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The WCO can be run in many different ways. The Seahawks have always sort of had a balance between power and finesse, while the Eagles are a power line.
We don't know which way the Browns will go, but I don't see Steiny going anywhere.
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Quote:
nope..... we didn't ask for a release. Actually were told we had nothing to worry about just 3 weeks back..... business is business.
And sometimes business sucks.
Like I said, you folks will land on your feet.
I don't know Hank, but I do know you a little bit.....you wouldn't have it any other way.
Wherever it leads, I sincerely hope it leads to good things.
Russ
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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...and StClair is still on the team with a 3mil salary? Yeah, makes sense 
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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j/c...
Obviously everyone loved Hank. I do, too. But, if this move brings us closer to being a contender, then 
Please enlighten me on how we just got better....I would love to hear the spin on this" "
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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I thought Hank did very good at guard toward seasons end....must mean we are getting younger at the position. Hint, hint!
Last edited by SunDawg; 03/03/10 09:19 PM.
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Just came on here and saw this thread. It feels like I've been punched in the gut.
Best of luck to you Hank. Hopefully you'll have a shot at the SB when you sign with another team.
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Let us know, and not Pittsburgh , you both know better
I will be the second to say (somebody else beat me to it) I will be rooting for Hank even if he would end up in Pittsburgh
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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That was me,...and I will not root for anybody in Pittsburgh.
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I will be the second to say (somebody else beat me to it) I will be rooting for Hank even if he would end up in Pittsburgh
GET HIM!!!! 
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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With all the holes on this team, now there is another one for backup center/guard. Compare the rushing stats with Fraley at guard compared to Womack and Fraley is worth every bit of that contract IMO.
While I am all about the "high character guy," -- and Hank is -- this is what I am probably more concerned with,....
We have an entire new FO,...do they know what they are doing ?
I really want to hope to trust so,...but this is a head-reeler.
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Is it really? Hank Fraley is a backup offensive linemen who was due a roster bonus. The Chargers just cut LaDainian Tomlinson for similar reasons. The Jets cut Thomas Jones, a player who had 1,400 rushing yards and 14 TD's last season. Guys who are much better than Hank Fraley get cut in the NFL all the time.
Was Hank Fraley a great guy and a good backup? Yes. Is he essential to this team being successful? No.
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I understand that these things happen, but I'm not very happy about it. A guy who could play guard and centre... at worst he was very good depth. ... on this move.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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In terms of money, yes it is. Without even looking, or knowing, were their roster bonues anywhere near what Fraley's was ?
Tomlinson and Jones make oodles more for half the work that a guy like Fraley puts out.
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2.13mil this year including bonus. link That doesn't seem like "too much" to pay the guy the is coaching your young center, and backing up 3 spots in the middle of the line. Hell this was the last year of his contract. He could have retired a Brown. 
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Fraley had a roster bonus of 500K.....peanuts. Why we started revamping the OL by getting rid of Hank is beyond me when we have absolute STIFFS like St. Clair and Womack making more money.
This is the 2nd move the new FO has made that just makes zero since to me. To be honest I can't think of anything they've done yet that does make since, but it is still very early.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Hope St Clair, and DA are next!!!
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You can't think of anything they've done because they haven't done anything. Free agency hasn't even started and people are already questioning the new guys? Good God.
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You forgot to compare his roster bonus to guys like Tomlinson and Jones,....(just pickin' on cfrs,...  )
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That's why I clarified that with "it's still very early". I am not going to give them passes when they do stupid stuff, and releasing a versatile veteran who was an excellent teammate is dumb...........especially considering he isn't a high priced contract, and we have much bigger STIFFS on the OL who are.
Is it the end of the world??? Nah. If we replace him with a young stud all will be forgiven. It is troubling they would start with Fraley though and leave absolute stiffs like Womack and St. Clair on the roster just because they are stronger. Hell they might be, but all the strength in the world sure didn't help them block anybody worth a crap last year.........Hank did a pretty decent job of that when he was in there.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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You can't think of anything they've done because they haven't done anything. Free agency hasn't even started and people are already questioning the new guys? Good God.
Just takin' it in stride though, is this something you would have done ? It is obvious the majority of the Board would not have,...that's all were saying (at least, I am).
No one has questioned the release of Jamal Lewis,....absolutely NOT ONE Board member has put up a fight on that FO decision.
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I would echo the sentiment that releasing Fraley was curious, while there are players less effective and more costly that remain on the OLine of the Browns.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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Quote:
With all the holes on this team, now there is another one for backup center/guard. Compare the rushing stats with Fraley at guard compared to Womack and Fraley is worth every bit of that contract IMO.
While I am all about the "high character guy," -- and Hank is -- this is what I am probably more concerned with,....
We have an entire new FO,...do they know what they are doing ?
I really want to hope to trust so,...but this is a head-reeler.
Two things:
Holmgren knows more about football than any coach or GM we've had here in decades. That's good for something.
Heckert was part of the brain-trust that figured Fraley wasn't good enough for the Eagles. That's good for something, too.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Good points. I want to see if Womack and St. Clair are brought back........that will tell me alot.
We've had guys here before that overvalued big strong fat ass OL, and that hasn't worked out well. If we keep FW or JS the only reason we did so was because they are big and "strong"................sorry that is absolute BS when they can't block anyone. It's the same mistake Botch used to make when picking OL. If they have feet like cement it doesn't mater how big and strong they are.
I have no problem getting bigger and stronger as long as those players can you know actually BLOCK someone. I am real curious to see if FW and JS are brought back, because both are Kevin Garmon version 2 and 3 imo...........big guys that simply have cement feet............that simply will not get it done.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Me personally. I wouldn't have done it. But I don't understand the reaction of people. Some are making it seem like a starting player was cut in his prime. Fraley will be thirty-three when the season starts and is a backup. These type of guys get cut all the time and are easily replaced. Yes, I know he was mentoring Alex Mack. But we already have a guy who gets paid to do that, George Warhop.
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Was Hank Fraley a great guy and a good backup? Yes. Is he essential to this team being successful? No.
Did you watch the games he started and do you watch the offensive line? I was all for the center position getting upgraded before last season, but injuries happen. Why cut Fraley when there is nobody currently on this team thats a better backup? All 53 players on the roster are essential, even the best backup o-lineman on the team. He was going to start sooner or later with the way the injury bug hits this team.
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I didn't think Womack was all that bad, not great but..... compared to St Clair he looked like Jim Parker.
This should be interesting. Fraley gone & Hadnot as good as gone St Clair worthless even if he stays. I hope our FO has something better up their sleeve than Necktie and St Leadfoot.Is there anybody decent on the URFA list? Did Mangini get a list of cheapo FAs from his brother in law? Maybe now that Haden ran a sundial 40, OL in the first is a possibility?
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bad move browns, probably could have found a good role for hank
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Here too....We can root for the person, but not for the team,
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jc
The Browns won't get better if they stay the same...let's not act like Hank was a Pro Bowler...he was a utility fill in at center and guard.
The good news is, obviously the Browns are looking to upgrade at the positions Hank played, and that is a good thing.
I appreciate everything Hank and his family did for the Browns and I will always think of Hank as a guy who did as much as he could with the talent he had.
Good luck in the future, Hank, except when you or your new team plays against the Browns...
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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I had Hank listed as one of my favorite Browns.Maybe that was the jinx
IIRC Hank came to the team during the time that:
Faine was traded
LCB went down
Hallen quit
and Ross Tucker didn't work out.
Hank solidified the position at the very least.
Hank actually did quite well this past year. Thought he would stick around as a back-up/ spot starter. Best of luck to 66 and his family.
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If Fraley was cut, and not the other guys who we think NEED to be cut.. mabe Fraley isn't so good...
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I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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You guys say it all the time..
Why doesn't Coye Francies get more PT? He must not be that good then..
Why doesn't Veikune not get more PT? He must not be that good then..
Why doesn't Robiskie not get more PT? He must not be that good then..
Why did Hank Fraley get cut? He must not be that good.
A lot of you are only taking up for him b/c of Danielle. Let's be honest. He's a fan favorite on this board b/c of her, and thats why there is not NEAR as much dissing as when Jamal Lewis was cut, Winslow was traded, Edwards was traded, etc.
He's done. I do hope that he can get on somewhere else, just as I hope for any past Brown.. Well except for Edwards.. lol.
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let's not act like Hank was a Pro Bowler...he was a utility fill in at center and guard.
With all due respect mac, nobody on this thread is acting or saying he was a pro bowler or we cut a pro bowler....if anything we all know he was a utility player...somebody who like us who works for and earns what he got, maybe that was the connection between Hank & us fans, nobody is saying he was or is a pro bowler...most responces are not even talking about his football skills, were responding to Hank the person and to me that says more about him than football.
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I liked Fraley. I'm sorry to see him go.
I do hope that we upgrade whenever and wherever possible though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Just clicking here... This kind of surprises me. OK, so maybe Hank isn't going to be your starting center or guard. However, he can play all three positions in the middle and do a better than credible job at it. I would think that kind of backup would be valuable. I hope the FO has a plan to upgrade that spot because, right now, that player doesn't exist on our roster. See 'ya Hank. I've enjoyed watching you play here. Good luck wherever you end up.
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
-- Mark Twain [/color]
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j/c
Sad to see Fraley go. He embodies the qualities we cherish as Browns Fans. The business side of things can really stink. But hopefully someday maybe we can cross paths again when his playign days are done...Because I think in seeing how he has brought several Centers along during his career...Hank has plenty to teach and can be very good at it.
Good Luck to you Hank....We will miss you and your family. Thanks for "being a Brown"...others have put on the uniform...but they never allowed themselves to become a Brown.....You did(you my not have even realized it) and we are appreciative of that.
I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...
What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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But the good news is that if they are ditching him, they clearly have a plan for upgrading the line.
If they are serious about upgrading the line they'll jettison St.Turnstile right now.
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Hank to me is what a Browns player should be and that is why he has been so liked throughout his time here. He is a classy guy, that gives it everything he has with that team first attitude.
My sentiments exactly. He was one of the few playing hard during the crappy part of last season. I'll miss his interviews.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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I'm very surprised by this move .. I liked Hank and Mack playing next to each other at the end of the season .. I think Hank is a stand up guy and has a few years left in the tank ( back-up across the line ) . Why St Clair hasn't been released is beyond, way beyond me !
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Fraley Released
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