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Gocong is a good pass rusher who is out of place in the 4-3. I would love for us to get him, but hopefully not at the price of a 3rd rounder.
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Gocong is a name that a lot of posters on here were pimping the year he was drafted, and many felt would make an excellent OLB.
If he can be had for a 5th, I say we do it now without blinking.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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If he can be had for a 5th, I say we do it now without blinking.
I agree. A fifth rounder for sure, two fifths would be fine too. Depending on the faith of the coaches in our other LBs, would really determine his worth. May be even a 4th. Cocong was a player that was very hyped yet came from a small school, like Cal Poly or something. I think he had a record for the most sacks in D1AA. I definitely would have spent a 4th rounder on him then. If the Eagles want to trade him for a fifth or fifth and another low/lower round, that would be great. He's still young, has been a starter on a 4-3 defense but was made for the 3-4. I think he could possibly make a difference on our defense.
But I am interested in what Veikune can do. I also am interested in what Benard can do for us. Both are absolutely unknown. Someone on here wrote that people need to get over it he's a bust, but. I think we need to at least let him play a second year in the NFL. Sure, being a 2nd round pick means your supposed to play. But, not every player that becomes a good player plays right away. I'm just interested in if he improves, if not, then we can talk about bust, but as of now it's a guy learning the 3-4 LB roles who didn't play his rookie year. I'm not ready to write him off just yet......
As for Benard, he played in like 1 or 2 games, one of those having multi sacks. That's just one game though, and he didn't start playing on the team until the very end of the season.
Trusnik is also a possibility, but I get the feeling he is more an ultra-backup type LB. Capable of filling in at OLB or ILB. OLB Trusnik just doesn't have the pass rushing ability it takes to be a starter, I think he stands a better chance on the inside. But he has a high motor and I feel like he's the type of guy who pays attention and works hard to improve. He's ultra effort, so he might be capable of starting if he improves. I don't think Trusnik stands much of a chance to start if Chris Cocong is here.
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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I thought Thaddeus Gibson was going to be a 3-4 LB?
I just copied/pasted from a website that had 3-4 and 4-3, didn't look at the names - good catch.
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All Pro
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as other say 4th or 5th. good to great deal.
the post that brought up the maiava, viekune picks last year. Maiava is a ILB. Viekune I thought would be OLB but didn't he practice at inside as well? Can anyone confirm where they had David playing the majority of his practice snaps last year?
"He who buys what he does not need steals from himself."
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Gini's love fest with Gocong is about to go overboard if we give up a much needed 3rd rounder.
You are acting like Mangini is the only one with any say so in the matter.
Heckert also feels Gocong is a pretty good player.
Agreed...several thoughts...he is not a fit in Philly's 43..that combined with Heckert knowing him is why the Browns want him..and they aren't giving up a 3rd for him..likely one of the 5ths...he is a upgrade over Kam and is stronger and more of a overall complete pass rusher..
I actually had him in one of my mocks and I believe Tab also was touting his name a lot.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/01/10 08:06 AM.
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Veikume started woeking at OLB, then moved inside IIRC.
This after being a DE in college.
I think that this is the year for him to either boom or bust. His learning should be complete enough to mke a run at the job by the end of this year's training camp.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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U won't see Viekune outside,he's more of a fit inside..
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Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I read this before and I agree with the article.
Gocong is No Longer a Restricted Free Agent
Since Gocong signed his RFA tender on March 30, the Browns would no longer have to send the tendered pick to the Eagles in exchange for Gocong.
The Browns may be able to swing a deal where they can give up a lesser pick now (one of their fifth round picks possibly) for Gocong, which is a great value for a starting outside linebacker.
I think this is what the talks are about..which 5th rounder to send and when to do it..
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The fact that this is a guy that Mangini coveted and Heckert picked makes me think the Eagles 3rd rd tender was in place specifically in hopes that the Browns would jump. I gotta say if this is the case, I like the hardball approach by our guys.  Now, let's get this guy in,I'm eager to see what he can bring.
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Head Coach Eric Mangini Coveted Gocong Back in 2006.
When Mangini was with the Jets, he made it quite clear to the media at that time he really liked Gocong's potential in a 3-4 defense as a pass rushing linebacker.
Unfortunately, the Eagles picked Gocong in the third round at pick No. 71 just before Mangini and the Jets picked at No. 76.
When I read that I HAD to know how Cartman reacted and whom he picked then....#76 Anthony Schlegel, LB, Ohio St. 
What does that tell me? He need reached....just like he did with Veikune and probably both WRs last year in round 2 instead of using his picks to GO GET the guy he supposedly COVETS...
Eric Mangini is what Eric Wedge was to the Indians...a manager who overvalues overachieving grunts over actual talent...both suck big time in in-game managing, both are intellectually as flexible as a brick...both will leave a mess behind them
only way is up...that's my good news of the day 
edit: oh btw....in case you haven't gotten it yet: Gocong SUCKS...he was suppsoed to be a pass rush force, yet has 4 sacks in 4 seasons? lol Punt this guy...he isn't even worth the 5th...where is he better than Hall or Benard? Eagles' biggest need is at LB and they want to get rid of this guy...I know numerous Eagles fans who just want to get rid of him...for whatever pick they can get....hello? McFly?
Gocong replacing Wimbley would be a lateral move AT BEST...I'd even consider it a backwards fumble....how can anyone think he's a solution? He'd be another waybelow AVG starter on this team...that's NOT what we need...we need upgrades
#gmstrong
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I was curious how us wanting Gocong would somehow turn into "Eric Mangini is a moron." Now I know.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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the board was so nice without Django for these past couple weeks .... sigh ...
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Thank you for reminding me how dense this board has become My bad to make an argument...should have known by now that I'll get cheerleader's pom poms thrown in my face  Schlegel was a fringe late rounder...and everyone pretty much knew he's a backup/ST AT BEST...does that remind you of something? Our last draft? When the Penguin pimped his picks as being great ST talents? lol Oh ,btw Schlegel lasted 1 year in NY and is out of the league for 2 years now Mangini will really make a great ST-Coach next year somewhere...not kidding he's great at that
#gmstrong
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maybe this is just the conspiracy theorist inside of me thinking too much but......
DQ's contract is up after this year. Maybe the FO is getting ready for that.
DQ is better suited to the 4-3. Trade?
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Quote:
Schlegel was a fringe late rounder...and everyone pretty much knew he's a backup/ST AT BEST...does that remind you of something? Our last draft? When the Penguin pimped his picks as being great ST talents? lol
Oh ,btw Schlegel lasted 1 year in NY and is out of the league for 2 years now
What does this have to do with the Browns showing interest in Gocong.
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I just know I can rely on you Django, just like the sun rising in the east. There is not a single element of football that can't somehow be tied to Mangini and how he is the Anti-Christ.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Quote:
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Schlegel was a fringe late rounder...and everyone pretty much knew he's a backup/ST AT BEST...does that remind you of something? Our last draft? When the Penguin pimped his picks as being great ST talents? lol
Oh ,btw Schlegel lasted 1 year in NY and is out of the league for 2 years now
What does this have to do with the Browns showing interest in Gocong.
I thought he was just complaining about Mangini again?
Was he trying to make a point on Gocong? The only thing I saw is that he called it a step back from Wimbley, which I think is hilarious.
you had a good run Hank.
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Quote:
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Unfortunately, the Eagles picked Gocong in the third round at pick No. 71 just before Mangini and the Jets picked at No. 76.
When I read that I HAD to know how Cartman reacted and whom he picked then....#76 Anthony Schlegel, LB, Ohio St.
What does that tell me? He need reached....
Umm. NYJ had this guy, named Tannenbaum. He is sorta a big deal. Many leather bound books and such.
Anyways, Tannenbaum is the GM of the NYJ and was when Mangini was there. He had final decision of draft picks, NOT Mangini.
Sure, Mangini likely had input, but let's not act like he was HC-GM.
Also:
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He'd be another waybelow AVG starter on this team...that's NOT what we need...we need upgrades
We would be giving up a 5th round pick for him (according to our guestimates). He would come in and compete for the OLB job. He may or may not win it (no idea how he would project to 3-4 OLB now). But, if he does win it as you suggest, what other 3-4 OLB could we draft in the 5th round that could do that?
In addition, to suggest that getting a 3-4 OLB which our GM has inside knowledge on for a 5th round pick does not sound like a horrible move to me. It isn't going to win us a division, but there are worse things we can do with such a pick.
#gmstrong
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Was he trying to make a point on Gocong? The only thing I saw is that he called it a step back from Wimbley, which I think is hilarious.
I said AT BEST a lateral move, more probably a step back though...guy has 4 sacks in 4 seasons, Wimbley has 26.5...and I consider Wimbley a below AVG pass rusher
need another argument? Wimbley was traded for a 3rd, Gocong probably will be dumped for a 5th at best...
yeah, it's "hilarious" to think Wimbley is better and more highly regarded around the league than Gocong  You guys really lack any sense of logic and rationale, lol....same guys who are the 1st to bash when GM or Coach XY is being fired....no backbone whatsoever...true homersim, gotta love it
#gmstrong
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I don't see a problem with getting Gocong with a late day pick .
A 5th?
With 3 of those how many rookies you really think will make this team at that point in the draft??
Hardly any..and most would be ST's anyway.
That doesn't mean the Browns can't take a tweener early on either,remember that.
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I said AT BEST a lateral move, more probably a step back though...guy has 4 sacks in 4 seasons, Wimbley has 26.5...and I consider Wimbley a below AVG pass rusher
need another argument? Wimbley was traded for a 3rd, Gocong probably will be dumped for a 5th at best...
Hardly seems like a fair assessment though. Wimbley was a 3-4 OLB where one of his main responsibilities was pressuring the QB (even when there was no blitz).
Gocong was 4-3 OLB who was not responsible for rushing the QB. Jimmie Johnson's defense (RIP JJ), actually had the CBs and S's blitzing more often than the strong-side OLB whose main responsibilities included covering the TE and the flat area (RB or WR screen). Yes, he blitzed occasionally, but even the blitz schemes the Eagles use generally try to open up the lanes in the middle.
Now, the million dollar question: is Gocong a better 3-4 OLB than Wimbley?
I have no idea. He played DE in college and 4-3 OLB in the NFL. I do not know if his skills will translate well enough to a 3-4 OLB. Anyone that says definitely is as crazy as anyone that says definitely not. Noone will know until we see him on the field.
The point is though, if Heckert and Mangini both believe that his skills will translate, then he's probably worth that 5th round pick.
#gmstrong
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In a normal draft a 5th would be ok for Gocong (but still owuldn't make sens with our roster situation)...in this draft you'll be able to get 2nd-3rd round talents in the 5th at certain positions (mainly DL, CB)
Also, it's flawed thinking that way....so let's trade all 4 of our 5th for backup guys who have proved to be below AVG starters....does it improve our team? We already have 40 of those backups/ST guys on our roster thanks to Mangini...there's no need there anymore, we already HAVE the best ST group...we need upgrades at starting positions...I'd rather draft OLB Teo-Nesheim in the 5th or G Lauvau or CB S.Thomspson, CB Verner, DL Peters, DL L.Joseph...
It's like in baseball: trade for washed up vets or take a flyer on some A or AA ball prospect? What good does vet number 41 do? It just clogs your roster....most 5th would be backups/ST anyway? Sure...but Gocong already IS that, older and more expensive at that....you just don't upgrade in ANY way taking a guy in his supposed "prime" from a team that has the biggest need at that player's position....that's as "McFly?" as it gets, sorry
Oh and for the 1000ths "if your Coach/GM deems player XY worthy for that pick, then he's worth it argument"....START THINKING with your OWN brain...it's the most stupid argument out there...I'm sure Mangini thought Veikune was well worth the #52nd selection in the draft last year, see how that argument works? Every team should win the SB every year if this argument has any ground, go punt it, it's a moron's argument for "I don't know what else to say/I have no clue"....we have an Hawaii U fan here who told anyone that he was worse than Purcell in College, that for me was worth more than what the Penguin was "thinking" when he drafted him...why? This member saw Veikune more than Mangini and was able to compare him to other Hawaii prospects, that's worth more than what a narcissistic "Football Genius" thinks about the guy in 3 months...open your eyes and start thinking on your own for a change
#gmstrong
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I am also tired of the "if your Coach/GM deems player XY worthy for that pick, then he's worth it argument". Its right up there with "He's a winner" argument. Its dumb, cliche, and trite. Also for the 100th time on record, Veikune is a bum/wasted pick. Atrocious pick, on par with Oakland taking the Ohio U safety in the second round.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Quote:
the board was so nice without Django for these past couple weeks .... sigh ...
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This draft is deep...one fifth rounder is not going to deplete this team of any incoming talent.
I doubt if MH is planing on using all 12 picks and bring in 12 more rookies.
You are making a weak attempt to spin what I said..you're the one jumping the gun and saying we're using all the picks on several players.. taking about one player who'll be a starter at WOLB..
Who are these other players we're trading for???
Thats extreme.. even for you.
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The sad part is...I don't "hate" Veikune 1 bit, I feel bad for him but his name has now become "Chaun Thompson" pt2....I actually liked him as a 4th/5th round project...it's not his fault he got picked where he got picked....I mean he didn't even watch the draft, he was out because he got told by EVERYBODY (agent, all opinionists) that he's a 2nd day pick Classic outsmart move by somebody who thinks he smarter than anybody else
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Whatever happend to your sig quoting me...guess it made you look pretty dumb huh? no backbone, lol
#gmstrong
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Oh and for the 1000ths "if your Coach/GM deems player XY worthy for that pick, then he's worth it argument"....START THINKING with your OWN brain...it's the most stupid argument out there...
ok, please tell us with your own brain how you know with absolute certainty that a 4-3 DE in college who transitioned to a 4-3 OLB in the NFL definitely does not have the skillset to be a 3-4 OLB. Or how you know exactly how he will perform.
i have already noted how it is impossible to me to know how he will play for us, so i would like some insite on this matter. it will be appreciated. thanks.
#gmstrong
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X 1,000,000
Pretty soon you're going to have to switch to scientific notation.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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The sad part is...I don't "hate" Veikune 1 bit, I feel bad for him but his name has now become "Chaun Thompson" pt2....
At this point I'd be happy if Viekune turned out to be as good as Thompson.
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At this point? He has even started his 2nd year in the league. Give the guy a chance to develop.
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I don't think Thompson was all THAT bad.
He, like Viekune, could have been had in a later round.
And that is their sin .......
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I feel bad for him but his name has now become "Chaun Thompson" pt2
He would have to be pt 3 as Leon Williams was Chaun Thompson pt 2. But at this point he can't even dream of being Leon Williams pt 2. He will go the route of Beau Bell and be cut (hopefully).
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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the board was so nice without Django for these past couple weeks .... sigh ...
X 1,000,000
i actually disagree. while i don't understand how someone who thinks so poorly of every decision ever made would want to be a fan of a team, i do like that he always seems to support the opposite viewpoint from most members of the board.
his seemingly blind hatred towards mangini forces posters to defend why they believe some decisions are good rather than just responding that it is a good decision. it actually increases the overall level of the board as it creates the debate and leaves a footprint for people's thought process on these moves.
just like how the tailgate would be awfully boring without Mac, this forum needs DJ or someone like him.
<this ad was not sponsored nor paid for by the DJ or anyone associated with him>
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but BLIND hatred towards Mangini doesn't add to a debate, does it? Just like radical belief in something without basis for rational thought stunts progress and growth.
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I feel bad for him but his name has now become "Chaun Thompson" pt2
He would have to be pt 3 as Leon Williams was Chaun Thompson pt 2. But at this point he can't even dream of being Leon Williams pt 2. He will go the route of Beau Bell and be cut (hopefully).
Do you go to every practice? Do you see Veikune a lot, and how he has transitioned to the ILB position? You have no idea what he will turn out to be, and wishing him to be cut is the same as wishing him to fail at this point because he hasn't had enough time to transition to a completely new position.
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I was still livinig in Berea then, so yes I went to plenty of TC's and saw him fall on his face so to speak. He stood out because he was so clueless. I dont want him on the team because he stinks, and he takes up the roster spot of player that can actually help our team. I saw rookies being brought in off the street playing in front of him last season, Marcus Benard for example, that weren't with us in TC, didn't have time to learn the defense, and "Develop" like Veikune. Yet they managed to see the field ahead of him. Sorry your arguement holds no water.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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I was still livinig in Berea then, so yes I went to plenty of TC's and saw him fall on his face so to speak. He stood out because he was so clueless. I dont want him on the team because he stinks, and he takes up the roster spot of player that can actually help our team. I saw rookies being brought in off the street playing in front of him last season, Marcus Benard for example, that weren't with us in TC, didn't have time to learn the defense, and "Develop" like Veikune. Yet they managed to see the field ahead of him. Sorry your arguement holds no water.
And Benard is an OLB, Veikune is an ILB. Maiava played ahead of him too, but Maiava has been an ILB his entire career too.
Veikune very well may be a bust, but he has been a Brown for less than a year and is transitioning to an entirely new position.
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