE FOR LOSERS is about the INTERPRETATION of stats and not stats themselves.

Now Me.... I saw something that was funny...the same numbers...right across the board...How often does that happen???? and from 2 completely different level players....There are a myriad of things that could have happened to allow this to be....the most obvious being the Brown's D being on the field twice as long as anyone else...LOL....But who really cares....I didn't....I just saw something kind of unexpected and interesting....and thought others might too....

You saw....He is saying they are the same.......he must be stupid...lets jump on him.....

So who is interpreting what incorrectly???? You go on and think that you have a point....I suppose it wouldn't be the first time you were wrong......

Fact is K will never be that terror that he was drafted to be..he still cannot set the edge and still gets sealed on the outside.
Pete..give all the long winded replies ya want...I see sum[ptin funnier than those stats you posted... carry on!

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Pete..give all the long winded replies ya want..

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ok.....if I must.....lol

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ya did it..even if you say you didn't care a single thing about it.... carry on!

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That's right I did....I posted it...Geez what was I thinking... [sarcasm]statistical oddities have no conversational value whatsoever[/sarcasm]...

And still....

You were the one who could not decipher that simple post for what it was....Should I use smaller words next time? I mean come on???? Really???? Really???? Was your passion to slam Wimbley was so strong that it blinded you from understanding my post and you just had to belittle that post lest someone see it and think that somehow Harrison and Wimbley are equals????

Like dealing with childern..passion to slam Wimbley ..but slamming him is more of a effort than slamming U ..

You're making yourself look foolish.
But do carry on.

That's your reply????

Dang...if that's all I had, I would have just turned the PC off......





Dude......WTH is going on....Where is AttackDawg and how long have you been posting under his name????

Do either of U really have a football take or just a retread of the seemingly endless barrage of babble you're known for?
If so come back tomorrow..

Ahh so it's an opinion you want....Is it ok that I use big words????

If you really want my opinion.....I still think Wimbley is a One Trick Pony concerning the pass rush. He still has not developed a 2nd move that he has confidence in. What has been helping him out this year is the movement around the field. He is still using his speed to get underneath the Tackles and beat them to the corner. But he is now doing so to people that haven't had to look out for him in the past. Right now we are taking advantage of that. We shall see how long that lasts. I think he has improved in his run coverage as well as his pass coverage. He is doing better in fighting off the blocks but still has room to improve. Until he can develop a strong 2nd move in the pass rush, he is just going to be average at best. He may be working on other moves...but he doesn't have confidence in them and he continually goes with what he is comfortable with...

In terms as a player with the Cleveland Browns, I think he is more than serviceable. He will be a player that will give you good minutes...but he can't be that player you can count on being a game changer.

In terms of a 1st round draft pick, it has to be a bust. Because this is the type of production you might expect from a 2nd or 3rd rounder. But if you figure in the ratio of production to draft picks of all the teams over the years, you might say it was niether boom nor bust......Imean so many 1st round picks aren't even producing or are even out of the league. He is at least in the league and playing.

I think eventually we will get a linebacker to play the right side for us and relocate him permanently to the left side...His speed will have a better effect against the Right Tackles anyway....

Is that good enough for you???

Pete314:

To put Harrison and Wimbley in the same sentence is not too far of a stretch to be honest with you

you look at Harrison's Sack # last season

Harrison had 16 sacks last season

Do you know 12 of those 16 sacks came on plays where Harrison was "UNCOVERED" ?

you look how many times Woodley or Harrison are uncovered coming to the QB

its the "Scheme"...

The Browns and Wimbely suffer from this "passive" 2-gap 3-4...the 2-gap 3-4 system is not dedicated as much on attacking, and in reality, the 2-gap 3-4 "limits" the types of blitzes you can bring.

The Steelers run a 1 gap 3-4

The Steelers DL "penetrates" alot more than ours does, and this is by design...Corey Williams and Shawn Rogder would "both" be penetrated into the backfield if our scheme would allow them to...but no our scheme on our DL is to "tie up" not penetrate and its stupid

Kameron Wimbley suffers from a bad scheme...since our DL is not allowed to penetrate, or stunt, or any of that, all they do is tie up and it forces Kam to be SuperMan

Wimbley is no where near as bad as you think he is...put #95 on the Steelers in a one-gap 3-4, he looks like the second coming of Greg Lloyd...

Well nobody asked me my opinion of Wimbley as a Steeler...

And you do have points. But right now, in terms of the Browns.... I think Wimbley's increased numbers are due to being moved around and opponents not having enough looks at him in those situations. The thing is....he is here...now...and in this system he is going to have to develop more moves in the pass rush.

So you don't like Rob Ryan's scheme? I've seen several times where we've had linebackers unblocked.

I'm not completely 100% against the 1 gap (though I'm more against it than for it), but the fact is that our linebackers are nowhere near good enough for it. If you want to run a 1 gap, you need to have sweet 'backers, but we don't have anything close to that. With the two gap, your linebackers are able to roam free more, and they don't have to be quite so awesome.

While the Steelers do run the one gap, I'm fairly certain that the Ravens run the two gap. I know that the Patriots and Jets both run the 2 gap.

Yes The Steelers, Chargers, and I do believe Dom Capers and the Packers are the only 3 teams running a 1-gap 3-4 (both Cowher/Marty Disciples)

Yes you are correct that the other teams including us run a 2-gap

I don't believe our LBers are "that bad"...its just the Scheme

Corey Williams and Rogers are "both" Pro Bowl Caliber Penetration...its what they do...they are 2 of the best at it..yet we don't use them to their strengths

Think about this

If your DL penetrates into the backfield more often(1-gap) vs just tieing guys up (2-gap) things happen

1. Get more pressure on the QB
2. RB met in the backfield for often
3. OL has to contend with a penetrating DL which helps your OLB generate pressure from the outside(See Steelers)

We could easily run a 1-gap 3-4 here, Wimbely and Jackson are both good enough to play it...Barton and the others are serviceable till we can get one more

using Rogers and Williams to their strengths(penetrating the OL and wrecking havoc in the backfield) will free our LB up to do much more damage than just our DL tieing guys up

1-gap 3-4 = attack and not react

2-gap 3-4 = react before attack

I want a downhill attacking D, Like the Steelers, the one-gap 3-4 does this

the one-gap 4-3 did this for the Eagles and the Giants..its easier to grasp and easier to attack with.....will ya get burned? sure sometimes, but thats with everything...no risk, no reward...

Not that it matters, but the Cowboys also run the 1 gap. As I'm sure you know, Wade Phillips is the son of Bum Phillips. who invented the 1 gap 3-4.

I agree that Rogers and Williams would both excel in a 1 gap, but I just don't think our linebackers are anywhere near good enough for it. They would give up too many big plays, which brings me to my main reason for not liking the 1 gap. The big plays. I prefer to prevent the big one and maybe not make as many huge plays. I like being aggressive, but you can do that from the two gap.

Right now I believe our d-line is stronger as a unit than our LBs are, so I would let em loose and see what happens. Why do I remember the Jets running a one gap last year? Why haven't we switched to it again?