DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cleveland Cavaliers Off-Season Thread

I think we're all on the same page on this issue with everything except the semantics of the terminology.

I must resist.... posting this....IT'S STAN VAN GUNDY!!!

man i never made the comparison, he looks like paul a lot more then he does ron jeremy

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Now knowing how the refs hate me for no apparent reason because Purp never told me who banned me in the first place even though I asked about a month ago. They'll try to claim I was name calling even though I never did. They'll say I was "flaming" even though Mattack started it all. I just want to say peace out and God bless to the truly open minded Cavs fans like LeBron, Kingo, Psy, etc. Even though we've clashed in the past you guys are actually classy and make me feel proud to represent Cavs fans everywhere.

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I didn't know you had a suspension, I thought you just took a hiatius for a little while because I didn't think the argument got out of hand. I didn't see much flaming going on.

I'm glad to see there's no hard feelings over the disagreements we've had in the past.

Cleveland.com is losing credibility with their daily. " lebron rumor mill". Front and center every day. I expect more from the plain dealer, can't be so transparent

CLEVELAND -- The Cleveland Cavaliers have fired Mike Brown, a source close to the head coach told ESPN The Magazine's Ric Bucher.

The Cavaliers had a midnight deadline on Sunday to fire the coach or pay him his full $4.5 million salary for next season.

Cleveland was ousted from the playoffs two weeks ago by the Boston Celtics, who upset the NBA's top regular-season team in six games.

Brown, who had one year left on his contract, could be quickly scooped up by one of the five other teams looking for head coaches. Brown has guided the team to the postseason in each of his five seasons. Cleveland's assistants also have one year remaining on their deals.

Brown was the league's coach of the year last season when the Cavs won 66 games. Cleveland lost to Orlando in the conference finals, however, and it was assumed Brown would have to get the team closer to a championship to keep his job.

Instead, the Cavs regressed. They were badly outplayed by the Celtics, who won the last two games played in Cleveland by a combined 50 points. But Cavs owner Dan Gilbert insisted last week that the team didn't quit against Boston.

"It's one of those things that you can't believe it after it's happened," Gilbert said. "I feel bad for the fans more than anybody."

Cleveland's next move will be an interesting one. Because of LeBron James' uncertain future, it's possible the Cavs would want his input into their next coaching hire, assuming the two-time MVP is still considering re-signing with Cleveland when free agency opens in July. The Cavs will have to search for a new coach not knowing if James will be back and would have to go into the draft and free agency without a coach.

James is eligible to opt out of his contract this summer, a move that would make the two-time MVP -- and zero-time NBA champion -- a free agent and set off a scramble for his services from New York to Miami to Los Angeles and, of course, back in Cleveland.

Information from The Associated Press was used in this report.


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Can't say this is too surprising.

Cavaliers will enter coaching search with plenty of big name hopes, but difficult reality
By Brian Windhorst, The Plain Dealer
May 24, 2010, 4:03AM


CLEVELAND, Ohio -- No NBA team makes a coaching change without considering who will be the next coach. Some plans are more feasible than others, of course.

After firing Mike Brown after five seasons on Sunday, the Cavs have thrust themselves into a complex and uncertain coaching search. For one, they are one of six teams now looking for a head coach. Also without a firm handle on the future of free agent LeBron James, the team will certainly be limited in how it can pitch its job to the top-flight coaches they may look to attract.

Usually, teams want new coaches in place before the draft and the start of free agency. But with the circumstances, the team may not be able to make a decision until after James does. That might not be until July.

Nonetheless, the Cavs do have a list. Here's a look, according to sources, at who is on it.

The dream choices:

Phil Jackson

A 10-time world champion who made his mark by coaching in Chicago and Los Angeles. Until he retires for good Jackson would be at the top of any search. There are two reasons why he will be at the top of the Cavs' list.

One is that his contract with the Lakers is up at the end of the playoffs, making him the James of coaching free agents. The second is Jackson has said Lakers' owner Jerry Buss wants him to take a sizeable paycut from his $12.5 million annual salary. It has been reported that Buss wants Jackson to take as much as a $7 million cut.

Never afraid to spend money and already assured of some payroll relief compared to the past three seasons, there is a chance Cavs owner Dan Gilbert would be willing to outspend Buss for Jackson.

Five years ago, Jackson did accept an interview with Gilbert before going back to the Lakers.

Even so, this would be considered an extreme long shot. It is hard to see Jackson coaching in Cleveland. Actually, it is hard to see him coaching anywhere but L.A., especially because his longtime girlfriend is Lakers' executive Jeanie Buss.

Mike Krzyzewksi

This is the second time the Duke legend's name has come up with an NBA job this year. The other was in relation to the New Jersey Nets, speculation that Krzyzewski shot down by saying: "You would be flattered if someone would offer you a job, but I would not be interested."

The Cavs, however, have some factors going for them that may make Krzyzewksi at least listen. The central reason would be James, who now has a strong and respectful relationship with Krzyzewski after three summers of playing for him on Team USA. The two developed a bond as James matured as a team leader of the national team under Krzyzewski's encouragement.

Also, Cavs general manager Danny Ferry has a long-standing and deep relationship with his former college coach. Ferry went to three Final Fours under Krzyzewski and won National Player of the Year honors in 1989. Coming to Cleveland may seem like a crazy move for the man known as "Coach K," but knowing Ferry was there to work with him could sweeten the pot to a certain degree.

Ferry and Krzyzewksi also share the same agent.

In his recently released book, "The Gold Standard," Krzyzewksi revealed that he was very close to leaving Duke to join the Lakers as head coach in 2004 when Kobe Bryant made a personal pitch. Now at age 63 and coming off a national championship, it may be Krzyzewski's last chance to coach a superstar in the player's prime.

In the years since, Krzyzewksi has earned NBA respect because of his success as the head coach of Team USA, something he didn't have six years ago.

Despite all that, this also would have to be in the long shot category. Krzyzewski's reputation is beyond reproach and his place in history secure. Not to mention he's one of the highest-paid college coaches. He has shunned NBA opportunities for years.

Tom Izzo

Like Krzyzewski, the Michigan State coach has been a target of NBA teams numerous times in the past. Well-respected for his work ethic and ability to teach defense and rebounding, Izzo has established a reputation as a blue collar coach who routinely gets the most out of his teams. His persona would fit in well with the Cavs' desires to have a coach who establishes a system and a culture with his team.

Gilbert, a Michigan State graduate, has a relationship with Izzo and is believed to like him.

Coming off another Final Four appearance, Izzo would have little motive to leave the Spartans. He's turned down chances to make more money in the past. He did, however, recruit James for awhile when James was in high school.

More realistic big names

John Calipari

One of James' close friends, Calipari has vehemently said he is staying at Kentucky. The problem is, few people in the NBA believe that he would not consider the right NBA job. Would the Cavs be that job if James' re-signs?

Despite what may be assumed, it is not believed that James would actively push for Calipari in Cleveland or anywhere else he may look to sign that has a coach opening. But simply because of the relationship plus the long list of players Calipari has sent to the league, he will likely be on the Cavs' list.

Calipari is known for a more open offensive style that takes advantage of the constant talented perimeter players he has. It is a drive-and-kick style that opens lanes and doesn't need a post player to be successful. That may make him attractive to some in the Cavs organization after the offense has struggled at times during Brown's tenure.

Byron Scott

Other than Brown now, Scott has the most impressive playoff resume of any coach currently on the unemployment line. He turned around both the Nets and the Hornets by devising systems that incorporated the several stars that both teams had. He took the Nets to the Finals twice. His career playoff record of 33-24 is a testament.

In both stops, Scott was known for making a positive impact in his first 2-3 seasons on the bench but then losing the support of his team farther down the line. Both times he was fired, including last season in New Orleans, came after trouble with core players on his teams.

But he was very close with point guard Chris Paul, a golfing buddy as well as player, and Paul and James have a strong relationship.

The Sleepers

Jeff Van Gundy

There are those who think Van Gundy is the most accomplished former coach without a current job. He's a defensive specialist who is also known for taking a hard line with players and challenging his stars. It would be, in many ways, a direct opposite of the player-inclusive style that Brown used.

However, sources indicate Van Gundy isn't itching to return to coaching yet. He has a lucrative contract with ESPN as an analyst. Yet the chance to coach James could be a draw.

Mike Budenholzer

If the Cavs consider a candidate without head coaching experience, figure Budenholzer to be at the top of that list. He's been with the San Antonio Spurs for the last 16 seasons and for the last three has been Gregg Popovich's lead assistant. He has a relationship with Ferry and other members of the Cavs organization.

The belief is that Budenholzer is the coach-in-waiting for when Popovich decides to give up coaching duties. The Spurs may not be willing to give him up.

Also on the list:

Former head coaches

Dwayne Casey: Current Dallas assistant, a candidate for other current openings including Atlanta.
Maurice Cheeks: Solid resume, currently assistant with Thunder.
Lawrence Frank: Hard-working young coach who did a quality job with Nets.
Mike Fratello: Long shot, former Cavs coach badly wants back in somewhere.
Avery Johnson: May not be best fit, up for other jobs at the moment.
Sam Mitchell: Former Coach of the Year with Raptors.
Eric Musselman: Interviewed for Cavs opening in 2005.
Terry Porter: Saw some success but seemed to get raw deal in both Milwaukee and Phoenix, last two stops.

Rising assistants

Tyrone Corbin: Getting interviews around league after studying under Jerry Sloan in Utah.
Dean Demopoulos: Nate McMillan's lead assistant in Portland who has been on radar for several years.
Bill Laimbeer: Won titles as WNBA coach in Detroit, now on Timberwolves staff.
Dan Majerle: Former Cav now on Phoenix staff getting interest in league.
Mike Malone: Respected for his knowledge and work ethic, Cavs assistant could get interview.
Tom Thibodeau: Celtics defensive wiz is one of highest-paid and respected assistants in business. Has been getting interviews for last three years.
Elston Turner: Has been lead assistant with Rick Adelman in Sacramento and now Houston. Already interviewed for several opening this year.
Monty Williams: Young assistant with Blazers who is getting attention is on the short list in New Orleans.

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But Cavs owner Dan Gilbert insisted last week that the team didn't quit against Boston.

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The more I watch the Celtics dismantle the Magic, who were playing great coming in.. the more inclined I am to believe him...

Me too.. The Celts seem to have been vastly underated coming into the playoffs...

I feel like the chargers after firing Marty. I am not optimistic that we will get a coach that is better than Mike Brown. In my mind we have just fired the best/most successful Cavs coach in our franchise history.

that list makes my head hurt.

the only way i see coach K coming to cleveland is if lebron signs the longer extenstion, which windy has been reporting he's probably going to sign a 3 year extension whether he stays or goes elsewhere.

i know phil jackson and the lakers seem to be drawing a line with this pay cut thing, but something tells me they will find a way to get it done or, jackson will just retire.

can't imagine him in cleveland.

i like byron scott. wouldn't be my first choice but i think he's a pretty solid coach.

this next move is a huge one for the cavs though, i think that's prettty obvious.

Lenny Wilkens anyone?

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"If the situation was right, I certainly would consider [coaching again]," Wilkens said. "I have not explored it. But Cleveland certainly has a good team. So does Chicago. A few teams are good and need coaches. Let's see how everything shakes out and then we'll see."

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Brian Windhorst will be on WKNR in one minute.

Larry Brown also might be available.

Unless MJ still holds a grudge for Ferry decking him. But, MJ wouldn't hold a grudge, right? (thinking to his HOF speech....hmmm, still thinking and lauging about that Ferry memory)

mo and z come out in defense of mike brown.

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/05/cleveland_cavaliers_players_il.html

Cleveland Cavaliers players Ilgauskas, Williams voice support for Mike Brown
By Mary Schmitt Boyer, The Plain Dealer
May 24, 2010, 2:12PM

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Cavaliers players Zydrunas Ilgauskas and Mo Williams came out in support of Mike Brown today when Brown was fired as coach of the Cavaliers after five seasons.
LeBron James is on vacation and unavailable for comment, according to his spokesman.

Ilgauskas, who had an infamous falling out with Brown after the coach didn't play him on the night he was poised to become the Cavs leader in games played early this season, clearly has put that behind him.

"I have nothing but good things to say about him,'' Ilgauskas told The Plain Dealer. "I enjoyed playing for him. I think coach Brown is a very good coach.

"Obviously, we didn't achieve what we set out to achieve, which is to win a championship. But if you're going to lay all the blame on coach Brown and think that's going to solve everything, you've got another think coming.

"I think we're all at fault -- the players, everybody. You have to, at some point, accept some of the responsibility. We all have to do that. A coach only can take you so far. At some point you have to do it yourself and we didn't do it. I think coach Brown will be fine. He'll be coaching again, and I'm very sure he'll have success.''

Williams agreed.

"Do I think he deserved it? No,'' Williams said. "My question is: Who's out there that's better? He's not a bad coach. To fire him, that's making a big statement. After him, you have to get a Hall of Fame coach.

"I thought we prematurely acted on our emotions, as an organization. I think he did a good job. If anything, bring in a veteran assistant. I think we just could have gotten better instead of blowing it all up. Now we're starting over.

"I'm hurt, because I like him a lot. He'll be missed. We know how the business of basketball goes. He knows the nature of the business, also. His presence will be missed.''

Both players thought Brown would survive the Cavs recent loss to the Boston Celtics in the second round of the playoffs, the third straight time they were unable to return to the NBA Finals after a somewhat surprising appearance there in 2007.

"As we've all come to find out, winning a championship is very hard,'' Ilgauskas said. "Just because you're willing to spend money ... you cannot buy a championship. That's one thing I've learned from my playing career. You have to earn it. You have to have the right players. You have to have a little bit of luck, but you have to have the right mix of players ... not necessarily the most talented. Because talent at some point goes out the window. It becomes who wants it more.

"I was asked all the time this year, 'Is this the best team you've been on?' I'd say, 'Yes, if we win a championship.' But so far the best team I've been on is the team that went to The Finals. You can knock those guys who were on the team but we defended. We were the No. 1 team in defense in field-goal percentage and points throughtout the playoffs. Yeah, we had LeBron, who was amazing. But everybody else was blue collar guys who did their job. They just went to work. They didn't look for any recognition or anything like that. You have to do the little things, especially in the playoffs. You have to box out. You have to go for loose balls and things like that. [The Celtics] outhustled us, which is inexcusable in the playoffs.''

Ilgauskas, who returned to the Cavs in midseason after being traded and released by Washington, is a free agent, and his future, like that of the Cavs, is up in the air. But he's more worried about the franchise than himself. Brown was his seventh coach since he was a first-round draft choice of the team in 1996.

"I don't care where I'm going to play next year or what's going to happen,'' he said. "But this city has become like a home to me. You hate to see people get disappointed, but I just have this funny feeling that they might come to regret this decision, unless they go for Phil Jackson or something. You can throw all the names you want at the wall, but the reality is different. I've been through a lot of coaches and coaching staffs and, trust me, they're not all that good.''

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don't think those are guys are 100% sincere, but i think it's just a good gesture so the guy gets positive remarks from his old team when looking for another job.

seems like he lost the team, but maybe not lost respect.

i wish the guy the best. i just hope the organization has something planned.

and honestly, if lebron leaves, i wouldn't mind keeping brown. i think the guy can grow, and maybe grow with a new team as it'd be a foregone conclusion they'd start from scratch if lbj left.

i also agree with z 100% about that finals team. maybe the nba is just better now and that cavs team would never do anything agains these celtics or these lakers, but those guys were tough. they were gritty, they did all the little things.

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Mike Brown Fired

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This is an amazing birthday gift for me

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"If the situation was right, I certainly would consider [coaching again]," Wilkens said. "I have not explored it. But Cleveland certainly has a good team. So does Chicago. A few teams are good and need coaches. Let's see how everything shakes out and then we'll see."

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Breaking News, Paul Silas also claimed that he would consider a come back to the Cavs if the situation was right.

I would agree witht that to the extent that it also might depend on who this other superstar we decide to "pay in" is,...

Look at the four remaining playoff teams, they all have a super-superstar (a LeBron) and then 1 or 2 other VERY good players around them. We still need that other 'VG" dude, I think.

i'd rather have Avery Johnson than Jeff Van Gundy to be perfectly honest. but, I see your point on the 2nd star syndrome.

a few years ago (when we made our Finals run), we had LeBron and a bunch of role players (guys who could only do 1 or 2 things well) and they worked their butts off on defense and rebounding and scratched their way to the Finals (with a nicely paved path on matchups).

now, we have "upgraded" those spots to 3rd stars (guys who can be the 3rd star on a championship team...I'd consider Shaq, Antawn, Mo, and AV in this category), but we don't have that 2nd star guy (the Gasol, Ray Allen guy). And, we traded in our defensive identity for a bunch of guys who can score but are limited defensively.

even if we resign LeBron quickly, this will be an incredibly interesting summer to see what moves Ferry has up his sleave to improve this team.

if they can get that second guy, maybe the rest of the roster will fall into place.

i like mo williams, and i think he gets dinged too much by fans (i don't care what pg you bring in, it's tough to be the starting pg when lebron dominates the ball) but i think if you're gonna run mo out there, you need to pair him with a guard who has versatility defensively, and someone who can create at least a little bit on his own. someone better than anthony parker. i think parker would be a great bench guy, and honestly, when we brought him in, i think we all thought he'd be that bench guy, he started every game.

tony parker is not a great defender, he might not even be A defender, but the spurs worked around it. we have to find a similiar solution. i think iguodala would be a nice pairing. don't like the contract, but that's the kinda guy you need to play him with.

The discussion goes like this:

Gilbert: "To get you to stay....what coach do you want me to sign?"
Lebron: "<insert name here>"
Gilbert: "Consider it done."

The guys on PTI said there's a chance we could nab Dirk for a near max deal to go along with Lebron. Not sure if they're smoking crack....but if he doesn't command a max, it could be done. He's past the point of being THE MAN on the team...but he could be our "Gasol".

i like the guy, but i think he's far from what we need.

as far as lebron and this coaching thing, what happens if lebron's plan backfires? lebron is banking on nobody really going out and getting a coach until he makes a decision, which means other free agents move, which means then coaches get hired. but what if teams start hiring? what if the bulls and nets hire a coach tomorrow? and his cavs get screwed because nobody wants to go there without knowledge lebron stays?

IF you listen to the Jalen rose segment on ESPN.com under the Bron Bron heading, he says Dirk would be the best pairing with LeBron and could be had for a max deal this offseason. That would be a HUGE signing

we would have to sign-n-trade to get Dirk.

who would 'mr. marketing' Mark Cuban want from our team more than Dirk? he's not exactly the take Hickson, AV, Delonte, Gibson and build the team back up through young asset type of guy.

guess you could consider it kinda like the celtics

the big 3 were a bunch of guys who could not get over the hump on their own, they all come together and get one title, and are probably on their way to their second.

i like dirk, but i think we will still have needs. and while dirk is one of the best shooters in the league, he doesn't play a whole lot of defense.

but again, we don't have a ton of wiggle room, we have to take the best we can get. i think dirk is worth the money too. although remember, we still are without a true 7 foot center with shaq and z still in limbo. dirk is 7 feet but he can't defend most centers.

Hawks and Hornets will most definitely hire coaches beforehand.

Nets and Bulls are the big ?. The billionaire Russian might throw $$ around to get his coach before other teams strike. Definitely at least a possibility.

So, Thib, Casey, and Avery might all be gone. Those are the top3 names on the market right now (assuming Phil stays put).

i think dirk goes back. i think there is respect, and also faith with dirk in mark cuban. and why not, he's one of the best owners to play for.

The Dallas sign and trade thing made me think, why not do it the other way? By that I mean, offer Miami something in a sign and trade for Wade? All we're hearing is so and so is freeing up cap space or team A is willing to do a sign and trade for LeBron...why not throw it back at them. Not that Miami would do this, but offer Anderson, West, & Parker for Wade in a sign and trade - it works out moneywise. Then maybe sign and trade with Portland - Pryzbilla for Mo if the numbers work (just thinking out loud, it may not work and he may not be worth it). If Danny wants to keep LeBron, he's going to have to at least start throwing out rumors like Cuban did.

i think LeBron laughs off these rumors. and I don't think Gilbert needs to take 100K fines to get his name in the media.

i don't think wade wants to leave miami, and i think amare may end up there with him.

remember, these guys have to want to come to cleveland, and the organization will have had to have given up on trying to sign...