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The procedures are fine.... the humans getting bribed to look the other way are not.
All that takes is the stroke of a pen to fire some people and voila', it's fixed.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
The procedures are fine.... the humans getting bribed to look the other way are not.
All that takes is the stroke of a pen to fire some people and voila', it's fixed.
Seems to me, the humans are part of the procedures. They first need to determine who's all involved, and I'd bet it's a lot more than 1 or 2 people.
The engineers said it was broken or failed, and all it took was some suit that probably has never seen the deck of an oil rig or understands the process of drilling to force it through. Isn't that why we have engineers? To tell us if something will or will not work as expected?
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Yes, and all of that worked fine. The problems were identified and things were passed along.
It's just that the humans higher in the food chain chose to ignore it all, and then the humans in government employ whose job it is to provide oversight and enforcement were bribed to look the other way.
The procedures worked... the humans chose to ignore what that dictates. All that is needed is to identify the offenders and fire/arrest them as needed..... and the other humans will get the message.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Your missing my point, and maybe I'm more referring to the process rather than the physical procedures.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Saint, does Joe Blundo have a point?
yebat' Putin
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He found a way to bring Halliburton into the discussion ... so that'll earn big points from the more liberal readers .......
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I'm talking about the procedures themselves. You are referring to how the oversight works (doesn't work).
The procedures themselves, as they are - worked fine. Problems were found, all of the proper people at every level was notified.
Where it failed, is that ALL of the people that could have prevented this, consciously chose to ignore everything on the gamble that it wouldn't be an issue - every one of them choosing to do so for personal gain. There is no check for that. There is no procedure to work around that.
BP cornered the market on the people that have a say, and had them all go in their favor. If you want some kind of a check for that, call the FBI and have them keep the same tabs on the enforcement people that they keep on Communications and Cryptography personnel.
The only recourse, and only way to stifle it in the future, is LOTS and LOTS of fines and jail time for EVERYONE involved at EVERY level, starting all the way at the top and filtering down.
Fine the individuals, fine the corporations (BP, Haliburton, etc...) and send lots of them to prison.
Unless there are SEVERE consequences, the actions will not change.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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It seems like it would be a pretty simple procedural law - to say that a relief well has to be 90% drilled and ready to go if necessary.....since that seems to be the known way to stop a leaking well...
Not sure what the costs of that would be on a per well basis
~Lyuokdea
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Well, that isn't going to prevent anything, that will just mitigate the consequences of their stupidity when it happens again - which is actually somewhat counter-productive.
The problem isn't that some piece of equipment failed and we need to be able to react faster. The problem is that processes and checks and balances are in place - and they were circumvented.... so what faith do you have that the PROPER drilling of a relief well wouldn't also be circumvented.
More rules and more regulations and more bureaucracy isn't what is needed. Things are in place to control these things.... kinda like immigration, we just need to make the asshats in charge actually follow the damned rules that already exist.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I have a question for anybody that can offer an educated answer.. I have been thinking for weeks that they should just drop some heavy duty ordinance around the well shaft, detonate it, and let the thing collapse in on itself... this, to my untrained brain, seemed like a fairly simple solution that nobody was even discussing... Now recently I've heard it discussed as one of those "absolute last resort" possibilities...
Why is this such a bad idea?
yebat' Putin
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I've suggested the very same thing in this thread, as have a few others. The Russians have used battlefield sized tactical nukes to close up a number of wells over the years.
The one major problem you have to worry about is the thickness of the crust between the surface and the top of the salt dome that encloses the oil reservoir. If isn't thick enough, and you crack it, you've got yourself one helluva problem on your hands.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Don't think it is a bad idea, and not because I had already thought of it too,...  How much worse could THAT make this ? As you said, I need educated on this too. Would like to know. I wouldn't think it has to be a nuclear device,....
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I would think that the problem is the same that every other "solution" shares ....
And that's the matter of extreme pressure pushing whatever is put down the shaft back out.
What happens if the put a nuke down there, and it is expelled, or fails to reach a depth that would allow it to do its job?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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It continues to sound like they have to get those relief wells drilled,....Wow, that pressure must be incredible, eh ?
How did this thing blow up in the first place ?
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You don't necessarily put it down the hole, you lay it next to it, or slightly above it.
Water does not compress, so the full force of the shock wave would be transferred into the crust. The initial blast, but all of the other compression waves that follow, would collapse it upon itself.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
It continues to sound like they have to get those relief wells drilled,....Wow, that pressure must be incredible, eh ?
How did this thing blow up in the first place ?
I believe that it was the Blowout preventer - of all things - that failed..... and they had warnings of possible failure LAST YEAR. It was NOT a surprise to anyone except that what they knew to be possible actually occurred.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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The thing I worry about is this ....
There were obviously mistakes made at this site.
Other sites should be checked ...... but that doesn't mean that the saqme things are happening there.
This is one accident a 1 of over a thousand drills in the gulf alone. It's tragic, but it is one well. It would be a bigger problem if we throw the baby out with the bathwater and over-regulate drilling so that it raises gas prices even more than they already are, adding even more pain to a recession.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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This is one accident a 1 of over a thousand drills in the gulf alone.
I believe as of 2006 there were over 4000 oil and natural gas rigs in the gulf.. which could be a problem with detonating explosives.. not sure how far reaching those shock waves could be and might damage other perfectly good wells.
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
There were obviously mistakes made at this site.
Other sites should be checked ...... but that doesn't mean that the saqme things are happening there.
I would ABSOLUTELY be having someone check all of the other wells - at least any other deep water rigs.
The problem is who do you trust to do the checks?
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
Quote:
This is one accident a 1 of over a thousand drills in the gulf alone.
I believe as of 2006 there were over 4000 oil and natural gas rigs in the gulf.. which could be a problem with detonating explosives.. not sure how far reaching those shock waves could be and might damage other perfectly good wells.
You really wanna think about something scary,, think about a gulf of mexico tsunami (if that's even possible)
Look at what one oil well fire has lead too... now think about it,, 4000 gas and oil wells in the path of a Tsunami? YIKES...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Well they have survived many of hurricanes including Katrina.
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It would be a non-event.
Tsunami's generally have zero effect at all on anything once you're in deep water.
If you were on a boat, you likely wouldn't barely even notice one passing under you.
p.s. You're probably thinking of a Rogue Wave situation... and to that I say Shush! Freakin' TLC doesn't need any more crappy ideas for "What IF" pseudo-science shows.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Quote:
p.s. You're probably thinking of a Rogue Wave situation... and to that I say Shush! Freakin' TLC doesn't need any more crappy ideas for "What IF" pseudo-science shows.
Next week... "What if....The Browns won the Superbowl". Riots, fires, pandemonium, scientist discover hell is covered in ice and pigs suddenly grow wings overnight.
Last edited by FloridaFan; 06/04/10 01:22 PM.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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They aren't THAT desperate for far fetched ideas..  
yebat' Putin
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All Pro
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j/c Saw this interesting article on cleveland.com. http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2010/06/putting_the_gulf_oil_spill_in.htmlFound it very useful for putting the size of this spill in perspective. For me, its easy to read X thousand gallons spilled, but I need visual aids to learn. Even though its not as simple as the picture portrays. Hopefully they have success shutting this thing down in the next few weeks.
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Now that is scary man,.., wow, I guess I didn't realize just how big an area this oil slick is covering... amazing.
I know that folks on here want to bash the Adminstration for not doing more and maybe there is a valid point there.. But BP,, just isn't getting it.
Spending 50 Million on a PR campaign.. come on....
I would bet you that if they put up that 50 mill for the people that are being effected by this thing, they'd get plenty of PR value out of it and it would mean more to me for instance...
Saw that British dude who is the CEO of BP in one of thier ads.. I ain't buying it..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
I know that folks on here want to bash the Adminstration for not doing more and maybe there is a valid point there.. But BP,, just isn't getting it.
The President went on TV and said that his administration had made every decision thus far as to what steps are to be taken ......
He said that his administration is responsible for handling this disaster .....
Then, the next day, when the plug thing had failed to work ..... he blamed everyone else.
Of course BP is going to run a PR campaign. They'r a business, and that's part of business. Being President, however, is not a business, and results should matter more than PR where the President (and his administration) are concerned.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Quote:
I know that folks on here want to bash the Adminstration for not doing more and maybe there is a valid point there.. But BP,, just isn't getting it.
The President went on TV and said that his administration had made every decision thus far as to what steps are to be taken ......
He said that his administration is responsible for handling this disaster .....
Then, the next day, when the plug thing had failed to work ..... he blamed everyone else.
Of course BP is going to run a PR campaign. They'r a business, and that's part of business. Being President, however, is not a business, and results should matter more than PR where the President (and his administration) are concerned.
Hater 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c Holy cow! How ironic is this sign? 
![[Linked Image from i75.photobucket.com]](http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i302/lrhinkle/d5eaf0b9-e429-4211-b53f-b843bfcf6aa9_zps2ac17420.jpg) #gmstrong
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And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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don'tcha just love irony?
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum 'Top kill' fails to stop flow of
oil, BP says
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