|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,887
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,887 |
Like Favre would come here anyways. We are not just a QB away from the Superbowl. Favre wants a hot at winning it all. He will either retire again or resign with Minn (not sure if his contract was a one year deal.)
But reguardless he isn't comming to Cleveland.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532 |
Yeah I agree, but still didnt and dont like the thought of him with an orange helmet on!
#brownsgoodkarma
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175 |
So you would keep Mangini just so we keep Ryan as our DC? And we are 5 or 6 players away from a good 3-4 too... I'm kind of bringing up the point Dong highlighted from the press conference. System isn't going to make or break a coach as much as not falling in line under Holmgren and being able to work with the new GM.
Things at the end of the season made most fans happy but it made me upset. Why couldn't he see talent he had on the team already? He got rid of decent players to get his guys in here (backups on a 9-7 team that missed the playoffs and were just as good this year without them) and the team was starving for talent (the Winslow and Edwards trades were actually ok in my book).
The right side of the o line and linebackers come to mind. He didn't try to get any impact free agents (they were told to stay away from Mangini by their agents). We all knew we needed help at corner and we got rod hood and hank poteat.
Most of us have been on the Harrison bandwagon from day one. 1900 yards his senior year in college and was nicknamed the Ghost because he couldn't be touched going through holes. But Mangini played Lewis, Davis and Jennings before Harrison had his coming out party at the same time his hand picked RG and RT got hurt and guys we had already got to play again.
His draft ok at best since it appeares Mack is what he thought he was and MM can catch but everyone else? They couldn't even beat out backups from the Jets or Mangini can't see talent past LTs and Centers.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,887
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,887 |
Quote:
they were told to stay away from Mangini by their agents
That didn't happen until after Spring Training. And I have a feeling it was a few agents who's clients ended up on a bus ride to Mangini's camp. And the comment was along the lines of:
An un-named Agent said he'd rather sign his client to a practice squad of another team than sign with the Browns for a starting spot.
But alas after that comment Evan Moore and Roth agents seemed pretty happy to have thier clients sign with the Browns.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850 |
Favre would do wonders for our offense... He would make MoMass and Robo look like the best tandem since Fitz and Boldin..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,206
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,206 |
lol, not even close. Those two can barely catch Anderson's fastball (when it actually gets to them and not the ground near their feet - or a defender), what makes you think they could handle one of Favereerre's passes?
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850 |
Favre has accuracy. Big difference.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 11,850 |
Mangini’s fate? Still unknown Filed by Scott Petrak January 6th, 2010 The Browns had nothing to report late Wednesday afternoon regarding president Mike Holmgren’s pivotal meeting with coach Eric Mangini. ESPN’s Adam Schefter reported the meeting began at 2 p.m. "We don’t have any updates," team spokesman Neal Gulkis said. Holmgren said Tuesday he hadn’t made up his mind whether to keep Mangini, and that Mangini had a legitimate chance to save his job. Holmgren gave him a list of questions to ponder before their meeting. Gulkis confirmed Philadelphia Eagles general manager Tom Heckert interviewed for the same position with the Browns. He was at team headquarters Wednesday and left. Heckert is a respected personnel man thoughout the NFL and had been considered for Browns GM in 2005 and ‘08. He withdrew from consideration last year after Mangini was hired as coach. With the Eagles in the playoffs, Heckert can’t be hired until they’re done playing. Holmgren said he has other GM interviews lined up, but wouldn’t say with whom. J.R. Rickert, Joshua Cribbs’ agent, isn’t happy with the early negotiations with Holmgren for a new contract. “I am always optimistic, but their idea of ‘making an effort’ and my idea of making an effort are vastly different,” Rickert said in an e-mail to The Chronicle. “We are talking about one of the all-time best special teams players in the game, and we expect ‘an effort’ that is commensurate with that.” Cribbs has been looking to renogiate the six-year, $6.7 million contract he signed in 2007 since last offseason. He earned his second Pro Bowl trip as a special teamer after posting his best season with six touchdowns and 2,510 all-purpose yards, the fifth most in NFL history. Holmgren said Tuesday he wants to keep Cribbs, but has to work out "the business part." "I believe players should be rewarded for what they do," Holmgren said. "So we have made an effort and we’ll continue to make an effort to handle Josh’s situation.” Cribbs would like to be paid like one of the top special teamers in the league, which means at least $3 million a year. Cribbs also played receiver and Wildcat quarterback this season. Link
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/6WV79RV/Browns-Coach-Sig.png)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
I'm gonna drive this thread down a bumpy road and upset some people but damnit, Holmgren has much more important fish to fry than one special-teams player.
Rickert, shut the Hell up, take a number, know your significance and importance in all this, and sit down. Cribbs isn't as important as our GM search and the fate of our head coach.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,827
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,827 |
Sorry I wasn't more clear. The question was did he call Farve to get Farve's opinion of Mangini as a Head Coach.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 13,587
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 13,587 |
Didn't MH tell everyone that he would decide on Mangini by End of Business today? Or was that the end of the week? Or am I making things up? That actually made me laugh. Maybe I can be cited as an anonymous source that MH has made up his mind (and they'd throw in that MH is coaching this year). :-p and 
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,399 |
Quote:
Cribbs would like to be paid like one of the top special teamers in the league, which means at least $3 million a year. Cribbs also played receiver and Wildcat quarterback this season.
If he wants $3 million a year give it to him.. that's easy, I was afraid he wanted upwards of $8-10M.... Sign the guy at $3M and consider it a bargain.
yebat' Putin
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
He'd have never gotten that. The key is going to be how much bonus money he wants because he's now clearly the best special teamer out there.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,342
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,342 |
Whatever Joe T. makes, offer Cribbs $5 less per year and it's a fair contract. Pay him!
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,991
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,991 |
Quote:
Didn't MH tell everyone that he would decide on Mangini by End of Business today? Or was that the end of the week? Or am I making things up?
Homegrown said end of the week before a decision is made. Give Cribbs his contract and bonus before the start of the next NFL year so part of his bonus can go on this year's cap.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,842
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 13,842 |
Holmgren Era, Day 2: No announcements as Cleveland Browns coach Eric Mangini departs facility By Tony Grossi January 06, 2010, 5:54PM UPDATED: 6:10 p.m. BEREA, Ohio -- News, notes, rumors and reports as new team president Mike Holmgren begins to build the Browns: -- Eric Mangini has left the building. After spending all day inside the Browns training facility and meeting with Holmgren, Mangini left hurriedly at about 5:35 p.m. and did not stop to answer questions. Holmgren and his agent, Bob LaMonte, left the facility at 6:05. A club source confirmed that Holmgren and Mangini met for two hours and that no decision was reached. About 15 minutes before Mangini departed, several of his assistant coaches were seen leaving the facility. Holmgren said on Tuesday that he would meet with Mangini at least once before making his decision. Holmgren also said he hoped to have the issue settled by the end of the week. A team source said the team would not comment on the situation until there was an announcement. If Mangini is not retained, Holmgren's coaching search will commence immediately. -- Fred Nance, recently hired as the Browns general counsel, arrived at the facility about 4 p.m. and was still there after Mangini left. -- The national "insiders" are split on the validity of the John Fox-to-Cleveland rumor. Here's what I know: 1. Fox is "very interested" in the possibility, according to a league source. 2. Panthers owner Jerry Richardson would be willing to arrive at a contract settlement to get out of the $6 million owed Fox for the 2010 season. 3. Richardson, seeing a potential owners' lockout in 2011, would not replace Fox with Bill Cowher, but might promote from within. 4. Behind the scenes, most if not all of Mike Holmgren's coaching and executive "ready lists" are made up of clients of agent Bob LaMonte. Fox is in that stable. -- Other LaMonte clients that could come into play include Leslie Frazier, defensive coordinator of Minnesota; Mike Sherman, Texas A&M head coach; Marty Mornhinweg, offensive coordinator of Philadelphia; and Mike Heimerdinger, offensive coordinator of Tennessee. -- On the GM front, a club source confirmed that Tom Heckert, general manager of Philadelphia, was interviewed by Holmgren this morning. Heckert, also in the LaMonte stable, is highly regarded in personnel circles. The Eagles, however, have been encouraging him to seek a team that would give him real GM powers. He doesn't have that in Philadelphia and never will. -- Other rumored GM candidates include LaMonte-clients Randy Mueller, a three-time GM now an assistant in San Diego; and Ted Sundquist, who's been out of the GM loop since leaving Denver two years ago. -- John Schneider, co-director of football operations with Green Bay, has strong ties to Holmgren, but is not a LaMonte client. web page
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
With as much as all the people have been talking, am I the only one who finds it a little strange that Mangini wouldn't say a word as he was leaving?
I also wonder why Nance suddenly showed up towards the end of the meeting. It could easily be any number of things.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
Quote:
I could easily say that going on a FLUKE four-game winning streak isn't cause for "unbridled optimism."
"Starting to work" equals unbridled optimism? Come on Toad, that hardly equates the "Savior of the Franchise" tag that has been foisted upon El Presidente by some.
Quote:
Just the simple fact that Lerner isn't calling the shots is reason for optimism.
Perhaps you mean for SOME optimism. In that case, yes, true.
Quote:
Then there's the fact that we're entering "Homertime" which begins the very moment the previous season ends.
That makes as much sense as anything else I've heard/read.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
Quote:
With as much as all the people have been talking, am I the only one who finds it a little strange that Mangini wouldn't say a word as he was leaving?
I also wonder why Nance suddenly showed up towards the end of the meeting. It could easily be any number of things.
If things are still undecided, what would you have EM say?
Yes, it could be for a dozen different reasons why Nance is there.
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,827
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,827 |
I would love to see Mangini's face as he left. That would give a lot of insight to how the meeting went.
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
That it was a productive meeting, which is what many would tend to say.
I'm not attempting to read anything into this that I want. I would have thought that if the meeting was productive and Mangini felt good about it that he'd have said so.
I'm trying to figure out why the assistant coaches were all there and why everyone left without saying a word.
I suppose the most likely answer is that Holmgren has put a gag-order on everyone from saying a word until this thing is resolved.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
I won't argue the mechanics of running the team, why he kept who he kept, why he got rid of which players, what players were as good at their replacements or anything else of that ilk. Simple fact is, we don't have all the facts regarding those moves so it's pointless. I really don't see what talent he got rid of that wasn't replaceable. We agree on the Winslow/Edwards trades. Who are these detrimental losses, this talent he couldn't see?
I didn't say I would keep Mangini just to keep Ryan, please don't put words in my mouth. I said Ryan and his D were one of the few highlights of the season. And he was, and they were, and they were playing especially well at the end of the season when they actually started to get the message that was being presented. Detail, discipline, versatility, hard work, study, sound fundamental football. Good stuff.
O-line: Drafted Mack. Hell of a start to fixing the OL. Told Steiner to bulk up. Good move. Kept Frailey. Good move. Brought in stop gap guards and tackles. Don't know what else you want, unless it was to break the bank on FA's past their prime. I'd look for a RT, possibly in the first round, and a guard at some point in the off season no matter who is coach. Can't do it all in one year. Don't see the problem here.
Harrison: He earned his spot, and kept it once he earned it. He worked on becoming a better blocker and it paid off. It may not have happened in your, my, or others time frame, but it did happen. The why of it, know one really knows. And I don't particularly care. I'm just glad he got his shot and ran with it. I'm sure Mangini is too. How do I know? He said so.
His draft picks are improving, what else do you want from late round picks? Maiava, Veikune, Robo, all saw increased playing time as their skills improved. Don't know what the complaint is.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 16,195 |
At this point for EM, if he didn't have a box with this personal belongings in it when he left, I'd say it would have to fall on the productive side for how the meeting went.
#GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 745
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 745 |
Quote:
At this point for EM, if he didn't have a box with this personal belongings in it when he left, I'd say it would have to fall on the productive side for how the meeting went.
Hi-ho!!
On the Heckert note, I feel like this guy is already hired. Obviously we won't know at least until the Eagles are out of the playoffs (this weekend if they play the Cowboys that poorly again), but there's just so many indications it'll be Heckert.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](http://i.imgur.com/GmuEd.gif) "One man's Bum is another man's Hobo" - Waterdawg
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,556
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,556 |
very very interesting.
Breaking out my crystal ball.
Holmgren Pres
Heckert VP (takes over when Holmgren goes back to coaching in a year or two)
Sneider GM
Mornhinweg HC
Jauron DC
Zorn OC
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
The Seahawks have been given permission to interview Heckert.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 260
2nd String
|
|
2nd String
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 260 |
Quote:
The Seahawks have been given permission to interview Heckert.
Speaking of the Seahawks, what if their new GM is not on board with their head coach?
This is complete speculation, but Jim Mora has experience under the Holmgren tree in both San Fran. working under Steve Mariucci and also under Holmgren himself in Seattle. Plus, they both have the same agent.
There is already speculation that Zorn could end up as a coach in Cleveland, but what if Mora is fired by Seattle, could he end up as a coordinator here in Cleveland? It is possible.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Yep, it is.
Mora was the coach-in-waiting whenever Holmgren left. And of course Mora has the same agent as Holmgren (Who the Hell doesn't in the freakin' league?!?!  ).
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175 |
When Mangini gets fired my list for head coach goes:
leslie frazier
marty mornhinweg
mike sherman
gunther cunningham
add in hopes and dreams of jon gruden and steve mariucci and I think we can pull a head coach out of a hat.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,693 |
: puke: How about Dungy? The only guy I'd LOVE in this scenario. And I'd still think it's a mistake. Too bad he's not from the Holmgren tree. Too bad Holmgren's ego won't allow it. But no egos involved. JMHO.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246 |
CalDawg, the Djangobrown of Mike Holmgren.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175 |
Dungy is as smart or smarter than Holmgren so if they could ever swing him that could really start a dynasty.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 9,149 |
Clean on Rooney, too,....just sayin'.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246 |
FYI, Dungy would never succeed here because he doesn't yell a lot on the sidelines and get animated and that's the only way you can be a successful coach. 
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175 |
But but, he has that blank stare thing down...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175
Practice Squad
|
|
Practice Squad
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 175 |
How do you guys feel about Mike Heimerdinger either as Head coach or oc/assistant head coach? (both would be upgrades in title) I would like him more as OC myself.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,961
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,961 |
This was posted a short time ago on Cleveland.com Quote:
Holmgren Era, Day 3: Eric Mangini is still on the job and another GM candidate is coming
By Tony Grossi
January 07, 2010, 12:19PM
(Joshua Gunter/ The Plain Dealer)Browns president Mike Holmgren is expected to meet with head coach Eric Mangini for the third straight day today.
Updated at 1:02 p.m.
BEREA, Ohio -- Eric Mangini beat Mike Holmgren to the office this morning.
The Browns coach, whose status is being evaluated by Holmgren, reported to work at about 7 a.m. Holmgren rolled in about two hours later.
The two men had a two-hour sitdown on Wednesday. It is believed that they will meet again today.
A Browns spokesman told The Plain Dealer there is no announcement on Mangini's status planned "at the present time."
Meantime, Browns spokesmen have declined to say whether owner Randy Lerner has been in the team's headquarters this week. Lerner did not attend Holmgren's introductory news conference on Tuesday because of weather-related problems, according to Holmgren.
Lerner did not attend the Browns' last three wins and it's not clear whether Lerner has spoken face-to-face with Mangini since the season ended.
• As expected, Holmgren will interview Will Lewis, Seahawks director of pro personnel, for the GM position.
The Plain Dealer reported that Lewis would be a prime candidate as soon as Holmgren accepted the job as team president.
Lewis, a former NFL cornerback, broke in as a scout under Holmgren with the Green Bay Packers. After Lewis' contract in Green Bay ran out, he rejoined Holmgren in Seattle in 1999 in the pro personnel department.
Lewis' interview fulfills the Browns' obligation to comply with the Rooney Rule as it pertains to the GM position.
It is known that Holmgren values Lewis in the personnel department and it is possible that Holmgren will seek to hire both Lewis and Tom Heckert Jr., who interviewed for the GM job on Wednesday.
Heckert was also supposed to interview for the Seattle GM position, but a source told The Plain Dealer that Heckert canceled that interview following his visit to Cleveland.
No team has co-general managers. It's possible Heckert or Lewis -- more likely Lewis because of his experience -- could fill the role of player personnel director in Holmgren's plans.
But the Seahawks would be under no obligation to release Lewis from his contract for a lateral move. The fact the Seahawks are contemplating an organization overhaul, however, could free up Lewis.
• Keith Gilbertson, who coached wide receivers under Holmgren in Seattle, is expected to be added to the Browns organization in an unspecified capacity, a source said.
Gilbertson, 61, was a long-time college coach in the Pacific Northwest and had two tours of duty with the Seahawks. The source said that Gilbertson might wind up in the Browns' personnel department.
• Browns receivers coach George McDonald has left the team to coach receivers at Rutgers University.
© 2010 cleveland.com. All rights reserved.
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2010/01/holmgren_era_day_3_eric_mangin.html
Basically, Mangini is still there, beat Holmgren in to work this morning,, maybe we'll know more today, maybe we won't..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Holmgren airs at 4 O'Clock
|
|
![[Linked Image from mypsn.eu.playstation.com]](http://mypsn.eu.playstation.com/psn/profile/Letherface.png)
![[Linked Image from s2.excoboard.com]](http://s2.excoboard.com/forums/25521/user/302752/484538.gif)
